Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[BADecker]

Russia attacked Ukraine as a defense, to prevent the attack of Ukraine from overthrowing Russia.

You are unable to see your own contradiction?

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/attack   here is the definition of the word attack.

You would make the war seem unimportant through the use of semantics? That looks like an attack on me, personally, rather than a piece of war talk.

It's like, "if you can't outsmart their understanding, pick on them any other way you can."

Meanwhile, Russia keeps on successfully defending the people of the Black Sea Corridor, Ukraine's own people that Ukraine was trying to kill off... which was the real start of the war.

[paxmao]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RlFtg6CJ7I

Another submarine for Ruzzia, while "protecting the Black Sea".

Refineries report...

https://united24media.com/war-in-ukraine/mapping-ukraines-drone-campaign-to-destroy-russias-oil-empire-12927

And another "well protected" oil terminal in the "Black Sea corridor"...

Novorrossiks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvMj5jiLKcQ

Tuapse
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hPVFAA67A8

And up to 1600 km away. Russia's size is becoming just not enough

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAsXgdkrS88

[BADecker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RlFtg6CJ7I

Another submarine for Ruzzia, while "protecting the Black Sea".

Refineries report...

https://united24media.com/war-in-ukraine/mapping-ukraines-drone-campaign-to-destroy-russias-oil-empire-12927

And another "well protected" oil terminal in the "Black Sea corridor"...

Novorrossiks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvMj5jiLKcQ

Tuapse
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hPVFAA67A8

And up to 1600 km away. Russia's size is becoming just not enough

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAsXgdkrS88

Yes, it is truly a shame that Zelensky terrorism is being supported by the EU. But this isn't stopping Russia at all from liberating the little, new countries of the Black Sea Corridor.

Russia has been playing the game of tit-for-tat. Z makes a move; then Russia hits back a whole lot harder.

The thing that we need to keep in mind is that the West has been trying to conquer Russia for more than 100 years. Will it work this time? Who knows? But it doesn't look like it so far. Even Trump by his flip-flopping is really allowing Russia to continue.

Now, with all the scandals that are coming out into the open regarding Z, perhaps even Western Europe leaders will need to stop their war against Russia... just to save face. Note that Italy (Meloni) and Hungary (Orban) are leading the charge to stop Brussels from continuing this criminal activity... in countries where the people are against it anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9cYxQk0qYI

[DaRude]

President Donald Trump this week approved a 28-point plan for peace between Russia and Ukraine that top administration officials have quietly developed over the last several weeks in consultation with Russian envoy Kirill Dmitriev and Ukrainian officials, a senior administration official told NBC News.
...
“The plan focuses on giving both sides security guarantees to secure a lasting peace,” the senior official told NBC News. “It includes things Ukraine wants and needs to have a durable peace.”

Another chance at peace, let's see if warmongers in Europe will torpedo this plan as well (send in Boris?), and force Ukraine to continue retreating on the battlefield to the last Ukrainian. Merz et al. want to delay loosing power for as long as they can, and if the cost only falls on Ukraine there's not much of a downside for them if it keeps them in power for another winter.

[montaga]

...............
guarantees to secure a lasting peace,
.................

Everlasting peace like in Chechnya, you can bribe a war lord for some time but you can not bribe an entire Nation forever.
https://youtu.be/KHvmSnn_Aik

[Branko]

Russian new strategic bomber entered the room:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGqj8o00Atc

[DaRude]

...............
guarantees to secure a lasting peace,
.................

Everlasting peace like in Chechnya, you can bribe a war lord for some time but you can not bribe an entire Nation forever.
https://youtu.be/KHvmSnn_Aik

I'm convinced that you're a bot who just posts that Russia will collapse any minute now, just keeps your hope up and keep going to the front lines, any second now...

Chechnya is a vulnerable spot for Russia which has been exploited before. But we need someone to exploit it, Europe is a laughing stock now, and Trump is pushing his agenda, which couldn't be further from trying to collapse Russia. So chances of unrest in Chechnya now are close to nil, and quite interesting that that's the best hopium you have left to spread.

[DaRude]

Exclusive: US threatens to cut intel, weapons to press Ukraine into peace deal, sources say

The United States has threatened to cut intelligence sharing and weapons supplies for Ukraine to press it into agreeing to the framework of a U.S.-brokered peace deal, two people familiar with the matter said.
The sources, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that Kyiv was under greater pressure from Washington than during any previous peace discussions, and that the U.S. wanted Ukraine to sign a framework of the deal by next Thursday.

Finally!! What a total mess and a useless war, made total sense not to address Russia's security demands before this whole thing started only to address them now after so much blood has been spilled  . And to think that some EU warmongers still want this to continue. Well, at least everyone won, Ukraine defended Poland, Russia got it's security demands and Russian speaking part of Ukraine, US got 50% of all resources in the remaining part of Ukraine, and EU, well you know...

[montaga]

......................the best hopium you have left to spread.

I have no hopium to spread.
It is a pipe dream to think Chechnya, Crimea or other ethnics will ever be Russian.
No amount of bending, twisting shaping will make someone something he/she is not.
It is like China trying to make you Chinese, good luck.

Last week Ukraine has signed a letter of intent to acquire up to 150 Swedish Gripen E fighter jets.
Also signed an agreement to acquire up to 100 Dassault Rafale F4 fighter jets  from Fance.
And now from the UK Terrahawk Paladin modular, remote-controlled air defense systems

And Kim now sends faulty amunitation because he is scraping bottom of the barrel, stocks going low.

[paxmao]

Exclusive: US threatens to cut intel, weapons to press Ukraine into peace deal, sources say

The United States has threatened to cut intelligence sharing and weapons supplies for Ukraine to press it into agreeing to the framework of a U.S.-brokered peace deal, two people familiar with the matter said.
The sources, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that Kyiv was under greater pressure from Washington than during any previous peace discussions, and that the U.S. wanted Ukraine to sign a framework of the deal by next Thursday.

Finally!! What a total mess and a useless war, made total sense not to address Russia's security demands before this whole thing started only to address them now after so much blood has been spilled  . And to think that some EU warmongers still want this to continue. Well, at least everyone won, Ukraine defended Poland, Russia got it's security demands and Russian speaking part of Ukraine, US got 50% of all resources in the remaining part of Ukraine, and EU, well you know...
[...]

Read carefully. US wants does not mean it just happens. Particularly is you want to sign an agreement that involves the UE... without the EU. Like if I sign with my neighbourgh that YOU will pay us both the gas bill.

Still spreading the fake that Ukranians do not have a will of their own and are just puppets. As Zelensky just said in his latest speech "our enemy does not know us".

Will we let them do this? We have no right to. And we won’t. Because those who seek to destroy us don’t know us well. They don’t understand who we truly are, what we’re about, what we stand for, what kind of people we are.

Remember that first day of the war. Most of us made our choice. The choice for Ukraine. Recall our feelings back then. What was it like? Dark, loud, heavy, painful. For many – terrifying. But the enemy did not see our backs running away. They saw our eyes – full of resolve to fight for what is ours. That is dignity. That is freedom. And this is truly the most terrifying thing for Russia: seeing the Ukrainians’ unity.

https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news/yednist-potribna-nam-yak-nikoli-abi-v-nashomu-domi-buv-dosto-101493

[DaRude]

Exclusive: US threatens to cut intel, weapons to press Ukraine into peace deal, sources say

The United States has threatened to cut intelligence sharing and weapons supplies for Ukraine to press it into agreeing to the framework of a U.S.-brokered peace deal, two people familiar with the matter said.
The sources, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that Kyiv was under greater pressure from Washington than during any previous peace discussions, and that the U.S. wanted Ukraine to sign a framework of the deal by next Thursday.

Finally!! What a total mess and a useless war, made total sense not to address Russia's security demands before this whole thing started only to address them now after so much blood has been spilled  . And to think that some EU warmongers still want this to continue. Well, at least everyone won, Ukraine defended Poland, Russia got it's security demands and Russian speaking part of Ukraine, US got 50% of all resources in the remaining part of Ukraine, and EU, well you know...
[...]

Read carefully. US wants does not mean it just happens. Particularly is you want to sign an agreement that involves the UE... without the EU. Like if I sign with my neighbourgh that YOU will pay us both the gas bill.

Still spreading the fake that Ukranians do not have a will of their own and are just puppets. As Zelensky just said in his latest speech "our enemy does not know us".

Will we let them do this? We have no right to. And we won’t. Because those who seek to destroy us don’t know us well. They don’t understand who we truly are, what we’re about, what we stand for, what kind of people we are.

Remember that first day of the war. Most of us made our choice. The choice for Ukraine. Recall our feelings back then. What was it like? Dark, loud, heavy, painful. For many – terrifying. But the enemy did not see our backs running away. They saw our eyes – full of resolve to fight for what is ours. That is dignity. That is freedom. And this is truly the most terrifying thing for Russia: seeing the Ukrainians’ unity.

https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news/yednist-potribna-nam-yak-nikoli-abi-v-nashomu-domi-buv-dosto-101493

Let's be serious, for everyone except Russia and China, whatever US wants does just happen, let's not fool ourselves here.

Yeah I'm sure that there are still many warmongers in EU who are against peace negotiations and would love nothing more than to still push more Ukrainian bodies at Russians, even without US's intelligence or support, with blackouts and heat interruptions for the rest of Ukrainians. Unless there's some secret reserves of Ukrainian soldiers and some winter counter offensive plans that no one knows about, all they get is to kill off more Ukrainians and Russians and then watch Russia get all of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia. I'm sure there's a special place in hell for those people.

The 28-point peace plan, endorsed by President Donald Trump on Thursday and developed by US and Russian negotiators, envisages major concessions by Kyiv that would cross its long-standing red lines.
The Ukrainian officials said the Trump administration had told Zelenskyy and other people in his team that the White House was working to an “aggressive” timeline to finalise the proposal in order to bring the war to an end before the close of the year.
They added that US officials expect ​Zelenskyy to sign the agreement “before Thanksgiving” on Thursday next week, with the aim of presenting a peace deal in Moscow later this month and concluding the process by early December.
...
White House press secretary Karoline Leavitt said Trump’s special envoy Steve Witkoff and US secretary of state Marco Rubio had been “quietly” working on the peace plan for the past month.
“The president supports this plan,” she added. “It’s a good plan for both Russia and Ukraine, and we believe that it should be acceptable to both sides, and we’re working very hard to get it done.”
...
US army spokesperson Colonel Dave Butler told reporters in Kyiv that Driscoll and Zelenskyy “agreed on an aggressive timeline for signature” on the peace plan. “It’ll be an agreement between the US and the Ukrainians for starters,” he said.
...
Opposition groups in Ukraine have called for the removal of Zelenskyy’s powerful chief of staff Andriy Yermak as well as the resignation of the entire government.

Edit:
Anyone who opposes the peace plan proposed by US must answer the simple question "And then what?". We can all see how Ukraine is doing with US support, so unless they can explain how Ukrainians can suddenly improve their position with reduced US support, they should be punched in the face. Because the simple truth is that the only answer to "And then what?" is Ukraine suffering through the winter, looses more people and territories and then will have to sign another peace plan on much worse terms. Anyone that argues that Ukraine must wait for a meteor to come out of the sky and destroy Russia, must assign probability to such outcome, and then say how many Ukrainian lives and territories they're willing to bet on such outcome. 

[BADecker]

The people of Ukraine - the real Ukrainians - do not want war. Many of them started fleeing Ukraine when the 'war party' (the current party) was elected. Some of them fled way back in 2014. Many fled when Russia moved to liberate the Black Sea oblasts in 2022. Many more have been fleeing all along, to the present.

People are not leaving Ukraine because they are against Ukraine. They simply don't want to be part of a failing war that is being used by the West to try to conquer Russia.

Is the Trump peace plan there to insert the West into Ukraine in ways that Russia doesn't agree with? Or is it a real peace plan that Ukraine and Russia can agree on without Western influence?

The wealthy warmongers in Western Europe don't want peace. Peace is really a fight against the Western wealthy warmongers. Trump's peace plan might be a trick against Russia.

To say it clearly, if the Trump peace plan gives something to Russia from the West, it also takes control of Russia in subtle ways.


Trump's Peace Deal: An Analysis


https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2025/11/23/trumps-peace-deal-an-analysis/
In some respects Trump's proposal gives Putin more of what Putin wants than does the Russian proposal.  Trump makes Putin pay for this by requiring the use of Russian frozen assets to rebuild Ukraine and by denying recognition to the area already incorporated into Russia, but still uncleared of Ukrainian forces.

Trump's proposal, characteristically, also introduces the US into the agreement in a profit-making manner. Frozen Russian assets will be used for payment of US companies tasked with rebuilding Ukraine:

"A powerful global package of measures to rebuild Ukraine, including but not limited to:

1. The creation of a Ukraine Development Fund to invest in fast-growing industries, including technology, data centres, and artificial intelligence.

b. The United States will cooperate with Ukraine to jointly rebuild, develop, modernise, and operate Ukraine's gas infrastructure, including pipelines and storage facilities.

c. Joint efforts to rehabilitate war-affected areas for the restoration, reconstruction and modernisation of cities and residential areas.

d. Infrastructure development.

e. Extraction of minerals and natural resources.

f. The World Bank will develop a special financing package to accelerate these efforts."

From the beginning of the military conflict I have said that what Putin wants from the conflict is a mutual security agreement with the West that brings the hostilities, not merely the conflict in Ukraine, to an end.  This is what Trump offers:

2. A comprehensive non-aggression agreement will be concluded between Russia, Ukraine and Europe. All ambiguities of the last 30 years wil be considered settled.

4. A dialogue will be held between Russia and NATO, mediated by the United States, to resolve all security issues and create conditions for de-escalation in order to ensure global security and increase opportunities for cooperation and future economic development.

7. Ukraine agrees to enshrine in its constitution that it will not join NATO, and NATO agrees to include in its statutes a provision that Ukraine will not be admitted in the future.

8. NATO agrees not to station troops in Ukraine.
...

[DaRude]

"It's important to us that there can be no peace plan for Ukraine unless we give the go-ahead on issues concerning European interests and European sovereignty," Merz said, speaking to reporters at an informal summit of EU leaders.

"Ukrainian interests are also European interests, and we want to work together to ensure their long-term protection," he noted. According to Merz, these shared interests include the fact that Kyiv "cannot be forced into unilateral territorial concessions."

The head of the German government also believes it is important that Ukraine "can continue to effectively defend itself against aggression in the future." To achieve this, it needs strong armed forces and reliable security guarantees from its partners, he added.
...
At the same time, Merz said he doesn't expect a breakthrough in the peace process in Ukraine this week.

Despicable, just despicable. And there's not much Ukrainians can do about it, just to continue to die until he had enough. We won't give you Taurus and we won't let you sign peace deal unless Russia guarantees to turn the gas back on for us, to the last Ukrainian! With such friends, who needs enemies.

[BADecker]

"It's important to us that there can be no peace plan for Ukraine unless we give the go-ahead on issues concerning European interests and European sovereignty," Merz said, speaking to reporters at an informal summit of EU leaders.

"Ukrainian interests are also European interests, and we want to work together to ensure their long-term protection," he noted. According to Merz, these shared interests include the fact that Kyiv "cannot be forced into unilateral territorial concessions."

The head of the German government also believes it is important that Ukraine "can continue to effectively defend itself against aggression in the future." To achieve this, it needs strong armed forces and reliable security guarantees from its partners, he added.
...
At the same time, Merz said he doesn't expect a breakthrough in the peace process in Ukraine this week.

https://media.tenor.com/-xptYENv0NMAAAAd/lord-maximus-farquaad-shrek.gif

Despicable, just despicable. And there's not much Ukrainians can do about it, just to continue to die until he had enough. We won't give you Taurus and we won't let you sign peace deal unless Russia guarantees to turn the gas back on for us, to the last Ukrainian! With such friends, who needs enemies.

Merz would talk like that... as Germany falls apart.

See Almost Every German City Is Now On The Verge Of Bankruptcy - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5566444.0.

[DaRude]

"It's important to us that there can be no peace plan for Ukraine unless we give the go-ahead on issues concerning European interests and European sovereignty," Merz said, speaking to reporters at an informal summit of EU leaders.

"Ukrainian interests are also European interests, and we want to work together to ensure their long-term protection," he noted. According to Merz, these shared interests include the fact that Kyiv "cannot be forced into unilateral territorial concessions."

The head of the German government also believes it is important that Ukraine "can continue to effectively defend itself against aggression in the future." To achieve this, it needs strong armed forces and reliable security guarantees from its partners, he added.
...
At the same time, Merz said he doesn't expect a breakthrough in the peace process in Ukraine this week.

https://media.tenor.com/-xptYENv0NMAAAAd/lord-maximus-farquaad-shrek.gif

Despicable, just despicable. And there's not much Ukrainians can do about it, just to continue to die until he had enough. We won't give you Taurus and we won't let you sign peace deal unless Russia guarantees to turn the gas back on for us, to the last Ukrainian! With such friends, who needs enemies.

Merz would talk like that... as Germany falls apart.

See Almost Every German City Is Now On The Verge Of Bankruptcy - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5566444.0.

Shunned at home, Germany’s far-right AfD deepens ties to Trump administration
Members of the hardline party held senior meetings with sympathetic US State Department officials in recent months, reflecting a growing alignment with parts of the MAGA movement
...
The AfD’s growing ties in Washington come as it surges in German opinion polls, threatening Chancellor Friedrich Merz’s conservatives ahead of a series of state elections next year that polls suggest could give the AfD its first state premier.
...
In February, US Vice President JD Vance shocked European leaders by accusing them of censoring free speech, repressing political rivals and failing to control immigration.

Vance then met with AfD co-leader Alice Weidel in a sign of support shortly before the federal German elections, where they came in an unprecedented second place.
...
In May, Secretary of State Marco Rubio said the party’s classification as extremist was tyranny in disguise.

Merz's days are numbered, that's why he needs Ukraine to keep fighting to delay the inevitable and stay in power for a bit longer.

[paxmao]

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/kremlin-aide-ushakov-says-he-witkoff-will-be-touch-about-their-leaked-call-2025-11-26/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ix7f5tbwFM

Bloomberg’s scoop showing how Trump aide Steve Witkoff coached the Kremlin on the best way to get into Trump’s good graces is extraordinary for what it tells us about Witkoff’s dubious loyalties and the Kremlin’s potential influence over US negotiation efforts. But equally interesting is the leaked material itself and where it may have come from.

The story covers two intercepted phone calls: one between Witkoff and top Kremlin aide Yuri Ushakov, and another between Ushakov and Kirill Dmitriev, who has been deeply involved in negotiations with the Trump White House.

Bloomberg’s story was published without any byline or dateline, presumably because noting where the story was written or who wrote it could give clues as to the identity of the source. Bloomberg says only that it has “reviewed and transcribed audio” of the two phone calls

[...]
Let's be serious, for everyone except Russia and China, whatever US wants does just happen, let's not fool ourselves here.

Yeah I'm sure that there are still many warmongers in EU who are against peace negotiations and would love nothing more than to still push more Ukrainian bodies at Russians, even without US's intelligence or support, with blackouts and heat interruptions for the rest of Ukrainians. Unless there's some secret reserves of Ukrainian soldiers and some winter counter offensive plans that no one knows about, all they get is to kill off more Ukrainians and Russians and then watch Russia get all of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia. I'm sure there's a special place in hell for those people.

[...]

Edit:
Anyone who opposes the peace plan proposed by US must answer the simple question "And then what?". We can all see how Ukraine is doing with US support, so unless they can explain how Ukrainians can suddenly improve their position with reduced US support, they should be punched in the face. Because the simple truth is that the only answer to "And then what?" is Ukraine suffering through the winter, looses more people and territories and then will have to sign another peace plan on much worse terms. Anyone that argues that Ukraine must wait for a meteor to come out of the sky and destroy Russia, must assign probability to such outcome, and then say how many Ukrainian lives and territories they're willing to bet on such outcome.  

So... you guys are still on the narrative that there was an actual US peace plan? There was a document, redacted by the Kremlin, leaked by Witcoff without asking Rubio just to try to anchor the negotiations (a classic, the first one to speak setting the "initial price"). Your wet dream of Ukraine loosing support and all that... well, it is not flying. At this moment this "plan" has been clearly rejected by Republicans, Democrats, Rubio, Europe and Ukraine so... not a plan.

And you of course try the biased approach: If not this then what? Well, if you have the Witkoff plan, you can have as well the Paxmao plan:

1) Ruzzia returns to their borders
2) creates a demilitarised zone INSIDE Ruzzia of at least 100 km
3) pays reparations of at least 2 million USD to ever single Ukranian and 5 million for relatives of those killed.
4) every single member of the military and the Ruzzian government is held accountable for war crimes,
5) Ruzzia returns prisioners and people abducted and publicly apologices for what they have done.
6) Putin leaves the head of the state and goes to be judged as he must,
7) Ruzzia creates a consitution that enshrines democratic rights and holds elections in 6 months.
In the meantime it becomes an UN protectorate with the mission of pacifying, de-putinfying Ruzzia and dismantling their nuclear arsenal to the last bolt.

See, I have a plan too. Am I not a diplomacy genius? Oh, and anyone opposing this should explain... if not that then what?

On the ground Ruzzia is showing clear signs of weakness. The price of the Ruzzian oil barrel - which is what is paying for the invasion of Ukraine - is lower than ever. The missile capabilities of Ukraine have increased to the point that they can hit refineries even near Moscow and the latest sanctions by the US were not the usual joke. Sign bonus for soldiers are lowering and, if you ask me, I doubt very much that orcs salaries will be paid in the near future.

It is quite clear that prolonging the war is not doing any favour to Ruzzia. Putin only likes it above 60 USD a barrel. Trump is probably trying to compensate for whatever may appear on the Epstein files I guess and for all the shit the Kremlin has on him.

[Lucius]

~snip~
It is quite clear that prolonging the war is not doing any favour to Ruzzia. Putin only likes it above 60 USD a barrel. Trump is probably trying to compensate for whatever may appear on the Epstein files I guess and for all the shit the Kremlin has on him.

I don't know what else should come out of those files to make it more than obvious that he used his services - we also know the name of the girl he was with and that Epstein tried to use it in some way for political blackmail. As for the dirt they have on each other, I don't believe that anyone would agree to open Pandora's box, so I don't think it's about blackmail, but that DT has, so to speak, a weakness for dictators and bad guys.

He recently hosted the Syrian president who was on the US list of terrorists with a reward of $10 million - what else can you say about a man who behaves like that towards someone who killed American soldiers.

The war will unfortunately last until Russia achieves what it has planned, or until the US convinces Ukraine that it must surrender on their terms. If that happens, then it's just a question of how many more wars will occur with the same goal - seizing other people's territory under any meaningless pretext.

[DaRude]

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/kremlin-aide-ushakov-says-he-witkoff-will-be-touch-about-their-leaked-call-2025-11-26/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ix7f5tbwFM

Bloomberg’s scoop showing how Trump aide Steve Witkoff coached the Kremlin on the best way to get into Trump’s good graces is extraordinary for what it tells us about Witkoff’s dubious loyalties and the Kremlin’s potential influence over US negotiation efforts. But equally interesting is the leaked material itself and where it may have come from.

The story covers two intercepted phone calls: one between Witkoff and top Kremlin aide Yuri Ushakov, and another between Ushakov and Kirill Dmitriev, who has been deeply involved in negotiations with the Trump White House.

Bloomberg’s story was published without any byline or dateline, presumably because noting where the story was written or who wrote it could give clues as to the identity of the source. Bloomberg says only that it has “reviewed and transcribed audio” of the two phone calls

-snip-

So... you guys are still on the narrative that there was an actual US peace plan? There was a document, redacted by the Kremlin, leaked by Witcoff without asking Rubio just to try to anchor the negotiations (a classic, the first one to speak setting the "initial price"). Your wet dream of Ukraine loosing support and all that... well, it is not flying. At this moment this "plan" has been clearly rejected by Republicans, Democrats, Rubio, Europe and Ukraine so... not a plan.

-snip-

U.S. Army secretary warned Ukraine of imminent defeat while pushing initial peace plan
...
Driscoll told his counterparts their troops faced a dire situation on the battlefield and would suffer an imminent defeat against Russian forces, two sources with knowledge of the matter told NBC News.

The Russians were ramping up the scale and pace of their aerial attacks, and they had the ability to fight on indefinitely, Driscoll told them, according to the sources. The situation for Ukraine would only get worse over time, he continued, and it was better to negotiate a peace settlement now rather than end up in an even weaker position in the future.

And there was more bad news. The U.S. delegation also said America’s defense industry could not keep supplying Ukraine with the weapons and air defenses at the rate needed to protect the country’s infrastructure and population, the sources said.
...
“The message was basically — you are losing,” one of the sources said, “and you need to accept the deal.”
...
“I look forward to hopefully meeting with President Zelenskyy and President Putin soon, but ONLY when the deal to end this War is FINAL or, in its final stages,” Trump added in the post.

A State Department spokesperson said, “President Trump’s entire team, including Secretary Rubio, Special Envoy Witkoff, Secretary Driscoll, and many others, are working in lockstep, as they have been for 10 months, to bring an end to the senseless and destructive war.”
.
Republican and Democratic senators said Rubio had told them it was a plan drafted by the Russians. But Rubio later said their account was false, and he and the White House later insisted it was a U.S. proposal with Russian and Ukrainian “input.”
...
Trump, meanwhile, ramped up pressure on Ukraine, telling reporters that Zelenskyy’s choice was to accept a peace deal or “continue to fight his little heart out.”

Unfortunately Zelenskiy is not fighting with only his but with Ukrainian hearts.

The only reason not to accept a peace plan is if you believe you can improve your situation with time. Rejecting a peace plan with a deteriorating position is either idiocy or you're doing someone else's bidding.

If you can get Trump and Putin to approve your plan, then sure, until then stop wasting time.

~snip~
It is quite clear that prolonging the war is not doing any favour to Ruzzia. Putin only likes it above 60 USD a barrel. Trump is probably trying to compensate for whatever may appear on the Epstein files I guess and for all the shit the Kremlin has on him.

I don't know what else should come out of those files to make it more than obvious that he used his services - we also know the name of the girl he was with and that Epstein tried to use it in some way for political blackmail. As for the dirt they have on each other, I don't believe that anyone would agree to open Pandora's box, so I don't think it's about blackmail, but that DT has, so to speak, a weakness for dictators and bad guys.

He recently hosted the Syrian president who was on the US list of terrorists with a reward of $10 million - what else can you say about a man who behaves like that towards someone who killed American soldiers.

The war will unfortunately last until Russia achieves what it has planned, or until the US convinces Ukraine that it must surrender on their terms. If that happens, then it's just a question of how many more wars will occur with the same goal - seizing other people's territory under any meaningless pretext.

If the west encroaches on Russian sphere and tries anymore coups with cookies, Russia will respond how it can. As long as Nuland doesn't show up somewhere with her cookies, the countries should be safe. In any case, the next unstable situation is, if the world is fine with US blockading Cuba then it can't have double standards with China and Taiwan.

[moderator's note: multiple posts have been merged]

[montaga]

.....................
If you can get Trump and Putin to approve your plan.

Trump has no say in the matter, it is not a school were he can bully his way around. The two warring party's have to come to a peace deal.
Trump would only guarantee a guerilla war for generations to come, neither Russia or US would be willing to finance it.
 Chechnya style peace deal is not a option, Ukraine is way  to big, for a peace bribe.
The whole of USSR could not get a victory in Afghanistan in 10 years of fighting.

[paxmao]

The war will unfortunately last until Russia achieves what it has planned, or until the US convinces Ukraine that it must surrender on their terms. If that happens, then it's just a question of how many more wars will occur with the same goal - seizing other people's territory under any meaningless pretext.

Not at all. Ruzzia is clearly showing signs of not being able to finance the war. It needs oil, it needs oil to be exported and have someone willing to buy it, it needs oil to be at a certain price. All these three things are being hit by sactions, drones, missiles and the increase in oil production.

[...]

The only reason not to accept a peace plan is if you believe you can improve your situation with time. Rejecting a peace plan with a deteriorating position is either idiocy or you're doing someone else's bidding.

If you can get Trump and Putin to approve your plan, then sure, until then stop wasting time.

Unfortunately, Ukraine does not improve their situation signing a plan that requires handing over their defensive belt, limitng their army, their alliances... and so many other things.

i am convinced that Ukraine is going not as much to improve their situation, but much more to worsen the Ruzzian situation to the point in which Putin has to consider if doubling down may end with him in a Gulag.