Third alt coin thread last two were too big. Builds links thoughts etc

[thedue]

GPU mining will be dead

Like the last years? 
Why keep people telling this... 

[philipma1957]

@citronick

I am curious to hear your investors strategy

I typically hold all my coins earned, pay for everything in fiat, and resell old gear to buy new gear to grow my hash power. However, thinking of investing my coins into new gear if ROI is fairly quick which will allow a larger growth in hash power

I am a retiree ... me and a few retired buddies decided to invest in BTC and ETH mining and trading in 2015.

If you can get a few buddies to co-invest... then you can explore larger farms and more diverse mining or trading. Explore Phil's smart strategy too.

Its good to be a miner this year!

Good luck to all of us this year and beyond.

Some advanced retirees there...respect!
My 2c...sometimes it is not even that important to have the most recent card.
One can buy Asus R9 380 4gb for $100 quite easily and it does at least 20Mh/s in eth or $43/mo, currently.
Even with $8-10 electricity, the card if free in 3 mo, much faster than RX 480 in eth or 1080 in zec. Granted, you can get more total hash with better cards, but also more initial outlay.

My game plan is to mine until eth goes POS, then stake with 30% of the coins. A good excuse to buy a nice computer.

ETH will switch to PoS ? When will it happen ? I can tell you that the day it will happen, GPU mining will be dead, as you will have plenty of GPUs switching to other altcoins and that will hammer to death any profitability on those.

GPU mining will be dead

Like the last years? 
Why keep people telling this... 

Some people  want to scare off buyers of gpu/pc rigs.

Time and time again  I have said encourage  need gpu miners.

My reason applies to  gpu/pc mining only.

has anyone watched intel commercials with the guy from big bang theory.  They spend money  to get you to buy intel gear.

Well the pc/desktop/gpu/gaming industry has slumped  as people want small things not desk tops.

the mining craze helps so many companies  they can buy some coin to make us  want more mining gear.

So I encourage anyone that games  to mine while they sleep.
I believe that  more gpu mining  will cause

Intel
Amd
Nvidia
every mobo company
every psu company
every ram company
every ssd company

to toss some money  at alt coins  so that we are willing o expand our mining farms.

[xleejohnx]

Very good info, exactly what I was looking for. thanks guys!

What is the best place to buy GPU gear with btc?

if you are in the USA go with conbase and get their swift debt card
it can be used anywhere and there are no fees right now for using the card
so you connect it with your btc account on coinbase and bammm never have to worry about who takes  btc anymore


it also have a limit setter so you dont have to worry about someone getting the info and emptying out the account
it will also send messages to your phone when the card was used and where

i have one and it works great never had a issue but once when i was trying to buy something from over seas

[64dimensions]

[/quote]

Some advanced retirees there...respect!
My 2c...sometimes it is not even that important to have the most recent card.
One can buy Asus R9 380 4gb for $100 quite easily and it does at least 20Mh/s in eth or $43/mo, currently.
Even with $8-10 electricity, the card if free in 3 mo, much faster than RX 480 in eth or 1080 in zec. Granted, you can get more total hash with better cards, but also more initial outlay.

My game plan is to mine until eth goes POS, then stake with 30% of the coins. A good excuse to buy a nice computer.
[/quote]

IMHO the ASUS R9 380 has other advantages over other 380 cards:

a) The cooler is somewhat larger.

b) The low power sweet spot is around 800/1500 and still hashes at 20+

[Biodom]

ETH will switch to PoS ? When will it happen ? I can tell you that the day it will happen, GPU mining will be dead, as you will have plenty of GPUs switching to other altcoins and that will hammer to death any profitability on those.

This had been planned from the get go and is fully explained in the road map.
Casper (Ethereum) is supposed to switch to POS, maybe in 2018, so plenty of time still.
Hedging BTC with alts makes perfect sense.
I like it how different coins have their various strengths and weaknesses, it is almost like evolution, only million time faster.
Rotating between some btc, some cash , some alts makes perfect sense to me, but it is the details that matter.

[vg54dett]

H81 pro BTC , H97 anniversary and MSI gaming 5 motherboards are out of stock almost everywhere.

Is there any other mobo that can handle 7 GPUs ?

(I know most of you doesn't build 7GPUs rigs, but maybe some have the knowledge anyway)

(Edit : Asrock mobos handle 7 GPUs using the PCI-e 3x splitter)

[Biodom]

H81 pro BTC , H97 anniversary and MSI gaming 5 motherboards are out of stock almost everywhere.

Is there any other mobo that can handle 7 GPUs ?

(I know most of you doesn't build 7GPUs rigs, but maybe some have the knowledge anyway)

H81 pro BTC and H97 anniversary are 6 GPU anyway.
Another 6 GPU is ASUS Z170-AR
Not sure if it is good or bad (lots of open boxes at Microcenter, but salespeople say that returns are similar in % to other mobos, just that they sell more of Z170-ARs).

[philipma1957]

H81 pro BTC , H97 anniversary and MSI gaming 5 motherboards are out of stock almost everywhere.

Is there any other mobo that can handle 7 GPUs ?

(I know most of you doesn't build 7GPUs rigs, but maybe some have the knowledge anyway)

this one should do six


https://www.amazon.com/GIGABYTE-GA-Z270P-D3-Crossfire-Motherboard-Motherboards/dp/B01N2V0AHI/ref=sr_1_2?


I know it does 5  as I got it to work on five.

[GabryRox]

H81 pro BTC , H97 anniversary and MSI gaming 5 motherboards are out of stock almost everywhere.

Is there any other mobo that can handle 7 GPUs ?

(I know most of you doesn't build 7GPUs rigs, but maybe some have the knowledge anyway)

this one should do six


https://www.amazon.com/GIGABYTE-GA-Z270P-D3-Crossfire-Motherboard-Motherboards/dp/B01N2V0AHI/ref=sr_1_2?


I know it does 5  as I got it to work on five.

Another one to look for (although it too is currently out of stock everywhere that I have checked) is the Biostar TB85. Since this board is very similar to the 2 ASRock's mentioned above in that it was specifically made for 6-GPU mining rigs, I would assume it would at least be a good candidate for being able to support 7 GPUs.  I was very lucky to get 2 of these about a month ago when NewEgg had them briefly in stock.  Now, as you say, pretty much impossible to find any of these mobos... at least for anything close to retail.

Mobo shortage is one thing, but have you guys noticed the severe shortage of MSI rx 470 4GB lately?  Many places are out of stock and the ones that have any are selling it for well over $200 now.  Again, I was very lucky here in that I ordered 7 from 3 places about 10 days ago for an average price of about $160.

- 4 from Jet at $152/ea - price on Jet now... $399!!!
- 2 from MicroCenter (1 for $185, 1 for $160 after rebate) - MC still has at $185 but only for in-store pickup and they are not in my state
- 1 from B&H Photo for $180 - they are now out of stock

Amazon:  amazon proper out of stock, lowest price from Amazon 3rd party sellers is $250
NewEgg:  in stock but from 3rd party seller at $255

It's amazing what a spike in altcoin prices can do to supply of these things. It's one thing when the Baikal supply dried up with the spike of Dash to $100, but this is something on another level.  While I count myself lucky to have gotten a hold 7 for a bit over $1k, I am also kicking myself because right after I placed that 4 GPU order with Jet, I searched it again to see if I could have gotten the same deal and indeed, it was available for the same price.  But, for whatever reason, i didn't pull the trigger and when I went back in the next few days the GPUs were either not available or averaging well over $200. But, at least I got enough to build my 4th rig.  Will be interesting to see how long this lasts.

[GabryRox]

Anyone here had any issues with strap-modding MSI 470 4gb?  I built my 4th rig yesterday... got 2 new 470s up and running smoothly on ETH+DCR but when I tried strap-modding each, it appeared to work fine but upon reboot, both showed up with an error in Device Manager and were not recognized.

This occurred trying them 1 at a time. First, I did device 0, which has Samsung memory, so I strap-modded using the 1750 timings. It appeared to take but after reboot, I got the login & desktop screens in extra-large text (like before the AMD drivers are installed). Then sure enough, the GPU was not recognized. This is the GPU i have my monitor plugged into.  Tried reboots to no avail, so flashed the ROM back to original and it worked fine after the reboot.

Next, I tried the strap-mod on device 1 (Hynix) copying the timings from 1500.  Again, appeared to update fine but after reboot, device manager did not recognize it.  Flashed back to original ROM and it's fine again.

Has anyone experienced this or have suggestions on what to try to fix it?  This is an almost identical build to my last rig, which took all strap-mods fine on first attempt. The only real difference is that I am using a Biostar TB85 mobo (vs the ASRock BTC Pro 2 in my last 2 builds) but I can't imagine that being the issue.

A similar thing did happen to me on my 2nd rig, but I soon moved to W10 (from W7) and since was able to strap-mod all without issue.

The only thing I can think of (but doesn't seem likely) is that I got the 2 mixed up and flashed with the wrong mod (Samsung 1750 vs Hynix 1500) but I went based the order GPUs are listed in GPU-z.  Based on my last 2 rig's setup, GPUz seemed to be the only consistent way to determine device #, but maybe that was just luck.  Meaning, the first GPU in the drop-down is device 0 and the last is device 5.  I suppose it's possible that I added the GPUs in a different order on the other 2 rigs because on this one, I added the first in the x16 slot, then the 2nd to the first x1 slot, which could have mixed things up device wise, since I think I added them in line order last 2 rigs.  Anyway, probably the best thing to do it take out that Hynix from the x1 slot and add a Samsung there (assuming i have another Samsung) and then try to 1750-mod them both and see what happens.  That's probably quicker and easier than un-installing everything and re-installing in line order.

Anyway, any tips or similar experiences would be appreciated!

[philipma1957]

Anyone here had any issues with strap-modding MSI 470 4gb?  I built my 4th rig yesterday... got 2 new 470s up and running smoothly on ETH+DCR but when I tried strap-modding each, it appeared to work fine but upon reboot, both showed up with an error in Device Manager and were not recognized.

This occurred trying them 1 at a time. First, I did device 0, which has Samsung memory, so I strap-modded using the 1750 timings. It appeared to take but after reboot, I got the login & desktop screens in extra-large text (like before the AMD drivers are installed). Then sure enough, the GPU was not recognized. This is the GPU i have my monitor plugged into.  Tried reboots to no avail, so flashed the ROM back to original and it worked fine after the reboot.

Next, I tried the strap-mod on device 1 (Hynix) copying the timings from 1500.  Again, appeared to update fine but after reboot, device manager did not recognize it.  Flashed back to original ROM and it's fine again.

Has anyone experienced this or have suggestions on what to try to fix it?  This is an almost identical build to my last rig, which took all strap-mods fine on first attempt. The only real difference is that I am using a Biostar TB85 mobo (vs the ASRock BTC Pro 2 in my last 2 builds) but I can't imagine that being the issue.

A similar thing did happen to me on my 2nd rig, but I soon moved to W10 (from W7) and since was able to strap-mod all without issue.

The only thing I can think of (but doesn't seem likely) is that I got the 2 mixed up and flashed with the wrong mod (Samsung 1750 vs Hynix 1500) but I went based the order GPUs are listed in GPU-z.  Based on my last 2 rig's setup, GPUz seemed to be the only consistent way to determine device #, but maybe that was just luck.  Meaning, the first GPU in the drop-down is device 0 and the last is device 5.  I suppose it's possible that I added the GPUs in a different order on the other 2 rigs because on this one, I added the first in the x16 slot, then the 2nd to the first x1 slot, which could have mixed things up device wise, since I think I added them in line order last 2 rigs.  Anyway, probably the best thing to do it take out that Hynix from the x1 slot and add a Samsung there (assuming i have another Samsung) and then try to 1750-mod them both and see what happens.  That's probably quicker and easier than un-installing everything and re-installing in line order.

Anyway, any tips or similar experiences would be appreciated!

gpu order on gpu-z could be weird due to different rams

try 1 rx 470   put the other one in another room to avoid confusion.

check it to see if it is the samsung  if it is flash it as a samsung.

some where I read weird things can happen on some samsung ram

[GabryRox]

well, it took me over 2 hours but i FINALLY got a measly 2 strap-1500 Hynix GPU's up and running solidly.  I tried pretty much every combination of 1 or 2 GPUs between 2 Samsungs and 2 Hynix but nothing would work after strapping either 1500 or 1750. Finally, I re-checked the driver version and found that this new rig (#4) was running 16.30, not 16.40 like my other 2 Win10 rigs.  I thought I checked that already but probably just missed the 1 digit difference.  I do remember reading a thread a while back about a few rogue driver versions that didn't jive well with strap modding, so I assume 16.30 is one of those.

Anyway, while that helped, it didn't solve every problem. After I got the 1st modded Hynix up and running, I plugged in another Hynix (pre-mod) but when I booted up, it screwed up the first GPU again. The only way I was able to fix it was uninstalling & reinstalling the drivers again, then it recognized both. Then I modded the 2nd and rebooted and it's been running fine overclocked and undervolted on ETH+DRC for almost 3 hours now.

One thing i noticed that is different with this rig is that every time I plug in a new GPU, i get 2 false starts before it actually boots. Never had this with the other rigs so assuming it may be something to do with the mobo since that's really the only varying factor.  Now it's too late to mess with this anymore and I want it to run overnight even if with only 2 GPUs, but tomorrow I think I will try adding 2 GPUs at a time because I really do not want to have to uninstall and reinstall drivers 4 more times to get this thing going with 6!

[QuintLeo]

Mobo shortage is one thing, but have you guys noticed the severe shortage of MSI rx 470 4GB lately?

 *ALL* RX 4xx series cards are being discontinued as AMD has shifted production to the RX 5xx series leaving the RX 4xx cards limited to stock/chips on hand.
 Availability issues on the RX 4xx series has ZERO to do with "altcoin pricing" at this point.

 Similarly, AMD seems to have ended production of the chips for the Fury line a couple-three months back anticipating the impending release of the VEGA cards.

[QuintLeo]

Very good info, exactly what I was looking for. thanks guys!

What is the best place to buy GPU gear with btc?

 NewEgg has been very good at selling gear to me for BTC.

[philipma1957]

Mobo shortage is one thing, but have you guys noticed the severe shortage of MSI rx 470 4GB lately?

 *ALL* RX 4xx series cards are being discontinued as AMD has shifted production to the RX 5xx series leaving the RX 4xx cards limited to stock/chips on hand.
 Availability issues on the RX 4xx series has ZERO to do with "altcoin pricing" at this point.

 Similarly, AMD seems to have ended production of the chips for the Fury line a couple-three months back anticipating the impending release of the VEGA cards.

Did it occur to you  that  they stopped making  the rx 470 and rx 480  switching to the rx 570 and rx 580   with no "real" upgrade simply  due to the hotness of the gpu coin world.

they  did the  7970  to r 280  which is basically the same card  in the midst of  ltc hotness  back in the day.

seems to me they are doing this to make $$ on cards.

Here what happens  the rx 470 and rx 480 all dry up.  They hold back the rx 570 and rx 580 just a bit  they then come out at top dollar and miners  will buy

Just tossing it out as a thought.

Today I ordered  my third nvidia 1080ti  got it at best buy.



http://www.bestbuy.com/site/pny-founders-edition-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-11gb-gddr5x-pci-express-3-0-graphics-card/5793701.p?

tax is 7%  rebate via best buy points is 6%    so it was 707 usd.  I have elite plus status  so I get a 45 day return policy on it.

so I will soon have a 2500 four card rig pulling only 785 watts for zec.

[d57heinz]

i bought from this seller the tb 85 from ebay.  then i checked out their store.. they have a bunch of parts for gear.. as well as payment by paypal and btc.  Prices can be a bit high on some things but if ya need parts it looks like a decent store.  good to have many sources for these parts.

http://deepinthemines.com

BR

[DevonMiner]

My 1080ti arrived a day late today ... I've not mined with Nvidia before ... so time for a few tests/tweaks ... using the latest 381.65 driver.

Straight off the bat (without making any voltage adjustments etc.) it's QUICK for sure! ... and throws out a fair amount of heat as well, fans set to 70% to keeps temp around 64 degrees.

Nicehash miner only offers to benchmark one algo, being Lyra2REv2: 63 MH/s, 282 watts rig draw at around $4.87 per day.

EWBF ZEC miner on Nicehash: 700 sols (fluctuates down to 682 sometimes), 291 watts rig draw at around $4.64 per day.

Nicehash Excavator: Equihash algo, 660 sols, 292 watts rig draw but it fluctuates wildly.

All the above are only 15/20 minute sessions so might be out a bit.

I hadn't even considered it might be suitable for Lyra2REv2, interesting GPU this.

Time to play with AfterBurner and see what can be tweaked, the core voltage seems to be locked? There must be a way to unlock that?

[d57heinz]

i realize this is OT but i came across this article today.  Really rather interesting.  I know back in the day on the diff threads we would always speculate what hw was still online and where the difficulty would head next. This guy gives a rather in depth analysis of the current power use of the bitcoin network.  good stuff!

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/op-ed-bitcoin-miners-consume-reasonable-amount-energy-and-its-all-worth-it/

BR

[philipma1957]

My 1080ti arrived a day late today ... I've not mined with Nvidia before ... so time for a few tests/tweaks ... using the latest 381.65 driver.

Straight off the bat (without making any voltage adjustments etc.) it's QUICK for sure! ... and throws out a fair amount of heat as well, fans set to 70% to keeps temp around 64 degrees.

Nicehash miner only offers to benchmark one algo, being Lyra2REv2: 63 MH/s, 282 watts rig draw at around $4.87 per day.

EWBF ZEC miner on Nicehash: 700 sols (fluctuates down to 682 sometimes), 291 watts rig draw at around $4.64 per day.

Nicehash Excavator: Equihash algo, 660 sols, 292 watts rig draw but it fluctuates wildly.

All the above are only 15/20 minute sessions so might be out a bit.

I hadn't even considered it might be suitable for Lyra2REv2, interesting GPU this.

Time to play with AfterBurner and see what can be tweaked, the core voltage seems to be locked? There must be a way to unlock that?

.

not sure about core unlock..

I think 378.78 driver may be better.

my entire rig is about 220 watts for 1 1080ti  at 70% power   giving 716 h  on th better   aorus 1080 ti

vs same watts  but 660 h on the zotac 1080 ti fe.  same settings.

I do have a 1500 watt titanium psu from rosewill
since I do 3 soon to be 4 cards  I am well under the 1500 watt max so my psu is 93-94%

I have a i5 6400 t cpu also a power saver and finally 1 stick of ddr4 ram a power saver.
along with a 128 gb samsung ssd.

this could be why a get 220 one card at the wall vs you getting 293 one card at the wall.

@ d57Heinz   I think  he is a bit off  with his best guess and high range numbers

he does not take into account people with super low power...   or people that winter heat with older s-3's  .

In my area we have 3 or 4 senior citizen developments that use electric heat.  No heat pump just baseboard radiators .  I know of a few people heating with s-3's the power cost is exactly the same as it would be for using the baseboard radiator.   so a 400 dollar bill  for 4 months is common for them.  but they get back btc.

so spend 400  either way  but the s-3 way you get around 100 a month back in btc. that is with 10 cent power.

also  with limited free power which some people have  3 s-3's will gen 30 a month.

So My guess is he is a bit off  as he leaves that  out a bit.
so maybe the best guess is 5-10% low and the high number is 5-10 too low.

but more of a gut feeling then a truth.

[vg54dett]

I have two question about simpleminer OS :

-is it possible to use different "bats" (custom miner option) for the different rigs in the same dashboard ? or do we have to make different hashboard with different mail address if we want to split between few pools or personnalize settings per rig ?

-is it possible to read past logs ? because I see a rig sometimes reboot when I'm away, I guess a GPU sometimes hang, but I don't know which one as I'm not in front of it when it occurs.