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Question: When will BTC get back above $70K:
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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 26487921 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (174 posts by 3 users with 9 merit deleted.)
xhomerx10
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July 01, 2022, 11:00:41 PM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)

LTC just got dumped from some exchanges due to the privacy issue.  BTC doesn't have this issue.

If anyone wonders why I quoted Tyler Winklevoss’ vocal support for Zcash when it was hit with a stupid FUD-delisting from Bittrex, or why I point here and in other threads to what Adam Back has said about fungibility:  This is why.

The above-quoted statement is mere FUD, without details.  No time to add details.

We need to get strong privacy in BTC, ASAP.  Those who are thoughtless and shortsighted don’t see how this has been a war of precedents from the start; and they lack any perspective on the big picture, long-term view.

Bitcoin set a bad precedent, just because the needed technology had not yet been developed.  Satoshi himself was interested in ways to make transactions unlinkable and untraceable, but he didn’t know how.  Now, the burden of fixing this problem has fallen on altcoins.

Some excellent precedents have been set for privacy.  Besides privacy coins, I don’t think that any exchange will dare to target Ethereum with a FUD-delisting over Tornado.Cash and Aztec Protocol, which provide much stronger privacy than LTC.  But someday, strong privacy needs to come home to Bitcoin—preferably before BTC fungibility gets so wrecked that it causes irreparable economic damage in Bitcoin.  Lack of fungibility destroys confidence in a currency; that is an old and timeless monetary principle, which BTC defies at its peril.

 That's a bat slap.

  I put as much effort into my reply to ImThour as he put into his analysis of a situation he thought required investigation.  I brought the matter relating the the drop in value of LTC to his attention and I assumed he could take it from there.  The perils of sending your LTC to exchanges are best left to another thread.
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July 01, 2022, 11:03:28 PM


Explanation
Biodom
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July 01, 2022, 11:06:24 PM

OT
hmmm...
https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/mystery-rocket-NASA-moon-crash-country-origin-17273903.php
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/3543757-nasa-calls-mystery-rocket-crash-on-moon-highly-unusual/

Not making any connections, but if something like the ref. below occurred now, we would have a full blown panic:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1561_celestial_phenomenon_over_Nuremberg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1566_celestial_phenomenon_over_Basel

Apparently, somewhere between 1561 and 1648 many such phenomena were observed and recorded.
Do I think that all of them were just 'sun dogs'? Unlikely, but to think that someone would come to Earth's vicinity for a space fight is also quite strange.
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July 01, 2022, 11:16:37 PM
Last edit: July 01, 2022, 11:35:01 PM by Torque
Merited by JayJuanGee (1), ivomm (1), a1 Hashrate LLC2022 (1)

another one, another one...bites the dust.
dropping like flies...hopefully, we are close the end than to a beginning with those entities.

Michael Saylor keeps stressing the importance of backtesting the collateral against the loans like Microstrategy did.

Did all these fly-by-night VC-funded crypto shitcoin derivative companies not backtest anything?

Are they all fucking stupid, or what?

Like, "Hey let's go over-leverage loans against all of our bitcoin collateral we bought at $40K-50K/btc. What could possibly go wrong?"  Roll Eyes

It's no wonder no one should trust them with anything.

Personally, I think all these shitty crypto companies were set up to cause a crash. Because they always magically show up during bull runs, only to get margin called, liquidate and go bankrupt literally every single bear market. They are designed to distract Average Joe away from bitcoin and steal noobs money. Just like the ICOs did.
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July 01, 2022, 11:18:53 PM
Merited by Biodom (1)

OT
hmmm...
https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/mystery-rocket-NASA-moon-crash-country-origin-17273903.php
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/3543757-nasa-calls-mystery-rocket-crash-on-moon-highly-unusual/

Not making any connections, but if something like the ref. below occurred now, we would have a full blown panic:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1561_celestial_phenomenon_over_Nuremberg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1566_celestial_phenomenon_over_Basel

Apparently, somewhere between 1561 and 1648 many such phenomena were observed and recorded.
Do I think that all of them were just 'sun dogs'? Unlikely, but to think that someone would come to Earth's vicinity for a space fight is also quite strange.


Maybe the accidental discovery of psychoactive mushrooms in the Holy Roman Empire?
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July 01, 2022, 11:21:18 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1), xhomerx10 (1), JayJuanGee (1)

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10968909/New-EU-vehicles-fitted-speed-limiting-tech-6-July-Britain-follow-suit.html


"The speed-limiting systems use GPS, sat-nav and cameras to identify the legal limit and will warn drivers to slow down - and if they don't the car can restrict engine power"


Fuck this
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July 01, 2022, 11:26:15 PM

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10968909/New-EU-vehicles-fitted-speed-limiting-tech-6-July-Britain-follow-suit.html


"The speed-limiting systems use GPS, sat-nav and cameras to identify the legal limit and will warn drivers to slow down - and if they don't the car can restrict engine power"


Fuck this

old (used) cars would dramatically increase in price, perhaps.
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July 01, 2022, 11:27:01 PM

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10968909/New-EU-vehicles-fitted-speed-limiting-tech-6-July-Britain-follow-suit.html


"The speed-limiting systems use GPS, sat-nav and cameras to identify the legal limit and will warn drivers to slow down - and if they don't the car can restrict engine power"


Fuck this

More nanny-state government overreach.
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July 01, 2022, 11:46:33 PM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10968909/New-EU-vehicles-fitted-speed-limiting-tech-6-July-Britain-follow-suit.html


"The speed-limiting systems use GPS, sat-nav and cameras to identify the legal limit and will warn drivers to slow down - and if they don't the car can restrict engine power"


Fuck this

More nanny-state government overreach.

Have to agree.

I drive in USA mostly.

On one Highway I use the speed limit is 65 MPH.
 I set cruise control to 79 MPH when the road is empty. It is an easy speed to maintain.

I get a driving score on my car's app it is usually a C due to speeding.
I know the road. I know my car 79 is a fine speed if the road in not crowded.
My car can do about 85-90 on a dry straight road and feels under my control.

At 95 it feels not in touch with the road.
At 79 it is solidly in touch with the road.

I resent the App telling me I am a C driver.

If the road was crowded and I set the cruise at 64 and weaved in and out I would rate okay on the app. So what the fuck does the app know.
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July 01, 2022, 11:49:52 PM
Last edit: July 02, 2022, 12:03:46 AM by cAPSLOCK



Went for the more Upscale Biltema food today.

There's still a 2.5 Mb limit  Cool


 Looks delicious!

Thanks for fixing it, I don't know how to do these things, especially on a phone.

I really like this thing.  The setup and learning curve may be outside your comfort zone, but the basic idea is the tool can take an image on your phone and reduce the jpg quality to make it something smaller to text etc.  Just a thought.

https://f-droid.org/en/packages/de.kaffeemitkoffein.imagepipe/

*edit* I am surprised you say it was bland!  It does look good!
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July 01, 2022, 11:50:50 PM
Merited by xhomerx10 (1)

There's still a 2.5 Mb limit  Cool




Maybe use SegPic
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July 02, 2022, 12:03:32 AM


Explanation
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July 02, 2022, 12:12:28 AM



“The people will rise”, “the proles will rise”—this is one of the most damaging myths in history.


I think you are right about this, but to play devil's advocate the "it's different this time" angle is the one world communication system.

But back to the other side... the rulers have not only access to that, but seemingly control over it.

An emergent outburst of popular resentment results only in a headless mob.  It rarely even happens; and when it does, it is trivial to suppress.  Quelling a riot is part of Rulership 101.

The masses are both inert and stupid.  Moreover, overthrowing an established government requires resources.  A revolution always needs organization, charismatic leadership, propaganda, and lots and lots of money.

Take, for example, your American Revolution.  The majority of the people were either favourable to the government (branded “Loyalists” as if loyalty were evil), or apathetic—the eighteenth-century equivalent of couch potatoes.  Around (IIRC) 30% of the British colonists got upset.  They were whipped into a frenzy, organized, and propagandized by what, from the government’s viewpoint, were traitors and criminals—what would nowadays be called “domestic terrorists”.  History otherwise remembers them, because history books are written by the winners.

Some of the revolutionary leaders were wealthy—for instance, Hancock; a bunch of rich men pledged “our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honour” to the cause of revolution.  And as anyone with even the slightest knowledge of such matters could predict, much of the revolution was a matter of logistics, raising resources, and also—obtaining external support via diplomacy.  The British insurrectionists (who, we must remember, were British subjects only anachronistically distinguished from other Brits) could never have violently overthrown the duly constituted, very stable government, if they had not timely obtained the military intervention of the French.

Popular resentment is what a computer programmer would call a necessary but insufficient prerequisite for revolution.  Wise governments conciliate the masses.  For instance, observe Stolypin.  Stolypin was a master statesman, one of the most talented of that historical epoch.  After a failed revolution, Stolypin authoritatively instituted genuine reforms that contented most people.  The Communist ideologues who were attempting to harness popular resentment needed to get rid of Stolypin; therefore, they assassinated him.  Without the wise and savvy Stolypin, a weak Tsar was simply lost.  A successful revolution was soon thereafter carried off when, a few years later, military defeat in the Great War made the government even weaker than usual.

Mass-communication does not turn a headless, mostly inert mass into anything but.  Do you see intelligent action emerging from mindless mass-chatter on Twitter—or in WO? Roll Eyes

Rather, consistently with what you said at the end, modern mass-communications are a collar snapped onto the collective neck of the masses, with the leash being firmly held by the powers that be.  Let’s put it this way:  When popular resentment resulted in the election of an American President who very slightly crossed certain lines, Twitter blatantly manipulated the next election (ban of NY Post to suppress the Hunter Biden story).  Then, Twitter banned the sitting President from its mass-communications platform.  LOL.  Oh, do you suppose that the inert, unintelligent masses will somehow organize themselves with sophisticated, decentralized cypherpunk communications methods that >99.9% of people do not even know exist?

(Cue stupid arguments about Trump vs. Biden.  Roll Eyes  What I just said was not about Trump vs. Biden.  Twitter, et al. indisputably manipulated an election by suppressing information, to get rid of a president who indisputably rose on a wave of popular resentment against the status quo.  Those are the facts, whatever one’s opinion may be of whether the stupidly resentful masses picked an idiot in Trump, or whether Biden is absolutely the greatest, wisest, and most competent leader in the history of the universe.)

“It’s different this time”, yes:  Insofar as “first-world” types of places are concerned, revolution is as obsolete as the musket, the sword, and the carrier pigeon.  A fool’s errand—a one-way ticket to supermax prison, a CIA black site, or the morgue.  Since WO is doubtless watched, I should emphasize very clearly that I am only discussing some famous historical circumstances.  I don’t much care what is called “illegal”, but I would not urge anyone to do something so moronic as attempting to “rise” against the government.
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July 02, 2022, 12:32:10 AM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)



“The people will rise”, “the proles will rise”—this is one of the most damaging myths in history.


I think you are right about this, but to play devil's advocate the "it's different this time" angle is the one world communication system.

But back to the other side... the rulers have not only access to that, but seemingly control over it.

An emergent outburst of popular resentment results only in a headless mob.  It rarely even happens; and when it does, it is trivial to suppress.  Quelling a riot is part of Rulership 101.

The masses are both inert and stupid.  Moreover, overthrowing an established government requires resources.  A revolution always needs organization, charismatic leadership, propaganda, and lots and lots of money.

Take, for example, your American Revolution.  The majority of the people were either favourable to the government (branded “Loyalists” as if loyalty were evil), or apathetic—the eighteenth-century equivalent of couch potatoes.  Around (IIRC) 30% of the British colonists got upset.  They were whipped into a frenzy, organized, and propagandized by what, from the government’s viewpoint, were traitors and criminals—what would nowadays be called “domestic terrorists”.  History otherwise remembers them, because history books are written by the winners.

Some of the revolutionary leaders were wealthy—for instance, Hancock; a bunch of rich men pledged “our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honour” to the cause of revolution.  And as anyone with even the slightest knowledge of such matters could predict, much of the revolution was a matter of logistics, raising resources, and also—obtaining external support via diplomacy.  The British insurrectionists (who, we must remember, were British subjects only anachronistically distinguished from other Brits) could never have violently overthrown the duly constituted, very stable government, if they had not timely obtained the military intervention of the French.

Popular resentment is what a computer programmer would call a necessary but insufficient prerequisite for revolution.  Wise governments conciliate the masses.  For instance, observe Stolypin.  Stolypin was a master statesman, one of the most talented of that historical epoch.  After a failed revolution, Stolypin authoritatively instituted genuine reforms that contented most people.  The Communist ideologues who were attempting to harness popular resentment needed to get rid of Stolypin; therefore, they assassinated him.  Without the wise and savvy Stolypin, a weak Tsar was simply lost.  A successful revolution was soon thereafter carried off when, a few years later, military defeat in the Great War made the government even weaker than usual.

Mass-communication does not turn a headless, mostly inert mass into anything but.  Do you see intelligent action emerging from mindless mass-chatter on Twitter—or in WO? Roll Eyes

Rather, consistently with what you said at the end, modern mass-communications are a collar snapped onto the collective neck of the masses, with the leash being firmly held by the powers that be.  Let’s put it this way:  When popular resentment resulted in the election of an American President who very slightly crossed certain lines, Twitter blatantly manipulated the next election (ban of NY Post to suppress the Hunter Biden story).  Then, Twitter banned the sitting President from its mass-communications platform.  LOL.  Oh, do you suppose that the inert, unintelligent masses will somehow organize themselves with sophisticated, decentralized cypherpunk communications methods that >99.9% of people do not even know exist?

(Cue stupid arguments about Trump vs. Biden.  Roll Eyes  What I just said was not about Trump vs. Biden.  Twitter, et al. indisputably manipulated an election by suppressing information, to get rid of a president who indisputably rose on a wave of popular resentment against the status quo.  Those are the facts, whatever one’s opinion may be of whether the stupidly resentful masses picked an idiot in Trump, or whether Biden is absolutely the greatest, wisest, and most competent leader in the history of the universe.)

“It’s different this time”, yes:  Insofar as “first-world” types of places are concerned, revolution is as obsolete as the musket, the sword, and the carrier pigeon.  A fool’s errand—a one-way ticket to supermax prison, a CIA black site, or the morgue.  Since WO is doubtless watched, I should emphasize very clearly that I am only discussing some famous historical circumstances.  I don’t much care what is called “illegal”, but I would not urge anyone to do something so moronic as attempting to “rise” against the government.

I firmly agree with much of what you say, but wanted to add the caveat, *Most Revolutionary Desires are quelled by 5he fact that the General Populace has Too Much to Lose.* In times of economic strife and worldwide political upheaval, Revolutionary Force has more leverage to work with if the organization and leadership is able to come together. This series of calculated disasters carry a significant risk of creating a momentum that can be harnessed by anyone with enough resources and influence to snap up the reigns. Whether the current planners designs succeed or fail, we could indeed be in for "interesting times" that no sane person should ever hope for...
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July 02, 2022, 12:44:47 AM
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https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10968909/New-EU-vehicles-fitted-speed-limiting-tech-6-July-Britain-follow-suit.html


"The speed-limiting systems use GPS, sat-nav and cameras to identify the legal limit and will warn drivers to slow down - and if they don't the car can restrict engine power"


Fuck this


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July 02, 2022, 01:05:15 AM

LTC just got dumped from some exchanges due to the privacy issue.  BTC doesn't have this issue.

If anyone wonders why I quoted Tyler Winklevoss’ vocal support for Zcash when it was hit with a stupid FUD-delisting from Bittrex, or why I point here and in other threads to what Adam Back has said about fungibility:  This is why.

The above-quoted statement is mere FUD, without details.  No time to add details.

We need to get strong privacy in BTC, ASAP.  Those who are thoughtless and shortsighted don’t see how this has been a war of precedents from the start; and they lack any perspective on the big picture, long-term view.

Bitcoin set a bad precedent, just because the needed technology had not yet been developed.  Satoshi himself was interested in ways to make transactions unlinkable and untraceable, but he didn’t know how.  Now, the burden of fixing this problem has fallen on altcoins.

Some excellent precedents have been set for privacy.  Besides privacy coins, I don’t think that any exchange will dare to target Ethereum with a FUD-delisting over Tornado.Cash and Aztec Protocol, which provide much stronger privacy than LTC.  But someday, strong privacy needs to come home to Bitcoin—preferably before BTC fungibility gets so wrecked that it causes irreparable economic damage in Bitcoin.  Lack of fungibility destroys confidence in a currency; that is an old and timeless monetary principle, which BTC defies at its peril.

 That's a bat slap.

  I put as much effort into my reply to ImThour as he put into his analysis of a situation he thought required investigation.  I brought the matter relating the the drop in value of LTC to his attention and I assumed he could take it from there.  The perils of sending your LTC to exchanges are best left to another thread.


No offense, xhomer.  You understand how that came off the wrong way, and I just had to reply accordingly.  This has been a fight ever since Mike Hearn and his canaille spun out propaganda to brainwash people that wrecking BTC fungibility was somehow a good thing.  Ultimately, I do not think the problem can be resolved until we attain what Adam Back said in that video:  Cryptographic indistinguishability and unlinkability.  Trust the maths.


Quoted for truth; note the date on a discussion that we are still having in 2022:

Taint tracking is precisely why we need ZeroCoin or CoinJoin or whatever. Do it now.

I am NOT joking. Bitcoin is useless without fungibility. Tracking taint programmatically or with regulatory intent is a clear attack on Bitcoin in perhaps the only way that it can presently be attempted since theres no way anyone can get mining superiority anymore. The Bitcoin Foundation should be renamed the Fiat Foundation if they aren't going to take this seriously. Besides, the miners aren't going to let anything get changed to track taint anyway, so why would the devs even talk about this.
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July 02, 2022, 02:01:19 AM


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