ㅤ

[o_e_l_e_o]

What possible reason could anyone have for splitting their UTXOs to themselves?

Because I keep the majority of my coins in cold storage and only want to move small amounts at a time to a hot wallet. And sweeping an entire output with zero change provides zero privacy, although I guess that doesn't really matter if you are sending it to a wallet which cooperates with blockchain analysis, lol.

But you only mention this flaw happening in Wasabi and never in Samourai.  Why aren't you capable of being honest when comparing?

At least you finally admit Wasabi reuses addresses!

Now show me a Samourai address reuse since they implemented the fixes you linked to, and I'll be happy to tell everyone to swap to JoinMarket instead.

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[Kruw]

What possible reason could anyone have for splitting their UTXOs to themselves?

Because I keep the majority of my coins in cold storage and only want to move small amounts at a time to a hot wallet.

You can coinjoin with your cold storage using the WabiSabi protocol.  Trezor already does this.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Wasabi, BTCPay Server, or Trezor.

Thanks for alerting me that BTCPay is also now a supporter of mass surveillance and blockchain analysis. Another company to forever cross off my list of recommendations.

[Kruw]

Wasabi, BTCPay Server, or Trezor.

Thanks for alerting me that BTCPay is also now a supporter of mass surveillance and blockchain analysis. Another company to forever cross off my list of recommendations.

Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.  You shill custodial mixing services in your signature, it's clear you have no interest in actually recommending people get the best privacy, you are just collecting a paycheck.

[o_e_l_e_o]

And yet still preferable to paying for the privilege of your "privacy wallet" actively spying on you.

I assume you changed the subject because you have no response to this, just as you've dodged the question about why you think it's acceptable to dox people you disagree with.

Now show me a Samourai address reuse since they implemented the fixes you linked to, and I'll be happy to tell everyone to swap to JoinMarket instead.

[Kruw]

And yet still preferable to paying for the privilege of your "privacy wallet" actively spying on you.

I assume you changed the subject because you have no response to this,

Now show me a Samourai address reuse since they implemented the fixes you linked to, and I'll be happy to tell everyone to swap to JoinMarket instead.

My response is that the hypocrisy of your statement speaks for itself, you simply moved the goalposts to dismiss Samourai's address reuse in Whirlpool because you aren't interested in being honest.

just as you've dodged the question about why you think it's acceptable to dox people you disagree with.

I didn't dodge, I don't care about your drama.  Exposing someone for using sockpuppets is not "doxing", anyone who reads the article knows that Samourai was caught using multiple fake identities to shill their product and attack their competitors (and even collect BTC from giveaways, lmfao): https://nopara73.medium.com/samouraileaks-samouraidevs-sockpuppet-exposed-7ce654b92c0b

Exposing this dishonest behavior is not "doxxing", it's proof that their garbage doesn't get propagated because it's the truth, it's everywhere because they control multiple accounts on social media to make their lies artificially loud.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Ok, so that's a "No" to being able to provide any examples since the issues was fixed. Got it.

Exposing this dishonest behavior is not "doxxing"

Linking accounts together is fine. Linking accounts together and also linking those accounts to a real identity is doxxing. Your stupid wordplay does not change the fact that Wasabi devs actively dox people they disagree with. How anyone in their right mind could ever use a "privacy" service which actively funds blockchain analysis and actively doxxes people they don't like is absolutely beyond me. You are as far from cypherpunks as it is possible to be.

[Kruw]

Ok, so that's a "No" to being able to provide any examples since the issues was fixed. Got it.

Dismissive goal post moving.

Exposing this dishonest behavior is not "doxxing"

Linking accounts together is fine. Linking accounts together and also linking those accounts to a real identity is doxxing. Your stupid wordplay does not change the fact that Wasabi devs actively dox people they disagree with. How anyone in their right mind could ever use a "privacy" service which actively funds blockchain analysis and actively doxxes people they don't like is absolutely beyond me. You are as far from cypherpunks as it is possible to be.

What are you even talking about?  The "doxxing" you are accusing Wasabi devs of is exposing SamouraiDev's use of sock puppets to deceive people on social media.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Dismissive goal post moving.

Nope, haven't moved at all. Just waiting for an example:

Now show me a Samourai address reuse since they implemented the fixes you linked to, and I'll be happy to tell everyone to swap to JoinMarket instead.

What are you even talking about?  The "doxxing" you are accusing Wasabi devs of is exposing SamouraiDev's use of sock puppets to deceive people on social media.

No, I'm talking about this: https://nitter.it/SamouraiWallet/status/1647936591417995264

[DaveF]

o_e_l_e_o , BlackHatCoiner you do know you are arguing with someone who claims to a contributor to Wasabi. That means they have to keep the narrative of Wasabi good others bad or they loose their special place in the world. Or something like that.

Due to the attitude of Wasabi they have lost users, due to the monitoring they have lost users, ignoring those 2 facts they also seem to be working towards working with larger financial institutions. And that is fine. As a business, that is their decision. As consumers it's our decision on which businesses or services to deal with.

At this point anyone who sees this thread / uses twitter or reddit and probably other social media knows what they are doing.
Anyone with a basic knowledge or caring about privacy knows not to use them.

Anything they say or people that contribute to them say that criticizes other services is just going to be seen as propaganda "us good them bad"
Go outside, enjoy the day. At this point almost nobody I know in the BTC world uses Wasabi anymore. A year ago the statement would have been anyone I know in the BTC world who is concerned with privacy uses Wasabi and so do a few others. And I really think the people still using it is mostly because of inertia. They are not going to change until Coinfirm marks one of their inputs as bad. Then they will shrug and complain and move to another wallet.

Lets face it, people are STILL installing and using atomic wallet 2 weeks after the hack: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5454994.0
What are the odds of people like that moving away from this (or any other wallet) because of the massive privacy damage....

Go outside, enjoy the weekend.

-Dave

[BlackHatCoiner]

Yep, if your "main wallet" doesn't support WabiSabi coinjoins, then you should switch your main wallet to one that does:  Wasabi, BTCPay Server, or Trezor.

How does this sound: I don't trust Wasabi developers' coding skills as much as Electrum's. Aside the fact they're outright liars, "privacy-preserving" hypocrites and childish responders, it is reasonable to trust Electrum as software more than Wasabi, because it's orders of magnitude more reviewed, tested, and used.

Thanks for alerting me that BTCPay is also now a supporter of mass surveillance and blockchain analysis. Another company to forever cross off my list of recommendations.

I think that, unless specified they're in favor of Wasabi after recent events, it's a little bit extreme to mark it supporter of mass surveillance. BTCPay is the best open-source bitcoin payment processor with lightning support I know of.

Due to the attitude of Wasabi they have lost users, due to the monitoring they have lost users, ignoring those 2 facts they also seem to be working towards working with larger financial institutions.

I know, but I've taken this more personally. Obviously, anyone with a little sense can notice that blacklisting and funding mass surveillance is against the Bitcoin spirit, but when that very supporter of blacklisting comes and tries to prove otherwise, I won't leave it unchallenged.

[nopara73]

Nobody's supporting mass surveillance here. Quite the opposite in fact. Delivering a Bitcoin privacy solution that's lightyears ahead of the others, is the best testimony to that. zkSNACKs operates with utmost transparency, pushing for a future where privacy is respected and mass surveillance becomes increasingly difficult. The folks at zkSNACKs are dedicated to this cause and tirelessly work on innovative solutions. One of these solutions: Wasabi Wallet, became so successful that the people behind it do not have the luxury to live in lalaland anymore. Working on privacy is risky and it does no good for anybody to go head first into the wall.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Nobody's supporting mass surveillance here.

You directly fund blockchain analysis.

Delivering a Bitcoin privacy solution that's lightyears ahead of the others

Still pushing the meaningless soundbites? Lol.

zkSNACKs operates with utmost transparency

Except you won't reveal which blockchain analysis companies you partnered with (although we now know it is Coinfirm - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5286821.msg62209702#msg62209702), you won't reveal what criteria you use to blacklist transactions, and you won't tell users you are censoring why they are being censored. Super transparent!

pushing for a future where privacy is respected and mass surveillance becomes increasingly difficult.

Difficult to fight against mass surveillance when you are actively funding it.

[Wind_FURY]

Nobody's supporting mass surveillance here. Quite the opposite in fact. Delivering a Bitcoin privacy solution that's lightyears ahead of the others, is the best testimony to that. zkSNACKs operates with utmost transparency, pushing for a future where privacy is respected and mass surveillance becomes increasingly difficult. The folks at zkSNACKs are dedicated to this cause and tirelessly work on innovative solutions. One of these solutions: Wasabi Wallet, became so successful that the people behind it do not have the luxury to live in lalaland anymore. Working on privacy is risky and it does no good for anybody to go head first into the wall.

Ser, first of all, I don't hate WasabiWallet and I also don't hate your decision to block transactions from "nefarious sources", but I merely want to ask one thing. Could you publicly say that WasabiWallet is still technically permissionless and trustless? Because I believe some people are still promoting it in that way.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Delivering a Bitcoin privacy solution that's lightyears ahead of the others, is the best testimony to that.

Let's leave asides for a moment that you're actively funding blockchain analysis, that you're outright liars when it comes to fungibility, that judging by the given letter you're immature individuals, and that you (singular) have been caught to doxxing your competitor.

What about the address reuse that's been multiple times reported? There's an entire twitter page exposing you're a bad service. I honestly haven't seen such a dev team which disregards all the evidence before, it's almost impressive.

[Kruw]

Nope, haven't moved at all. Just waiting for an example:

You already received multiple examples, why would you require more besides the ones I already gave you?

No, I'm talking about this: https://nitter.it/SamouraiWallet/status/1647936591417995264

Pay attention, this is the article published on April 27th:  https://nopara73.medium.com/samouraileaks-samouraidevs-sockpuppet-exposed-7ce654b92c0b

You are attacking the wrong people.  A Wasabi developer exposing the Samourai developer using sock puppets to deceive social media users out of their Bitcoins is not "doxxing".

o_e_l_e_o , BlackHatCoiner you do know you are arguing with someone who claims to a contributor to Wasabi. That means they have to keep the narrative of Wasabi good others bad or they loose their special place in the world. Or something like that.

All three of you are advertising custodial mixers, which means you have to engage in deception to keep people from using non custodial privacy solutions in order for people to use the services you are shilling.  You are traitors to Bitcoin for luring people into those honeypots since the WabiSabi protocol exists to give Bitcoin users complete privacy without trusting any third parties.

Due to the attitude of Wasabi they have lost users, due to the monitoring they have lost users, ignoring those 2 facts they also seem to be working towards working with larger financial institutions. And that is fine. As a business, that is their decision. As consumers it's our decision on which businesses or services to deal with.

At this point anyone who sees this thread / uses twitter or reddit and probably other social media knows what they are doing.
Anyone with a basic knowledge or caring about privacy knows not to use them.

Anything they say or people that contribute to them say that criticizes other services is just going to be seen as propaganda "us good them bad"
Go outside, enjoy the day. At this point almost nobody I know in the BTC world uses Wasabi anymore. A year ago the statement would have been anyone I know in the BTC world who is concerned with privacy uses Wasabi and so do a few others. And I really think the people still using it is mostly because of inertia. They are not going to change until Coinfirm marks one of their inputs as bad. Then they will shrug and complain and move to another wallet.

You're lying, Wasabi has more liquidity than any other coinjoin protocols, you can verify this on the blockchain yourself: https://twitter.com/wasabiwallet/status/1668900203649290241

Yep, if your "main wallet" doesn't support WabiSabi coinjoins, then you should switch your main wallet to one that does:  Wasabi, BTCPay Server, or Trezor.

How does this sound: I don't trust Wasabi developers' coding skills as much as Electrum's. Aside the fact they're outright liars, "privacy-preserving" hypocrites and childish responders, it is reasonable to trust Electrum as software more than Wasabi, because it's orders of magnitude more reviewed, tested, and used.

Hopefully Electrum will implement WabiSabi coinjoins then so you can get privacy on chain since you refuse to use any of the other wallets that do.

I think that, unless specified they're in favor of Wasabi after recent events, it's a little bit extreme to mark it supporter of mass surveillance. BTCPay is the best open-source bitcoin payment processor with lightning support I know of.

WabiSabi is a coinjoin protocol, your idea that using coinjoin makes you a supporter of mass surveillance is literally backwards.  Coinjoins prevent mass surveillance.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Could you publicly say that WasabiWallet is still technically permissionless and trustless? Because I believe some people are still promoting it in that way.

The Wasabi team lie constantly.

Here's a post I made a year ago highlighting some of the lies on their website: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5286821.msg60337199#msg60337199. Nothing has changed in the last year.

Here's a post where I link to the devs lying on Twitter about the issue of address reuse: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5419000.msg61220171#msg61220171

The Wasabi team have no problem lying about their product in order to make themselves profits.

You already received multiple examples, why would you require more besides the ones I already gave you?

It's getting pretty tiresome having to repeat everything I say to you three times before you actually bother to read it. Once again, with emphasis this time:

Now show me a Samourai address reuse since they implemented the fixes you linked to, and I'll be happy to tell everyone to swap to JoinMarket instead.

A Wasabi developer exposing the Samourai developer using sock puppets to deceive social media users out of their Bitcoins is not "doxxing".

Define it however you like to help you sleep at night. As noted in the tweet I linked: "Doxxing your competition is evil. Gaslighting everyone about it is next level."

the WabiSabi protocol exists to give Bitcoin users complete privacy without trusting any third parties.

Except the third parties you pay to spy on your users.

WabiSabi is a coinjoin protocol, your idea that using coinjoin makes you a supporter of mass surveillance is literally backwards.  Coinjoins prevent mass surveillance.

Nice strawman. Literally no one has said using coinjoin makes you a supporter of mass surveillance. It is Wasabi actively funding blockchain analysis which makes you a supporter of mass surveillance.

[Kruw]

A Wasabi developer exposing the Samourai developer using sock puppets to deceive social media users out of their Bitcoins is not "doxxing".

Define it however you like to help you sleep at night. As noted in the tweet I linked: "Doxxing your competition is evil. Gaslighting everyone about it is next level."

I would sleep much better if everyone read the article exposing Samourai's deceptive use of multiple social media accounts to push their product, trash their competition, and even collect free BTC multiple times from giveaways: https://nopara73.medium.com/samouraileaks-samouraidevs-sockpuppet-exposed-7ce654b92c0b

^ You are gaslighting everyone by calling this proof of malicious behavior "doxxing" in order to make a martyr out of a clearly evil liar for his clearly deceptive behavior.

[o_e_l_e_o]

I don't care if someone makes 100 social media accounts. Doxxing is never acceptable. The end.

[Kruw]

I don't care if someone makes 100 social media accounts. Doxxing is never acceptable. The end.

Exposing someone using multiple social media accounts as sock puppets is not "Doxxing".  The end.