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nima
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August 29, 2012, 03:04:06 PM
 #561

Wrd, on top of that I don't understand why bonds are ”tricky”. Just pay out the security issuer (Goat) and let him divvy it up from there. The only reason why it would be ”tricky” is if he (or whoever its using him aa sock puppet) wanted to ID all the bond holders. I wonder why he would want to do that?

A silly question: Why would pirate40 want to identify all bond holders? IRS?

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unclescrooge
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August 29, 2012, 03:05:02 PM
 #562

Wrd, on top of that I don't understand why bonds are ”tricky”. Just pay out the security issuer (Goat) and let him divvy it up from there. The only reason why it would be ”tricky” is if he (or whoever its using him aa sock puppet) wanted to ID all the bond holders. I wonder why he would want to do that?

A silly question: Why would pirate40 want to identify all bond holders? IRS?

That's the 5 millions dollars question Smiley

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August 29, 2012, 03:09:28 PM
 #563

Wrd, on top of that I don't understand why bonds are ”tricky”. Just pay out the security issuer (Goat) and let him divvy it up from there. The only reason why it would be ”tricky” is if he (or whoever its using him aa sock puppet) wanted to ID all the bond holders. I wonder why he would want to do that?

A silly question: Why would pirate40 want to identify all bond holders? IRS?

That's the 5 millions dollars question Smiley

For right now I will assume yes... I think he has a gun to his head.

Agreed :/

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August 29, 2012, 03:12:24 PM
 #564


No - you still don't get it.
I don't have any PPT bonds and when I did, I did not buy them for cents.

Goat was trying to get himself rich by selling empty PPT bonds - and Nefario was helping him, probably being his partner in this business.
And now they are both screwed.

Absolutely baseless accusation, proof please.
The proof of Goat selling empty PPT bonds?
Or the proof or you being his lying bitch?

Both.
1) The number of active assets is 30175 ATM, while it was far below 27895, after Pirate announced that he's stopping accepting deposits.
2) You are denying this simple fact.

Look Mr. conspiracy theorist,

I provided you with all the numbers for that asset you requested(dates as well), and all you could provide was "I remember them being different", you got chewed out by everyone else on that thread as well because you're so damn sure you remembered several sets of numbers, dates and times over a period of a few days and that the numbers I provided (pulled from a DB) are wrong, and therefor I must be in league with Goat.

Now, as I've said I'll give users signed receipts of their asset balance (but not give user details to pirate) what else have you got to say, except to trot out your theory that the rest of the world is conspiring against specifically you.


I believe it would be stupid for any GLBSE user to get a receipt to give to pirate, it won't increase their chance of getting paid, and will reduce the chance other users will (not that I think they have a chance either way), pirate will keep making excuses not to pay.

I also believe it would be dangerous for GLBSE users to give such information to pirate, why in the world would he want it?

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piotr_n
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August 29, 2012, 03:14:31 PM
 #565

Oh, spare me the crap, Nefario.
You simply left me with the choice of me being crazy, not remembering a number I saw yesterday - or you being a Goat's laying bitch.
And now you pretending to be surprised that I chose the later - what the hell were you thinking I'd choose? Smiley

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nima
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August 29, 2012, 03:17:27 PM
 #566

Wrd, on top of that I don't understand why bonds are ”tricky”. Just pay out the security issuer (Goat) and let him divvy it up from there. The only reason why it would be ”tricky” is if he (or whoever its using him aa sock puppet) wanted to ID all the bond holders. I wonder why he would want to do that?

A silly question: Why would pirate40 want to identify all bond holders? IRS?

That's the 5 millions dollars question Smiley

For right now I will assume yes... I think he has a gun to his head.

Agreed :/

Gotta hide in Cuba for years now when IRS finds out I had 5 btc.  Grin

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Nefario
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August 29, 2012, 03:18:54 PM
 #567

you being a Goat's laying bitch.
And now you pretending to be surprised that I chose the later Smiley

Is laying a step up or down?

I feign no surprise, I place you in the tinfoil hat category of people so expect to hear all sorts of things.

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piotr_n
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August 29, 2012, 03:21:31 PM
 #568

you being a Goat's laying bitch.
And now you pretending to be surprised that I chose the later Smiley

Is laying a step up or down?

I feign no surprise, I place you in the tinfoil hat category of people so expect to hear all sorts of things.
How should I know if the lie was a step up, or down, for you?
For me, such a lie, would have definitely been a step down.
But since you are so stupid, and so I cannot put myself in your position - I believe that you may still be thinking that it was leading you up...

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Nefario
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August 29, 2012, 03:26:05 PM
 #569

you being a Goat's laying bitch.
And now you pretending to be surprised that I chose the later Smiley

Is laying a step up or down?

I feign no surprise, I place you in the tinfoil hat category of people so expect to hear all sorts of things.
How should I know if the lie was a step up, or down, for you?
For me, such a lie, would have definitely been a step down.
But since you are so stupid, and so I cannot put myself in your position - I believe that you may still be thinking that it was leading you up...


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August 29, 2012, 04:08:40 PM
 #570

you still don't get it do you, the greed of cashing out cheaply picked up bonds for bitcents on a bitcoin is blinding you -  GLBSE PPTs are NOT BTCST Trust Sub-accounts there is nothing for Goat/Nefario to submit to Pirate. GBLSE should not, can't and won't release their user's data to 3rd parties without a legal motion such as court order
1. Create "mule" GLBSE account named ronald_mcdonald
2. Transfer over all bonds to mule account
3. Submit info to Pirate
4. Huh
5. Profit

THIS SPOT FOR RENT* | GPG ID: 4880D85C | 1% Escrow | 8% IPO/ICO Escrow services Temporarily Closed | Bitcointalk is the ONLY place where I use this name (No Skype/IRC/YIM/AIM/etc) | 13CsmTqGNwvFXb7tD9yFvJcEYCDTB8wQTS | Beware of these SCAM sites! | *Sponsored Link
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August 29, 2012, 04:19:00 PM
 #571

you still don't get it do you, the greed of cashing out cheaply picked up bonds for bitcents on a bitcoin is blinding you -  GLBSE PPTs are NOT BTCST Trust Sub-accounts there is nothing for Goat/Nefario to submit to Pirate. GBLSE should not, can't and won't release their user's data to 3rd parties without a legal motion such as court order
1. Create "mule" GLBSE account named ronald_mcdonald
2. Transfer over all bonds to mule account
3. Submit info to Pirate
4. Huh
5. Profit
That sound like a good plan... except that the guy who administrates GLBSE is the one that Pirate is trying to avoid, because he's cheeky goat's bitch, that would not hesitate to lie for a profit.
So how can you trust in his service?
Especially if you know that he recently stole 3000 ASICMINER assets.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.msg1138495#msg1138495

Check out gocoin - my original project of a bitcoin client written in Go, with some unique features.
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August 29, 2012, 04:26:10 PM
 #572

you still don't get it do you, the greed of cashing out cheaply picked up bonds for bitcents on a bitcoin is blinding you -  GLBSE PPTs are NOT BTCST Trust Sub-accounts there is nothing for Goat/Nefario to submit to Pirate. GBLSE should not, can't and won't release their user's data to 3rd parties without a legal motion such as court order
1. Create "mule" GLBSE account named ronald_mcdonald
2. Transfer over all bonds to mule account
3. Submit info to Pirate
4. Huh
5. Profit
That sound like a good plan... except that the guy who administrates GLBSE is the one that Pirate is trying to avoid, because he's cheeky goat's bitch, that would not hesitate to lie for a profit.
So how can you trust in his service?
Especially if you know that he recently stole 3000 ASICMINER assets.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.msg1138495#msg1138495
Personally, I trust Goat *WAY* more than Pirate, but if Pirate really wants/needs proof from the bond-holders themselves, I see no reason why he can't just set up a GLBSE account himself and say "Ok anybody who wants their payout, send your shares of XXXXX bond to pirate_deposits and you'll receive .XXXX BTC per share".  Problem solved, and you circumvent Nefario and Goat all together.

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August 29, 2012, 04:28:35 PM
 #573

Personally, I trust Goat *WAY* more than Pirate, but if Pirate really wants/needs proof from the bond-holders themselves, I see no reason why he can't just set up an account himself and say "Ok anybody who wants their payout, send your shares of XXXXX bond to pirate_deposits and you'll receive .XXXX BTC per share".  Problem solved, and you circumvent Nefario and Goat all together.
You don't see a reason - but I do.
If Pirate does start an account - and something gets missing from his account; he will be the one responsible.
The service is under full control of Nefario (who is already proven to be a cheeky crook) and there is no way for anyone to prove that Nerafio stole anything from him at GLBSE.
Just like there was no way for nedbert9 to prove that Nefario stole 3k of his ASICMINER.
But the common sense says that he is the obvious thief, since he refused to revert the stealing transactions.

Pirate would have to be crazy, like I used to be, to open an account on this fucking thief's server.

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bitlane
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August 29, 2012, 04:28:57 PM
 #574

Personally, I trust Goat *WAY* more than Pirate, but if Pirate really wants/needs proof from the bond-holders themselves, I see no reason why he can't just set up an account himself and say "Ok anybody who wants their payout, send your shares of XXXXX bond to pirate_deposits and you'll receive .XXXX BTC per share".  Problem solved, and you circumvent Nefario and Goat all together.

OR, Pirate can simply set up his own BID Wall and tell everyone to dump. He doesn't need anyone's info.

Goat, Nefario and anyone else showing Pirate just the slightest bit of resistance to his crap should be rewarded, not kicked in public.

THEY ARE PROTECTING THEIR CUSTOMERS.

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August 29, 2012, 04:37:01 PM
 #575

you still don't get it do you, the greed of cashing out cheaply picked up bonds for bitcents on a bitcoin is blinding you -  GLBSE PPTs are NOT BTCST Trust Sub-accounts there is nothing for Goat/Nefario to submit to Pirate. GBLSE should not, can't and won't release their user's data to 3rd parties without a legal motion such as court order
1. Create "mule" GLBSE account named ronald_mcdonald
2. Transfer over all bonds to mule account
3. Submit info to Pirate
4. Huh
5. Profit

it's a neat shortcut but there still would be an obligation to those who don't submit/trust this mule account.

if I invested in GLBSE PPT I expect to get paid by either dividend or through buy-back according to asset's contract, and in this case I don't owe pirate anything and would not approve GLBSE/Goat passing around my data to 3rd parties. Pirate dealt with Goat and should honor his end of deal with Goat, then Goat needs to honor his part of deal with his bond holders through GLBSE.

edit: yeah or as bitlane said Pirate could just put a bid order for face value + all missing interest and it is done deal
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August 29, 2012, 04:44:49 PM
 #576

The service is under full control of Nefario (who is already proven to be a cheeky crook) and there is no way for anyone to prove that Nerafio stole anything from him at GLBSE.
Just like there was no way for nedbert9 to prove that Nefario stole 3k of his ASICMINER.
But the common sense says that he is the obvious thief, since he refused to revert the stealing transactions.

Pirate would have to be crazy, like I used to be, to open an account on this fucking thief's server.

I am realy glad I have taken the tiem to work with FellowTraveler on getting Open Transactions working, so if people like you end up using my server every asset balance they have will be signed with their own secret private key that only exists on their computer, so if they try to claim I stole something their own digital signature will refute their accusation.

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August 29, 2012, 06:02:25 PM
 #577

The service is under full control of Nefario (who is already proven to be a cheeky crook) and there is no way for anyone to prove that Nerafio stole anything from him at GLBSE.

Listen, crazy, if you need lies to win an argument then it's no win at all.


Quote
Just like there was no way for nedbert9 to prove that Nefario stole 3k of his ASICMINER.

If there is no way to prove anything or no proof of anything, why are you accusing me?

Quote
But the common sense says that he is the obvious thief, since he refused to revert the stealing transactions.

I provide a secure platform for people to use, which includes 2fa, it requires that users keep their passwords safe, don't re-use them and use a machine that isn't compromised. If they can't do these things then there is nothing I can do to protect them. I've done everything I can and the rest is up to the user.

Just like a real stock market, if someone breaks into your account and executes trades, well that's just too bad they don't get reversed.

Whats to stop someone who made a bad trade or has fat fingers from claiming their account was compromised? Then every time the market takes a turn for the worst there would be a sudden rush of claims of hacked accounts.

On top of this I can't reverse trades when bitcoin has been withdrawn, since it's not GLBSE's fault, we've gone to the trouble to secure the exchange, we should not be required to foot the cost of someone else who didn't secure their account.

Quote
Pirate would have to be crazy, like I used to be, to open an account on this fucking thief's server.

You're just sore that you lost money betting in the pirate game, and Goat won't give it back to you and I won't help you. You had your chance, you could have bought insured PPT's, or like most sensible people you could have kept your money. You made yourself a victim, don't go blaming others, don't go calling assets on my exchange "illegal IPO's" when you we're perfectly happy to buy into them when things were sweet.

I am realy glad I have taken the tiem to work with FellowTraveler on getting Open Transactions working, so if people like you end up using my server every asset balance they have will be signed with their own secret private key that only exists on their computer, so if they try to claim I stole something their own digital signature will refute their accusation.

-MarkM-


No one cares about OpenTransactions, it's difficult to use and the problem it's tying to solve is the wrong one, the problem is key management.

GLBSE used to have all clients sign their orders with their private key, pretty soon because obvious that this wasn't going to scale as more and more people lost their keys

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DeaDTerra
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August 29, 2012, 06:04:48 PM
 #578

The service is under full control of Nefario (who is already proven to be a cheeky crook) and there is no way for anyone to prove that Nerafio stole anything from him at GLBSE.

Listen, crazy, if you need lies to win an argument then it's no win at all.


Quote
Just like there was no way for nedbert9 to prove that Nefario stole 3k of his ASICMINER.

If there is no way to prove anything or no proof of anything, why are you accusing me?

Quote
But the common sense says that he is the obvious thief, since he refused to revert the stealing transactions.

I provide a secure platform for people to use, which includes 2fa, it requires that users keep their passwords safe, don't re-use them and use a machine that isn't compromised. If they can't do these things then there is nothing I can do to protect them. I've done everything I can and the rest is up to the user.

Just like a real stock market, if someone breaks into your account and executes trades, well that's just too bad they don't get reversed.

Whats to stop someone who made a bad trade or has fat fingers from claiming their account was compromised? Then every time the market takes a turn for the worst there would be a sudden rush of claims of hacked accounts.

On top of this I can't reverse trades when bitcoin has been withdrawn, since it's not GLBSE's fault, we've gone to the trouble to secure the exchange, we should not be required to foot the cost of someone else who didn't secure their account.

Quote
Pirate would have to be crazy, like I used to be, to open an account on this fucking thief's server.

You're just sore that you lost money betting in the pirate game, and Goat won't give it back to you and I won't help you. You had your chance, you could have bought insured PPT's, or like most sensible people you could have kept your money. You made yourself a victim, don't go blaming others, don't go calling assets on my exchange "illegal IPO's" when you we're perfectly happy to buy into them when things were sweet.

I am realy glad I have taken the tiem to work with FellowTraveler on getting Open Transactions working, so if people like you end up using my server every asset balance they have will be signed with their own secret private key that only exists on their computer, so if they try to claim I stole something their own digital signature will refute their accusation.

-MarkM-


No one cares about OpenTransactions, it's difficult to use and the problem it's tying to solve is the wrong one, the problem is key management.

GLBSE used to have all clients sign their orders with their private key, pretty soon because obvious that this wasn't going to scale as more and more people lost their keys
Wow...
People on this forum are getting more and more stupid each day that passes.
Accusing Nefario of theft when the share were sold into the open market... really?
Comeon guys, lay off this crazy hunt for a scape goat.
//DeaDTerra
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August 29, 2012, 06:43:47 PM
 #579

so now it is about fat fingers - not a stolen session anymore...
sure - it could have been anything... i agree
but you know what, as for me, it was most likely just you.
otherwise you would have reverted the transaction.
if you let this money to get withdrawn from your service, even though all the withdrawals are delayed anyway and man needs to wait an hour for a fucking 1.66.
300 - and you just let it go through like that...
that's your fucking fault and you should have taken the consequences

Check out gocoin - my original project of a bitcoin client written in Go, with some unique features.
PGP fingerprint: AB9E A551 E262 A87A 13BB  9059 1BE7 B545 CDF3 FD0E
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August 29, 2012, 06:57:58 PM
 #580

so now it is about fat fingers - not a stolen session anymore...
sure - it could have been anything... i agree
but you know what, as for me, it was most likely just you.
otherwise you would have reverted the transaction.
if you let this money to get withdrawn from your service, even though all the withdrawals are delayed anyway and man needs to wait an hour for a fucking 1.66.
300 - and you just let it go through like that...
that's your fucking fault and you should have taken the consequences

Does any exchange revert a transaction when someone has allowed their account to be compromised?

MtGox? Intersango? BTC-e?

You'll find the answer is no, for obvious reasons.

We've taken a hit plenty of times, when it was our fault but never had to do so for a compromised account as GLBSE takes all precautions, I see no reason why we or any other site should do so if they're not responsible.

People are responsible for their own security there is only so much we can do and this is doubly so with bitcoin.

PGP key id at pgp.mit.edu 0xA68F4B7C

To get help and support for GLBSE please email support@glbse.com
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