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Author Topic: [ANN] [VIA] ★ Viacoin ★ ~ the future of digital currency ~ ★  (Read 822429 times)
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November 10, 2015, 10:30:08 PM
 #5141

not sure anyone here really cares, but you should.

Peter Todd no longer on the project.   Doesn't look like he contributed much (his own words):

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s9xtq/peter_todds_role_in_dev/cwvfhqz

So.....  600 BTC went where exactly?

CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY

REPLACEBYFEE


Here, I'll quote for you, because we all know clicking is hard for millennials.

Quote
It may also be of interest how Viacoin fits into this picture. Firstly, since Viacoin is based on Bitcoin Core it is a downstream project from Bitcoin Core. That means, anything that goes into Bitcoin may also end up in Viacoin. The fact remains that Bitcoin Core is the most active project with the most expertise and peer review in the cryptocurrency ecosystem.

Overall, my goal with Viacoin was to contribute positively to the ecosystem and that even if my project was not successful, that it would have a legacy that was useful for the world at large. The invention of bitcoin is an incredibly important invention for humanity and I want to see the technology develop and succeed.

This being the case, Peter and I agreed that it makes no sense to develop features in a vacuum because this stuff is hard and takes a long time to mature. Even if the target was for Viacoin (and in the example of CLTV, it was first deployed in Viacoin in January 2015), it makes sense that the BIPs and development work go on upstream with the aim of filtering back down. This ensures several criterion are met: that work is well peer reviewed and where possible contributions end up in Bitcoin Core and benefit everyone. If something is included in Bitcoin it must have been considered a good thing and is well peer reviewed and tested. Viacoin will benefit downstream: but the reverse is not true, something developed exclusively for Viacoin will never have the same level of quality.

All things being equal, if the feature/fix is merged to Bitcoin Core, that's a win for the Bitcoin ecosystem and for Viacoin which will get the feature downstream. If the feature is considered a bad idea as revealed by peer review, it stops a bad idea. If the idea is good but too radical for Bitcoin (which is hard to change because of it's size due to risks, or osification), then Viacoin is still at liberty to make the feature itself because Viacoin is much smaller. There almost no ossification and a lot less risks.

Peter is his own man, guided by his own lights. To be clear his principals about Bitcoin override everything. So I let him get on with Bitcoin Core work he wanted but didnt necessarily have time to do without being paid since paid consulting takes priority. I say this because it's not possible to have a conflict of interest with Peter involved, he will never do something he doesn't believe in and want to do in the first place.

I would like to comment about "number of commits". It may not be apparent to readers who are not directly involved in Bitcoin development, but writing code may actually be the least time consuming part of development. The amount of time required to even tests a patch cannot be underestimated. It can take a long time to get things right, and it may take a long time for reviewers to find problems. Unlike most other projects, it is incredible easy to introduce consensus bugs or introduce attack vectors with incredible consequences. Consensus systems really are difficult and code review, testing and security reviews are extremely time consuming. Even when one writes a patch, especially consensus or policy code it is very time consuming to do all the ancillary work of writing BIPs, discussion and championing the pull request and competing for reviewers (yes, literally there is competition to get stuff reviewed because there are so many patches and things going on).

Since all this blocksize debacle, I have also become very involved in Bitcoin Core helping where I can especially in the area of scalability, code review and testing. I can vouch it is entirely possible to spend weeks on end with very little material to show. It's just the nature of the work.

So whether you like or hate Viacoin, CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY for example, was materialsed because of it. That is to say, without paying Peter it is very unlikely the necessary work would have done the work on materialising CLTV and it would not have been deployed in Bitcoin today. I take no credit for CLTV, it is an invention of Peter Todd and Greg Maxwell, but I did provide the oil to make it happen. CLTV was deployed (enforced) in Viacoin in January 2015 and we're about to begin deployment in Bitcoin Core. CLTV is widely anticipated by service provider developers (wallets, micropayment channels, lightning network), and I've affectionally nicknamed it OP_HODL. RBF is another big contribution which has seen several iterations. That means a lot of code, and as yet still unmerged, although it seems likely this will be added soon.

Overall, Peter is an incredibly valuable asset to the Bitcoin community. There are very few people with the kind of deep understanding and attention to detail. It has been a privilege working with him.


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November 11, 2015, 06:05:53 AM
 #5142

not sure anyone here really cares, but you should.

Peter Todd no longer on the project.   Doesn't look like he contributed much (his own words):

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s9xtq/peter_todds_role_in_dev/cwvfhqz

oh shit homes, he says

I was previously getting paid by viacoin to do Bitcoin Core dev work - I never actually contributed to Viacoin directly - but that ended a few weeks ago.
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November 11, 2015, 05:38:45 PM
 #5143

not sure anyone here really cares, but you should.

Peter Todd no longer on the project.   Doesn't look like he contributed much (his own words):

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s9xtq/peter_todds_role_in_dev/cwvfhqz

youre not a very good shill

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November 11, 2015, 06:10:26 PM
 #5144

Btcdrak,

Did you get checktimeverify working with p2sh script signing? I have multisig working but since multisig validates with a template in script.cpp, the new op which adds op_if etc wont validate as there is no template for it, thus im not able to combine signatures using signrawtransaction.

The first leg of a multisig signing works, but doesnt combine othr signatures.

★☆★Syscoin - Decentralized Marketplace and Multisig Platform
Pay with Bitcoin, ZCash and many more
For more visit Syscoin.org  ★☆★
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November 11, 2015, 06:35:54 PM
 #5145

Btcdrak,

Did you get checktimeverify working with p2sh script signing? I have multisig working but since multisig validates with a template in script.cpp, the new op which adds op_if etc wont validate as there is no template for it, thus im not able to combine signatures using signrawtransaction.

The first leg of a multisig signing works, but doesnt combine othr signatures.

I am not sure I understand the question. CLTV is used in the context of P2SH redeemscripts which means you can create complex scripts with many conditions.
If you can run through what you're trying to do specifically, maybe I'll get a better understand.
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November 11, 2015, 08:47:33 PM
 #5146


CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY

REPLACEBYFEE


Here, I'll quote for you, because we all know clicking is hard for millennials.


I'm sure if early investors knew that VIA was becoming a glorified token to further development work on Bitcoin and Drak's OKCoin account they would have though twice about investing. Saying "well the code will be featured in Viacoin too!" is such a copout. If they wanted to beg for BTC to further develop Bitcoin then be upfront about it, but pitching us a new alt coin that claims to fix the problems of Bitcoin while taking these solutions to Bitcoin is deceptive.

The whole selling point of Viacoin was to do things on its chain that Bitcoin core devs supposedly refuse to implement. Yet suddenly every innovation produced for VIA is actually getting in the Bitcoin code, which makes the original argument for VIA's existence null and void.

Look I know Drak, Todd and you Icebreaker are a bunch of autists who don't think like normal human beings and you think it is perfectly acceptable to ask for almost half a million dollars for a few hundred lines of code but some of us live in the real world where such obscene salaries would normally command in the business world at the minimum a 50-60 hour work week for a whole year and personal cell phone access on the weekends.

This business of Drak getting on twitter everyday, yacking about what is going on in whaleclub, and accusing Gavin of driving people to suicide and then occasionally popping in once a month to write a line or two here and contributing little to the Viacoin github is unacceptable. I'd fired his ass a long time ago if he was on my staff.

The question is has he delivered 600 BTC worth of work and effort into Via? the answer is a solid NO.

What's funny is you got guys like Dave Zimbeck who himself alone built Bithalo, Nighttrader, a working decentralized marketplace with Bitbay, 2-party smart contracts and is in the process of finalizing pegging and all while managing to stay active with his community on an at-least weekly basis and yet he gets called the scammer! 

This whole place really is like high school made up of cliques.
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November 11, 2015, 10:05:58 PM
 #5147

Btcdrak,

Did you get checktimeverify working with p2sh script signing? I have multisig working but since multisig validates with a template in script.cpp, the new op which adds op_if etc wont validate as there is no template for it, thus im not able to combine signatures using signrawtransaction.

The first leg of a multisig signing works, but doesnt combine othr signatures.

I am not sure I understand the question. CLTV is used in the context of P2SH redeemscripts which means you can create complex scripts with many conditions.
If you can run through what you're trying to do specifically, maybe I'll get a better understand.
So i will remove cltv out of the question and simplify for you. I believe its a general bitcoin scripting drawback.

Imagine I set up a multisig and then fund pay and spend from it, i need to sign as 2 of 2 and imagine the first person signs then the second signs and sends the tx using the raw tx api. I use createmultisig rpc to make the initial tx.

This works. It validates and sends to the network and spending the multisig funds go through. Now imagine i do something simple like change the first OP_2 into an OP_IF OP_2 OP_ELSE OP_2 OP_ENDIF <rest of multisig>

This should resolve to the same thing for my 2 of 2 multisig. The first person can sign, the second tries so and it fails at combining the signatures... Nothing changed from working multisig other than changing the script.

If you look at script.cpp you see a multisig template, but OP_IF invalidates it. So how do i make this work? Has peter todd even tested it using the raw api?

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November 12, 2015, 12:57:42 AM
 #5148


CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY

REPLACEBYFEE


Here, I'll quote for you, because we all know clicking is hard for millennials.


I'm sure if early investors knew that VIA was becoming a glorified token to further development work on Bitcoin and Drak's OKCoin account they would have though twice about investing. Saying "well the code will be featured in Viacoin too!" is such a copout. If they wanted to beg for BTC to further develop Bitcoin then be upfront about it, but pitching us a new alt coin that claims to fix the problems of Bitcoin while taking these solutions to Bitcoin is deceptive.

The whole selling point of Viacoin was to do things on its chain that Bitcoin core devs supposedly refuse to implement. Yet suddenly every innovation produced for VIA is actually getting in the Bitcoin code, which makes the original argument for VIA's existence null and void.

Look I know Drak, Todd and you Icebreaker are a bunch of autists who don't think like normal human beings and you think it is perfectly acceptable to ask for almost half a million dollars for a few hundred lines of code but some of us live in the real world where such obscene salaries would normally command in the business world at the minimum a 50-60 hour work week for a whole year and personal cell phone access on the weekends.

This business of Drak getting on twitter everyday, yacking about what is going on in whaleclub, and accusing Gavin of driving people to suicide and then occasionally popping in once a month to write a line or two here and contributing little to the Viacoin github is unacceptable. I'd fired his ass a long time ago if he was on my staff.

The question is has he delivered 600 BTC worth of work and effort into Via? the answer is a solid NO.

What's funny is you got guys like Dave Zimbeck who himself alone built Bithalo, Nighttrader, a working decentralized marketplace with Bitbay, 2-party smart contracts and is in the process of finalizing pegging and all while managing to stay active with his community on an at-least weekly basis and yet he gets called the scammer! 

This whole place really is like high school made up of cliques.

this coin is dead.  the pathetic market cap is proof of that.  i'm not sure it was a premeditated scam, but Drak certainly has not covered himself in glory the way this has been handled.  after raising a shit-ton during the ICO, and some initial (fake?) momentum, essentially nothing of significance has been done.  that's a death sentence when other coins are innovating and marketing and have devs that actually give a fuck.

Drak won, the VIA supporters lost.
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November 12, 2015, 02:23:46 AM
 #5149


CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY

REPLACEBYFEE


Here, I'll quote for you, because we all know clicking is hard for millennials.


I'm sure if early investors knew that VIA was becoming a glorified token to further development work on Bitcoin and Drak's OKCoin account they would have though twice about investing. Saying "well the code will be featured in Viacoin too!" is such a copout. If they wanted to beg for BTC to further develop Bitcoin then be upfront about it, but pitching us a new alt coin that claims to fix the problems of Bitcoin while taking these solutions to Bitcoin is deceptive.

The whole selling point of Viacoin was to do things on its chain that Bitcoin core devs supposedly refuse to implement. Yet suddenly every innovation produced for VIA is actually getting in the Bitcoin code, which makes the original argument for VIA's existence null and void.

Look I know Drak, Todd and you Icebreaker are a bunch of autists who don't think like normal human beings and you think it is perfectly acceptable to ask for almost half a million dollars for a few hundred lines of code but some of us live in the real world where such obscene salaries would normally command in the business world at the minimum a 50-60 hour work week for a whole year and personal cell phone access on the weekends.

This business of Drak getting on twitter everyday, yacking about what is going on in whaleclub, and accusing Gavin of driving people to suicide and then occasionally popping in once a month to write a line or two here and contributing little to the Viacoin github is unacceptable. I'd fired his ass a long time ago if he was on my staff.

The question is has he delivered 600 BTC worth of work and effort into Via? the answer is a solid NO.

What's funny is you got guys like Dave Zimbeck who himself alone built Bithalo, Nighttrader, a working decentralized marketplace with Bitbay, 2-party smart contracts and is in the process of finalizing pegging and all while managing to stay active with his community on an at-least weekly basis and yet he gets called the scammer!  

This whole place really is like high school made up of cliques.

Perhaps if you were more of an "autist" you would understand why some lines of code are vastly more valuable and difficult to produce than others.

We all knew PT's dev work would explicitly benefit both BTC and VIA; that was the deal all along.  It's only 'shocking' 'scandalous' news to you.

VIA got CLTV months before Bitcoin.  The market didn't care, but that's no excuse for you to whine about it.  The point is Via had (and still has) its chance to shine.

Your 20/20 hindsight is asinine and immature.  If VIA/XCH had gone to the moon thanks to their advanced features, 600 BTC would have been a small price to pay.

But unfortunately that hasn't happened yet, so now you feel entitled to retroactively pooh-pooh what has been accomplished, as if shepherding CLTV from concept to battle-tested code is some small thing?

IDC about your lame high school:cliques metaphor.  It has no value beyond providing a vent for your pouting.

You should please go sodomize yourself with retractable batons.


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whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
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November 12, 2015, 06:22:19 AM
 #5150

this coin is dead.  the pathetic market cap is proof of that.

its working as advertised, developer is active, so no its not dead
sure market cap is low at the moment (there are at least a hundred completely useless shitcoins with much higher market cap and that includes alts with market cap in millions)
someone is going through a lot of trouble to make sure market cap stays below 100k
so instead of fudding you should use this opportunity to grab some for cheap,
i sure did sneak in some bids to grab a few here and there Grin


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November 12, 2015, 06:43:58 AM
 #5151

someone is going through a lot of trouble to make sure market cap stays below 100k

lol.


i sure did sneak in some bids to grab a few here and there Grin

good luck with that.
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November 12, 2015, 04:02:53 PM
 #5152

i sure did sneak in some bids to grab a few here and there Grin

good luck with that.

yeah i got a good chunk this cheap over time, cry me a river Grin

so why do you even care what coins others are interested in, are you a broken busybody?
this is one of like ten alts i'm interested in (ranging from low/mid/higher market caps),
i ignore the rest instead of wasting time complaining about those

  tips will be spent on ale and ladies of questionable character Grin
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November 28, 2015, 07:28:07 AM
 #5153


CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY

REPLACEBYFEE


Here, I'll quote for you, because we all know clicking is hard for millennials.


I'm sure if early investors knew that VIA was becoming a glorified token to further development work on Bitcoin and Drak's OKCoin account they would have though twice about investing. Saying "well the code will be featured in Viacoin too!" is such a copout. If they wanted to beg for BTC to further develop Bitcoin then be upfront about it, but pitching us a new alt coin that claims to fix the problems of Bitcoin while taking these solutions to Bitcoin is deceptive.

The whole selling point of Viacoin was to do things on its chain that Bitcoin core devs supposedly refuse to implement. Yet suddenly every innovation produced for VIA is actually getting in the Bitcoin code, which makes the original argument for VIA's existence null and void.

Look I know Drak, Todd and you Icebreaker are a bunch of autists who don't think like normal human beings and you think it is perfectly acceptable to ask for almost half a million dollars for a few hundred lines of code but some of us live in the real world where such obscene salaries would normally command in the business world at the minimum a 50-60 hour work week for a whole year and personal cell phone access on the weekends.

This business of Drak getting on twitter everyday, yacking about what is going on in whaleclub, and accusing Gavin of driving people to suicide and then occasionally popping in once a month to write a line or two here and contributing little to the Viacoin github is unacceptable. I'd fired his ass a long time ago if he was on my staff.

The question is has he delivered 600 BTC worth of work and effort into Via? the answer is a solid NO.

What's funny is you got guys like Dave Zimbeck who himself alone built Bithalo, Nighttrader, a working decentralized marketplace with Bitbay, 2-party smart contracts and is in the process of finalizing pegging and all while managing to stay active with his community on an at-least weekly basis and yet he gets called the scammer! 

This whole place really is like high school made up of cliques.


What makes this critique sting so badly is that the truth pokes out sharply in places.

Btcdrak's explanation that the pathway of innovation flows from bitcoin to viacoin is disheartening.

Can there be a philosophy change with VIA? Alts should be an incubator for groundbreaking technology, not merely a test tube for incremental improvements to bitcoin itself.

FonzieCoin: As Fair as it is Cool
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November 29, 2015, 11:52:58 AM
 #5154

this coin is dead.  the pathetic market cap is proof of that.

its working as advertised, developer is active, so no its not dead
sure market cap is low at the moment (there are at least a hundred completely useless shitcoins with much higher market cap and that includes alts with market cap in millions)
someone is going through a lot of trouble to make sure market cap stays below 100k
so instead of fudding you should use this opportunity to grab some for cheap,
i sure did sneak in some bids to grab a few here and there Grin

Here I agree that the market capitalization can not objectively evaluate the degree of the coin. It takes time, that everyone could take their place, because now cryptocurrency so much competition and everyone must lure users than to itself
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November 29, 2015, 07:03:18 PM
 #5155

We have took the initiative to start a better place to discuss and develop ideas to create awareness and adoption for Viacoin:

ViacoinPlanet.slack.com

Introduction Viacoin Planet

Viacoin is technically one of the strongest and most robust Cryptocurrencies and deserves greater awareness. At this point most energy has gone into the development of Viacoin, but to create more awareness of its potential, it needs the help of its supporters. This platform is a way to explore and promote opportunities and application possibilities for Viacoin.
The purpose of this platform is to attract business to the Viacoin Blockchain. We like to do it with you! Everybody is welcome, even for a laugh.

we have made some channels and also have set up some rules – to avoid the trolling that made Viacoin-Bitcointalk dysfunctional for promotional efforts. Our role is to facilitate this channel and keep the conversation positive and in service of promoting viacoin.

Do you like to join?
Please send a message to ViacoinPlanet@gmail.com (Mailadress was edited on 7th of december)

We strive for a reaction within 24 to 48 hours.

Channels:

We initially made 10 channels. From channel # 3 –Attract business and lower it is explained how it can be used. But do not hold yourself back. Use your own creativity in your approach. Everybody works different.

#  1-introduction
   Introduction and rules of Viacoin planet

# 2-general
   Announcements from Viacoin Planet

# 3-attract-business
•   Discuss how to attract business
•   Discuss what/who you need to attract business
               --> This can initiate a NEW channel

# 4-usecases
•   Discuss and create use cases which (in theory) can be used on the Viacoin Blockchain
•   Research who could have interest in a created use case and approach them (is in relation with other channels and can lead to another task in a channel, for example: # attract business or #presentations. Or a complete new channel.

# 5-presentations
•   Discuss and create presentations for:
o   Viacoin in General
o   Clearinghouse
o   apps or services which can be used the Viacoin Blockchain
o   “how to” attract business for the Viacoin Blockchain to help other in their approach to talk to business
o    Etc. --> Use or own experience and creativity

# 6-promotions
Discuss and create campaigns for:
•   Viacoin in general
•   Certain apps that can or will be used on the Viacoin Blockchain
•   Attract certain developers which are needed to make an app on the Viacoin Blockchain
•   Etc. --> Use or own experience and creativity

# 7-translations
Discuss and make translations for Presentations, promotions, websites, etc.

# 8-websites
Discuss and create websites for:
•   Viacoin
•   Clearinghouse
•   Apps/services
•   Etc. --> Use or own experience and creativity

# “new channels can be added on request”
Spinoff of another channel, due to new ideas

# 98-share-info-on-via
When you have seen or created a informative of positively funny twee about Viacoin or anything related to it, please post it in this channel and asked if it can be retweeted via twitter, shared via Facebook, etc.

# 99-random
When you like to talk about non related topics, please do it in this channel.

Rules:
Here are some rules to create and maintain a good working environment for the Viacoin supporters.
•   If you like to create a new channel, please contact me and also let me know the reason to create this new channel. I will make a new channel when it can help your development on a certain subject.
•   Keep on topic in a the specific channel you want to post.
•   No cross-posting with other Channels, only if it could benefit the development in that particular subject. For example; If you write a presentation in the Channel #Presentations, it could be shared in the  Channel  #Translations
•   No spamming. Keep on topic.
•   If you like to talk on other topics which are not directly involving  subject in a Channel, please talk in the channel # Random
•   Duplicate posts will be deleted.
•   Opinion posts are welcome, but please back up your point of view and do not repeat yourself multiple times. Seeking clarification is OK or adding new information to support your views.
•   Abusive comments and baseless accusations will be deleted.
o   After 3 warnings  your account will be blocked.

•   But most of all, let’s learn from each other and in the meantime have some fun Smiley
kahir
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November 29, 2015, 07:29:15 PM
 #5156

ohhhh smigooll where are youuuu
btcdrak
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November 29, 2015, 10:53:13 PM
 #5157

ohhhh smigooll where are youuuu

Right here!
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November 29, 2015, 11:33:40 PM
 #5158

We have took the initiative to start a better place to discuss and develop ideas to create awareness and adoption for Viacoin:

ViacoinPlanet.slack.com

Introduction Viacoin Planet

Viacoin is technically one of the strongest and most robust Cryptocurrencies and deserves greater awareness. At this point most energy has gone into the development of Viacoin, but to create more awareness of its potential, it needs the help of its supporters. This platform is a way to explore and promote opportunities and application possibilities for Viacoin.
The purpose of this platform is to attract business to the Viacoin Blockchain. We like to do it with you! Everybody is welcome, even for a laugh.

we have made some channels and also have set up some rules – to avoid the trolling that made Viacoin-Bitcointalk dysfunctional for promotional efforts. Our role is to facilitate this channel and keep the conversation positive and in service of promoting viacoin.

Do you like to join?
Please send a message to tedunite@gmail.com

Brilliant idea! Maybe you could just set the channel to self invitable? Up to you.
Ted Unite
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November 30, 2015, 09:53:30 AM
 #5159


Brilliant idea! Maybe you could just set the channel to self invitable? Up to you.

Thanks for the tip drak. I will look into it.
I would also like to mention that GooseNL was involved from the beginning. Thanks for your support!
He will also be an admin and moderate on Viacoin Planet.
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December 01, 2015, 06:54:17 AM
 #5160


Brilliant idea! Maybe you could just set the channel to self invitable? Up to you.

Thanks for the tip drak. I will look into it.
I would also like to mention that GooseNL was involved from the beginning. Thanks for your support!
He will also be an admin and moderate on Viacoin Planet.

Unfortunately Slack.com does not allow public domains to be used as a sign up mode. My assumption is that most people here have a public domain. And I have to add private domains manually.

So please send your mailadress to ViacoinPlanet@gmail.com (mailadress was edited on 7th of december) and I will send you an invitation.
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