[ANN][RIC] Riecoin: constellations POW *CPU* HARD FORK successful, world record

[trny]

I can sure help moderate, read over material or anything of that nature. Not much good with anything that has to be programmed, or setting up forums, webpages but willing to do what I can wherever I can.

Already mailed Cryptsy about BTER about this. Cryptsy said they would have their folks take a look at it, Bter I've yet to get a reply from. They do have a ANN thread here for new coins. I suggested Riecoin there as well and suggest everyone else do the same:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=280806.msg5208999#msg5208999

TBH Riecoin is the first coin I've wanted to get involved in at its early stage. Emailing exchanges is a good start but some infrastructure would be nice. Someone with knowledge on setting up a SimpleMachines forum would be very much appreciated. Please reply if this is you!

I think the primary push here should be for miners. That's where the added value of Riecoin comes from ultimately. Having no centralization counts for a lot, but many coins offer that. So that's how I've tried to approach the video script.

I think in general the marketing of Riecoin should be done a bit like Seti@home. If we can offer an incredibly simple, prominently displayed method for the average person to mine and contribute, we may be able to attract people who are still really new to cryptos. That would be a huge advantage.

Video Script:
"Riecoin is a completely decentralized crypto currency build on Bitcoin offering an entirely new proof-of-work.  Miners of Riecoin process transactions in the same way Bitcoin miners do, but the mining of Riecoins produces a byproduct that is of value to the scientific community - highly verified prime sextuplets, or prime numbers. The prime numbers generated by mining Riecoin are so well confirmed that eventually, if enough people contribute to the endeavor, all new blocks found would be record breaking new prime numbers 559 digits long! . . .The coin gets its name and algorithm from famous 19th century mathematician Bernard Riemann who hypothesized about the distribution of prime numbers. The data collected from Riecoin mining will benefit mathematicians everywhere working with primes and working to solve Riemann's hypothesis - a competitive endeavor that carries a prize of 1 million dollars! . . . Riecoin also functions as an advanced decentralized currency. Like Bitcoin, there is no central authority, no one can change the ledger or double spend. To safeguard a fair launch, the first 24hrs following Riecoin's release offered no reward. This novel approach allowed early miners to verify there was no premine and have their miners tested and running when the coins finally started flowing. Riemann's algorithm also provides a stable, predictable supply of new coins, so its well suited for payment systems and as an investment. Feel free to ask any questions you might have - the Riecoin community is always happy to help. . . If you'd like to support p2p decentralized currency and contribute to human knowledge through world record breaking mathematical research in prime numbers - help out by mining Riecoins today on your computer!"


This is the style I'll be able to provide for reference.
https://vimeo.com/86834359

Excellent script that plays up the PoW and fair launch. However, I'm not sure that describing the prime numbers as "well confirmed" is accurate, the sentence could simply be "Eventually, if enough people contribute to Riecoin mining, new blocks found will contain record breaking prime sextuplets that are over 559 digits long!"

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[remistevens]

I can sure help moderate, read over material or anything of that nature. Not much good with anything that has to be programmed, or setting up forums, webpages but willing to do what I can wherever I can.

Already mailed Cryptsy about BTER about this. Cryptsy said they would have their folks take a look at it, Bter I've yet to get a reply from. They do have a ANN thread here for new coins. I suggested Riecoin there as well and suggest everyone else do the same:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=280806.msg5208999#msg5208999

TBH Riecoin is the first coin I've wanted to get involved in at its early stage. Emailing exchanges is a good start but some infrastructure would be nice. Someone with knowledge on setting up a SimpleMachines forum would be very much appreciated. Please reply if this is you!

I think the primary push here should be for miners. That's where the added value of Riecoin comes from ultimately. Having no centralization counts for a lot, but many coins offer that. So that's how I've tried to approach the video script.

I think in general the marketing of Riecoin should be done a bit like Seti@home. If we can offer an incredibly simple, prominently displayed method for the average person to mine and contribute, we may be able to attract people who are still really new to cryptos. That would be a huge advantage.

Video Script:
"Riecoin is a completely decentralized crypto currency build on Bitcoin offering an entirely new proof-of-work.  Miners of Riecoin process transactions in the same way Bitcoin miners do, but the mining of Riecoins produces a byproduct that is of value to the scientific community - highly verified prime sextuplets, or prime numbers. The prime numbers generated by mining Riecoin are so well confirmed that eventually, if enough people contribute to the endeavor, all new blocks found would be record breaking new prime numbers 559 digits long! . . .The coin gets its name and algorithm from famous 19th century mathematician Bernard Riemann who hypothesized about the distribution of prime numbers. The data collected from Riecoin mining will benefit mathematicians everywhere working with primes and working to solve Riemann's hypothesis - a competitive endeavor that carries a prize of 1 million dollars! . . . Riecoin also functions as an advanced decentralized currency. Like Bitcoin, there is no central authority, no one can change the ledger or double spend. To safeguard a fair launch, the first 24hrs following Riecoin's release offered no reward. This novel approach allowed early miners to verify there was no premine and have their miners tested and running when the coins finally started flowing. Riemann's algorithm also provides a stable, predictable supply of new coins, so its well suited for payment systems and as an investment. Feel free to ask any questions you might have - the Riecoin community is always happy to help. . . If you'd like to support p2p decentralized currency and contribute to human knowledge through world record breaking mathematical research in prime numbers - help out by mining Riecoins today on your computer!"


This is the style I'll be able to provide for reference.
https://vimeo.com/86834359

Excellent script that plays up the PoW and fair launch. However, I'm not sure that describing the prime numbers as "well confirmed" is accurate, the sentence could simply be "Eventually, if enough people contribute to Riecoin mining, new blocks found will contain record breaking prime sextuplets that are over 559 digits long!"

Thanks, I'd emailed it to Gatra and he set me straight on that mistake as well. I'd been trying to somehow mention that Rie's primes have negligible instances of false primes in contrast from XPM. Also that Rie has no centralization like Primecoin. I just don't think it makes sense to say those things in the video - don't want to sound negative. I own XPM and like their project also. If any thing I think we want Riecoin to sound appealing to Primecoin's crowd - not as a competitor but as a compliment to the research on primes.

Anyway, here's a revision"

"Riecoin is a decentralized crypto currency built on Bitcoin offering an entirely new proof-of-work.  Miners of Riecoin process transactions in the same way Bitcoin miners do, but the mining of Riecoins also produces a byproduct that is of value to the scientific community - highly verified prime sextuplets, or prime numbers. In fact, if enough people mine Riecoins all at once, they could collectively generate prime sextuples 559 digits long that would break world records! All of this through a completely decentralized p2p currency with a fair launch - pretty cool right? . . .The coin gets its name from famous 19th century mathematician Bernard Riemann who investigated the Riemann zeta function and established its importance for understanding the distribution of prime numbers. The data collected from Riecoin mining tests Hardy-Littlewook k-tuple conjectures regarding the distribution of primes using Riemann's zeta function; its information that could prove invaluable to human understanding of mathematics. . . .Riecoin also functions as an advanced decentralized currency. Like Bitcoin, there is no central authority, no one can change the ledger or double spend. To safeguard a fair launch, the first 24hrs following Riecoin's release offered no reward. This novel approach allowed early miners to verify there was no premine and have their miners tested and running when the coins finally started flowing. Riemann's algorithm also provides a stable, predictable supply of new coins, so its well suited for payment systems and as an investment. Feel free to ask any questions you might have - the Riecoin community is always happy to help. . . If you'd like to support p2p decentralized currency and help create world record breaking mathematical research in prime numbers - start mining Riecoins today on your computer!

[trny]

Thanks, I'd emailed it to Gatra and he set me straight on that mistake as well. I'd been trying to somehow mention that Rie's primes have negligible instances of false primes in contrast from XPM. Also that Rie has no centralization like Primecoin. I just don't think it makes sense to say those things in the video - don't want to sound negative. I own XPM and like their project also. If any thing I think we want Riecoin to sound appealing to Primecoin's crowd - not as a competitor but as a compliment to the research on primes.

Anyway, here's a revision

"Riecoin is a decentralized crypto currency built on Bitcoin offering an entirely new proof-of-work.  Miners of Riecoin process transactions in the same way Bitcoin miners do, but the mining of Riecoins also produces a byproduct that is of value to the scientific community - highly verified prime sextuplets, or prime numbers. In fact, if enough people mine Riecoins all at once, they could collectively generate prime sextuples 559 digits long that would break world records! All of this through a completely decentralized p2p currency with a fair launch - pretty cool right? . . .The coin gets its name from famous 19th century mathematician Bernard Riemann who investigated the Riemann zeta function and established its importance for understanding the distribution of prime numbers. The data collected from Riecoin mining tests Hardy-Littlewook k-tuple conjectures regarding the distribution of primes using Riemann's zeta function; its information that could prove invaluable to human understanding of mathematics. . . .Riecoin also functions as an advanced decentralized currency. Like Bitcoin, there is no central authority, no one can change the ledger or double spend. To safeguard a fair launch, the first 24hrs following Riecoin's release offered no reward. This novel approach allowed early miners to verify there was no premine and have their miners tested and running when the coins finally started flowing. Riemann's algorithm also provides a stable, predictable supply of new coins, so its well suited for payment systems and as an investment. Feel free to ask any questions you might have - the Riecoin community is always happy to help. . . If you'd like to support p2p decentralized currency and help create world record breaking mathematical research in prime numbers - start mining Riecoins today on your computer!"

I agree that we don't need to shed XPM in a negative light in the introductory video. Riecoin and Primecoin are competitors in the free market but quite like siblings mathematically.

I also still like adding the "prime sextuplets over 559 digits long" to emphasize that the network can go above and beyond current world records. The hard part for you will be to create convincing/engaging animations for all the math jargon 

[deadthings]

The hard part for you will be to create convincing/engaging animations for all the math jargon 

When in doubt - girls in bikinis.

[remistevens]

Just a question for the experts. How many crypto currencies out there are decentralized, had a fair launch, and have a direct external benefit from hashing?  Donation schemes, banks, earning coins, maintaining the network - all these upgrades and advantages are related to the currency/coin alone. Primecoin has an external benefit, but its ultimately centralized. . ...What else? Heating hot tubs. This is pretty unique isn't it? Yet the market cap is about where Junkcoin is. . .

[hanzac]

There was no need for proof. Shutting down within 48hrs and disappearing would of been the proof of scam. He changed that. I never said the dude was scamming, I was saying it was a possibility based on the circumstances of the shutdown.

The site may have been "legit" but its still poorly run by someone who doesn't know what they are doing. Ex. the whole bitcoin flaw claim.

Has any user of the site received an e-mail telling them the site was closing? Why is there a min withdrawal on coins still? Why am I not able to withdraw the remaining BTC I have there?

If this dude was professional all of this would of been done.

Please don't ask too much for the start-up exchange sites (this is very mean). We need to encourage the newly born things. That's also the heart to encourage the decentralized businesses.

Seems like you are enjoying the professional `MT-GOX` things, right? Their profession will make you feel happy, right? Their profession will make you feel they are legit, right?

Please don't be narrow minded to link the unprofessional <--> scam. Please learn about deep intention of their activity.

[mhps]

I agree that we don't need to shed XPM in a negative light in the introductory video. Riecoin and Primecoin are competitors in the free market but quite like siblings mathematically.

Only siblings? "entirely new proof-of-work" ? Not recognizing that XPM inspired and laid the yellow brick road for RIC just smacks intellectual dishonesty.

"highly verified" ... well for those who care if XPM-found primes are not real primes they can run a prime test for all the XPM-found numbers and finish it in probably a matter of minutes.  There are only on the order of 10 million numbers to verify. It's trivial.

Primecoin allowed small miners to find blocks which is tied to prime chains. I mined RIC a little and found that trying to find a Riecoin block is hopeless for individual miners, which makes a disappointing game for those who are interested in the math/record aspect.

[dogaatac]

This coin is the best cpu coin i think.
More effective and valuable then xpm

[danieldrake]

Should there be a dedicated forum or venue for us to direct meaningful conversation about spreading RIC by creating services, block crawlers,

etc? The subreddit is not very lively, and we need somewhere to potentially organize bounties for people willing to contribute.

Agreed. The team behind RIC definitely needs some help in the PR and promotions dept. Not much going on there.

More contests, giveaways, promos etc.

Cmon Gatra, lets get on the go with this.

Whats your plan? What do you need help with? What direction you want to take this? We're here to help!

I'm putting together a promo video for Riecoin now, should be ready later this week. I want to share the script and get some feedback - would be

a better place to discuss in a dedicated Rieforum somewhere.

Is anyone willing to establish and moderate a forum? I'd contribute some RIC to that end

I can sure help moderate, read over material or anything of that nature. Not much good with anything that has to be programmed, or setting up

forums, webpages but willing to do what I can wherever I can.

TBH Riecoin is the first coin I've wanted to get involved in at its early stage. Emailing exchanges is a good start but some infrastructure would

be nice. Someone with knowledge on setting up a SimpleMachines forum would be very much appreciated. Please reply if this is you!

Here you go:

www.rieforum.com

Mods wanted.

[MaddestScientist]

Great! 

Here you go:

www.rieforum.com

Mods wanted.

[remistevens]

I agree that we don't need to shed XPM in a negative light in the introductory video. Riecoin and Primecoin are competitors in the free market but quite like siblings mathematically.

Only siblings? "entirely new proof-of-work" ? Not recognizing that XPM inspired and laid the yellow brick road for RIC just smacks intellectual dishonesty.

"highly verified" ... well for those who care if XPM-found primes are not real primes they can run a prime test for all the XPM-found numbers and finish it in probably a matter of minutes.  There are only on the order of 10 million numbers to verify. It's trivial.

Primecoin allowed small miners to find blocks which is tied to prime chains. I mined RIC a little and found that trying to find a Riecoin block is hopeless for individual miners, which makes a disappointing game for those who are interested in the math/record aspect.

I thank you for the opportunity to respond to some criticisms - there's no better way to elucidate an argument. The more I think about Riecoin, the more I want to defend it and invest. But hey, I am the most open minded person around, if you can convince me this is a bad coin I'll put my time and money elsewhere.

In response to your points:
1)Its an entirely different algorithm, nothing was built off of XPM. Was the dev inspired by earlier ideas? - Surely, but the concept of using miners to create an important mathematical byproduct is much older than XPM. Now we have a coin that does it AND is decentralized - Riecoin.  

2)XPM miners generate false primes, RIC miners do not. Its a comment on the efficiency of the output not whether or not you can check the quality. But there may be a point here worth investigating, if both coins had equal amounts of contributors, which would put out more actual primes (after XPMs false's are removed)?

3)If your concern is earning coins, you're not interested in the math, you're trying to make money. Everyone mining contributes to the discovery process whether they are rewarded or not. People don't run Seti@home to earn coins, which is why I mentioned it earlier....And if the plight of the little guy not being able to earn coins is your concern, and I agree its a problem, isn't that solvable with pools like every other coin out there?

Finally, you've neglected to mention the most important issue here: decentralization. I like XPM and what they created, but so long as it has a centralized feature I fail to see how it can function any better as a currency than a fascist government fiat... The whole reason Bitcoin has succeeded is because trust of a 3rd party is not required for trade between individuals, the system has no back door. That's the innovation, that's what makes Bitcoin an amazing new technology- and Primecoin unfortunately lacks it. I struggle to call them siblings, to me this is just too big of a distinction - half brothers maybe.

[tinus42]

Is it still worth to mine this coin with CPU or is it only viable with a GPU?

[trny]

Great! 

Here you go:

www.rieforum.com

Mods wanted.

Messaged gatra asking to add a link to this from the main site. Also trying to correspond with him regarding the block explorer (code nearly complete)

[dbt1033]

Is it still worth to mine this coin with CPU or is it only viable with a GPU?

It's my understanding that this coin is cpu-only at the moment.

[refer_2_me]

Is it still worth to mine this coin with CPU or is it only viable with a GPU?

It's my understanding that this coin is cpu-only at the moment.

It is CPU only. Or at least there are no publicly available GPU miners or even rumors that I have heard of private ones.

[mhps]

I agree that we don't need to shed XPM in a negative light in the introductory video. Riecoin and Primecoin are competitors in the free market but quite like siblings mathematically.

Only siblings? "entirely new proof-of-work" ? Not recognizing that XPM inspired and laid the yellow brick road for RIC just smacks intellectual dishonesty.

"highly verified" ... well for those who care if XPM-found primes are not real primes they can run a prime test for all the XPM-found numbers and finish it in probably a matter of minutes.  There are only on the order of 10 million numbers to verify. It's trivial.

Primecoin allowed small miners to find blocks which is tied to prime chains. I mined RIC a little and found that trying to find a Riecoin block is hopeless for individual miners, which makes a disappointing game for those who are interested in the math/record aspect.

I thank you for the opportunity to respond to some criticisms - there's no better way to elucidate an argument. The more I think about Riecoin, the more I want to defend it and invest. But hey, I am the most open minded person around, if you can convince me this is a bad coin I'll put my time and money elsewhere.

In response to your points:
1)Its an entirely different algorithm, nothing was built off of XPM. Was the dev inspired by earlier ideas? - Surely, but the concept of using miners to create an important mathematical byproduct is much older than XPM. Now we have a coin that does it AND is decentralized - Riecoin.   

There is much more work to make a successful scientific computing cryptocurrency than having the idea and picking an algorithm.  It took 4.5 years for the first of such coin to appear after Bitcoin and only a half year for the second one to show up. We see that the nut is difficult to crack but once it is cracked it is relatively easy to make a similar one.

2)XPM miners generate false primes, RIC miners do not. Its a comment on the efficiency of the output not whether or not you can check the quality. But there may be a point here worth investigating, if both coins had equal amounts of contributors, which would put out more actual primes (after XPMs false's are removed)?

I don't see why it is a big deal. There are about 40,000 Cunningham chains found by Primecoin, with less than 10 million prime numbers. If anyone wants to do research, testing these prime candidates one by one is no big deal. The Primecoin miner network has done most of the heavy lifting by prividing a candidate set that is 99% true. Many records have been broken and these C-chains are proven true.

3)If your concern is earning coins, you're not interested in the math, you're trying to make money. Everyone mining contributes to the discovery process whether they are rewarded or not. People don't run Seti@home to earn coins, which is why I mentioned it earlier....And if the plight of the little guy not being able to earn coins is your concern, and I agree its a problem, isn't that solvable with pools like every other coin out there?

I don't know if you have mined Primecoin solo. In the first several months, old PCs can find Primecoin blocks. For those who are concerned with math and record, it is very cool that if you can find "your own" C-chain that is a contender of the world record, and have the hash signature, time stamp, and a cool address to show it.  It's just more fun.

Finally, you've neglected to mention the most important issue here: decentralization. I like XPM and what they created, but so long as it has a centralized feature I fail to see how it can function any better as a currency than a fascist government fiat... The whole reason Bitcoin has succeeded is because trust of a 3rd party is not required for trade between individuals, the system has no back door. That's the innovation, that's what makes Bitcoin an amazing new technology- and Primecoin unfortunately lacks it. I struggle to call them siblings, to me this is just too big of a distinction - half brothers maybe.

The checkpoint in XPM is just a message broadcast mechanism that individual miners can opt out. I think it is turned off by default actually. It doesn't make a coin more centralized than an "offcial" talk thread here on bitcointal or a dedicated message board does. Don't confuse it with PPC's check point system. Sunny King has said the plan is phasing them out.

Anyway credit should be given where it is due.  Riecoin is mildly interesting. Its difficulty will make the coin unpopular. Its market capitalization will suffer. There are many rare coins -- bitbars, novacoin, onecoin ... the unit price can be high but the price of many of these coins are controlled/manipulated by giant holders who got it cheap initially.

[JohnnyCrypto]

Seems gatra was working on his prime finding POW since before XPM was even released.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=245953.msg2628489#msg2628489

So it seems Sunny & gatra were thinking about the same thing at the same time. No clone here.

[remistevens]

Thanks for the detailed response, its much appreciated. I'm still not convinced by much of what you're saying though, or at least, it doesn't fit with what Gatra has said so I am confused. Again, I'm not here to fight, I welcome being set straight. Math and computers were not my major.

There is much more work to make a successful scientific computing cryptocurrency than having the idea and picking an algorithm.  It took 4.5 years for the first of such coin to appear after Bitcoin and only a half year for the second one to show up. We see that the nut is difficult to crack but once it is cracked it is relatively easy to make a similar one.

This was answered above. The way you've phrased this sounds like Gatra benefited from Sunny and XPM release. Is that accurate? What is it based on?

I don't see why it is a big deal. There are about 40,000 Cunningham chains found by Primecoin, with less than 10 million prime numbers. If anyone wants to do research, testing these prime candidates one by one is no big deal. The Primecoin miner network has done most of the heavy lifting by prividing a candidate set that is 99% true. Many records have been broken and these C-chains are proven true.

I agree, its not a big deal. At the end of the day I appreciate that the data produced by both coins is useful, but neither Cunningham chains nor prime sextuplets are of any value directly to the work I do.

I don't know if you have mined Primecoin solo. In the first several months, old PCs can find Primecoin blocks. For those who are concerned with math and record, it is very cool that if you can find "your own" C-chain that is a contender of the world record, and have the hash signature, time stamp, and a cool address to show it.  It's just more fun.

OK, but that is a characteristic of the launch, not the coin. Every coin is un-minable solo eventually if it becomes popular.

The checkpoint in XPM is just a message broadcast mechanism that individual miners can opt out. I think it is turned off by default actually. It doesn't make a coin more centralized than an "offcial" talk thread here on bitcointal or a dedicated message board does. Don't confuse it with PPC's check point system. Sunny King has said the plan is phasing them out.
Primecoin unfortunately lacks it. I struggle to call them siblings, to me this is just too big of a distinction - half brothers maybe.

Please understand that I am listening to 2 mechanics explain to me the inner workings of a UFO's carburetor. From Riecoin.org: "A centralized checkpoint allows its controllers to perform double spends without any need for any % of hash rate. Can we be sure it will not be hacked and/or abused?". If its feasible that a central controller could double spend, to me that makes it all dependent on trust - just like gov fiat. So who do I believe here?

Anyway credit should be given where it is due.  Riecoin is mildly interesting. Its difficulty will make the coin unpopular. Its market capitalization will suffer. There are many rare coins -- bitbars, novacoin, onecoin ... the unit price can be high but the price of many of these coins are controlled/manipulated by giant holders who got it cheap initially.

OK, no offense if I've misinterpreted your statement, but are you trying to deceive me here? I realize many new people are confused by these concepts, but I am not. Those coins are not actually rare, they just moved the decimal to the left, that has no relevance on distribution of the wealth in the system whatsoever. Distribution is determined by how many people got involved, when and how.

The Riecoin launch wasn't perfect, solo mining was impossible for an average person and pools were not yet set up. So like many many coins initial distribution was not the best. This has happened to many good coins, they succeed if those initial big holders sell and distribute. I've seen some big blocks of RIC get sold all at once, I've bought quite a few myself. I believe those big RIC stakes have shrunk significantly. I don't think those big holders are the manipulative type either, this was not a hyped coin. You'd want to make a big splash and draw in many suckers wouldn't you? And the way the launch happened with the 24hrs of no reward, Gatra personally had no opportunity to become the big stakeholder. Why would you create a coin for other random people to use as a scam? And what scammer would bother setting his machines to mine an under mentioned coin? I think what happened was a lot of math types running the university's giant machines got lucky, decided they had too many coins, and sold a whole bunch.

At the very least. If this coin is "mildly interesting", its priced at "who cares" and peaked at "pretty boring".

 

[neuroMode]

Hey guys!

Lazycoins.com is a new exchange launching soon. If you want to see Riecoin get listed there then make a new thread for the coin and upvote it on reddit.com/r/lazycoins or tweet the coin to @LazyCoins! Follow us to stay updated the moment we launch!

Cheers!

[truckythin]

Hey guys!

Lazycoins.com is a new exchange launching soon. If you want to see Riecoin get listed there then make a new thread for the coin and upvote it on reddit.com/r/lazycoins or tweet the coin to @LazyCoins! Follow us to stay updated the moment we launch!

Cheers!

no, thanks. We need bter/cryptsy and btc-e only.