[NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread

[TauMuon]

Until we have a forum, the NEM subreddit will do nicely! Make sure all you Bitcointalk people go over there and subscribe/post/comment.

[tron666]

This has probably already been said but..
In the future when everything is in place, including the usefulness of Nem etc, I think each and everyone of us should actively spread the word of Nem. I don't just mean through the internet, but actually "going out" with pre agreed official flyers/business cards and hand them out as much as we can. We could give them out at internet cafés, outside universities/colleges, the average man in the street (you never know), shops, on walls, everywhere. The flyers would really need to make the eyes catch what its all about within a second as some people glance at a flyer for a second before binning it if it does not stand out to you.  
Just being an observer will not help progress much.
I know you all know this but the vision of what Nem could become is just too beautiful for me not to rabbit on
Of course my basic obvious idea here could be complete rubbish, It wouldn't be the first time!  

Too much aggression can have a negative impact.  At least lets not do it "Jehovas witness" style. No offense meant to any "witnesses" here.

[TauMuon]

What charitable foundations would you like to see NEM donate to?  I think it'll be fun to decide now.

I personally am a fan of charities such as Water for Kids, Build Africa or any other charity which helps out vulnerable people in third world countries, especially ones involving building projects like schools, wells etc. How cool would that be for NEM to get involved with? I think it resonates well with NEM's egalitarian ethos.

@The Development Team, what do you think about reserving a stake or 2 (maybe more?) for a charitable cause? I think that'd be really great.

Edit: I posted this same question to the NEM subreddit. Head over there to talk if you feel like it!

[TauMuon]

Also, I'll post the poll for the logo again. I know it's not official and it doesn't include some newer ones, but still handy to see.

Poll for the logo.

Imgur album of the options (and their corresponding numbers) can be found here.

[jessica222]

Right now it's a good time to launch a new coin .we should launch as soon as possible

[makoto1337]

Also look at this fellas:
http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2014/02/13/the-mathematically-secure-way-to-accept-zero-confirmation-transactions/

Maybe we could somehow built this into NEM in a way that makes it easier to calculate the "confidence" ? Jaguar what do you think ?
We could promote a 0 confirmation transaction time

I took a look at this. I think we could do something similar, but the situation is not as bad for Proof of Stake/Importance as it is for Proof of Work. With POS/POI, the number of transaction confirmations is not what will guarantee security, but rather "coin days destroyed" in transactions. Once you spend some currency, the coin-days are reset (and in NXT and NEM, for the next 1440 blocks/1 day they have a weight of 0 after being spent). If large amounts of coin-days are destroyed in a block, it will make it harder to double spend, especially if transparent forging is implemented.

We are still studying Proof of Importance, but at least in theory I think it can be more secure than POS because not only would someone have to control a majority of the currency, but they would also have to control the structure of the transaction graph, meaning they would have to control the actions of the majority of the users as well. Based on some simulation analyses and tests using real NXT transactions, I plan to write a whitepaper on this approach.

[utopianfuture]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2. Feel free to check the accuracy yourself.

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran accounts opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : accounts opened during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts opened for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 706 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders

Interpretations of this statistics are up to readers but I believe we should have at least 2000 unique accounts after the fundraising is over. Given the increasing percentage of group 3 accounts, I may require new account registrations going through a verification process first after page 80.

2. After publishing the development plan, our core team has moved to a Trello board. Ideas are being discussed and works are being done in earnest. That board is private for now. I have opened another board : NEM promotion and I would like you to join in if you want your ideas stick. The key difference between the board and this thread is that: the ideas in that board will stick and have people trying to carry it through. I read many great ideas in this thread but without people push them forward they might just be great ideas forever. Furthermore, they may be buried under dozen of pages on different topics after a few days. So a task board for these ideas is a good thing.

So Pm me your email if you want to join the board. Many things are in need of people managing : Reddit, Twitter, websites, charity etc.
https://trello.com/b/GEWEPSZJ/nem-promotion.  This board will be open to the public but of course only members can write. And just to be clear joining and working to what extent on the board is voluntary; it is just a way to organize the community's efforts better.

Thanks for supporting NEM.

[utopianfuture]

Correct me if I'm wrong but according to my fusion powered quantum ROI calculator we've struck gold here. 1 stake = 1 million NEM. If NEM were to be listed on any BTC exchange we'd see a minimum price of 1 satoshi per NEM. This equals 0.01 BTC per stake. We're rich!

It is too conservative. I will not stop until NEM's market capitalization at least reaching Litecoin's level. 

That's what I was thinking. This is not a "dump at the first possible opportunity" project. I'm afraid though that many stakholders think like that.

This is why we should make sure that we can also build a similarly strong community! Then,anything is possible. But in the end the goal should be to achieve someting that has value (not because of the investment but) because it is usefull!

Yeah - agreed. NEM in and off itself won't be more usefull than NXT or most other cryptos. The most advanced and stable priced crypto isn't usefull if you can't do anything with it (other than storing value if it's really really stable). What could and will make it more usefull is the services and other things we (mostly devs ) build around NEM.

Agree with the comments. I have been thinking what can be do to give value to NEM beyond the still restricted world of crypto currencies. Maybe, if the development can introduced the idea of NXT's coloured coins and assist's exchanges in straightforward way, I guess it can be more easy to establish markets in which NEM can be used to buy/sells gods and thus transfer value to the coin. Thus, one of the markets that NEM can exploit is those agricultural products under the denomination of Fair Trade. Quite often, those products are sealed by small cooperatives of farmers in third developed countries. I envision in the near future that NEM, thanks to its egalitarian character, can be used by small communities or cooperatives to interchange its products in a fair way, without the intromission of intermediates that inflates the prices on their benefits

I love this idea. please join our Trello borad to make this possible. (pm me)

[utopianfuture]

What charitable foundations would you like to see NEM donate to?  I think it'll be fun to decide now.

I personally am a fan of charities such as Water for Kids, Build Africa or any other charity which helps out vulnerable people in third world countries, especially ones involving building projects like schools, wells etc. How cool would that be for NEM to get involved with? I think it resonates well with NEM's egalitarian ethos.

@The Development Team, what do you think about reserving a stake or 2 (maybe more?) for a charitable cause? I think that'd be really great.

Edit: I posted this same question to the NEM subreddit. Head over there to talk if you feel like it!

While it is tempting to do so, I would prefer charity as a decentralized effort. We should be able to do it as a community.

[j23a]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran account opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : account openned during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts openned for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 706 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders

Interpretations of this statistics are up to readers but I believe we should have at least 2000 unique accounts after the fundraising is over. Given the increasing percentage of group 3 accounts, I may require new account registrations going through a verification process first after page 80.

2. After publishing the development plan, our core team has moved to a Trello board. Ideas are being discussed and works are being done in earnest. That board is private for now. I have opened another board for a while: NEM promotion and I would like you to join in if you want your ideas stick. The key difference between the board and this thread is that: the ideas in that board will stick and have people trying to carry it through. I read many great ideas in this thread but without people push them forward they might just be great ideas forever. Furthermore, they may be buried under dozen of pages on different topics after a few days. So a task board for these ideas is a good thing.
So Pm me your email if you want to join the board. Many things are in need of people managing : Reddit, Twitter, websites, charity etc.
https://trello.com/b/GEWEPSZJ/nem-promotion  This board will be open to the public but of course only members can write.

Thanks for supporting NEM. We will be a great community.

I'm really surprised by the number on Group 1 Stakeholders. It's significantly larger than I expected. And that's a really good thing because at least they know what a Bitcoin is and are involved in it enough to be members of a forum related to it. Of course I still think new people is also very important, it's just nice to see that a lot of people from this forum are involved and know about Nem, since if it's even slightly popular the vast majority of them will get involved and active. I hope.

I also think it's important for people to tell other about it. The majority of the people that I tell about this just look at me how a cow looks at an incoming train, or reply once to me about it on Facebook, and then stop talking. I've only managed to get five other people involved, because they trust me.

[wo24-7]

I've been reading this forum trying to learn more and more from everyone.  Although I have no clue about codes and computer related things beyond the basic level what you learn in school.  Thought I'd "introduce" myself by posting. Don't really have any "new" ideas because there has been soo many great ideas on here so far from other memebers. The one I really agree on is helping out charity groups like previously stated.  Maybe one for Wounded Vets (I'm in Active Duty Army). I bought my first stake of NEM when it was 160 nxt than bought anotherfor my wife when it went up to 550 nxt. I have 2 ppl from work that are very interested and are going to buy 1 stake each in a few days or so. It is hard explaining to them what I know because if you never heard of Bitcoin it kinda sounds like a "scam" so they started looking into it to better understand.  I look forward to all the ideas that get brought up, helping in ways I can and seeing NEM grow.

[makoto1337]

Also look at this fellas:
http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2014/02/13/the-mathematically-secure-way-to-accept-zero-confirmation-transactions/

Maybe we could somehow built this into NEM in a way that makes it easier to calculate the "confidence" ? Jaguar what do you think ?
We could promote a 0 confirmation transaction time

I took a look at this. I think we could do something similar, but the situation is not as bad for Proof of Stake/Importance as it is for Proof of Work. With POS/POI, the number of transaction confirmations is not what will guarantee security, but rather "coin days destroyed" in transactions. Once you spend some currency, the coin-days are reset (and in NXT and NEM, for the next 1440 blocks/1 day they have a weight of 0 after being spent). If large amounts of coin-days are destroyed in a block, it will make it harder to double spend, especially if transparent forging is implemented.

We are still studying Proof of Importance, but at least in theory I think it can be more secure than POS because not only would someone have to control a majority of the currency, but they would also have to control the structure of the transaction graph, meaning they would have to control the actions of the majority of the users as well. Based on some simulation analyses and tests using real NXT transactions, I plan to write a whitepaper on this approach.

See early NXT discussion about guaranteed instant transactions here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=316104.0

Jack, thanks for the link! It is quite interesting, though the idea of "special accounts" is a bit cumbersome. There should be a better solution, perhaps utilizing the asset market or secure messaging feature.

[j23a]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran account opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : account openned during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts openned for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 706 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders

Interpretations of this statistics are up to readers but I believe we should have at least 2000 unique accounts after the fundraising is over. Given the increasing percentage of group 3 accounts, I may require new account registrations going through a verification process first after page 80.

2. After publishing the development plan, our core team has moved to a Trello board. Ideas are being discussed and works are being done in earnest. That board is private for now. I have opened another board for a while: NEM promotion and I would like you to join in if you want your ideas stick. The key difference between the board and this thread is that: the ideas in that board will stick and have people trying to carry it through. I read many great ideas in this thread but without people push them forward they might just be great ideas forever. Furthermore, they may be buried under dozen of pages on different topics after a few days. So a task board for these ideas is a good thing.
So Pm me your email if you want to join the board. Many things are in need of people managing : Reddit, Twitter, websites, charity etc.
https://trello.com/b/GEWEPSZJ/nem-promotion  This board will be open to the public but of course only members can write.

Thanks for supporting NEM. We will be a great community.

I'm really surprised by the number on Group 1 Stakeholders. It's significantly larger than I expected. And that's a really good thing because at least they know what a Bitcoin is and are involved in it enough to be members of a forum related to it. Of course I still think new people is also very important, it's just nice to see that a lot of people from this forum are involved and know about Nem, since if it's even slightly popular the vast majority of them will get involved and active. I hope.

I also think it's important for people to tell other about it. The majority of the people that I tell about this just look at me how a cow looks at an incoming train, or reply once to me about it on Facebook, and then stop talking. I've only managed to get five other people involved, because they trust me.

I know how you feel. I tried to get my mates into bitcoin a while back, too expensive they said. Then after I got into nxt they were a little interested but after investigating it were put off by the few holding the majority of coins. I finally succeeded with Nem, being that they could be there at the genesis. The crypto world can be a lonely one when you have no allies in your personal life to share your interests and goals.

Today I tried explaining it to this friend, and I think I did a pretty good job showing her the charts on coinmarketcap, showing her the price at the beginning of Bitcoin, NXT, etc. But she still wouldn't take a chance on NEM. Later on she asked me, "Does your mom know you're crazy?"

Some people get it, others truly don't. My big regret in my current life is not knowing about Bitcoin until last December, because I know I would not have been one of the people who would not get it. I would have been mining away, Litecoin, buying Bitcoins. It bums me out that I want to have Bitcoins, and see the price at $700, $800, and think about how I just did not know. And then I would look at Ethereum, and other interesting projects that look promising and how positive they look, and then think about the Bitcoins that I could have invested if I just knew earlier about Bitcoins. Then I see how fundraising like those basically benefit the rich, because they can throw a lot of money on it. Would it had been a big risk investing a Bitcoin in NXT if you bought that Bitcoin for $2?

And then came Nem, it excites me because of its fundraising style, where a person doesn't feel that they're missing out because it's just so much cheaper and a fairer than the other next gen coins. So I try to tell as many people who I feel are good people, because I don't want them to feel like I did missing out on something potentially incredible simply because they didn't know about.

I'm very strict as to who I tell about the opportunity. I wouldn't tell anyone if I felt they were selfish.

[Eadeqa]

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran accounts opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : accounts opened during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts opened for NEM registration only (1 post)

Not all of group 3 are sock puppets. I know I asked a friend to open an account and post it. I paid for her. Sent her TX via PM. She is unique stakeholder, even though she is listed in group 3.

Plus she has over 10 K twitter followers. If this thing picks up, she might be an asset in promotion

[bazka]

This site might be useful,

http://cryptocurrency.meetup.com/

Turn up to a local meeting place in your various countries and spread the word.

[patmast3r]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2. Feel free to check the accuracy yourself.

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran accounts opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : accounts opened during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts opened for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:
...

wow...props to Kooream for taking the time to make such a detailed analysis. It really is comforting to see that Group 1 and 2 are much greater than expected.

[Kooream]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2. Feel free to check the accuracy yourself.

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran accounts opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : accounts opened during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts opened for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 706 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders


Thanks for supporting NEM.

I made a little mistake. In the second thread there are 281 veteran stakeholder against 706. I apologize for the misunderstanding but my defense I was tired in the end of the list.

[nemnation]

that is way better distribution than nxt!! looking good. any plans for first exchanges or swarms or anything?? mayby swarm bter seeing as they have nxt up! whats going to happen client wise? will it just be a copy of the nxt client?

[nemnation]

do you need anyone to do a twitter/facebook page or set up a reddit subforum?? id be willing to help with any of that.. im not a programmer so cant help with any dev!

[utopianfuture]

Some updates :

1. This is the NEM stakeholder population statistics compiled by Kooream https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdG1XYWlDemNENl9IaGR5ZHNUNTNhcmc#gid=1  This statistics is up to page 70 of registration thread 2. Feel free to check the accuracy yourself.

Basically, we look though the profiles of every stakeholders and group them into three groups: Group 1 : veteran accounts opened before the fundrasing; Group 2 : accounts opened during the fundrasing but showed further activity; Group 3: accounts opened for NEM registration only (1 post)

The results are:

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 706 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders


Thanks for supporting NEM.

I made a little mistake. In the second thread there are 281 veteran stakeholder against 706. I apologize for the misunderstanding but my defense I was tired in the end of the list.

Is was embarrassing. Kooream was sleepy when he made the summary for  thread 2 and I forgot to check as well. So the summary statistics are (nothing changes to individual grouping)

For thread 1:

Group 1 : 711 stakeholders
Group 2 : 310 stakeholders
Group 3 : 440 stakeholders

For thread 2 up to page 70

Group 1 : 281 stakeholders
Group 2 : 286 stakeholders
Group 3 : 706 stakeholders

So this statistics is probably more in line with the expectation. While I believe the majority of group 3 accounts are not sockpuppets given that it is allowed to make a proxy account to buy 1 share for your loved one; and maybe some new accounts are not yet active. In light of the recent jump in group 3 registration, I would close automatic registration to new accounts starting from page 80. New accounts want to join in will need to contact me to verify their status before the registration. Automatic registrations are still open to veteran account opened before the fund raising.