ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[minerpumpkin]

Its just very early for next round of questions, and when I see proposed questions, its all about dividends.

Yes, because that's what currently fuels all the fear around here. We don't know when we can expect something again. It's pages upon pages of speculation when, how much, and what percentage will be paid out as dividends. This is, after all, the reason everyone invests. This is why I wrote in the introduction that we don't mean to appear greedy, but there's been so many things going wrong that we need to know what to expect.

As shawshankinmate correctly points out: There's no batch planned, except for the tentative June batch, that "may be cancelled or postponed". We don't even know how many PH/s that batch is supposed to be.

[shawshankinmate37927]

As shawshankinmate correctly points out: There's no batch planned, except for the tentative June batch, that "may be cancelled or postponed". We don't even know how many PH/s that batch is supposed to be.

Sorry if I'm contributing to the confusion, but I don't believe the June batch is tentative.  I believe the 60 PH of chips that are/were in "their final stages of production" is the June batch and I believe that is also the third batch.

1) On the Balance Sheet, approximately how many chips does the current Inventory (Products + Materials + Masks) represent?

A little less than 60P of wafers, most of which are on their final stages of production. The materials consist mainly of lead frames for packaging. The mask is re-usable for years if there are continuing demands for the corresponding wafers.

2) How many months of inventory do you estimate that represents?

Depending on the Bitcoin price. Under this price we expect it to be 1-1.5.

[minerpumpkin]

As shawshankinmate correctly points out: There's no batch planned, except for the tentative June batch, that "may be cancelled or postponed". We don't even know how many PH/s that batch is supposed to be.

Sorry if I'm contributing to the confusion, but I don't believe the June batch is tentative.  I believe the 60 PH of chips that are/were in "their final stages of production" is the June batch and I believe that is also the third batch.

1) On the Balance Sheet, approximately how many chips does the current Inventory (Products + Materials + Masks) represent?

A little less than 60P of wafers, most of which are on their final stages of production. The materials consist mainly of lead frames for packaging. The mask is re-usable for years if there are continuing demands for the corresponding wafers.

2) How many months of inventory do you estimate that represents?

Depending on the Bitcoin price. Under this price we expect it to be 1-1.5.

That batch surely exists and the first chips may even be finished by now. But friedcat was also talking about another batch:

There still are forecast plans for June we haven't paid for. They may be cancelled or delayed to later months according to how fast customers can turn Bitcoin chips to hashing power.

And that, in fact, is somewhat of a mystery batch. Is it the 'original' June batch? Just another further batch? Was the 60 PH/s batch after all a spontaneous one? - There are speculations that FC may have opted to buy free fabrication time with the revenue that was thought to be paid out as the May 27th dividends.

Also: FC originally planned to pay dividends by May 27. I'm surprised that now everyone thinks we won't see dividends after all batches are though (August, September?).

[dmcdad]

Also: FC originally planned to pay dividends by May 27. I'm surprised that now everyone thinks we won't see dividends after all batches are though (August, September?).

The sentiment pendulum swings wide and far on this forum. I suspect we'll see dividends within a month.

[arousedrhino]

Brief Answers to Shareholder Questions

4) When will dividends start, and how frequently will they occur?

When the cash-flow becomes positive. After we decide to put significant quantity of chips on ASICMiner owned farms it should be per week. Before that, per month.

Any updates into where these dates now stand?

I don't know if a lot has changed since then. But is it question-time again?

It hasn't even been a month yet. If you expect an update from FC every 2 weeks then I hate to break it to you but this is not the investment for you. FC speaks when he has news and if he doesn't know the exact date he doesn't set a deadline that he cannot meet. Give the man at least 30 days from that statement to ask for an update, even that I think should not be expected given the way FC communicates.

[ace345]

Has anybody been able to transfer their direct shares to Havelock yet?

[minerpumpkin]

I don't know if a lot has changed since then. But is it question-time again?

It hasn't even been a month yet. If you expect an update from FC every 2 weeks then I hate to break it to you but this is not the investment for you. FC speaks when he has news and if he doesn't know the exact date he doesn't set a deadline that he cannot meet. Give the man at least 30 days from that statement to ask for an update, even that I think should not be expected given the way FC communicates.

Well, I was just trying to be helpful, since the interpretations of FC's dividend mentality seem to run very wild. After his answers on April 21st, everyone asked me to submit followup questions within 3 days.

[necro_nemesis]

Brief Answers to Shareholder Questions

4) When will dividends start, and how frequently will they occur?

When the cash-flow becomes positive. After we decide to put significant quantity of chips on ASICMiner owned farms it should be per week. Before that, per month.

Any updates into where these dates now stand?

I don't know if a lot has changed since then. But is it question-time again?

It hasn't even been a month yet. If you expect an update from FC every 2 weeks then I hate to break it to you but this is not the investment for you. FC speaks when he has news and if he doesn't know the exact date he doesn't set a deadline that he cannot meet. Give the man at least 30 days from that statement to ask for an update, even that I think should not be expected given the way FC communicates.

On this particular question there wasn't clarity. It was left as conditional with a decision point. The question was "when" not what conditions must exist.

[arousedrhino]

Brief Answers to Shareholder Questions

4) When will dividends start, and how frequently will they occur?

When the cash-flow becomes positive. After we decide to put significant quantity of chips on ASICMiner owned farms it should be per week. Before that, per month.

Any updates into where these dates now stand?

I don't know if a lot has changed since then. But is it question-time again?

It hasn't even been a month yet. If you expect an update from FC every 2 weeks then I hate to break it to you but this is not the investment for you. FC speaks when he has news and if he doesn't know the exact date he doesn't set a deadline that he cannot meet. Give the man at least 30 days from that statement to ask for an update, even that I think should not be expected given the way FC communicates.

On this particular question there wasn't clarity. It was left as conditional with a decision point. The question was "when" not what conditions must exist.

He purposefully did not provide clarity on the question since he doesn't have a firm date. If he set a date and missed it you would all bitch then as well, you really cannot win on this forum. No matter what you do someone will bitch and not be happy with it. When FC knows he will announce it, thats how he has worked in the past I don't know why that would change now.

[vortex1878]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

That could even mean divs in the coming week.

I am a bit BTC skint myself atm but I chose to rather borrow money than selling any shares at these ridiculously low levels.
This is no advice. Everybody has to take decisions for himself.

I expect things to happen soon and quickly and big. So quickly that the weak hands won't have time to pull their sales orders on Havelock.

[hdbuck]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

[vortex1878]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

EDIT: No offense. But are you sure you know what determines a positive cashflow?

[hdbuck]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

yea.. production was indeed paid upfront by AM (i.e negative cashflows; no divs).
so what should AM do again to break even before having postive cashflows?

[freedomno1]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

yea.. production was indeed paid upfront by AM (i.e negative cashflows; no divs).
so what should AM do again to break even before having postive cashflows?

Well Friedcat beat Tesla to open source the chip development industry and increase the scale of development
So where mining is going and how decentralized hashrate and pools are addressed will make the next few months interesting.
https://bitcoinfoundation.org/2014/06/13/centralized-mining/
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jun/13/tesla-elon-musk-electric-cars-patent-technology

[vortex1878]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

yea.. production was indeed paid upfront by AM (i.e negative cashflows; no divs).
so what should AM do again to break even before having postive cashflows?

Break even ≠ positive cashflow.

As we both agree that all was mostly paid for, the cashflow should have turned positive pretty soon after the release of the statement - unless there were new expenses for e.g. further batches.

[hdbuck]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

yea.. production was indeed paid upfront by AM (i.e negative cashflows; no divs).
so what should AM do again to break even before having postive cashflows?

Break even ≠ positive cashflow.

thats why i said 'before'

As we both agree that all was mostly paid for, the cashflow should have turned positive pretty soon after the release of the statement - unless there were new expenses for e.g. further batches.

hm well i wouldnt know that. could also take another month to sell it all (or most part of it), hence having positive cashflows.
plus we still dunno if he will retain those generated incomes for further batches.
soo unless franchisees and solomining kicks in..

[vortex1878]

I am not in the mood to argue tonight but I cannot resist:

You will only break even after having positive cashflows.

Peace.

[vortex1878]

Divs will be paid out as soon as the cashflow is positive and fiat was exchanged to BTC. Not when batch x is sold or sth. I wonder why hdbuck came up with that idea...

well, for the cash flow to be positive, FC has to sell the 60 Ph inventory.

Nope. It was already (mostly) paid for at the time of the statement. In addition to that there are progressive payment terms with the customers.

yea.. production was indeed paid upfront by AM (i.e negative cashflows; no divs).
so what should AM do again to break even before having postive cashflows?

Break even ≠ positive cashflow.

thats why i said 'before'

As we both agree that all was mostly paid for, the cashflow should have turned positive pretty soon after the release of the statement - unless there were new expenses for e.g. further batches.

hm well i wouldnt know that. could also take another month to sell it all (or most part of it), hence having positive cashflows.
plus we still dunno if he will retain those generated incomes for further batches.
soo unless franchisees and solomining kicks in..

More cash comes in during defined period than flows out --> positive cashflow.

We also know that retention ratio for Gen4 will be 1/3. I doubt retention for future Gen3 batches would be significant thanks to progressive payment terms with the customers.

The cashflow of AM should already be positive.

[hdbuck]

The cashflow of AM should already be positive.

divs are based on profit. hence, breaking even the whole Gen3 phase

[vortex1878]

The cashflow of AM should already be positive.

divs are based on profit. hence, breaking even with this Gen3 phase.

Yes, a fancy graph you dug out there. What exactly are you trying to tell us?