Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[hmmmstrange]

Anyone who believes the 'official story' that 850k coins were actually stolen is a gullible fool imo. Something else went on there, either an inside job or they simply lost the private keys to the coins somehow.

It doesnt matter what happened to those 850k coins. If they were stolen, then essentially the market was being set for the last few months by an inflated (850k) money supply. If they were lost then the money supply has fallen by 850k. Either way, we will be now setting a price with a money supply that has been reduced considerably.

[F-bernanke]

Anyone who believes the 'official story' that 850k coins were actually stolen is a gullible fool imo. Something else went on there, either an inside job or they simply lost the private keys to the coins somehow.

It doesnt matter what happened to those 850k coins. If they were stolen, then essentially the market was being set for the last few months by an inflated (850k) money supply. If they were lost then the money supply has fallen by 850k. Either way, we will be now setting a price with a money supply that has been reduced considerably.

The BTC supply is even more reduced than the money supply. There were more fake BTC's then FIAT in there (value wise).

Fractional reserve banking causes supply inflation.

[JorgeStolfi]

Exactly. These stolen / inside job btcs have already been in circulation for a long time and are reflected in the prices on other exchanges. This is not a bullish news.

In case privkeys were lost - that would be pro-bullish.

In either case, the "loss" of those coins, per se, should have no effect on the market.

MtGOX customers owned imaginary bitcoins and imaginary dollars, but when that fact was discovered/leaked they were already cut off from the market, so the effect was entirely confined to them. 

As long as customers at other exchanges continue to believe that they own real bitcoins and real dollars, the amounts of those presumed assests that are avaliable for trading in those markets wil be the same as they were before MtGOX's failure.  The key loss and closure, per se, will create neither a surplus nor a shortage of coins in those markets.

Of course the loss and closure will have indirect psychological effects, and it is hard to see how they could lead to a prcie increase.

[proudhon]

Fuck it, I'm buying.

[FTWbitcoinFTW]

Fuck it, I'm buying.

Insta sold all my bitcoin !!

thanks for advice !

[600watt]

Anyone who believes the 'official story' that 850k coins were actually stolen is a gullible fool imo. Something else went on there, either an inside job or they simply lost the private keys to the coins somehow.

It doesnt matter what happened to those 850k coins. If they were stolen, then essentially the market was being set for the last few months by an inflated (850k) money supply. If they were lost then the money supply has fallen by 850k. Either way, we will be now setting a price with a money supply that has been reduced considerably.

if coins are lost: money is lost for the buyers, not for the sellers (if not on gox), but there are less coins on the market now.
if coins were stolen: money lost for the buyers, not for the sellers (if not on gox), but there is the same amount on the market, either already traded (probable) or still hidden (not probable)

[600watt]

ccmf now

[Franktank]

Fuck it, I'm buying.

Are you back....?

[seljo]

Adam maybe a new poll like will this weekend be dump or pump weekend, hodl and stuff.

[sonofliberty]

[hmmmstrange]

Exactly. These stolen / inside job btcs have already been in circulation for a long time and are reflected in the prices on other exchanges. This is not a bullish news.

In case privkeys were lost - that would be pro-bullish.

In either case, the "loss" of those coins, per se, should have no effect on the market.

MtGOX customers owned imaginary bitcoins and imaginary dollars, but when that fact was discovered/leaked they were already cut off from the market, so the effect was entirely confined to them. 

As long as customers at other exchanges continue to believe that they own real bitcoins and real dollars, the amounts of those presumed assests that are avaliable for trading in those markets wil be the same as they were before MtGOX's failure.  The key loss and closure, per se, will create neither a surplus nor a shortage of coins in those markets.

Of course the loss and closure will have indirect psychological effects, and it is hard to see how they could lead to a prcie increase.

You are completely wrong Jorge, watch what happens when 5% of a resource is lost when only 1-3% of that resource is traded at the margin to set the price.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[magicmexican]

Mt.Gox learned Monday that 1.75 million bitcoins held by the company and its customers had disappeared - CNN

[Richard Branson]

ccmf now

NOT!

Just check the 4H and 6H charts.
We are still in a serious downtrend, it's not broken.

Sub 500$ this week, low 400$ coins in 2 weeks.

[600watt]

Fuck it, I'm buying.

mk would say:

buy it, I´m fucking

[tailor]

You are completely wrong Jorge, watch what happens when 5% of a resource is lost when only 1-3% of that resource is traded at the margin to set the price.

Precisely. How much money was deposited into MTgox to buy coins vs. how many coins held there were mined? If $480M had been deposited, MTgox would not be in the situation is is now. The $7B market cap of BTC is based on a small percentage of coins having been purchased. Certainly $7B wasn't spent to buy the coins.

[Sitarow]

Fuck it, I'm buying.

Are you back....?

A question asked by those getting into bitcoin would be. Should I speculate on hardware vs difficulty increase or Buy BTC directly what gives most BTC return?

Updated the mining hardware cost to btc return chart on a 20% network difficulty rate increase.

I update it with newer hardware over time.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmeuPljmUNHCdEpqX2RmMDFwemJyLURVUWFtZ3J3aGc&usp=drive_web#gid=9

Edit: there are multiple sheet tabs at the bottom.

[hdbuck]

@sitarrow thx for the material! long week end of study ahead.

[Sitarow]

@sitarrow thx for the material! long week end of study ahead.

The BTC return for each hardware is if the network difficulty increases at 20%. (Average is 23.1%)

Worth knowing.

Edit: and feel free to make a copy for your own records. Just check back and get an update every Bitcoin Network difficulty retarget every 12 days or so.

[600watt]

the chief editor of a major german economic newssite "Handelsblatt-online" said publicly that

-bitcoin was hacked
-forged bitcoins are circulating
-the central bank of bitcoin (mtgox) went bankrupt

http://www.handelsblatt.com/9534814.html