[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[r_victory]

What does Dash bring to the table in this potential new partnership between Dash and ThorChain?

Find out more by reading the full article on the blog.

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[gadado2]

For upgrade to v 18.0.1

Is the Sentinel upgrade required or will the payment be ok with just updateing dash core/bin without a Sentinel upgrade?

Second is it possible to implement a better PoseBan System...
The issue I have is.. I check each day once on Dash ninja if my mn's are still running.
The Pose jumps form 0 to 2500 in an instant and if it was some hours ago changes are big that in the morning after when I check it accumulated to over 4000 and result into a MN ban.

So it seems a daily Dash Ninja check is not helpfull at all. Would be nice to have a system wher you have at least 48 hourse before a ban or an idication sooner or anything.

I don't read the forum frequent anymore so I will not detect when there is a new version and relay a bit on an early Pose warning system.

[xkcdd]

For upgrade to v 18.0.1

Is the Sentinel upgrade required or will the payment be ok with just updateing dash core/bin without a Sentinel upgrade?

Second is it possible to implement a better PoseBan System...
The issue I have is.. I check each day once on Dash ninja if my mn's are still running.
The Pose jumps form 0 to 2500 in an instant and if it was some hours ago changes are big that in the morning after when I check it accumulated to over 4000 and result into a MN ban.

So it seems a daily Dash Ninja check is not helpfull at all. Would be nice to have a system wher you have at least 48 hourse before a ban or an idication sooner or anything.

I don't read the forum frequent anymore so I will not detect when there is a new version and relay a bit on an early Pose warning system.

Strictly speaking sentinel is not required, your node will not ban if you don't have it. The POSE system could be improved, but it won't be and not in the way you are talking about.  If you are getting frequent bans it is because your node is misbehaving, the general solution to this is re-install the node using the Dash Masternode Zeus (on the forum) and then you wont have to check dash ninja ever again.

[gadado2]

For upgrade to v 18.0.1

Is the Sentinel upgrade required or will the payment be ok with just updateing dash core/bin without a Sentinel upgrade?

Second is it possible to implement a better PoseBan System...
The issue I have is.. I check each day once on Dash ninja if my mn's are still running.
The Pose jumps form 0 to 2500 in an instant and if it was some hours ago changes are big that in the morning after when I check it accumulated to over 4000 and result into a MN ban.

So it seems a daily Dash Ninja check is not helpfull at all. Would be nice to have a system wher you have at least 48 hourse before a ban or an idication sooner or anything.

I don't read the forum frequent anymore so I will not detect when there is a new version and relay a bit on an early Pose warning system.

Strictly speaking sentinel is not required, your node will not ban if you don't have it. The POSE system could be improved, but it won't be and not in the way you are talking about.  If you are getting frequent bans it is because your node is misbehaving, the general solution to this is re-install the node using the Dash Masternode Zeus (on the forum) and then you wont have to check dash ninja ever again.

I am useing Zeus. I let it update the binary and restarted the Server. One Node had a Pose of about 2000 at that time.
Checked today .. it got banned.
Ninja still had listed it with v17 although Zeus logged the update with bins v18.

Seems with every update I run into ban trouble. That is frustrating.
Somehow I never see when the Version changes.

No I have no issues anymore in between the updates. Remember I posted here with you a time back and I activated an automatic daily MN reset. You helped me with that. That works very well.

Edit Update:

Hm seems my DiskSpace was full. Thank you for the DiskSpace freeing up feature of Zeus. That was handy.
I updated Zeus, bin and sentinel and reactivated the MN. Now Ninja lists it as 1.8.01 and port open so seems good.

A hint for all with full diskspace: Don't remove the Zeus and try to git it new.. it doesn't works when your disk is close to full. (had to manual execute commands from the zeus disk freeing method to recover on another node)

One difficult I hit when trying to update Zeus:
If I enter the git getting comando as you have it in the dash forum it refuses to execute it and says it will not get it into a directory that is not empty...
so I had to do rm -r TheDirectory to install it again.

Looking forward to the next update. 

[Pang.]

position 95 in coingecko. We are beating our own records.

Meanwhile, coins like ETC are approaching the top 10 along with Doge or Shiba.

We simply get what we deserve.

All the best

[toknormal]

Ethereum investors now experiencing the same pain as Dash.

Giving away the primary supply for nothing instead of having it bid for in trustless markets leads to......long term disinvestment. (And Ethereum even has on chain sinks which Dash doesn't).

They might get a boost while the nodes are getting populated, like we did, then when nodecount hits equilibrium - the great crash (like we did). At least they have an on-chain sink so there's some potential viability to the staking model economically.

[r_victory]

Dash's InstantSend transaction speed is available on @opencart for merchants thanks to @NowPayments_io integration!

https://twitter.com/Dashpay/status/1572599374395351041

[xkcdd]

There is an interesting discussion being had currently on the Dash Forums about how centralised Dash Platform should be.

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/should-platform-run-on-all-nodes-or-should-platform-run-only-on-high-performance-nodes.53374/

What do you think?  Should Platform run on all the Masternodes resulting in higher fees to use it, or should it run on a tiny subset of nodes resulting in less fees but a high degree of centralisation?

[r_victory]

There is an interesting discussion being had currently on the Dash Forums about how centralised Dash Platform should be.

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/should-platform-run-on-all-nodes-or-should-platform-run-only-on-high-performance-nodes.53374/

What do you think?  Should Platform run on all the Masternodes resulting in higher fees to use it, or should it run on a tiny subset of nodes resulting in less fees but a high degree of centralisation?

I will take a look at this discussion, but I believe both options have a strong downside, however, I would rather pay more than have a highly centralized cryptocurrency/platform.

Too much centralization is never a good option!

[aleix]

DAO: The Evolution of Organization
https://research.cointelegraph.com/reports/detail/dao-the-evolution-of-organization


https://research-backend.cointelegraph.com/uploads/attachments/cl9344fz300t7r4qnbmh6bhqk-dao-report-october.pdf

[r_victory]

This week, we had a presentation on high-performance masternodes and presented some numbers on our expected decentralization depending on not yet-decided parameters. We had also done some research on the decentralization of other crypto projects so we have something to compare against.

Check out the presentation to learn more about that!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ0iJZ1pvsc

[aleix]

Dash Podcast 198 with Dash Core CTO Sam Westrich: High-Performance Masternodes AMA

https://youtu.be/zRj2cLjVR8Q

[Pang.]

It's amazing how a project can be as good as the people who manage it.

We can start with the best idea in the world, deliver it to a management team, and end up with an empty garbage.

I remember when Evan passed the baton to Ryan and slowly walked away from the project, Ryan talked and talked, while after each budget, enormous amounts of money were spent on salaries, logo change, legal matters, travel, conference attendance. ..

All of this happened, Ryan walked out the back door without bringing anything groundbreaking to the project, and now we have to wait years to spend what DCG was spending on a funding round when Dash was above $400.

How is it possible that now with the value at $40 we try to achieve what was not done with Dash at $500 or more?

I looked at the value of my master node from time to time and I'm glad I didn't bet more on this ticket at the time. The idea was great, but as I said, giving something to someone who is not capable of fulfilling it is an anticipated failure.


I do not doubt people who work or make an effort, but despite this, that effort must be focused to achieve an objective.

I can put effort into moving stones from one place to another and accomplish nothing but waste time and hurt my back. Or I can project to make a house with those stones and place them cunningly until I achieve it.

We have been digressing for more than six years. And we keep dragging out deadlines and creating empty discussions, while with each passing day, fewer people use or know about Dash.

My congratulations to all the managers who have helped to ruin this great project.

All the best.

[toknormal]

Descending smoothly into the top 90.

"Circulating supply" has increased by more than 23% since our little protocol change designed to "decrease circulating supply"  

ROI negative in $USD terms due to capital loss on collateral wiping out masternode rewards.

All predictable (and predicted), since having the protocol release supply with a zero price tag that bypasses competitive bidding does have the effect of all of the above. "Management" effects are secondary and a result of demoralisation due to lack of financial performance as a store of value and departing investors/talent.

[Pang.]

I remember years ago, when I still thought that the Dash people listened to their "investors", I was very insistent when DIF was promoted, that it would be a good idea to create the possibility that each fraction of Dash had an intrinsic value beyond its own value. network and usage.

We had a beastly budget, and some of that money could have been spent tying a portion of each Dash to a gold/silver standard, or even a real estate standard.

They all laughed, and said that Dash didn't need that. So they invested in bus trips for Max around the USA, supersonic planes, a marijuana platform that would be the future, logo changes for  thousands of dollars that a child would have made for $200, rain of money on Venezuela that was changed to instant dollars...

Right now it would have been possible for each fraction of Dash to have maybe 5% intrinsic value, maybe it would be $10, $20 or $50, but it would make the coin forever ideal for hoarding.

I said that I had been in finance for more than 25 years, and that the model that was followed was not correct when distributing the budget. That it was better to burn the Dash than to throw it into useless projects that depreciated in value. But no one listened, and everyone laughed toasting that Dash was $800 or more.

Well, the future is uncertain really, but one thing is clear. The predictions I made, or Toknormal, have come true, and that would simply be reason enough to stop and listen next time.

All the best

[toknormal]

The predictions I made, or Toknormal, have come true, and that would simply be reason enough to stop and listen next time.

In particular, this asymmetry in Dash's market dynamics compared with fully mined POW has had a devastating impact on marketcap.

When Ryan was attempting to justify the last protocol change he was only analysing secondary markets and excluded primary. This meant he could only come to the wrong conclusion - in fact the complete reverse of reality. Masternodes and the DAO are the only entities in Dash that exert a net sell pressure on the markets so we have this huge hole in primary demand invoked by the core protocol which other POWs do not.

Fix this and set it to a more optimal non-mining reward level and we might have a chance to recover marketcap buoyancy, turn around sentiment, attract new talent and re-fuel the innovation aspects of the asset. (...and with it, investability). Any loss of Dash-denominated masternode reward would then be more than compensated for in collateral capital gain (i.e. the reverse of what's happening at the moment where capital loss wipes out MN rewards).

For those of you who are "scared" by that prospect, I'm sorry we have no choice. We are heading for page 2 status soon so you'd better start considering a bit of bullet-biting thoughts to make this coin attractive to outside investors for a change and that is the one thing they've always disliked and not without good reason. We must not be "scared".

It's just numbers - if Ryan was worth listening to the first time then his thesis is also worth listening to once corrected for lack of scope.

[nutildah]

For those of you who are "scared" by that prospect, I'm sorry we have no choice.

Your suggestion has been ignored by developers for years and now you are making demands on them. Amazing!

Here's a more feasible approach: fork Dash and make it the way you want it. Since your idea is so clearly the way to go, miners will follow, and you will hailed as a victorious crypto king.

[toknormal]

Your suggestion has been ignored by developers for years and now you are making demands on them. Amazing!

Here's a more feasible approach: fork Dash

"Developers" do not govern this coin (ostensibly). Masternodes do - or at least are supposed to. If masternodes make wrong decisions (as they did with the last big protocol change) it's they who suffer because they have most at stake. So the community has to be persuaded first before any developer pressure / forking nonsense is viable.

Not an easy thing to do I accept because tribal allegiance and "hopium" are generally much more powerful motivators than simple reading-of-numbers.

But the alternative is to watch their collateral shrivel up and die like many other hybrid POS assets did, and for similar reasons. Alt markets have been reflating against BTC for the last couple of years and Dash is not reflating with them because we're too busy making it attractive to inside investors instead of outside ones.

[xkcdd]

Regarding your chart, Tokenormal, any newly minted coins are unmatched in the market, so I take objection to the way you've drawn the graphic, miners are minting coins out of thin air and then finding buyers for them.  Another unmatched seller are exchanges and their fees, they sell fees collected from transactions into a market without a buyer on the other side.  Examples of matched transactions are trades put on via an exchange where buyers and sellers are matched via orderbooks or liquidity pools with each other.

Let's not mince our words, miners exert unmatched sell pressure, thus their emissions can only push down price, as such POW coins like Dash should do whatever it can to minimise this or at least make it possible to withhold these coins from market for some time, which is what masternodes can do because of their low running costs, similar to stakers in the POS systems.

[toknormal]

miners are minting coins out of thin air

Sure. Remind me to add that to your list of nonsense quotes  

Miners have costs - they are the cost of acquisition of the coin so they therefore do not mint them out of "thin air".

The reason they have those costs is because they are required to bid for the coin against other "buyers" in an open, trustless market in order to acquire it. Their sells in the secondary (exchange) markets are therefore fully matched against their "purchases" in the primary.

This is of course not true for the DAO or for masternode rewards which is unearned income that only has a sell side. Masternodes have no acquisition cost for the reward (other than a hosting cost) and their sells in the secondary market are therefore unmatched which is why we've never been competitive against fully mined POW coins in terms of attracting investors.

We've always lost marketcap to them regardless of how much "development" and "feature" advantage we had over them.