OpenBazaar - decentralized eBay

[knight22]

Some news:

https://www.reddit.com/r/OpenBazaar/comments/3cko74/update_openbazaar_developer_efforts_are_focused/

Since OpenBazaar began in April of 2014, it's been a group of volunteers all over the world contributing spare time to push out new releases every few months.

Altogether we put out five releases, and the fifth of these is what is in our github repo right now. It is usable, but still has bugs and isn't ready for real commerce yet.

Now that several of the core devs (myself included) have formed a company and received funding, we're changing our approach to development. We won't be doing incremental releases every few months, but instead put out a larger version 1 release later this year. Here's what the roadmap looks like. [...]

[eerygarden]

Some news:

https://www.reddit.com/r/OpenBazaar/comments/3cko74/update_openbazaar_developer_efforts_are_focused/

Since OpenBazaar began in April of 2014, it's been a group of volunteers all over the world contributing spare time to push out new releases every few months.

Altogether we put out five releases, and the fifth of these is what is in our github repo right now. It is usable, but still has bugs and isn't ready for real commerce yet.

Now that several of the core devs (myself included) have formed a company and received funding, we're changing our approach to development. We won't be doing incremental releases every few months, but instead put out a larger version 1 release later this year. Here's what the roadmap looks like. [...]

Any clues if the release due in November will be available to windows users?

[moni3z]

What's up with the Commercial APIs? Haven't seen any documentation what they're going to be.

[eerygarden]

Saying it with pictures.

[tatu]

Saying it with pictures.

*snip*

So it's going to go fully live in November? Does anyone have a link to something that details and explains how it will work in full? Their site and blog only seems to give the bare bones of it. I'm mostly interested in how they will deal with illegal items being sold on there and how will they censor or remove those things. I mean, I don't have a problem with drugs being sold on there but extreme forms of illegal porn and guns would be a no no.

[eerygarden]

Saying it with pictures.

*snip*

So it's going to go fully live in November? Does anyone have a link to something that details and explains how it will work in full? Their site and blog only seems to give the bare bones of it. I'm mostly interested in how they will deal with illegal items being sold on there and how will they censor or remove those things. I mean, I don't have a problem with drugs being sold on there but extreme forms of illegal porn and guns would be a no no.

I think they will be running their own portal and moderating it that way. Presumably bad guys will be running their own portals too.

[WhatTheGox]

Saying it with pictures.

*snip*

So it's going to go fully live in November? Does anyone have a link to something that details and explains how it will work in full? Their site and blog only seems to give the bare bones of it. I'm mostly interested in how they will deal with illegal items being sold on there and how will they censor or remove those things. I mean, I don't have a problem with drugs being sold on there but extreme forms of illegal porn and guns would be a no no.

I dont see how anyone has any power to remove or censor any items, i thought that was the whole point?  I should imagine that is a challenge mostly for the authorities to work out new ways to police a completely new trade system.

[MUFC]

Saying it with pictures.

*snip*

So it's going to go fully live in November? Does anyone have a link to something that details and explains how it will work in full? Their site and blog only seems to give the bare bones of it. I'm mostly interested in how they will deal with illegal items being sold on there and how will they censor or remove those things. I mean, I don't have a problem with drugs being sold on there but extreme forms of illegal porn and guns would be a no no.

I dont see how anyone has any power to remove or censor any items, i thought that was the whole point?  I should imagine that is a challenge mostly for the authorities to work out new ways to police a completely new trade system.

So the whole point is for open bazarr to facilitate the sale of weapons and child porn and anything else someone might want to sell? I'm sure "let the authorities deal with it" will stand up in court. What makes them different from Ross Ulbrict other than they're not directly profiting off it (though arguable seeing as they got a million in funding recently and will likely get more)? Regardless that wont matter to prosecuters as they wont care.

[gentlemand]

So the whole point is for open bazarr to facilitate the sale of weapons and child porn and anything else someone might want to sell? I'm sure "let the authorities deal with it" will stand up in court. What makes them different from Ross Ulbrict other than they're not directly profiting off it (though arguable seeing as they got a million in funding recently and will likely get more)? Regardless that wont matter to prosecuters as they wont care.

It's the equivalent of Bittorrent. Quite a few people have been nailed for facilitating torrenting, mainly the operators of listing sites. The inventor of Bittorrent has done nothing wrong and is living a free life.

Open Bazaar will send the software out into the world. The guy selling child porn is the one who chooses to use it for nefarious ends. He'll be the one who's nailed if they can find him.

I assume the escrow might be liable too but they'll have nothing more to do with Open Bazaar's developers than the pervert.

Silk Road was centralised. If DPR chose to shut it down then no more deals would've happened on there. He was the one making them happen as the middle man.

[MUFC]

So the whole point is for open bazarr to facilitate the sale of weapons and child porn and anything else someone might want to sell? I'm sure "let the authorities deal with it" will stand up in court. What makes them different from Ross Ulbrict other than they're not directly profiting off it (though arguable seeing as they got a million in funding recently and will likely get more)? Regardless that wont matter to prosecuters as they wont care.

It's the equivalent of Bittorrent. Quite a few people have been nailed for facilitating torrenting, mainly the operators of listing sites. The inventor of Bittorrent has done nothing wrong and is living a free life.

Yes but sites like Piratebay don't host cp and would remove that sort of stuff. Most people really aren't going to be wanting to use this to sell their goods when their listings are ranked alongside weapons and extreme porn. I think this sort of software should be used by each individual market not a free for all ie have a one on the clearnet for ebay type stuff, then one on the deepnet for drugs and then there will be others that have the more sinister stuff (not that I would endorse them but I think drugs should be kept off regular users wanting to sell their own legal wares etc).

[gentlemand]

Yes but sites like Piratebay don't host cp and would remove that sort of stuff. Most people really aren't going to be wanting to use this to sell their goods when their listings are ranked alongside weapons and extreme porn. I think this sort of software should be used by each individual market not a free for all ie have a one on the clearnet for ebay type stuff, then one on the deepnet for drugs and then there will be others that have the more sinister stuff (not that I would endorse them but I think drugs should be kept off regular users wanting to sell their own legal wares etc).

I think that's how it'll pan out too. The nasty shit will keep itself separate. There'll be portals for regular commerce. Neither area will want to mix with the other.

[TheButterZone]

So the whole point is for open bazarr to facilitate the sale of weapons and child porn and anything else someone might want to sell? I'm sure "let the authorities deal with it" will stand up in court. What makes them different from Ross Ulbrict other than they're not directly profiting off it (though arguable seeing as they got a million in funding recently and will likely get more)? Regardless that wont matter to prosecuters as they wont care.

It's the equivalent of Bittorrent. Quite a few people have been nailed for facilitating torrenting, mainly the operators of listing sites. The inventor of Bittorrent has done nothing wrong and is living a free life.

Open Bazaar will send the software out into the world. The guy selling child porn is the one who chooses to use it for nefarious ends. He'll be the one who's nailed if they can find him.

I assume the escrow might be liable too but they'll have nothing more to do with Open Bazaar's developers than the pervert.

Silk Road was centralised. If DPR chose to shut it down then no more deals would've happened on there. He was the one making them happen as the middle man.

Just like Craig Newmark and the practically non-existent check of any illegality on craigslist.org

[BitcoinAccepted]

So the whole point is for open bazarr to facilitate the sale of weapons and child porn and anything else someone might want to sell? I'm sure "let the authorities deal with it" will stand up in court. What makes them different from Ross Ulbrict other than they're not directly profiting off it (though arguable seeing as they got a million in funding recently and will likely get more)? Regardless that wont matter to prosecuters as they wont care.

It's the equivalent of Bittorrent. Quite a few people have been nailed for facilitating torrenting, mainly the operators of listing sites. The inventor of Bittorrent has done nothing wrong and is living a free life.

Yes but sites like Piratebay don't host cp and would remove that sort of stuff. Most people really aren't going to be wanting to use this to sell their goods when their listings are ranked alongside weapons and extreme porn. I think this sort of software should be used by each individual market not a free for all ie have a one on the clearnet for ebay type stuff, then one on the deepnet for drugs and then there will be others that have the more sinister stuff (not that I would endorse them but I think drugs should be kept off regular users wanting to sell their own legal wares etc).

This is where I have reservations about the way the system will operate / be managed.

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

Its going to be further complicated by individual country laws ie. UK You can sell either seeds or hydroponic equipment but you can't sell seeds and hydroponic equipment together because we have laws covering incitement. It is illegal to germinate a cannabis seed in the UK so listing a propagation light or advising a customer on growing techniques along with your seeds is covered by encouragement laws. It is not even necessary for there to be evidence of a crime being committed to secure a conviction for the incitement part.

If the items you list are legal in your home country and in the country you ship to then I see no problem. It could get messy very quickly though.

[cbeast]

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

You can have a family friendly portal if you want to build one. I'm sure someone will. It would be great for buying bibles, prayer beads, and cattails for self-flagellation, if you wish.

[moni3z]

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

Its going to be further complicated by individual country laws ie. UK You can sell either seeds or hydroponic equipment but you can't sell seeds and hydroponic equipment together because we have laws covering incitement. It is illegal to germinate a cannabis seed in the UK so listing a propagation light or advising a customer on growing techniques along with your seeds is covered by encouragement laws. It is not even necessary for there to be evidence of a crime being committed to secure a conviction for the incitement part.

If the items you list are legal in your home country and in the country you ship to then I see no problem. It could get messy very quickly though.

In this case you could write an app called "UK Seed Bank" and include every single seed, including marijuana seeds only in the listings, since OpenBazaar is decentralized and your app just needs to query the OB API for seeds and nothing else. You could additionally monetize your app by allowing OpenBazaar vendors to advertise on it, so when you open the app there's a rotating "Habeeb's House of Khat Seeds" banner on the top or manipulate the listing so your paid advertisers are listed first.

[Clegg]

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

Its going to be further complicated by individual country laws ie. UK You can sell either seeds or hydroponic equipment but you can't sell seeds and hydroponic equipment together because we have laws covering incitement. It is illegal to germinate a cannabis seed in the UK so listing a propagation light or advising a customer on growing techniques along with your seeds is covered by encouragement laws. It is not even necessary for there to be evidence of a crime being committed to secure a conviction for the incitement part.

If the items you list are legal in your home country and in the country you ship to then I see no problem. It could get messy very quickly though.

This is why I'm unsure of how well it is actually going to work. I think there should be different versions of open bazaar and maybe they will. People really aren't going to be wanting to be listing 'legit' items on a site where you can buy drugs or the worst type of porn. There should be specific sites for each thing. For those that want to buy drugs they should go to the decentralized market on the darknet and for those who want to buy candles or alpaca socks they go to another on the clearnet. Regardless I'm sure it's only a matter of time before a decentralized deepweb market pops up (of there isn't one already - though I haven't heard of it).

[cellard]

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

Its going to be further complicated by individual country laws ie. UK You can sell either seeds or hydroponic equipment but you can't sell seeds and hydroponic equipment together because we have laws covering incitement. It is illegal to germinate a cannabis seed in the UK so listing a propagation light or advising a customer on growing techniques along with your seeds is covered by encouragement laws. It is not even necessary for there to be evidence of a crime being committed to secure a conviction for the incitement part.

If the items you list are legal in your home country and in the country you ship to then I see no problem. It could get messy very quickly though.

This is why I'm unsure of how well it is actually going to work. I think there should be different versions of open bazaar and maybe they will. People really aren't going to be wanting to be listing 'legit' items on a site where you can buy drugs or the worst type of porn. There should be specific sites for each thing. For those that want to buy drugs they should go to the decentralized market on the darknet and for those who want to buy candles or alpaca socks they go to another on the clearnet. Regardless I'm sure it's only a matter of time before a decentralized deepweb market pops up (of there isn't one already - though I haven't heard of it).

Same as BitcoinAccepted here, im not going to be using anything ilegal. I don't want my coins to be mixed with coins that have illicit origin. Thats the problem of a public ledger, if you get some coins that are proved of illicit origin it may be a problem for you. Who would accept them as payment?
Well since BTC is not refundable it shouldn't be a problem, but it still hurts its fungible features.

[cbeast]

I don't want my coins to be mixed with coins that have illicit origin.

That sounds like a personal problem. It certainly doesn't imply guilt. You can always mix them if it makes you feel better. Sorry for the harsh tone, but you already bank with criminal bankers and use cocaine tainted cash. At least Bitcoin is an honest effort to curtail central banking atrocities.

[jabo38]

If OpenBazaar has listings including drugs / weapons etc on there then I won't be using the platform and I know of many other legit retailers who would follow the same principle.

Its going to be further complicated by individual country laws ie. UK You can sell either seeds or hydroponic equipment but you can't sell seeds and hydroponic equipment together because we have laws covering incitement. It is illegal to germinate a cannabis seed in the UK so listing a propagation light or advising a customer on growing techniques along with your seeds is covered by encouragement laws. It is not even necessary for there to be evidence of a crime being committed to secure a conviction for the incitement part.

If the items you list are legal in your home country and in the country you ship to then I see no problem. It could get messy very quickly though.

This is why I'm unsure of how well it is actually going to work. I think there should be different versions of open bazaar and maybe they will. People really aren't going to be wanting to be listing 'legit' items on a site where you can buy drugs or the worst type of porn. There should be specific sites for each thing. For those that want to buy drugs they should go to the decentralized market on the darknet and for those who want to buy candles or alpaca socks they go to another on the clearnet. Regardless I'm sure it's only a matter of time before a decentralized deepweb market pops up (of there isn't one already - though I haven't heard of it).

Same as BitcoinAccepted here, im not going to be using anything ilegal. I don't want my coins to be mixed with coins that have illicit origin. Thats the problem of a public ledger, if you get some coins that are proved of illicit origin it may be a problem for you. Who would accept them as payment?
Well since BTC is not refundable it shouldn't be a problem, but it still hurts its fungible features.

A lot of dollar bills are used in crimes or are the subject of crime.  But they still spend just fine.

[Clegg]

Same as BitcoinAccepted here, im not going to be using anything ilegal. I don't want my coins to be mixed with coins that have illicit origin. Thats the problem of a public ledger, if you get some coins that are proved of illicit origin it may be a problem for you. Who would accept them as payment?
Well since BTC is not refundable it shouldn't be a problem, but it still hurts its fungible features.

There's no way to tell where your coins have come from so if you're worried about this you should be mixing your coins adequately and also making privacy your number one priority. Just because the same site is selling dodgy stuff doesn't mean your coins will be mixed with dirty ones either. As far as I'm aware money goes to some sort of third party escrow agent so it's not like Silk road where they would hold onyo your coins.