[OLD] Eligius: ASIC, no registration, no fee CPPSRB BTC + 105% PPS NMC, 877 #

[imsaguy]

I think all miners should demand more explicit rules/agreements with regard to how their hashing power will be used. Don't leave it up to 'verbal' agreements, 'common sense', etc.  Spell it out.  That is the only way to protect yourself.

[1714110159]

1714110159

[bitlane]

My thread in regards to "Pool Ops being the new Alt Coin Police" has been DELETED from the Pools Forum.

Censorship at it's finest.

I feel as though I am about to be banned....and I guess that makes sense, considering this forum allows scammers of all sorts to thrive in the Marketplace without consequence, yet a LEGITIMATE POST in regards to a malicious act of vandalism is deleted from view.

Par for the course, as it seems.
Just in case this is my last post, thanks for the memories.

I am still waiting for gmaxwell to answer why my thread was deleted, before we get too far and forget about this.
That thread was DIRECTLY related to this discussion and was about as ON TOPIC as one can get, under the circumstances.

Both THIS post and that thread belong where they were intended.

[imsaguy]

I am still waiting for gmaxwell to answer why my thread was deleted, before we get too far and forget about this.

Don't worry, its just one developer looking out for another.

There are several mods, more than just gmaxwell.  Be careful with the accusations.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Well that is the first thing I thought of when I seen all them blocks starting to fly by when he pulled a scumbag slush move by secretly starting to mine with massive hash power, when people start doing things undercover on the down low they usually have something to hide. And there he is claiming to be a god faring man, yeah right.

People are require to notify you when they mine? 

[bitlane]

I am still waiting for gmaxwell to answer why my thread was deleted, before we get too far and forget about this.

Don't worry, its just one developer looking out for another.

There are several mods, more than just gmaxwell.  Be careful with the accusations.

It's not an accusation, just a question, as he was the most active in the discussion and might have insight./

[DeathAndTaxes]

I think all miners should demand more explicit rules/agreements with regard to how their hashing power will be used. Don't leave it up to 'verbal' agreements, 'common sense', etc.  Spell it out.  That is the only way to protect yourself.

Protect themselves?  How was a miner in the pool harmed?

[imsaguy]

I think all miners should demand more explicit rules/agreements with regard to how their hashing power will be used. Don't leave it up to 'verbal' agreements, 'common sense', etc.  Spell it out.  That is the only way to protect yourself.

Protect themselves?  How was a miner in the pool harmed?

They haven't been.  My point is that if they are afraid of what a pool may/may not do on a whim, they should get it all spelled out so everyone has the same expectations.

[imsaguy]

There's an ongoing discussion in #bitcoin-otc about this right now.

Direct quote:

Code:

<btc_novice> luke-jr also, it was unethical to take your users' hashing power and use it for other purposes
<+luke-jr> btc_novice: I didn't.
<btc_novice> luke-jr did you use your hashing power, or eligius combined hashing power?
<+luke-jr> btc_novice: all hashing involving CLC was done by me

[Littleshop]

My thread in regards to "Pool Ops being the new Alt Coin Police" has been DELETED from the Pools Forum.

Censorship at it's finest.

I feel as though I am about to be banned....and I guess that makes sense, considering this forum allows scammers of all sorts to thrive in the Marketplace without consequence, yet a LEGITIMATE POST in regards to a malicious act of vandalism is deleted from view.

Par for the course, as it seems.
Just in case this is my last post, thanks for the memories.

I am still waiting for gmaxwell to answer why my thread was deleted, before we get too far and forget about this.
That thread was DIRECTLY related to this discussion and was about as ON TOPIC as one can get, under the circumstances.

Both THIS post and that thread belong where they were intended.

I have posted a message about this censorship in META.  Hopefully there will be an appropriate response. 

[bitlane]

I guess gmaxwell has said all he wants to say at this point, in the earlier quote that was posted...when talking about the CLC demise.

Code:

[10:31]	luke-jr	coblee: I didn't orphan anything mature
[10:31]	coblee	luke-jr: oh ok
[10:32]	luke-jr	I intentionally avoided anyone actually losing money
[10:32]	coblee	so just mining, not including transactions, and dumping?
[10:33]	luke-jr	coblee: actually, I decided it was better not to dump
[10:33]	luke-jr	coblee: I've also asked BTC-e to reverse the dumping I did earlier
[10:33]	coblee	how would they reverse the dumping?
[10:33]	gmaxwell	presumably the counterparties would rather have their btc back.
[10:34]	gmaxwell	So they could just undo the trades, luke didn't withdraw the bitcoin he got.
[10:34]	luke-jr	coblee: well, presuming by dumping, we mean "selling"
[10:34]	TuxBlackEdo	what happen?
[10:34]	TuxBlackEdo	and why are we still awake?
[10:35]	coblee	this is pretty funny
[10:35]	luke-jr	TuxBlackEdo: I effectively disabled the latest scamcoin
[10:35]	gmaxwell	TuxBlackEdo: a new altcoin showed up out of nowhere.. complete with an exchange and a bunch of eager ponzi pumpers.
[10:35]	_W_	TuxBlackEdo, it's morning here
[10:35]	gmaxwell	TuxBlackEdo: and look took charge of the chain.
[10:35]	TuxBlackEdo	coilcoin, right?
[10:35]	luke-jr	Coiled*
[10:36]	gmaxwell	And some people who were planing to make money fast, are none too happy that they can't get any blocks or txn in, and that luke crashed the price on the market.
[10:36]	luke-jr	why is artforz helping them workaround it?
[10:36]	gmaxwell	Awesome. The race is on.
[10:36]	luke-jr	gmaxwell: well, he's just encouraging them to get BTCGuild onboard "next time" -.-
[10:36]	luke-jr	nothing fancy
[10:37]	TuxBlackEdo	instead of crashing the price of a alt chain we should try to somehow make the price of namecoin go through the roof
[10:37]	gmaxwell	oh. meh, well fine. Its true— but since the cost of setting up more merged chains is still high— good luck with that.
[10:37]	coblee	they are bashing you on btc-e luke-jr lol
[10:37]	TuxBlackEdo	that's pretty cool though, props luke-jr
[10:37]	luke-jr	TuxBlackEdo: pfft, you abuse namecoin anyway
[10:38]	gmaxwell	coblee: it's a little beyond bashing. At least earlier is was pretty scarry.
[10:38]	TuxBlackEdo	how
[10:38]	luke-jr	TuxBlackEdo: you just sell them
[10:38]	TuxBlackEdo	explain how i "abuse" namecoins?
[10:38]	coblee	scary how?
[10:38]	TuxBlackEdo	I never sold a namecoin
[10:38]	TuxBlackEdo	actually i do the opposite
[10:39]	TuxBlackEdo	while everyone was selling i was setting up big buy orders
[10:39]	luke-jr	TuxBlackEdo: then why do you want price up?
[10:39]	TuxBlackEdo	i own a ton of namecoins
[10:40]	TuxBlackEdo	ill move some namecoins right now to prove
[10:40]	gmaxwell	TuxBlackEdo: I'll give you an address to move them to.
[10:40]	TuxBlackEdo	hehe
[10:40]	TuxBlackEdo	ill move them to
[10:40]	luke-jr	lol
[10:41]	TuxBlackEdo	MxbmJyLDcqTmuzcQoGjPen4fW3AdkNLqBP
[10:41]	TuxBlackEdo	done
[10:42]	TuxBlackEdo	a412edf5e41529582f138cbc4bd3991203150fab4797fc472853dedd730b5ca9
[10:43]	gmaxwell	hahah
[10:43]	gmaxwell	castonbtce: so what can we say CLC stands for?
[10:43]	gmaxwell	castonbtce: crazy loser coin?
[10:43]	gmaxwell	k65onyx: catastrophic loss of coins?
[10:43]	gmaxwell	artforz: lol
[10:43]	gmaxwell	castonbtce: cunt luke coin
[10:44]	luke-jr	hmm
[10:44]	luke-jr	just in case I accidentally orphaned some non-generation, I just let them all through a few blocks ago
[10:44]	luke-jr	bet they don't notice <.<
[10:45]	doublec	I saw them
[10:45]	gmaxwell	well they were saying that you'd stopped earlier, so who knows.
[10:47]	TuxBlackEdo	how long is namecoin going to take to generate a block...
[10:48]	JFK911	;;bc,stats
[10:48]	gribble	Current Blocks: 160874 | Current Difficulty: 1159929.4972244 | Next Difficulty At Block: 161279 | Next Difficulty In: 405 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 14 hours, 46 minutes, and 30 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1221673.16179828 | Estimated Percent Change: 5.32305323054
[10:51]	luke-jr	reckon I should leave it on overnight?
[10:51]	TuxBlackEdo	luke-jr, http://explorer.dot-bit.org/a/MxbmJyLDcqTmuzcQoGjPen4fW3AdkNLqBP

[gmaxwell]

I am still waiting for gmaxwell to answer why my thread was deleted, before we get too far and forget about this.
That thread was DIRECTLY related to this discussion and was about as ON TOPIC as one can get, under the circumstances.

Both THIS post and that thread belong where they were intended.

T'wasn't me. Though I doubt that is going to discourage your attempted character assassinations in the slightest. Apparently, the ALT-coin way is to ineptly try to make people afraid of being critical, or of pointing out (/demonstrating) the fragility of the alt-coin ecosystem. :-/  

(Not to mention the fact that the thread in question is right here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=56791.0)

But as I pointed out before (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=23768.msg677202#msg677202), the apparent effort to get away with horrific over the top verbal abuse by attacking your critics and then claiming a conflict of interest simply isn't going to work.

[Turbor]

I can take it that since the admin/mods deleted my posts in an on topic thread that they support luke and his immoral ungodly actions? Why is this forum, something that I support with bitcoins weekly doing this? luke is an asshole, he abused his power and broke trust, but this forum broke mine. Why were my posts censored???

WTF is this shit?

I bitched about rogue mods before and guess who it is again... yeah ban me you cock sucker. Censor my ass..  

Sad enough that some of the mods seemd involved in this shabby action !

[bitlane]

Though I doubt that is going to discourage your attempted character assassinations in the slightest.

Actually, you did a pretty good job of that to yourself, with your performance in the above chat log that I re-posted.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=23768.msg677863#msg677863
No harm no foul...LOL

[gmaxwell]

Though I doubt that is going to discourage your attempted character assassinations in the slightest.

Actually, you did a pretty good job of that to yourself, with your performance in the above chat log that I re-posted.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=23768.msg677863#msg677863
No harm no foul...LOL

I don't believe I advanced any positions there that I haven't advanced here.  Thanks for the retractions of your false allegations, by the way, oh wait. You didn't bother.

Sad enough that some of the mods seemd involved in this shabby action !

My involvement is limited to disagreeing with the people who are very upset about this.  Instead I think this is an interesting and informative exercise in the area of bitcoin and alt-chain security which was conducted in a non-harmful (/minimally harmful, I regret that my positions have upset Makomk) manner, and I hope it will be a useful learning experience for all involved.

[imsaguy]

Did deepbit just delete his post or did a mod do that?

He did, since gmaxwell is defending himself now..

[bitlane]

I don't believe I advanced any positions there that I haven't advanced here.  Thanks for the retractions of your false allegations, by the way, oh wait. You didn't bother.

The only allegation made against YOU was that you were suspected of being a Lukejr-Cronie......
..and I didn't see the point in removing it, since it was clearly proven TRUE (all by you none the less).

When you first came out casting doubt, offering reason and basically strengthening Luke's position, almost making excuses for him and WHY he did what he did.....people took notice (and some responded).
THEN, when you were quoted as part of the 'Crash Celebration' in an IRC chat log, being sure to credit Luke warmly and openly, the rest of the required pieces seemed to fall into place...almost seamlessly, to finally label you as such: a Lukejr-Cronie.

[Turbor]

People that sabotage others just because they can are rats in my eyes. You can try to talk this nice all day long.

[gmaxwell]

People that sabotage others just because they can are rats in my eyes. You can try to talk this nice all day long.

People who deceive others about the security of alt-chains in order to make a quick buck are rats in mine. Er, well rats is a bit too intense. I think there are a lot of misguided people and a few greedy people (and even more who wonder wtf all this noise is).  ... People who are making all this noise instead of doing something innovative and fixing the problem (hell, I gave several probably adequate solutions) strike me as kinda whiny.  It's like you want your get rich quick without even putting some effort into it.
 

the rest of the required pieces seemed to fall into place...almost seamlessly, to finally label you as such: a Lukejr-Cronie.

Luke is sometimes little crazy but he's intelligent, committed, straight-forward, hard working, and he usually seems pretty kind. (Though I agree blowing up makomk's work so quickly wasn't exactly kind— but neither was Makomk's surprise introduction, surprise altchain introductions maximize the get-rich-quick factor) I've certainly disagreed with Luke, sometimes I think he's overly pedantic and difficult to compromise with. But he's done a number of good things for the Bitcoin community, and I respect him for it. I think it's ironic that more of the code in CoiledCoin was written by (designed by, argued for, and tested by) Luke than the proponents of that chain.

If that makes me a cronie— well, I've been called worse things. Last week I was a patsy to the state or something. I'd wear you allegation with a badge of honor, but it would be too inscrutable to anyone outside of this bizarre little niche of a niche that some people seem to feel is so important.

[markm]

Heh well if advance announcement is a criteria, let me remind everyone once again of such chains as Martian BotCoins, United Kingdom Britcoins, Canadian Digital Notes, CZech Bitcash, bitNicKeLs, General Mining Corp and General Retirement Corp. Just because you don't see them around a lot doesn't mean they are creeping up to surprise anyone, there has been plenty of forewarning of them.

Oh and just because Unthinkingbit didn't have any use for Groupcoins once Devcoins were developed doesn't mean they no longer exist, either. In fact they have merged mining patches now just like Devcoin does, hoped to provide a slight lead time test before Devcoin's merged mining kicked in but in practice I don't think anyone who has figured out how to actually attempt to merged-mine has tried them yet to see if it actually works.

Maybe a bunch more chains would be useful, I wonder how many chains at once Luke would bother setting up to attack? A dozen? Two dozen? A hundred?

-MarkM-

[Turbor]

No matter how intelligent you are if you have no heart people will never respect you. At least in real life...