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Author Topic: 📈 NastyFans: The Bitcoin Enthusiast Fan Club (est. 2012)  (Read 922572 times)
kuzetsa
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September 18, 2012, 03:01:23 AM
 #201

((...snip...)) The amount also updates every 10 minutes and if the GLBSE API goes down for some reason, it uses the last price that was taken from the API.  This is an automated script.  I am not sure why kuzetsa thinks it is some kind of conspiracy.

Fine, you just don't know how to parse the API correctly:

Code:
GLBSE depth API:

HTTP GET URL /api/asset/NASTY

raw:

{"buys":[[1,51000000],[4,51000000],[10,45000000],[1,44650000],[13,44600000],[1,44500000],[10,44000000],[100,27000000],[1000,10000]],"sells":[[24,749999000],[40,524800000],[12,500000000],[23,500000000],[21,500000000],[10,110000000],[1,100000000],[345,80000000],[100,79900000],[30,77800000],[30,77800000],[8,75000000],[11,69800000],[20,65700000],[13,63999000],[15,62000000],[10,62000000],[9,61500000],[4,60000000],[3,60000000],[19,60000000],[5,58000000],[73,55530000],[1,55000000],[20,52000000],[1,51989999]]}

cooked (extracted) values in satoshi:

51989999 (best ask)
51000000 (best bid)

GLBSE market data API:
HTTP GET URL /api/asset/NASTY

raw:

{"btc_vol_total":420548544563,"t24hvol":562300001,"t5dvol":5966550001,"max":51000000,"min":51989999,"t24havg":50728571,"t5davg":50443939,"t7davg":51239975,"latest_trade":44650001,"quantity":1,"bid":51000000,"ask":51989999}

cooked (extracted) values in satoshi:

Highest / Best bid price aka "max": 51000000
Lowest / Best ask price aka "min": 51989999
Average for past 24 hours aka "t24havg": 50728571
Average for past 5 days aka "t5davg": 50443939
Average for past 5 days aka "t7davg": 51239975

and lastly, the best:

"bid": 51000000
"ask": 51989999

Apparently, there is a value in the API that matches what you're caching:

"latest_trade": 44650001

You uhm... you do realize that is NOT the current market price in any way shape or form, that is just whatever arbitrary value someone happened to trade at. if someone was bold enough to actually sell to one of the 0.00001 BTC bids, I'm pretty sure suddenly the value for latest_trade would be that, and would stay there until someone bought or sold (traded) at any other random arbitrary value.
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bitfair
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September 18, 2012, 03:21:20 AM
 #202

Apparently, there is a value in the API that matches what you're caching:

"latest_trade": 44650001

You uhm... you do realize that is NOT the current market price in any way shape or form, that is just whatever arbitrary value someone happened to trade at. if someone was bold enough to actually sell to one of the 0.00001 BTC bids, I'm pretty sure suddenly the value for latest_trade would be that, and would stay there until someone bought or sold (traded) at any other random arbitrary value.

Kuzetsa, I believe you are the only one so far in the history of this operation who seems to have misunderstood this.

And AFAIK, GLBSE matches trades against the best price available - meaning that if you try to sell a share at 0.00001 BTC, the order will actually execute at the highest bid instead. So the "latest_trade" field is normally at what was either the lowest ask or highest bid at the moment when the last trade went through.

Nothing random or arbitrary about that at all!

(And using the average of the bid and the ask as a "current price" would be much more misleading, by the way...)
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September 18, 2012, 03:39:16 AM
 #203

(( edited to remove excessive quotations))

I just sold a share as a test, and the API updated:

Code:
{"btc_vol_total":420911534562,"t24hvol":925290000,"t5dvol":6329540000,"max":51000000,"min":51990000,"t24havg":51009000,"t5davg":50545555,"t7davg":51268840,"latest_trade":51000000,"quantity":1,"bid":51000000,"ask":51990000}

And then bought it back at a slightly worse price (lost a bitcent to test)

Code:
{"btc_vol_total":420911534562,"t24hvol":925290000,"t5dvol":6329540000,"max":51000000,"min":51990000,"t24havg":51009000,"t5davg":50545555,"t7davg":51268840,"latest_trade":51990000,"quantity":1,"bid":51000000,"ask":51990000}

Just as easily I could have done this in reverse by buying, then selling.

most recent trade would have been 0.51 instead of 0.5199 like it is now. Just that easily I have manipulated the value of "last trade" and it only cost me aprox 1 bitcent to do it.

EDITED TO ADD screenshot from at or around 0340 GMT, Tuesday September 17th 2012
kuzetsa
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September 18, 2012, 04:02:49 AM
 #204

Code:
Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition

spot price, noun: the price of goods, currencies, or securities that are offered for immediate delivery and payment.

((...snip...)) And using the average of the bid and the ask as a "current price" would be much more misleading, by the way

"spot price", and the "bid-ask spread" are real values. I do not understand / why would that be misleading?
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September 18, 2012, 04:21:02 AM
 #205

the "bid-ask spread" are real values. I do not understand / why would that be misleading?

The bid and ask prices are just someone's wishes.  They aren't real because they have never been realized.  If someone was to purchase or sell at one of those "wishful" prices, then it would be realized and become real....the "current price" or the "latest price".

Just like if I was buying a house.  The appraiser values the house 200K you haggle with the seller and buy it at 170K.  Then you get hit with a tax bill on your house with the 200K appraisal.  The first thing you do is call the city and tell them that the house sold for 170K... the real market value and they usually correct it without any problem and you don't get as ripped off on taxes as you might have gotten.  Because 170K is the real value.  The house never sold for 200K.  The only true market price is the price I paid for the house.

I have a few ridiculous low ball offers for shares on GLBSE all the time, but they are just fantasy.  But every once in a while fantasy becomes reality. Cheesy

However, the bid and asks do have useful and relevant info and are important to pay attention to.

Don't tread on bees! http://beesbros.com
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September 18, 2012, 04:22:44 AM
 #206

"spot price", and the "bid-ask spread" are real values. I do not understand / why would that be misleading?

I quite agree. "Spot price" is often considered to be the price at which the last trade was executed. Although this can cause trouble in markets with little liquidity and infrequent activity, as you rightly have observed, since that price may no longer be available for anyone to trade at.

Using the average of highest bid and lowest ask as the "current price" can be misleading in cases when they are far apart. Imagine if the highest bid is at 5 and the lowest ask at 15, and the current price was quoted as 10 ((5+15)/2) - a price which really isn't available for anyone to trade at anyway.

So pick your poison! Cheesy

(However, confusion could be easily avoided in the first place if OgNasty changed the text in OP from "Price per share" to something like "Latest traded price". That would be unambiguous enough, right?)
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September 18, 2012, 04:32:18 AM
 #207

"spot price", and the "bid-ask spread" are real values. I do not understand / why would that be misleading?

I quite agree. "Spot price" is often considered to be the price at which the last trade was executed. Although this can cause trouble in markets with little liquidity and infrequent activity, as you rightly have observed, since that price may no longer be available for anyone to trade at.

Using the average of highest bid and lowest ask as the "current price" can be misleading in cases when they are far apart. Imagine if the highest bid is at 5 and the lowest ask at 15, and the current price was quoted as 10 ((5+15)/2) - a price which really isn't available for anyone to trade at anyway.

So pick your poison! Cheesy

(However, confusion could be easily avoided in the first place if OgNasty changed the text in OP from "Price per share" to something like "Latest traded price". That would be unambiguous enough, right?)

Yeah - average of bid/ask can be horribly off.  It's not unusual to see a share where there's no bids other than at 0.000001 : where some panic seller has sold to every reasonable bid.

Spot is guaranteed to be wrong - as it always represents one end or the other of the active trading range: and that range can be pretty wide.

Best value to use (if it's available through the API) would be 5-day average in my opinion. 
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September 18, 2012, 04:58:47 AM
 #208

Best value to use (if it's available through the API) would be 5-day average in my opinion. 
The best thing to do is just pick 5 day average, or "last price" and just make sure it's named correctly.

It's true that stocks don't have a "current price" because they sell for whatever people value it at. Bid and Ask price are never the actual value because they can be changed easily and may never be executed.
 The "last price" simply shows what a buyer and a seller valued the stock to be worth at the time it was sold. This is the price displayed when you look at stock tickers.


In all cases, I think everyone meant to say "last price." So let's use that.
Or use the 5 day average of "last prices."
cytokine
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September 18, 2012, 04:34:45 PM
 #209

Normally I do not comment publicly with my opinion on various securities, but somehow I feel compelled Smiley

NASTY is undervalued relative to other comparable mining securities. In fact, the pricing of NASTY is precisely what led me to completely shed my GIGAMINING position and move into NASTY shares - a decision which turned out to be correct, as GIGAMINIG fell drastically in value afterwards (I got out at around 1.15/share). NASTY is one of my favorite assets, right up there with COGNITIVE in terms of being one of the few reliable, trustworthy, and value-producing mining offers (that's right, NASTY has produced a strong positive return over and above the rate of simply holding coins, which is quite rare among mining offers.)

That said, it was *slightly* better before when it used GPUMax, but I wholeheartedly agree with the managers decision to not support a business run by a suspected criminal.
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September 22, 2012, 02:32:19 AM
 #210

I've updated the "current price" to say "last price" to remove any confusion.

UPDATE:
Thanks to Nefario adding dividend information to the API, Dividend Yield & P/E Ratio are now completely automated.  I've also added a new automated statistic showing the total number of shares on the market.  In addition to those automated updates, I will be manually updating the newly added Dividends Paid statistic.  When combined with the Coins Mined statistic, shareholders will be able to estimate what the next dividend will be beforehand.

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unthy
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September 22, 2012, 05:53:12 PM
 #211

A dividend of BTC14.3 has been paid.

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unthy
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September 22, 2012, 10:44:59 PM
 #212

Thanks so much. The new stats make sense to me.

... I'm still not sure what you meant earlier when you implied I had some paranoid idea in my head about "omg it's a conspiracy" or whatever. Nothing of the sort. I just thought something seemed off since the numbers didn't add up to my own observations on your security.

NASTY mining is quite nice. Thanks for putting in all the work so far.
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September 22, 2012, 11:20:45 PM
 #213

Another good week!  Just can't wait for the ASICs to be running :-D 
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September 23, 2012, 06:17:27 AM
 #214

I placed another order for a Bitforce Single yesterday.  Hopefully we have it in about 30 days, as it looks like BFL has greatly sped up their delivery times recently.

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unthy
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September 23, 2012, 06:46:06 AM
 #215

BFL BF SC Single or the $149 one?
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September 23, 2012, 06:48:45 AM
 #216

BFL BF SC Single or the $149 one?

The $599 FPGA.

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unthy
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September 24, 2012, 01:48:00 AM
 #217

Will ASIC equipment increase dividends?
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September 24, 2012, 01:50:20 AM
 #218

Will ASIC equipment increase dividends?

Yes, very much so.  We will be going from our current 5,600MH/s to the ordered ASIC 320,000MH/s.

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September 27, 2012, 09:43:13 PM
 #219

The Dividends Paid statistic is now automated.

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September 27, 2012, 09:54:55 PM
 #220

The Dividends Paid statistic is now automated.
Thank you for your effort - I simply love statistics Cheesy

You're welcome.  Thanks for pointing out the Outstanding Shares statistic is available in real time and not just through the dividend API from the previous week.  I'll have that updated soon.

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