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mattadc
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July 29, 2014, 08:39:08 AM |
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Take Satoshi, BCnext, UP, for example. They left and these communities suffered.
I see this so clearly, how others don't...well... it just baffles me. I'll leave it at that.
No you don't. No coin has surpassed BTC. It is the gold standard as far as crypto is concerned; there is nothing that has come close to beating it. The BTC community has NOT suffered. NXT, that's a different story. NEM... isn't even a coin yet, so just hold your horses and wait until its actually a real thing before you decide it suffers from the same problems as the #1 cryptocurrency of all-time. NEMstake has been decreasing in value over the past couple of months, just like almost every other altcoin. The only thing that really sets NEM apart from the crowd is that its not actually a real coin yet and already has a multimillion dollar market cap. Having said that, I still like NEM and I expect big things in its future. Just cut down on the grandiosity a little bit, its embarrassing. You think you could take that quote any further out of context  Listen, BTC is the BEST SO FAR, it has the best head start, read what I wrote a little more carefully. It will be passed up btw. If it's NEM, I don't know, you are totally offended that I'm stating that BTC could be doing better. Calm down, BTC is the beginning, not the end. It was never meant to be the end. Satoshi was introducing a new tecnology, the blockchain, a trustless public ledger, he did not intend for Bitcoin itself to change the world on its own, but the blockchain, the public ledger and his some of his other innovations that were not included in Bitcoin btw, I beleive he did think would change the world. That is what we are talking about here. Try to think into the future a little bit. And my point wasn't to get into BTC debate, though I may have brought this on myself. I am simply stating that NEM needs a full time Management team. That's all. Your statement may be one result to the claims or complaints, which have emerged in past few days. The frequency of a word "utopian" may be used as a measurement  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=654845.msg8050911#msg8050911https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=654845.msg8054499#msg8054499 |
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Simakki
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July 29, 2014, 09:00:02 AM |
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There should be a handout created for NEM targeted for people completely new to digital currencies. It should be brochure like, easy for anyone to print out. Make it as simple as possible, explain the idea of digital currencies as a whole and then what approach NEM is taking. People involved in the swarm team could print these off and post them locally on bulletins or hand them out by hand on streets, campuses, local events.
Going further, we could put a message inside some of the brochure offering free X amount of NEM (we could include what market value this would be in $) for anyone potentially interested in getting involved with the project. We could make the brochures unique by serial numbers and have them redeem them after creating an account on the Nem forums.
Does this seem like a realistic marketing idea?
No. Bitcoin itself is only used by a million people around the world. Getting people to use crypto currencies is an education campaign and a simple brochure (even with measly freebies attached - which I don't like) would have a very low effectiveness rate. I've seen the marketing strategies used by Litecoin and Dogecoin. Back in 2013 they were spamming on large internet forums like Bodybuilding but it wasn't an education campaign "why you should use cryptos" but more like "hear about dat Bitcoin chyieet? Well throw money at Litecoin and make $$$$" However unethical it was for LTC / Doge people to pass off their coin as a money flipping opportunity, I don't think anyone on their forum ever writes: "hey guys, remember in 2013 when you were passing off money flipping opportunities to random people on the internet?". That method they used was effective in the sense that Doge was able to hit $60 million and LTC is still the Prince to BTC and I was around (albeit not registered on BTT at the time) to see its' raise. Ironically it was those LTC money flipping threads on websites like Bodybuilding that made me lurk on Bitcointalk. People don't need handouts or brochures. People need simple and impossible to screw up mobile apps. Agreed. Make a stupid simple mobile app that feels low intensity and designed to be social instead of institutional and your value will increase organically because of the viral effect. If people go "what is this thing in the top 100" on the store and its stupid simple when they run it because they heard about it from a friend, it will happen naturally. You get it in the top 100 in the first place just by making it a social currency by using gamification or some other simple / fun app that ties in to the real block chain. Maybe it's currency for an MMO game on mobile or whatever. As long as your API is solid, people can tie in to it in a variety of ways with viral apps on mobile. If it isn't easy and it isn't mobile, you'll never hit critical mass. You could have a variety of different apps that do different things (maybe one is a game, maybe one is a "friends bar tab" app) but both use the real block chain underneath. The same dollar that buys bubblegum can also buy a Ferrari, and that is the point. The more uses it has the more value it has. Totally agree. Nowadays even elderly people in Finland pay their bills with tablets and are very willing to use smartphones, even though they are really not into technology itself it has and will change their ways to consume. I don´t see any options than focusing especially in UI and Mobile apps, normal folks don't really care about sophisticated functions if they cannot even manage to install those applications by themselves. |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 09:13:49 AM |
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Take Satoshi, BCnext, UP, for example. They left and these communities suffered.
I see this so clearly, how others don't...well... it just baffles me. I'll leave it at that.
No you don't. No coin has surpassed BTC. It is the gold standard as far as crypto is concerned; there is nothing that has come close to beating it. The BTC community has NOT suffered. NXT, that's a different story. NEM... isn't even a coin yet, so just hold your horses and wait until its actually a real thing before you decide it suffers from the same problems as the #1 cryptocurrency of all-time. NEMstake has been decreasing in value over the past couple of months, just like almost every other altcoin. The only thing that really sets NEM apart from the crowd is that its not actually a real coin yet and already has a multimillion dollar market cap. Having said that, I still like NEM and I expect big things in its future. Just cut down on the grandiosity a little bit, its embarrassing. You think you could take that quote any further out of context Listen, BTC is the BEST SO FAR, it has the best head start, read what I wrote a little more carefully. It will be passed up btw. If it's NEM, I don't know, you are totally offended that I'm stating that BTC could be doing better. Calm down, BTC is the beginning, not the end. It was never meant to be the end. Satoshi was introducing a new tecnology, the blockchain, a trustless public ledger, he did not intend for Bitcoin itself to change the world on its own, but the blockchain, the public ledger and his some of his other innovations that were not included in Bitcoin btw, I beleive he did think would change the world. That is what we are talking about here. Try to think into the future a little bit. And my point wasn't to get into BTC debate, though I may have brought this on myself. I am simply stating that NEM needs a full time Management team. That's all. Your statement may be one result to the claims or complaints, which have emerged in past few days. The frequency of a word "utopian" may be used as a measurement https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=654845.msg8050911#msg8050911https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=654845.msg8054499#msg8054499huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? |
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mattadc
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July 29, 2014, 09:20:48 AM |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 09:34:11 AM |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? so im UP? lol I wish |
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mattadc
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July 29, 2014, 09:39:28 AM |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? so im UP? lol I wish nope, just meant that after he left there has appeared an empty space... |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 09:45:33 AM
Last edit: July 29, 2014, 12:32:48 PM by lexicon |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? so im UP? lol I wish nope, just meant that after he left there has appeared an empty space... ok lol Yeah, We need Pat to take that spot full time. Hopefully NEM can afford him. But I cant see why not. We have the funds and hes worth every penny Xtester too, we need to start using these promotional funds They are really are not available till launch, but that can be the plan They are good and we need to secure them, even if the fuckers didn't send me my token yet LMAO I want them, they are good. We have them, but they should be paid for what they do. The community can help for free. I will help for free. But if we want a quality team, we hire them, and fire them if they do bad, like anything else. Not that Id think theyd get fired lol. They are rock solid. The community needs to speak up if they agree with me. We need to be making moves as a community. That's what makes NEM different!!! The community make moves, takes action. And we should be rewarding those who do the real work. Those look like solid ones to me. Build a foundation!! People act like anything that resembles a real business is the "old way" that we want to get away from That's short sighted IMO Hire some leaders, seems like a no brainer to me THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DECENTRALIZED
AND NO SOLID MANAGEMENT STRUCTUREI think it says in the development contract that the community is NOT in control of these funds, but that doesn't mean we can't voice our opinion about what they should be spent on. And guys, we have a boatload of money. It's not like I'm talking about wasting it!! If people didn't realize yet, I try not to be a dumbass, and I can become impatient, it is one of my faults, yes. At the same time I demand things get done. I'm no nonsense - get things done - don't let the small stuff pile up - pay attention to the details - dont miss the small things because big things are being done - I speak up - BIG PICTURE -kind of guy |
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dandruff1138
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July 29, 2014, 12:28:33 PM |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? so im UP? lol I wish nope, just meant that after he left there has appeared an empty space... ok lol Yeah, We need Pat to take that spot full time. Hopefully NEM can afford him. But I cant see why not. We have the funds and hes worth every penny Xtester too, we need to start using these promotional funds They are really are not available till launch, but that can be the plan They are good and we need to secure them, even if the fuckers didn't send me my token yet LMAO I want them, they are good. We have them, but they should be paid for what they do. The community can help for free. I will help for free. But if we want a quality team, we hire them, and fire them if they do bad, like anything else. Not that Id think theyd get fired lol. They are rock solid. The community needs to speak up if they agree with me. We need to be making moves as a community. That's what makes NEM different!!! The community make moves, takes action. And we should be rewarding those who do the real work. Those look like solid ones to me. Build a foundation!! People act like anything that resembles a real business is the "old way" that we want to get away from That's short sighted IMO Hire some leaders, seems like a no brainer to me THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DECENTRALIZED
AND NO SOLID MANAGEMENT STRUCTUREI think it says in the development contract that the community is NOT in control of these funds, but that doesn't mean we can't voice our opinion about what they should be spent on. And guys, we have a boatload of money. It's not like I'm talking about wasting it!! UI agree on all points except for boatload of money. We don;t have ANY money, as this coin isn't even released yet. Curious to see where things go from here. There are two things that would change my mind on NEM, who jumps on board, and if/when the coin gets released. |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 12:47:03 PM |
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huh? I looked at the links and don't get it? lexicon: Management links: Utopianfuture 1+1=? so im UP? lol I wish nope, just meant that after he left there has appeared an empty space... ok lol Yeah, We need Pat to take that spot full time. Hopefully NEM can afford him. But I cant see why not. We have the funds and hes worth every penny Xtester too, we need to start using these promotional funds They are really are not available till launch, but that can be the plan They are good and we need to secure them, even if the fuckers didn't send me my token yet LMAO I want them, they are good. We have them, but they should be paid for what they do. The community can help for free. I will help for free. But if we want a quality team, we hire them, and fire them if they do bad, like anything else. Not that Id think theyd get fired lol. They are rock solid. The community needs to speak up if they agree with me. We need to be making moves as a community. That's what makes NEM different!!! The community make moves, takes action. And we should be rewarding those who do the real work. Those look like solid ones to me. Build a foundation!! People act like anything that resembles a real business is the "old way" that we want to get away from That's short sighted IMO Hire some leaders, seems like a no brainer to me THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DECENTRALIZED
AND NO SOLID MANAGEMENT STRUCTUREI think it says in the development contract that the community is NOT in control of these funds, but that doesn't mean we can't voice our opinion about what they should be spent on. And guys, we have a boatload of money. It's not like I'm talking about wasting it!! UI agree on all points except for boatload of money. We don;t have ANY money, as this coin isn't even released yet. Curious to see where things go from here. There are two things that would change my mind on NEM, who jumps on board, and if/when the coin gets released. I agree with you there, thats why earlier I said once launch happens, then we will have money. Thanks for speaking up and agreeing with my major points, of get small stuff done fast, and get solid management team established. Others need to weigh in on these issues, one way or the other, maybe the majority of the community disagrees with my points, or hopefully you see the importance of them, either way lets hear it guys. Who is for getting solid management structure set up. So we as a community can direct them, and stand behind them when they need us. BUT there has to be a THEY, ie management to begin with, for us to work with. Again PAT = Project Manager ~ Xtester = Marketing Director |
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rockethead
Legendary
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Activity: 1059
Merit: 1016
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July 29, 2014, 01:03:21 PM |
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@lexicon
glad you made that edit lol
please stop with the new manager thing too. there isnt a need for one. and its insulting to patmast3r who basically is the lead guy even though he doesnt see himself as one.
Is he, I didn't know that, well maybe that's why things are getting fixed, i know Xtester has a lot of pull too. Let's give Pat the credit he is due. I call for Pat to be the OFFICIAL project manager. That's the only thing I think I disagree with you on, is we DO need a project manager, you say we don't need one because he in acting as one now? Let's REALLY give him the reigns, we need someone like him!! Does anyone in the community have a problem with this. And he should be paid as well. The dev and marketing teams are doing a great job managing a project of this complexity, IMHO. Feel free to give pat money, though  Overall, I don't think we should rely too much on any centralized leadership. That won't be sustainable in the long run. That is probably why Satoshi, BCNext, UP all left. I think that it is very obvious that you and the other programmers should be paid for what you made and maintain technology wise. This is a no brainer, you took your expertise and developed something remarkable. Are we going to just leave the NEM system you made open, for anyone to change, just come on in and add to it, as someone would a wiki. Then someone can leave a note that says, this isn't working, this is incorrect, and so on. Of course not. It's impossible for this to be done because their would be too many cooks in the kitchen, and security issues of course. Can someone get with you guys and say hey, let's try this, and then you guys say, wow, great idea, we should do it, and in some circumstances that person be invited to join the team; again, of course. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The same goes with the actual infrastructure of management. There has to be management. Not just maintaining the actual system, but with the management of the NEM community itself. There doesn't have to be designated leaders for it to merely survive, however, the same holds true with NEM Management, as with the wiki example above for the tech, when it comes to management of day to day operations regarding NEM. We can't just have lexicon coming on and posting that we should do this, and we shouldn't do that, and then some agree and some not agree. Of course the Management team will take direction from the programmers and the community, but someone has to run the show. For NEM to have any chance at changing the world, it will come from the developers of the tech, and the developers and actors of the management infrastructure. The day to day operations on both sides. For this we need designated leaders. Without them, we have no chance against our competitors. Take Satoshi, BCnext, UP, for example. They left and these communities suffered, but all bounced back to a point, NEM even more so! Yes, Bitcoin "made it" in some peoples eyes, but in my eyes, they have failed miserably at mass adoption. If Satoshi, had taken his premine, and assembled a team, to manage, and market Bitcoin. IMO we would see Bitcoin being used much more that the measly percentage of the world that is using it now. Satoshi left because it was the alpha of cryptos. Nxt same thing. It is the beta of cryptos. It will stay there as well. It doesn't have enough funding to put any meaningful management team together. Period. It holds, and for a short while, it will hold a respectable postiton in the tiny crypto world, until it falls to better funded and more organized competitors. NEM has the promotional funds to put together a meaningful management team. I don't see a better group of guys to head this management team up than what we have now. With Pat as the lead as Project Manager and Xtester as the Marketing Director. These guys are great guys that need to do this full time, or someone else does, if NEM is to change the world. They need to be doing this full time and they need to eat. Like Ethereum is trying to produce Satoshi's 3rd and final product. Not alpha and not beta, but a finished product, NEM has that chance, to be that as well, with the amount of promotional funds that have been allocated. Now it is time to put a meaningful, full time, team together, or NEM will suffer Nxt's fate the minute Ethereum and others come onto the scene. I see this so clearly, how others don't...well... it just baffles me. I'll leave it at that. Your proposition is something worthwhile looking into. Maybe we should just do it with a different twist instead. We leave NEM as it is, a decentralized ecosystem and have a centralized one that is fully financed by itself and for itself, hopefully with some catalyst funds coming in from NEM. That will be cool ain't it? After all, no one is going to live on fresh air and sunshine trying to promote NEM with no money. Foundation ain't going to work either. It is too long and arduous a journey and gets politicized eventually. Just look at the Bitcoin Foundation. Not getting anywhere other than in-fighting. So long there is no money to be made, it will be hard to hire any good guys coming in to run the show. |
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adsactly
Full Member
Offline
Activity: 170
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ADSactly is an Autonomous Decentralized Society
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July 29, 2014, 01:10:21 PM |
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worldcryptonetwork.com is Mad Bitcoins new News site for Crypto Coins
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Do you want to be the FIRST to Know about New Cryptocurrency Projects and New Inventions that could potentially change the world for the better? Join ADSactly Discord the Decentralized Community of Cryptocurrency Enthusiasts and New Comers. http://discord.me/adsactly |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 02:12:16 PM
Last edit: July 29, 2014, 02:22:47 PM by lexicon |
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@lexicon
glad you made that edit lol
please stop with the new manager thing too. there isnt a need for one. and its insulting to patmast3r who basically is the lead guy even though he doesnt see himself as one.
Is he, I didn't know that, well maybe that's why things are getting fixed, i know Xtester has a lot of pull too. Let's give Pat the credit he is due. I call for Pat to be the OFFICIAL project manager. That's the only thing I think I disagree with you on, is we DO need a project manager, you say we don't need one because he in acting as one now? Let's REALLY give him the reigns, we need someone like him!! Does anyone in the community have a problem with this. And he should be paid as well. The dev and marketing teams are doing a great job managing a project of this complexity, IMHO. Feel free to give pat money, though Overall, I don't think we should rely too much on any centralized leadership. That won't be sustainable in the long run. That is probably why Satoshi, BCNext, UP all left. I think that it is very obvious that you and the other programmers should be paid for what you made and maintain technology wise. This is a no brainer, you took your expertise and developed something remarkable. Are we going to just leave the NEM system you made open, for anyone to change, just come on in and add to it, as someone would a wiki. Then someone can leave a note that says, this isn't working, this is incorrect, and so on. Of course not. It's impossible for this to be done because their would be too many cooks in the kitchen, and security issues of course. Can someone get with you guys and say hey, let's try this, and then you guys say, wow, great idea, we should do it, and in some circumstances that person be invited to join the team; again, of course. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The same goes with the actual infrastructure of management. There has to be management. Not just maintaining the actual system, but with the management of the NEM community itself. There doesn't have to be designated leaders for it to merely survive, however, the same holds true with NEM Management, as with the wiki example above for the tech, when it comes to management of day to day operations regarding NEM. We can't just have lexicon coming on and posting that we should do this, and we shouldn't do that, and then some agree and some not agree. Of course the Management team will take direction from the programmers and the community, but someone has to run the show. For NEM to have any chance at changing the world, it will come from the developers of the tech, and the developers and actors of the management infrastructure. The day to day operations on both sides. For this we need designated leaders. Without them, we have no chance against our competitors. Take Satoshi, BCnext, UP, for example. They left and these communities suffered, but all bounced back to a point, NEM even more so! Yes, Bitcoin "made it" in some peoples eyes, but in my eyes, they have failed miserably at mass adoption. If Satoshi, had taken his premine, and assembled a team, to manage, and market Bitcoin. IMO we would see Bitcoin being used much more that the measly percentage of the world that is using it now. Satoshi left because it was the alpha of cryptos. Nxt same thing. It is the beta of cryptos. It will stay there as well. It doesn't have enough funding to put any meaningful management team together. Period. It holds, and for a short while, it will hold a respectable postiton in the tiny crypto world, until it falls to better funded and more organized competitors. NEM has the promotional funds to put together a meaningful management team. I don't see a better group of guys to head this management team up than what we have now. With Pat as the lead as Project Manager and Xtester as the Marketing Director. These guys are great guys that need to do this full time, or someone else does, if NEM is to change the world. They need to be doing this full time and they need to eat. Like Ethereum is trying to produce Satoshi's 3rd and final product. Not alpha and not beta, but a finished product, NEM has that chance, to be that as well, with the amount of promotional funds that have been allocated. Now it is time to put a meaningful, full time, team together, or NEM will suffer Nxt's fate the minute Ethereum and others come onto the scene. I see this so clearly, how others don't...well... it just baffles me. I'll leave it at that. Your proposition is something worthwhile looking into. Maybe we should just do it with a different twist instead. We leave NEM as it is, a decentralized ecosystem and have a centralized one that is fully financed by itself and for itself, hopefully with some catalyst funds coming in from NEM. That will be cool ain't it? After all, no one is going to live on fresh air and sunshine trying to promote NEM with no money. Foundation ain't going to work either. It is too long and arduous a journey and gets politicized eventually. Just look at the Bitcoin Foundation. Not getting anywhere other than in-fighting. So long there is no money to be made, it will be hard to hire any good guys coming in to run the show. I stand corrected, we do not have a what I would consider a "boatload of money to pay these guys". But we do have a "nice chunk" that can be used to pay them, and this comes from the "Development Fund" This Development Fund consists of: 66.2 BTC
419697 Nxt - minus some refunds
and the proceeds from 155 stakes that will be auctioned off prior to launch According to the Development Contract, this Development Fund is to be allocated for "Independent code audits, Bug fixes, and Contractor Salaries. I am proposing that A. Patmast3r contracted to "Manage the Project" B. Xtester is contracted to be the "Director of Marketing" I am NOT proposing that they receive all of this money by any means.I am simply stating that we do have the money to pay them for their work as contractors.Please understand that the community does not have control over these funds, the people that do are: The developers of the system. Jaguar0625
Gimre
Thies
Makoto
BloodyRookie
Krysto
TranLoOur development team that are being paid already from: 600 Stakes which they fully deserve! Very small % for what they have given us10% (400 stakes) is reserved to compensate the core development team for their work in fully developing NIS and NCC to the V1 blockchain specifcations. 5% (200 stakes) is reserved for the extended development team for their work on NEM promotion and the NEM ecosystem. Keep in mind this still leaves another 10% (400 stakes) for: The last 10% is reserved for future development after the
completion of the V1 blockchain, including further development of the ecosystem and
new features for the core blockchain*NOTE* any of the Development Fund that is not used:
will go as a bonus on top of the (600 Stakes) the Developers of the System receiveSo I agree with you on NOT setting up a foundation, just paying these guys for their hard work and bringing them on OFFICIALLY as contractors that will lead the NEM Community Projects and Marketing Efforts |
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rockethead
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1059
Merit: 1016
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July 29, 2014, 02:52:46 PM |
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I stand corrected, we do not have a what I would consider a "boatload of money to pay these guys".
But we do have a "nice chunk" that can be used to pay them, and this comes from the "Development Fund"
This Development Fund consists of:
66.2 BTC
419697 Nxt - minus some refunds
and the proceeds from 155 stakes that will be auctioned off prior to launch
According to the Development Contract, this Development Fund is to be allocated for "Independent code audits, Bug fixes, and Contractor Salaries.
I am proposing that A. Patmast3r contracted to "Manage the Project"
B. Xtester is contracted to be the "Director of Marketing"
I am NOT proposing that they receive all of this money by any means.
I am simply stating that we do have the money to pay them for their work as contractors.
Please understand that the community does not have control over these funds,
the people that do are: The developers of the system.
Jaguar0625
Gimre
Thies
Makoto
BloodyRookie
Krysto
TranLo
Our development team that are being paid already from: 600 Stakes which they fully deserve! Very small % for what they have given us
10% (400 stakes) is reserved to compensate the core development
team for their work in fully developing NIS and NCC to the V1 blockchain specifcations.
5% (200 stakes) is reserved for the extended development team for their work on NEM promotion
and the NEM ecosystem.
Keep in mind this still leaves another 10% (400 stakes) for:
The last 10% is reserved for future development after the
completion of the V1 blockchain, including further development of the ecosystem and
new features for the core blockchain
*NOTE* any of the Development Fund that is not used:
will go as a bonus on top of the (600 Stakes) the Developers of the System receive
So I agree with you on NOT setting up a foundation, just paying these guys for their hard work and bringing them on OFFICIALLY as contractors that will lead the NEM Community Projects and Marketing Efforts
That we will need to ask them if they wish to become "contractors" after V1. ;-) Edit: Any of the remaining funds not used (i.e., initial ~100BTC and the subsequent 155BTC) should go to the marketing instead. We need that badly. |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 03:15:33 PM |
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@lexicon
glad you made that edit lol
please stop with the new manager thing too. there isnt a need for one. and its insulting to patmast3r who basically is the lead guy even though he doesnt see himself as one.
Is he, I didn't know that, well maybe that's why things are getting fixed, i know Xtester has a lot of pull too. Let's give Pat the credit he is due. I call for Pat to be the OFFICIAL project manager. That's the only thing I think I disagree with you on, is we DO need a project manager, you say we don't need one because he in acting as one now? Let's REALLY give him the reigns, we need someone like him!! Does anyone in the community have a problem with this. And he should be paid as well. The dev and marketing teams are doing a great job managing a project of this complexity, IMHO. Feel free to give pat money, though Overall, I don't think we should rely too much on any centralized leadership. That won't be sustainable in the long run. That is probably why Satoshi, BCNext, UP all left. I think that it is very obvious that you and the other programmers should be paid for what you made and maintain technology wise. This is a no brainer, you took your expertise and developed something remarkable. Are we going to just leave the NEM system you made open, for anyone to change, just come on in and add to it, as someone would a wiki. Then someone can leave a note that says, this isn't working, this is incorrect, and so on. Of course not. It's impossible for this to be done because their would be too many cooks in the kitchen, and security issues of course. Can someone get with you guys and say hey, let's try this, and then you guys say, wow, great idea, we should do it, and in some circumstances that person be invited to join the team; again, of course. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The same goes with the actual infrastructure of management. There has to be management. Not just maintaining the actual system, but with the management of the NEM community itself. There doesn't have to be designated leaders for it to merely survive, however, the same holds true with NEM Management, as with the wiki example above for the tech, when it comes to management of day to day operations regarding NEM. We can't just have lexicon coming on and posting that we should do this, and we shouldn't do that, and then some agree and some not agree. Of course the Management team will take direction from the programmers and the community, but someone has to run the show. For NEM to have any chance at changing the world, it will come from the developers of the tech, and the developers and actors of the management infrastructure. The day to day operations on both sides. For this we need designated leaders. Without them, we have no chance against our competitors. Take Satoshi, BCnext, UP, for example. They left and these communities suffered, but all bounced back to a point, NEM even more so! Yes, Bitcoin "made it" in some peoples eyes, but in my eyes, they have failed miserably at mass adoption. If Satoshi, had taken his premine, and assembled a team, to manage, and market Bitcoin. IMO we would see Bitcoin being used much more that the measly percentage of the world that is using it now. Satoshi left because it was the alpha of cryptos. Nxt same thing. It is the beta of cryptos. It will stay there as well. It doesn't have enough funding to put any meaningful management team together. Period. It holds, and for a short while, it will hold a respectable postiton in the tiny crypto world, until it falls to better funded and more organized competitors. NEM has the promotional funds to put together a meaningful management team. I don't see a better group of guys to head this management team up than what we have now. With Pat as the lead as Project Manager and Xtester as the Marketing Director. These guys are great guys that need to do this full time, or someone else does, if NEM is to change the world. They need to be doing this full time and they need to eat. Like Ethereum is trying to produce Satoshi's 3rd and final product. Not alpha and not beta, but a finished product, NEM has that chance, to be that as well, with the amount of promotional funds that have been allocated. Now it is time to put a meaningful, full time, team together, or NEM will suffer Nxt's fate the minute Ethereum and others come onto the scene. I see this so clearly, how others don't...well... it just baffles me. I'll leave it at that. Your proposition is something worthwhile looking into. Maybe we should just do it with a different twist instead. We leave NEM as it is, a decentralized ecosystem and have a centralized one that is fully financed by itself and for itself, hopefully with some catalyst funds coming in from NEM. That will be cool ain't it? After all, no one is going to live on fresh air and sunshine trying to promote NEM with no money. Foundation ain't going to work either. It is too long and arduous a journey and gets politicized eventually. Just look at the Bitcoin Foundation. Not getting anywhere other than in-fighting. So long there is no money to be made, it will be hard to hire any good guys coming in to run the show. I stand corrected, we do not have a what I would consider a "boatload of money to pay these guys". But we do have a "nice chunk" that can be used to pay them, and this comes from the "Development Fund" This Development Fund consists of: 66.2 BTC
419697 Nxt - minus some refunds
and the proceeds from 155 stakes that will be auctioned off prior to launch According to the Development Contract, this Development Fund is to be allocated for "Independent code audits, Bug fixes, and Contractor Salaries. I am proposing that A. Patmast3r contracted to "Manage the Project" B. Xtester is contracted to be the "Director of Marketing" I am NOT proposing that they receive all of this money by any means.I am simply stating that we do have the money to pay them for their work as contractors.Please understand that the community does not have control over these funds, the people that do are: The developers of the system. Jaguar0625
Gimre
Thies
Makoto
BloodyRookie
Krysto
TranLoOur development team that are being paid already from: 600 Stakes which they fully deserve! Very small % for what they have given us10% (400 stakes) is reserved to compensate the core development team for their work in fully developing NIS and NCC to the V1 blockchain specifcations. 5% (200 stakes) is reserved for the extended development team for their work on NEM promotion and the NEM ecosystem. Keep in mind this still leaves another 10% (400 stakes) for: The last 10% is reserved for future development after the
completion of the V1 blockchain, including further development of the ecosystem and
new features for the core blockchain*NOTE* any of the Development Fund that is not used:
will go as a bonus on top of the (600 Stakes) the Developers of the System receiveSo I agree with you on NOT setting up a foundation, just paying these guys for their hard work and bringing them on OFFICIALLY as contractors that will lead the NEM Community Projects and Marketing EffortsYes, 1. I am Asking Pat and Xtester if they will officially work for NEM in this capacity?
2. I am Asking the community if they support the idea?
3. I am Asking the Developers if the community supports the idea, that they will allow Pat and Xtester to be paid? (If they, along with the community, can come up with a fair contract that both can agree on)If were really going to be taking this thing global, it's going to take a lot of work. These guys have already put in a hell of a lot of work, and much more must be done. If they don't agree to do it. Then we can at least come up with an amount of pay to use to find someone with the talent that will. I'm tring very hard to get things more official here, as we are approaching launch in a few months. NEM has some lofty goals, they are not going to happen all by themselves, we have to get organized. The start of this is getting leadership together, to guide us on our journey to change the world. |
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patmast3r
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July 29, 2014, 03:15:51 PM |
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Let's get this off the table. It will never ever happen that I become some kind of project manager. Xtester is already head of the marketing team so no change necessary there. Your wish cam true - Boom ! We don't need any kind of project manager. Marketing used to be our weakness but now there is loads of stuff going on and we have a dedicated team in place. The rest has always been managed by the core devs. All decisions there are made by the core devs and no single person will approve anything since that would be utterly retarded in a decentralized movement and for the simple reason that they know it best. This is no different that how things went when UP was around. Please stop with this topic now as there is no way in hell it will ever happen. |
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lexicon
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July 29, 2014, 03:22:14 PM |
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Let's get this off the table. It will never ever happen that I become some kind of project manager. Xtester is already head of the marketing team so no change necessary there. Your wish cam true - Boom ! We don't need any kind of project manager. Marketing used to be our weakness but now there is loads of stuff going on and we have a dedicated team in place. The rest has always been managed by the core devs. All decisions there are made by the core devs and no single person will approve anything since that would be utterly retarded in a decentralized movement and for the simple reason that they know it best. This is no different that how things went when UP was around. Please stop with this topic now as there is no way in hell it will ever happen. Ok, so the devs are leading the management of the project as well as developing and maintaining the system, is this what you are saying? Also, thought you would be a great project manager btw |
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patmast3r
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July 29, 2014, 03:29:39 PM |
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Let's get this off the table. It will never ever happen that I become some kind of project manager. Xtester is already head of the marketing team so no change necessary there. Your wish cam true - Boom ! We don't need any kind of project manager. Marketing used to be our weakness but now there is loads of stuff going on and we have a dedicated team in place. The rest has always been managed by the core devs. All decisions there are made by the core devs and no single person will approve anything since that would be utterly retarded in a decentralized movement and for the simple reason that they know it best. This is no different that how things went when UP was around. Please stop with this topic now as there is no way in hell it will ever happen. Ok, so the devs are leading the management of the project as well as developing and maintaining the system, is this what you are saying? Also, thought you would be a great project manager btw Well it's pretty much everyone shares opinions and in the end there is an agreement. This has made things on the orginizational side slow in the past but we'll try to settle any non technical problem within 2 days from now on (a rule that xtester brought up btw. ). Of course some things will always take longer as they depend on external factors. I'm confident that this structure will drive NEM forward faster than any single project lead ever could because the people that know it best make the decisions and not some moron that thinks he know's best  . |
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