[ANN] FIMK: 2.5G POS, extra block rewards, messaging, asset colors, p2p shopping

[xibeijan]

I am a large FIM holder (from IPO) and I even I think it would be nice to have incentives for smaller FIM holders to get involved.

We'll think this through how to arrange it, but it's very difficult to do without skewing the incentives towards unfairness.

Bonus rewards are not paid very often, so random variance will play a big role and even small time forgers have a considerable chance of hitting the bonanza on one of them.

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

[Eliphaz Fimk]

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

[PilotofBTC]

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

[gvans]

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.

Brilliant idea btw to split it in two Only I would correct that either one of the two blocks in a row are as likely to be forged by a big stakeholder since that square number block is just a regular block like the rest of them. But the odds that the same account forges two in a row is way lower.

[vincentvincent]

Hello

I wanted to ask if there is any risk associated with forging if done with a downloaded "local" client?

And aliases can still not be created right?

Is Fimk Ry devs forging with the unreleased fimk balances as well ?

I don't see any risks in forging with a downloaded client running on your local machine. your password will stay locally, I see no risk.

I was able to create aliases? So I think creating aliases should be possible also for you?

[Vega]

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

[gvans]

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

BUT, they all would have to be forging too. That's the catch, isn't it.

If even the need of active forging is not an issue, then it has to be something along these lines I suppose
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=633304.msg7720567#msg7720567

[Vega]

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

BUT, they all would have to be forging too. That's the catch, isn't it.

If even the need of active forging is not an issue, then it has to be something along these lines I suppose
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=633304.msg7720567#msg7720567

There is no cath, you can forge with as many account as you want on one node. There is no difference if you log in with one account or a 1000.

[xibeijan]

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

[Vega]

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.

[xibeijan]

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.

lol. 20 bucks today can easily become 10,000 USD tomorrow in the crypto world.  Everyone knows this.

[lovely89]

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.

lol. 20 bucks today can easily become 10,000 USD tomorrow in the crypto world.  Everyone knows this.

The only way to successfully distribute coins evenly to people is to have those people uniquely identified. Without a central authority, or without the mass cooperation of every single person involved, people will always be able to game the system. It's not even about effort, it's about ability. This makes any attempt to reward smaller stakeholders futile. 

[Eliphaz Fimk]

And aliases can still not be created right?

They can, just use the correct format of the account number (update readme falsely speaks of accepting both formats - coders are like that).

Is Fimk Ry devs forging with the unreleased fimk balances as well ?

No.

This makes any attempt to reward smaller stakeholders futile. 

On this part I agree and would leave the minor issue of bonus rewards behind now. The rewards are given so rarely that random variance takes care of it. Unfortunately for the first reward randomness had a good one on us, resulting in a lot of wasted energy for the community in an attempt to solve an issue of little significance.

We have arranged the basic income to help those with less money. We cannot yet save the whole world but we can save the early adopter Finns 

[realthe]

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting

[Simakki]

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting

Already No. 5  Hopefully we'll see more exchanges trading FIMK.
Forging blocks are quite funny and what i have understood, devs are creating new Exchange for FIMK and it will launch soon!

[BlackFor3st]

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting

Already No. 5  Hopefully we'll see more exchanges trading FIMK.
Forging blocks are quite funny and what i have understood, devs are creating new Exchange for FIMK and it will launch soon!

Will bter need a permission to list FIM or can the devs decide about that?

[oldnbold]

I purchased my FIMK via dgex.com and I've now downloaded the browser web wallet; so next step presumably is to go to https://wallet.fimk.fi:7886/, click on Returning User?, enter the passphrase for my FIMK account, as set out in my dgex.com back office, wait for the blockchain to download and start forging.

Is that it or have I missed a step?

Thought I should check first.

TIA 

[moki2]

how to distrubution?i want to know,lol

[GeneToniK]

So FIMK is list in Coinmarketcap and coinmarketcap shows now, change of 1h and 7 days, and all coins in one list, low volume list is closed^^

Second i have a  newbie question, excuse my bad english xD
 The question : When i´am logged out of my account and my pc is don`t running, i can forge. How this works ?

[dance]

So FIMK is list in Coinmarketcap and coinmarketcap shows now, change of 1h and 7 days, and all coins in one list, low volume list is closed^^

Second i have a  newbie question, excuse my bad english xD
 The question : When i´am logged out of my account and my pc is don`t running, i can forge. How this works ?

If you are using wallet on fimk.fi website, even if you logging out the 'server part' is still running (keeping your passphrase in memory). But up-time and security are not guaranteed.