[ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping

[Azael]

Factom is total bullshit. They keep promising "M2" yet they deliver nothing.. and give no updates whatsoever. They've always got their arms open for more money though

- Public fundraising offering last year
- ICO
- Kept 50% of ICO coins and dump it on the crypto "community" after hyping it on chinese exchanges
- get money from Azure
- get money from Department of Homeland Security
- now ANOTHER public offering

This thread is only used to generate more hype for this shit token whose developers only know how to collect money

Well updated here: https://github.com/FactomProject if you can read through the code then do and if you can't take the time to then you have no right to complain.


They are one of the most well funded alt startups. Why is that a problem? They need capital until they have a finished product. Do you think that $4.4 million raised means they will all line their pockets with that money? That's only with shitcoin IPOs. Founders get rich when their company gets sold and not during the initial crowdsales to sustain operations. And yes there is Seed and a A, B and C round.. so if you dislike that they raise capital to pay their workforce or for expansion then you should absolutely get out.

And then you throw some unsubstantiated allegations that you need to back up before I adress them..

Azure/DHS is also a bad thing according to you? Alright then lol.. The hell...  

The paid workforce is busy doing what? They can't even provide a useful update to M2? They are months past their self-imposed deadline and they expect people should have to go read the github code? What a joke

Why is that a joke? The progress is visible on GitHub and they test find new bugs and fix them and test again until it works. You don't have to know much about software development to know that it is hard to give an ETA on that right?

I don't even agree with them giving out the first ETA but it is necessary to try to estimate the project when introducing people to give an idea and ballpark.


So basically you are angry because they gave an ETA and then found some bugs so that it took longer to build. And now you want them to give you another one when there is really no guarantee they can match it given that software development means running into unexpected problems. Really?

And to answer your first question about the "paid workforce" - hopefully they are working.

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[crazyivan]

So, when I told u 2 months I ve got info Factom s got cash-flow problems, I was labeled as a TROLL. What s up now my friends? Ha?

Next time, I suggest you listen when I share some info with you. No problem them raising capital, that s fine. The problem is they keep everyone in the dark, as usual.

[MyFarm]

So, when I told u 2 months I ve got info Factom s got cash-flow problems, I was labeled as a TROLL. What s up now my friends? Ha?

Next time, I suggest you listen when I share some info with you.

Considering a, "Cash flow problem" is defined as spending more than you bring in, of course they have cash flow problems, they're an early stage startup.  That's why they're going through a series A financing round.  And you know what, they'll continue to have cash flow problems in the future and will conduct a series B round.  I could see a company like Factom have, "Cash flow problems" for a long time.  That doesn't mean they aren't a fantastic investment.

It's a non-issue for anyone who has a clue how these things work.

[crazyivan]

Factom series A completed at a $29.1 million valuation, and FCT is trading at $14.2 million market cap. How long before traders realize that? Last time when it was trading at around $1m market cap it took the market 4 months to catch up to the old $11.8 million valuation.


Anyway congratulations to everyone who stuck around and congratulations to Factom team!

I do agree with this calculation. It seems the market values the company much higher then market cap of Factoids. It should not be long before the price doubles.

[tempus]

Yeah really great informative argument 

If you wouldn't have started like a troll (Factom is total bullshit.) and just repeated what others complained before, without even reading what was posted some pages before, what should I do? I tried to refute complainers with arguments. But even I get bored if it's always the same and about superficial stuff like "there is a delay and they don't say when M2 will be".

Thing is: Those who really want to know what this project is about should invest some hours and do deeper research. If those who do that still see reason to complain they should not invest or sell if they've bought before. If they believe to see quality they should be patient. Because when it's obvious that a team works hard, a delay can be seen as perfectionism. It also could mean they try and try and try without getting things done because of a lack of skills, but like I've said: Do your research and come to your own conclusions. I can't do that for you and out of your perspective there is not that much reason to trust me. I could lie or I could be wrong.

And sometimes I just say: Sell ......because if the M2 delay is a reason to say Factom is bullshit - the conclusion is already finished. I believe it's superficial but it's everyones own choice to be.
 

[flashbit]

Yeah really great informative argument 

If you wouldn't have started like a troll (Factom is total bullshit.) and just repeated what others complained before, without even reading what was posted some pages before, what should I do? I tried to refute complainers with arguments. But even I get bored if it's always the same and about superficial stuff like "there is a delay and they don't say when M2 will be".

Thing is: Those who really want to know what this project is about should invest some hours and do deeper research. If those who do that still see reason to complain they should not invest or sell if they've bought before. If they believe to see quality they should be patient. Because when it's obvious that a team works hard, a delay can be seen as perfectionism. It also could mean they try and try and try without getting things done because of a lack of skills, but like I've said: Do your research and come to your own conclusions. I can't do that for you and out of your perspective there is not that much reason to trust me. I could lie or I could be wrong.

And sometimes I just say: Sell ......because if the M2 delay is a reason to say Factom is bullshit - the conclusion is already finished. I believe it's superficial but it's everyones own choice to be.
 

Tempus I wouldn't feed the trolls. Not worth it. We know they have a clear agenda. Simply click ignore.

[tempus]

So, when I told u 2 months I ve got info Factom s got cash-flow problems, I was labeled as a TROLL. What s up now my friends? Ha?

Next time, I suggest you listen when I share some info with you. No problem them raising capital, that s fine. The problem is they keep everyone in the dark, as usual.

You are funny. That a project needs funding and that they would raise more VC was clear and it's nothing special.

But it's kind of weird to speak about cash-flow-problems if they can do it and they shares are sold long before the deadline.

Would be easier to take such an info serious if they would fire people, code in a lodge and sell grandmothers diamonds at ebay. ;-)

[Azael]

Yeah really great informative argument 

If you wouldn't have started like a troll (Factom is total bullshit.) and just repeated what others complained before, without even reading what was posted some pages before, what should I do? I tried to refute complainers with arguments. But even I get bored if it's always the same and about superficial stuff like "there is a delay and they don't say when M2 will be".

Thing is: Those who really want to know what this project is about should invest some hours and do deeper research. If those who do that still see reason to complain they should not invest or sell if they've bought before. If they believe to see quality they should be patient. Because when it's obvious that a team works hard, a delay can be seen as perfectionism. It also could mean they try and try and try without getting things done because of a lack of skills, but like I've said: Do your research and come to your own conclusions. I can't do that for you and out of your perspective there is not that much reason to trust me. I could lie or I could be wrong.

And sometimes I just say: Sell ......because if the M2 delay is a reason to say Factom is bullshit - the conclusion is already finished. I believe it's superficial but it's everyones own choice to be.
 

I agree with you I feel very often that people demand respect without giving any: demanding answers that is answered by Google or a few pages back or demanding things that can be found out by a few hours research or rational thinking.

When you do the above and also swear and spew unsubstantiated claims or outright lies... well.. not that many are willing to spend time to write a nice response.

[tempus]

Yeah really great informative argument 

If you wouldn't have started like a troll (Factom is total bullshit.) and just repeated what others complained before, without even reading what was posted some pages before, what should I do? I tried to refute complainers with arguments. But even I get bored if it's always the same and about superficial stuff like "there is a delay and they don't say when M2 will be".

Thing is: Those who really want to know what this project is about should invest some hours and do deeper research. If those who do that still see reason to complain they should not invest or sell if they've bought before. If they believe to see quality they should be patient. Because when it's obvious that a team works hard, a delay can be seen as perfectionism. It also could mean they try and try and try without getting things done because of a lack of skills, but like I've said: Do your research and come to your own conclusions. I can't do that for you and out of your perspective there is not that much reason to trust me. I could lie or I could be wrong.

And sometimes I just say: Sell ......because if the M2 delay is a reason to say Factom is bullshit - the conclusion is already finished. I believe it's superficial but it's everyones own choice to be.
 

Tempus I wouldn't feed the trolls. Not worth it. We know they have a clear agenda. Simply click ignore.

I understand your opinion and it's not wrong to just ignore them. But I always was the opinion that FUD is an opportunity to turn it.
And sometimes it's not even real trolling. Crazyivan for example can write like a troll but I don't consider him as one with hidden intentions.

The other guy I replied on: No clue if agenda or not.

[Azael]

So, when I told u 2 months I ve got info Factom s got cash-flow problems, I was labeled as a TROLL. What s up now my friends? Ha?

Next time, I suggest you listen when I share some info with you. No problem them raising capital, that s fine. The problem is they keep everyone in the dark, as usual.

You are funny. That a project needs funding and that they would raise more VC was clear and it's nothing special.

But it's kind of weird to speak about cash-flow-problems if they can do it and they shares are sold long before the deadline.

Would be easier to take such an info serious if they would fire people, code in a lodge and sell grandmothers diamonds at ebay. ;-)

Seems like they sold out their goal in a mere 2 days. Or well 0.35% out of 17% left. Maybe they left some money on the table.

[Azael]

Factom series A completed at a $29.1 million valuation, and FCT is trading at $14.2 million market cap. How long before traders realize that? Last time when it was trading at around $1m market cap it took the market 4 months to catch up to the old $11.8 million valuation.


Anyway congratulations to everyone who stuck around and congratulations to Factom team!

I do agree with this calculation. It seems the market values the company much higher then market cap of Factoids. It should not be long before the price doubles.

Neat and if you play with the thought that FCT peaked at $24.7 million whilst having a $11.8 million valuation the now $29.1 million valuation leaves a lot of room for FCT to grow past $29.1 million market capitalization especially with M2. Now that is a bit more speculative though.

Ideally the FCT price thus value of the network should follow Factom INC valuation and the interesting thing with the network is that ideally it should be more valuable tomorrow just by the legitimacy of simply being up another day, and with Factom legitimacy is very important.

Now that their crowdsale on bnktothefuture is nearly a done deal I have a few take aways: The new valuation at $29.1 million and at what pace they sold out shares at that valuation which will be 15th-18th probably. It tells me there is plenty of demand for Factom.


And to go a bit more on the speculative side of things: $4.5 million raised in series A, the total amount in seed round of 2015 was something like $1.5 million if I recall the SEC docs I read. So we're talking series B in 3x the time (some 30 months from seed to round A) or we're talking a serious acceleration of pace and workforce which seems likely if M2 is dished out more resources will be put on getting sales. And likely in series B we're talking something like seed $10.8M, A $29.1M (+169.44%), B $50M+ valuation. Following the same increase from seed to A it would be $78.25M exactly but there is less risk at that point so I would put it at something like $5xM+ valuation but that is just judging by the numbers.

If we include a succesful contract with DHS, M2 and community participation and other upcoming surprises.. my calculations should be the floor for the FCT price. Also take my numbers collected from BNKtothefuture as rough estimates since oddly enough the site seems to have changed a few times for me now and I need to do the EUR -> USD conversion again. I'll come back to edit this post when I get home later with the exact numbers but if they are a bit off it is not by much.

[Soul_eater_123]

Cash flow problems implies a company running out of funds and not being able to raise more or at the very least having difficulty raising more money.  That DOES NOT apply to Factom at all.  People are falling over themselves to fund them and large companies are falling over themselves to hire them and work with them.  Overall they are in really good shape.  Anyone who expects them to be the size of Apple or Google after just a year or so are insane.

[woodson]

I would consider it wise to not publicly speak about cash flow issues while having on going dealings with a country.  Having experience in valuations, the % amount that they are raising based on valuation certainly shouldnt raise an eyebrow but rather suggest prudence... note, Im not a large holder but watching Factum very closely for the adjust to market value presently....

[greentea]

I just stumbled about this page thanks to a youtube link of Tempus on Polo:

https://bnktothefuture.com/pitches/factom-series-a

Does anyone have more information what this is about? For me, it looks like they are selling shares of their company (how many %?) and will get handet out at least $4.5m in about 4 weeks.

When did this funding start?

Kind of funny is: Just wrote the post above about the same site but didn't even recognized that it's also about investing.
Was totally focused on the new video. ;-)

But you could be right. Looks as if they will get about $4.5 Mio.

Two interesting points there:

1. 27 days remaining and already 98% filled
2. Factom is on the first place. No other company comes close to them:

https://bnktothefuture.com/search/pitches

Interesting find, that's basically double the current marketcap (with 5MM at 17% valuation), wonder what that will do to the price

[D-Lux]

Following the same increase from seed to A it would be $78.25M exactly but there is less risk at that point so I would put it at something like $5xM+ valuation but that is just judging by the numbers.

Less risk would actually imply a valuation higher than 78.25M, I believe.

[Azael]

Following the same increase from seed to A it would be $78.25M exactly but there is less risk at that point so I would put it at something like $5xM+ valuation but that is just judging by the numbers.

Less risk would actually imply a valuation higher than 78.25M, I believe.

Correct, my bad.

[tempus]

A good summary about Factoids and Entry Credits (also about Ether):


Transactional currencies - Entry Credits and Gas

DISCLAIMER:
While I work for Factom, the opinions expressed in this piece are, as always, my own.

(...)
https://tpbit.blogspot.de/2016/07/transactional-currencies-entry-credits.html

[customer73]

Very interesting indeed.  So 17% company equity for $5,000,000?  By my math, that sets company valuation at roughly $29,500,00.  Assuming this is correct, I wonder who estimated Factom to be worth $29,500,000 and exactly how this value was derived?
 

And I believe it's a very positive sign that it's value has nearly tripled since that. Even more if they give deeper infos to potential VC-Investors. The fact that the $4.5 Mio is nearly filled long before the deadline, could be seen as a sign that Investors agree that Factom is worth the $29 Mio and they see potential for more. They wouldn't buy if they wouldn't believe in it. In best case VC-Investors have some facts we don't know about yet. It's highly speculative, but if that should be the case it's about good news yet to come.

If I'm wrong it's at least obvious that there are VC-Investors who believe in Factoms future. And why not. It may be a risk, but it could be great "bet". If I would be rich I also would try to get shares, not "just" Factoids - even if I think that Factoids are also a great Investment maybe even better.

And what's also interesting: The value of Factom as company and the value of Factoids will be connected in future. Most likely never totally, but Factom's value (as a company) also will depend on how much the system will be used. Maybe they also sell applications they develop for companies but it would be basically the same. It would be (maybe already 'is') about customized applications for customers to use the system as effective as possible - for a specific use case.

All together: A lot of good signs lately. Nothing that's totally safe yet, but I can't think of realistic bad scenarios while they are obviously wanted regarding VC-money, are awarded from DHS, etc. And I really like it to see that Peter Kirby speaks about land-title-registry in that way.

You can invest in Factom Co. en https://bnktothefuture.com from 1000$ and pay with Bitcoin. And yes, you can have access to 'classified information'.

[tempus]

I just stumbled about this page thanks to a youtube link of Tempus on Polo:

https://bnktothefuture.com/pitches/factom-series-a

Does anyone have more information what this is about? For me, it looks like they are selling shares of their company (how many %?) and will get handet out at least $4.5m in about 4 weeks.

When did this funding start?

Kind of funny is: Just wrote the post above about the same site but didn't even recognized that it's also about investing.
Was totally focused on the new video. ;-)

But you could be right. Looks as if they will get about $4.5 Mio.

Two interesting points there:

1. 27 days remaining and already 98% filled
2. Factom is on the first place. No other company comes close to them:

https://bnktothefuture.com/search/pitches

Interesting find, that's basically double the current marketcap (with 5MM at 17% valuation), wonder what that will do to the price

The question is, if the value of the company and the value of the system (marketcap) are kind of equal or will be in future. I think it's only safe to say that it's connected, that the value of both will be highly dependent on the use of the system - the demand for Entry Credits.

A safe conclusion for now is:
Those who bought the shares give more money and pay higher a price than Kuala Investments last year. It's safe to say that they are obviously very optimistic about Factom and it's future.


But I don't believe that it's possible to see more objectivity in the value of the company as in the value of the market-cap. Both are not objective but speculative. Both involve the potential of the future. And no doubt, it's absolutely rational to think that way because there is a high potential. I believe Factom's potential could be even higher. But before Factom really starts it's service we can't know how much demand there will be. And it will be the future demand that will give objective informations about the value of Factoids.

At the same time it will never be totally objective because it never will be totally stable. Exactly that will be exciting if Factom will be wanted, because it's rational to expect an increasing demand, maybe even an exploding demand. And that would be a massive trigger for the market.

Kind of paradox is: For me it's much easier to "predict" subjective tendencies of the market than to predict the potential of future objective potential, like the future demand. I thought a lot about potential scenarios for Entry Credit demand in future but I don't have enough knowledge about use cases and how it would be used and so on.

One example is Honduras: If there should be a signed deal somewhere in the future the market would hype it. Something like that would be a very intense psychological trigger and it's likely that the price would explode. But who knows how much demand that would be? I mean, one bank would have most likely much more demand than land-title-registry of a whole country. But again: I don't know for sure, because it's also about how Factom would be used.

Objective informations and subjective reactions on the market can be very paradox. The latest news about Venture Capital can be seen that way. On the market it's something like a "low-intensive-trigger", because it seems to give good objective information, but I'm not that sure that it really gives objective informations about value. But of course, it gives positive signals.

[tempus]

Very interesting indeed.  So 17% company equity for $5,000,000?  By my math, that sets company valuation at roughly $29,500,00.  Assuming this is correct, I wonder who estimated Factom to be worth $29,500,000 and exactly how this value was derived?
 

And I believe it's a very positive sign that it's value has nearly tripled since that. Even more if they give deeper infos to potential VC-Investors. The fact that the $4.5 Mio is nearly filled long before the deadline, could be seen as a sign that Investors agree that Factom is worth the $29 Mio and they see potential for more. They wouldn't buy if they wouldn't believe in it. In best case VC-Investors have some facts we don't know about yet. It's highly speculative, but if that should be the case it's about good news yet to come.

If I'm wrong it's at least obvious that there are VC-Investors who believe in Factoms future. And why not. It may be a risk, but it could be great "bet". If I would be rich I also would try to get shares, not "just" Factoids - even if I think that Factoids are also a great Investment maybe even better.

And what's also interesting: The value of Factom as company and the value of Factoids will be connected in future. Most likely never totally, but Factom's value (as a company) also will depend on how much the system will be used. Maybe they also sell applications they develop for companies but it would be basically the same. It would be (maybe already 'is') about customized applications for customers to use the system as effective as possible - for a specific use case.

All together: A lot of good signs lately. Nothing that's totally safe yet, but I can't think of realistic bad scenarios while they are obviously wanted regarding VC-money, are awarded from DHS, etc. And I really like it to see that Peter Kirby speaks about land-title-registry in that way.

You can invest in Factom Co. en https://bnktothefuture.com from 1000$ and pay with Bitcoin. And yes, you can have access to 'classified information'.

Thanks for that info! I didn't really look into it because I always thought it's needed to invest more. Did you invest?