BiblePay | 10% to Orphan-Charity | RANDOMX MINING | Sanctuaries (Masternodes)

[dave_bbp]

Hello all,

so I've been away the last 2 days and just came home to see that POG officially started. I read all 10 pages of new posts in this thread, then read the POG beginner guide, updated my wallet to 1186 and added "tithe=1" and a nickname to the config.

The wallet starts fine and I see the POG stats etc., but please help me understand these problems:

1. current titheinfo:

Code:

{
  "24_hour_tithes": 128902.4,
  "pog_difficulty": 166639.1616298037,
  "min_coin_age": 60,
  "min_coin_amt": 25000,
  "max_tithe_amount": 1,
  "Tithable_Coin_Quantity": 0,
  "Tithable_Largest_Coin": 0,
  "Tithable_Coin_Avg_Age": 0,
  "Tithable_Total_Coin_Balance": 0,
  "Tithability_Amount": 0,
  "Tithability_Summary": "NO",
  "Tithe_Cap": 50694,
  "Daily_Miner_Emissions": 94628,
  "Pool_Emissions": 75702.40000000001,
  "Lowest_ROI%": 16.5,
  "Highest_ROI%": -35
}

The guide says "maximum difficulty = 65535" and "maximum tithe per day approx. 100k". So how come both these values are way out of specification (and why does the wallet report "tithe_cap 50694"?

2. Up to today I did not cap my utxoamount. Does that mean that probably my current coin age is 0 for all my balance and I cannot receive POG payments (as of now) for 2 months??

3. Why does "exec bankroll x y" always return "Signing transaction failed", no matter which values for x and y I try (even tried 1 1)?

[1715551228]

1715551228

[1715551228]

1715551228

[slovakia]

diff 166k? total tithe over 50k? wasnt max 50k?

yes its normal for new users, muhahahahahaha..... all idea of POG is broken     users=37 ppl ....


sunk=stop pls spam here......

[vahtis]

Hello all,

so I've been away the last 2 days and just came home to see that POG officially started. I read all 10 pages of new posts in this thread, then read the POG beginner guide, updated my wallet to 1186 and added "tithe=1" and a nickname to the config.

The wallet starts fine and I see the POG stats etc., but please help me understand these problems:

1. current titheinfo:

Code:

{
  "24_hour_tithes": 128902.4,
  "pog_difficulty": 166639.1616298037,
  "min_coin_age": 60,
  "min_coin_amt": 25000,
  "max_tithe_amount": 1,
  "Tithable_Coin_Quantity": 0,
  "Tithable_Largest_Coin": 0,
  "Tithable_Coin_Avg_Age": 0,
  "Tithable_Total_Coin_Balance": 0,
  "Tithability_Amount": 0,
  "Tithability_Summary": "NO",
  "Tithe_Cap": 50694,
  "Daily_Miner_Emissions": 94628,
  "Pool_Emissions": 75702.40000000001,
  "Lowest_ROI%": 16.5,
  "Highest_ROI%": -35
}

The guide says "maximum difficulty = 65535" and "maximum tithe per day approx. 100k". So how come both these values are way out of specification (and why does the wallet report "tithe_cap 50694"?

2. Up to today I did not cap my utxoamount. Does that mean that probably my current coin age is 0 for all my balance and I cannot receive POG payments (as of now) for 2 months??

3. Why does "exec bankroll x y" always return "Signing transaction failed", no matter which values for x and y I try (even tried 1 1)?

For the second question is that yes all your coins are aged 0.

[slavino]

that POG looks very bad for me and others.....i doubt that was good step for us.....

diff 166k  

sunk818 whats your problem with slovak people?slovakia helped more new miners here.....and you?


bible_pay my friend bought 100 000bbp and tithes and told me that was err   ... where is problem for new miners? its not rentabile what we see

[Sakic]

Hello all,

so I've been away the last 2 days and just came home to see that POG officially started. I read all 10 pages of new posts in this thread, then read the POG beginner guide, updated my wallet to 1186 and added "tithe=1" and a nickname to the config.

The wallet starts fine and I see the POG stats etc., but please help me understand these problems:

1. current titheinfo:

Code:

{
  "24_hour_tithes": 128902.4,
  "pog_difficulty": 166639.1616298037,
  "min_coin_age": 60,
  "min_coin_amt": 25000,
  "max_tithe_amount": 1,
  "Tithable_Coin_Quantity": 0,
  "Tithable_Largest_Coin": 0,
  "Tithable_Coin_Avg_Age": 0,
  "Tithable_Total_Coin_Balance": 0,
  "Tithability_Amount": 0,
  "Tithability_Summary": "NO",
  "Tithe_Cap": 50694,
  "Daily_Miner_Emissions": 94628,
  "Pool_Emissions": 75702.40000000001,
  "Lowest_ROI%": 16.5,
  "Highest_ROI%": -35
}

The guide says "maximum difficulty = 65535" and "maximum tithe per day approx. 100k". So how come both these values are way out of specification (and why does the wallet report "tithe_cap 50694"?

2. Up to today I did not cap my utxoamount. Does that mean that probably my current coin age is 0 for all my balance and I cannot receive POG payments (as of now) for 2 months??

3. Why does "exec bankroll x y" always return "Signing transaction failed", no matter which values for x and y I try (even tried 1 1)?

3. you have to unlock your wallet first

[bible_pay]

Hello all,

so I've been away the last 2 days and just came home to see that POG officially started. I read all 10 pages of new posts in this thread, then read the POG beginner guide, updated my wallet to 1186 and added "tithe=1" and a nickname to the config.

The wallet starts fine and I see the POG stats etc., but please help me understand these problems:

1. current titheinfo:

Code:

{
  "24_hour_tithes": 128902.4,
  "pog_difficulty": 166639.1616298037,
  "min_coin_age": 60,
  "min_coin_amt": 25000,
  "max_tithe_amount": 1,
  "Tithable_Coin_Quantity": 0,
  "Tithable_Largest_Coin": 0,
  "Tithable_Coin_Avg_Age": 0,
  "Tithable_Total_Coin_Balance": 0,
  "Tithability_Amount": 0,
  "Tithability_Summary": "NO",
  "Tithe_Cap": 50694,
  "Daily_Miner_Emissions": 94628,
  "Pool_Emissions": 75702.40000000001,
  "Lowest_ROI%": 16.5,
  "Highest_ROI%": -35
}

The guide says "maximum difficulty = 65535" and "maximum tithe per day approx. 100k". So how come both these values are way out of specification (and why does the wallet report "tithe_cap 50694"?

2. Up to today I did not cap my utxoamount. Does that mean that probably my current coin age is 0 for all my balance and I cannot receive POG payments (as of now) for 2 months??

3. Why does "exec bankroll x y" always return "Signing transaction failed", no matter which values for x and y I try (even tried 1 1)?

On #1, Ill modify the guide - maximum diff is infinity, but diff > 65535 has the same hardness up to infinity.
On #2, Yes, no aged coins.
On #3, Wallet must be unlocked first.

[bible_pay]

that POG looks very bad for me and others.....i doubt that was good step for us.....

diff 166k  

sunk818 whats your problem with slovak people?slovakia helped more new miners here.....and you?


bible_pay my friend bought 100 000bbp and tithes and told me that was err   ... where is problem for new miners? its not rentabile what we see

Time will tell, I disagree, I think we will have 500 distinct POG mining addresses within 30 days.

I think we will write a report that shows distinct POG miners over 30 days, trending, since not every miner mines a block per day.

The rest of your post is incomprehensible.

[bible_pay]

diff 166k? total tithe over 50k? wasnt max 50k?

yes its normal for new users, muhahahahahaha..... all idea of POG is broken     users=37 ppl ....


sunk=stop pls spam here......

Nothing is broken, only 37 have enough coin-age to tithe so far.

We will see the total distinct users over 30 days and then you can apologize.

I updated the guide regarding the diff.  It's correct as-is.

[jaapgvk]

Rob (and everyone who helped), congratulations on the successful start of POG! I was on the sidelines for just a few months, and a whole new idea has been materialized

I'm running POG on auto with coins with a coinage of just 5 days, and I received my first reward today Let's see how this will develop!

[dave_bbp]

Ah I see, thanks guys, now the "bankroll" went through. I thought the unlock for this was already covered by the PODC unlock you make at wallet startup.
Thank you rob for clearing up the diff.

I checked back with my utxoreport and it seems like my wallet did NOT use all my coins over the last couple of weeks, but nevertheless I seem to have no "aged" coins, that seems strange.

[sunk818]

Ah I see, thanks guys, now the "bankroll" went through. I thought the unlock for this was already covered by the PODC unlock you make at wallet startup.
Thank you rob for clearing up the diff.

I checked back with my utxoreport and it seems like my wallet did NOT use all my coins over the last couple of weeks, but nevertheless I seem to have no "aged" coins, that seems strange.

If you did an exec bankroll then all those coins split into different denominations would be 0.

@Rob - seeing some weirdness with PoG difficulty set at 0, and min coin age display 0 when I click on "PoG Tithe?" checkbox.

I was able to tithe even though PoG difficulty is thru the roof.

Tithe Ability shows Qty 3 but none of the remaining can actually tithe. Even though MinCoinValue says 1 in red text, I believe behind the scenes, the min coin value is actually greater.

[slovakia]

it looks that POG crashed 

[bible_pay]

Ah I see, thanks guys, now the "bankroll" went through. I thought the unlock for this was already covered by the PODC unlock you make at wallet startup.
Thank you rob for clearing up the diff.

I checked back with my utxoreport and it seems like my wallet did NOT use all my coins over the last couple of weeks, but nevertheless I seem to have no "aged" coins, that seems strange.

If you did an exec bankroll then all those coins split into different denominations would be 0.

@Rob - seeing some weirdness with PoG difficulty set at 0, and min coin age display 0 when I click on "PoG Tithe?" checkbox.

I was able to tithe even though PoG difficulty is thru the roof.

Tithe Ability shows Qty 3 but none of the remaining can actually tithe. Even though MinCoinValue says 1 in red text, I believe behind the scenes, the min coin value is actually greater.

Pog diff was 0 for 3 blocks because we had 40 blocks with zero tithes behind it.  That normally doesnt happen so this will work itself out as more people tithe consistently.

The checkbox:  The gui doesnt update automatically so you just have to uncheck and check the pog tithe manually before you make a tithe.  (That refreshes the screen metrics).

Everything looks fine, Slovakia....

EDIT: I'm positive we throw an error on the GUI though if you click Send and the block clicked by (IE diff rose between blocks) and we reject the tithe.    I'm confident when you clicked Send the underlying diff was lower at that particular moment.

[bible_pay]

We could probably do a couple things in our next mandatory to make things easier on newbies, and future proof POG with less pog volatility....

We could change the max tithe amount to 5bbp (from 300) -- (this would allow thousands of small tithes per day each using up the coin age of the single coin-owner) meaning more people would fit in the daily pool before exhausting the tithe cap of the pool.

We could require a minimum of 1 day of coin-age at difficulty 0 (IE at diff 0, 1 day of coin age and a max of 5bbp per tithe).  (And remember the 5bbp is descending, so at diff of 32000 the max would be 2.5 bbp).

As far as someone trying to hog a block despite owning a lot of coin age - (IE if someone tries to send in 25 tithes manually, they would use up all the coin age on 25 tx's) so that is not an attack vector.

I think these 2 things would enhance pog and make it relatively future proof.  For now lets see how this goes over the next 30 days.

The system as-is still requires a user to have the coin-age first of all - so these things are not necessarily attacks - but currently allowing 300 bbp chunks means less maximum users in the pool per day - which is something we can improve on with the above I think.

[sunk818]

Why pog difficulty looks back 40 blocks only?

Wouldn't average of last forty blocks or going back 205 blocks take care of this issue?

[bible_pay]

Why pog difficulty looks back 40 blocks only?

Wouldn't average of last forty blocks or going back 205 blocks take care of this issue?

It looks back 40 so that we can have more fair participation and chances per day for all, and also for performance reasons (a constant 40 block lookback is easier on the core).

When you say 'take care of this issue' what issue are you referring to?

[sunk818]

Pog difficulty 0

Is your thought that 40 blocks and tithe=1 will have at least one tithe in that period when things settle down because tithe=1 is every 4 hours?

[bible_pay]

Pog difficulty 0

Is your thought is that 40 blocks and tithe=1 will have at least one tithe in that period when things settle down?

Yes, I think it might fill itself up (but-its a victim of its own catastrophic change however - spikes to 128,000 cause no one to tithe for large periods repeating the issue), but also, if we tweak the params during the next mandatory then the diff of zero wont really be zero (if 0 would requires 1 day coin age) meaning no catastrophic move from floodgates open to 100,000 diff in just 3 blocks.

But having the 40 block lookback itself - I think it has positive benefits - for people who didnt have a chance to tithe during the morning will have another chance (with 205, you have a flat line slow moving diff, with 40 you have 5 elliott waves per day).

I think all it needs is a max tithe amount of 3bbp and a min coin age of 1 at the lower end of the chart (diff 0).  That would give us 20,000 tithes per day, people using up all their coin age if they attack, and probably 10,000 distinct users in the pool.  The vol would drop to normal vol with these params (theoretically, it appears).

[sunk818]

is there a way to prevent multiple submission of PoG tithe? Like if a tithe is in the mempool, you can prevent subsequent tithe until you get at least 1 confirmation?

[bbptoshi]

does PODCupdate prioritize to use younger coins to preserve the ones with more coin age?  That would be helpful for also doing POG.