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Author Topic: [ANN] Spondoolies-Tech - carrier grade, data center ready mining rigs  (Read 1253066 times)
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April 12, 2014, 09:21:38 PM
 #881


"... (e) The Purchaser is not entitled to refuse acceptance of the Products, or make claims for compensation due to any delayed delivery; and ..."

NO refunds, buddy...

That is pretty clear and unambiguous.

And if it wasn't, this quote (also from the terms of sale) is:

Quote
3) Delivery; Shipment. Delivery dates communicated or acknowledged by Spondoolies in the Order Confirmation are approximate only, and are dependent upon supply chain interruptions and stoppages, development delays, and other factors. Therefore, Purchaser shall not rely upon, and Spondoolies shall not be liable under whatsoever circumstances for any other estimation statement of expectation when delivery will occur.

which seems fair enough. The purchaser assumes all risk, just like any other pre-order.  Spondoolies-Tech should qualify their public statements regarding their resolve to deliver on time with a statement like "but if we don't, its too bad".

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April 12, 2014, 09:42:37 PM
 #882

The technical data is available in the web site. It's a bit outdated. Upon signing an NDA we'll release all the needed information to start a design based on our 1st gen and 2nd gen ASICs. Multiple parties, companies and one collective already got the information.

The updated spec of our 2nd gen ASIC:

Voltage 0.63 V
Total Engines 193
Max frequency at TT corner 984 MHz
Performance 190 GHs
Power 65 W
Power/performance 0.34 W/GHs

Multiple voltages and overclocking points possible.

Does it make you more comfortable ?
Should I post working FPGA pictures ?
Verilog test bench ?

Seriously, we know what we're doing.
The ASICs will arrive on time, working. SP30 will be delivered on time and on spec.

Edit:
Some more information on the system. SP30, like the SP10 will contains two ASICs boards and one management board.
The management board will contain the same TI Sitara processor and FPGA. Beside the FPGA, it's almost identical to Beagle Bone Black.
(Unlike other vendors, we don't ship with hobby boards...)
Each ASICs board contains 15 RockerBox ASICs. The total system output is expected to be over 5.5 TH/s
We've improved our DC2DC design, and we're testing it separately on a test board.

Edit2:
We won't release any information on our 3rd gen ASIC (PickAxe) beside stating again that the design goal is to compete and win in the EH/s (Exa Hash/s) era, while eradicating (by making obsolete) a well known northern farm.

I presume that you are just a marketroid. What you just did by saying "we know what we are doing" and "verilog testbench" is to suggest that you don't have any experience with designing power-limited and noise-limited ASICs. There is obviously a small possibility that someone in your team knows it, but intentionally told you to misinform. But I somehow doubt this had happened in Israel right after shabbat.

You could make an intelligent post without disclosing any proprietary info. Bitfury for example had posted max clock speed for his chip with all hashing engines running and with just one engine running. He also posted whole slew of timing-margin and noise-margin vs. supply voltage values.

If you have no detailed BSIM (or similar analog) models of your chips at this stage then you quite clearly aren't in the "know what we are doing" category but in the "CAD monkey" category. This doesn't bode well for the successful delivery. Simon Barber of Hashfast was the most recent example on this forum: "our chip will work because Apache Redhawk says so!"

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=270384.msg2894710#msg2894710

PS. In the above message all "you" should be understood as "plural you" (i.e. whole company as opposed to the person posting) with the exception of the very first.

Please comment, critique, criticize or ridicule BIP 2112: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0
Long-term mining prognosis: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91101.0
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April 12, 2014, 09:46:25 PM
 #883


"... (e) The Purchaser is not entitled to refuse acceptance of the Products, or make claims for compensation due to any delayed delivery; and ..."

NO refunds, buddy...

That is pretty clear and unambiguous.

And if it wasn't, this quote (also from the terms of sale) is:

Quote
3) Delivery; Shipment. Delivery dates communicated or acknowledged by Spondoolies in the Order Confirmation are approximate only, and are dependent upon supply chain interruptions and stoppages, development delays, and other factors. Therefore, Purchaser shall not rely upon, and Spondoolies shall not be liable under whatsoever circumstances for any other estimation statement of expectation when delivery will occur.

which seems fair enough. The purchaser assumes all risk, just like any other pre-order.  Spondoolies-Tech should qualify their public statements regarding their resolve to deliver on time with a statement like "but if we don't, its too bad".


Since we won't get to it, it's a moot point.

Should we offer 15% discount on the next purchase like other vendor who fail to meet spec ?

As explained, failure to meet the deadline can occurred only as a result of catastrophic event, in which case offering refunds now will be a gross lie.

Pre-ordering has risks. It also has potential for steep rewards. Do your decision.

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April 12, 2014, 09:52:37 PM
 #884

The technical data is available in the web site. It's a bit outdated. Upon signing an NDA we'll release all the needed information to start a design based on our 1st gen and 2nd gen ASICs. Multiple parties, companies and one collective already got the information.

The updated spec of our 2nd gen ASIC:

Voltage 0.63 V
Total Engines 193
Max frequency at TT corner 984 MHz
Performance 190 GHs
Power 65 W
Power/performance 0.34 W/GHs

Multiple voltages and overclocking points possible.

Does it make you more comfortable ?
Should I post working FPGA pictures ?
Verilog test bench ?

Seriously, we know what we're doing.
The ASICs will arrive on time, working. SP30 will be delivered on time and on spec.

Edit:
Some more information on the system. SP30, like the SP10 will contains two ASICs boards and one management board.
The management board will contain the same TI Sitara processor and FPGA. Beside the FPGA, it's almost identical to Beagle Bone Black.
(Unlike other vendors, we don't ship with hobby boards...)
Each ASICs board contains 15 RockerBox ASICs. The total system output is expected to be over 5.5 TH/s
We've improved our DC2DC design, and we're testing it separately on a test board.

Edit2:
We won't release any information on our 3rd gen ASIC (PickAxe) beside stating again that the design goal is to compete and win in the EH/s (Exa Hash/s) era, while eradicating (by making obsolete) a well known northern farm.

I presume that you are just a marketroid. What you just did by saying "we know what we are doing" and "verilog testbench" is to suggest that you don't have any experience with designing power-limited and noise-limited ASICs. There is obviously a small possibility that someone in your team knows it, but intentionally told you to misinform. But I somehow doubt this had happened in Israel right after shabbat.

You could make an intelligent post without disclosing any proprietary info. Bitfury for example had posted max clock speed for his chip with all hashing engines running and with just one engine running. He also posted whole slew of timing-margin and noise-margin vs. supply voltage values.

If you have no detailed BSIM (or similar analog) models of your chips at this stage then you quite clearly aren't in the "know what we are doing" category but in the "CAD monkey" category. This doesn't bode well for the successful delivery. Simon Barber of Hashfast was the most recent example on this forum: "our chip will work because Apache Redhawk says so!"

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=270384.msg2894710#msg2894710

PS. In the above message all "you" should be understood as "plural you" (i.e. whole company as opposed to the person posting) with the exception of the very first.

Indeed, I'm not an ASIC technical guy.
Point taken. After Passover holiday (towards the end of next week) we'll publish some more technical data.
I do however know the exact status of the project and it's timeline. And everything I've said is true.

As explained multiple time before. The 2nd gen is a simple die shrink of our 1st gen ASIC. It's essentially the same engine.

Edit: RockerBox technical brief is here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/c65ebuvoh5sek2f/rockerbox_brief.pdf
Full datasheet will be given upon signing NDA
We'll post more technical data to "prove" project status after the Passover holiday.

This post was written by Guy Corem, Spondoolies-Tech CEO
(This user is shared between multiple Spondoolies-Tech employees)

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April 12, 2014, 09:57:16 PM
 #885

Pre-ordering has risks. It also has potential for steep rewards. Do your decision.

I have no skin in this game at the moment but at least KNC has a plan B.

I'd send you $40k now if I thought I could ROI 6 SP30s in a year, but with current difficulty projections and the price trend on BTC, the numbers don't work. Good luck with your project.
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April 12, 2014, 10:15:31 PM
 #886

Indeed, I'm not an ASIC technical guy.
Point taken. After Passover holiday (towards the end of next week) we'll publish some more technical data.
I do however know the exact status of the project and it's timeline. And everything I've said is true.

As explained multiple time before. The 2nd gen is a simple die shrink of our 1st gen ASIC. It's essentially the same engine.
Well, there enough people here who understand that with a simple die shrink noise margins shrink faster than the consumed power.

Anyway, I will gladly wait for an update after Nissan 22nd, 5774.

Meanwhile, please enjoy a belated happy Purim song, because I don't know any Passover songs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5T25pdNBVU

Please comment, critique, criticize or ridicule BIP 2112: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0
Long-term mining prognosis: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91101.0
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April 12, 2014, 10:21:20 PM
 #887

Indeed, I'm not an ASIC technical guy.
Point taken. After Passover holiday (towards the end of next week) we'll publish some more technical data.
I do however know the exact status of the project and it's timeline. And everything I've said is true.

As explained multiple time before. The 2nd gen is a simple die shrink of our 1st gen ASIC. It's essentially the same engine.
Well, there enough people here who understand that with a simple die shrink noise margins shrink faster than the consumed power.

Anyway, I will gladly wait for an update after Nissan 22nd, 5774.

Meanwhile, please enjoy a belated happy Purim song, because I don't know any Passover songs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5T25pdNBVU

It will be around the 24th of April
I've edited my previous reply, please find and read it.
Thank you for the song.

The exact same team that did the 1st gen is doing the 2nd gen.
They have done multiple 28nm ASICs before - much more complex one.

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April 12, 2014, 10:33:28 PM
 #888

Pre-ordering has risks. It also has potential for steep rewards. Do your decision.
I have no skin in this game at the moment but at least KNC has a plan B.
KNC published plan B well after they knew they'll be late. The can give their customers all the hash-rate to fulfill plan B immediately.
They are cynically decided not to.
I'd send you $40k now if I thought I could ROI 6 SP30s in a year, but with current difficulty projections and the price trend on BTC, the numbers don't work. Good luck with your project.
Thank you. For many others the numbers do work.

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April 12, 2014, 11:01:06 PM
 #889

What to buy and why?

Funny you should ask ! You are on the right track. Keep plugging those numbers into the mining profitability calculators.
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April 12, 2014, 11:05:30 PM
 #890

Thank you. For many others the numbers do work.

I imagine  the deep discounts on SP30s you offer big customers and cooperatives make the risk/reward assessment  look better.

Unfortunately, smaller miners don't have the purchasing power of corporations and cooperatives, which incidentally makes your statements
regarding your dedication to distribution of network hash power look just a little disingenuous.
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April 12, 2014, 11:11:23 PM
 #891

@ 24 PIN ATX

With all the scrypt ASICs units from KnC, fibonacci, flower, Alpha tech and a few others all hitting the streets at about the same time, those scrypt calculators are worthless.

They are telling you that your 500 mh/s will make you a big fish in a small pond based on the current available information.

The reality is that there will be lots of big fish like you in the same small pond.

I hate having to think of metaphors. This might help:

You need to spend a bit of time working out how many scrypt asics will hit the streets and when, then add up their projected hash rates based on unit sales, then work out the likely difficulty that you will be mining at, then apply some crystal ball gazing at the price of scrypt coins when the asics hit the streets, then factor in that alts are generally pegged to the price of bitcoin, then work out what the price of bitcoin might be when the scrypt asics hit the streets all at once, then factor the loss of interest from the thousands of CPU and GPU miners that will be put out of business and may stop supporting the price of the various scrypt coins, then add 2% for a margin of error. Lastly, do something similar for all the next gen bitcoin asics, the cloud mining farms and services out there, then take a punt at the comparable cost vs. benefit of scrypt vs. bitcoin mining.

I hope that helped?


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April 12, 2014, 11:13:28 PM
 #892

I hope that helped?

R)FL     Its basically a form of high stakes gambling.
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April 12, 2014, 11:14:24 PM
 #893

Thank you. For many others the numbers do work.

I imagine  the deep discounts on SP30s you offer big customers and cooperatives make the risk/reward assessment  look better.

Unfortunately, smaller miners don't have the purchasing power of the corporations and cooperatives, which incidentally makes your statements
regarding your dedication to distribution of network hash power look just a little disingenuous.
The amount of miners we've sold to big corporations is less than 10% of the total miners we've sold.
We do give bulk discounts, but probably not what they're used to.
We'll happily do group buys and give larger discounts on the SP30 and SP10.

We're committed to the distribution of the hash-rate and the long term viability of the eco-system.

Guy

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April 12, 2014, 11:26:03 PM
 #894

Going to sleep.

Per a request in the PM, Hammer (1st gen) datasheet: https://www.dropbox.com/s/68dfsslw68xlce0/ds_hammer_14041.pdf

It still WIP (the datasheet, not the ASIC...). Comments and suggestions are welcome.

Now really going to sleep.

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April 12, 2014, 11:30:29 PM
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We'll happily do group buys and give larger discounts on the SP30 and SP10.


Thanks for your kind reply Guy.
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April 12, 2014, 11:40:46 PM
 #896

Thanks for posting the link to the datsheet

Trends

Quadriga CX BTC/CAD Coin Exchange     www.quadrigacx.com/?ref=umvq5t3i2r6im243v94vucbo
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April 12, 2014, 11:43:09 PM
 #897

Thanks for posting the link to the datsheet

Trends
You're welcome.

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April 12, 2014, 11:59:13 PM
 #898

Good to have the Spondoolies-Tech CEO (Guy) here to respond to all the questions. Thanks Guy !

Sorry if we seem to be treating you with a small serving of skepticism, no disrespect is intended. This is a tough business for everybody right now, and it doesn't look like its going to improve anytime soon. Regulatory risk, pricing risk, delivery risk, risk risk risk ...

Keep up the good work !

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April 13, 2014, 12:01:45 AM
 #899

I have had an order in my cart for a few days now. Just having a hard time pulling the trigger. I am guessing the moment i get these the difficulty will sky rocket to where i cant get ROI. But i am interested because when I look at profit calculator it seems Like I would be able to get ROI by the end of the year. Of course the big problem is no one can predict the future.  Sad

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April 13, 2014, 12:19:12 AM
 #900

An Error Has Occurred!
The last posting from your IP was less than 360 seconds ago. Please try again later.  

======


Seems like a better idea I query what to by and why.

Which everyone ignores. Including the manufacturer.

Yes I am ready if you can answer MY ORIGINAL POST [ seems like ages ago]

WHAT TO BUY AND WHY?
I ask a serious question detailed my predicament and I get laughed off here and declared a troll.

My questions(s) in my original query still stand remain unanswered.

You are ready to spend $100k on something you know nothing about?

Seems like a great idea!
WHAT A SHIT WEBSITE.

NO WONDER BITCOIN IS TANKING.

ACTULLY PAR FOR THE COURSE THIS TREE HUGGING HORSEHIT PINK CROWD OF GLAD HAPPY FREAKS HAVE ALWAYS INTENTIONALU DELAYED TRANSACTIONS TO ARIBITRAGE UNDER THE CLAIM IT IS SO SECURE IT REQUIRES A ZILLIONS CONFIRMATIONS TO ENURE IT IS COOKED. FILTHY DISENGENOUS USAGE AND TANTAMOUNT TO THE BIGGEST SCAM BEING PERPURATED TO DATE.

you have zero posting history and apparently want to spend $100,000 on equipment you clearly know almost nothing about. Is it surprising that the general response was "go away and do your research"?   This site used to make you post in a 'newbie' subsection until you had a few weeks and 50 posts on the site - it helped make sure people posted valid questions and not general 'what should i buy" questions in the actual forum threads

You swung from wanting to invest 100K to screaming on the internet that bitcoin is a scam. Thank you, come again

24" PCI-E cables with 16AWG wires and stripped ends - great for server PSU mods, best prices https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=563461
No longer a wannabe - now an ASIC owner!
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