Congrats, you figured out one of the guys that works in our office. Amazing job! you obviously have no fucking life. Also non of those domains are associated with Joshua, stop making shit up at this point. Do a simple whois check.

Keep it up, post more info about  Alex Singer, or Jake Cohen, or Jim Brown.. Get our Socials and phone numbers and come visit our houses you fucking stalkers.

And come see us in person. It'll never stop us from shipping miners you tard.

Amazing detective work for sure guy.. Give me your address so I can give you a donation.

Invading the personal privacy of our employees is crossing the line.

One of the more technically oriented and knowledgeable members of this thread said something smart over the phone once, its that he understands these products need to be tested and regulated, modified and altered before we take it market. Because taking a bad product market will effect our client's trust in our company and be the ultimate demise of the business in due time. That still, no one has gotten it right and everyone came in later than expected. If we get it right, but are late, at least we're still on track.

Wow I hadn't logged on in a while.

So I just PMed eightcylinders.

We are definitely interested in trading spots if AMT will use this as a way to get us our refund.

So is AMT essentially saying once eightcylinders pays for the spot, they'll cut us a check?


Edit: Wow just noticed I have ~ 4 PMs of offers to buy as well.

Isawhim, you can blab blab blab with your off topic analysis, but you're still wrong. A customer who hasn't received a product yet isn't cooling off, they are an order. What the hell is wrong with you, going to bat over and over for this company to let them screw a customer? Why do so many people here think that these manufacturers should be given a pass for months of delays and lies every time. A business should treat its customers well, at least until they become unbearable. I don't get how people who at least appear to have the ability to make a rational decision just fall so short when it comes to this sort of thing.

I sent this message to Grumpybearsgirl on Feb 1st, as you can see.  I got no response.

While following this thread it has also become clear that Sirminesalot has some kind of relation with Grumpybearsgirl.  The user's intentions are not as pure as they want you to think.  See the unsolicited message below:

That is why I kiss BTC's ass... AMT just happens to be between me and BTC at the moment. I commend them for what they have done, but I am NOT kissing AMT's ass.

Your #1 is just an opinion, not backed by anything other than your own speculation.
Your #2 is just more speculation, obviously from an uninformed resource.

Hi, for any who are yet unconvinced of the legitimate status of AMT, I can attest to it. I ordered an 80GH/s model and got it already. However, I came on this thread to address the 1.2TH/s unit I have yet to receive. I have been keeping up with this thread and even communicating with a staff member, so I understand there have been delays. I will post a full review complete with photos when I receive the other unit in my order.

If AMT reads this, my order is #847. A response of any kind would be appreciated as I have not had contact in a few days now. I understand the difficulties of starting a new business venture, especially in a market like that of cryptocurrencies. I fully support AMT and their efforts in building a business in this field. Trolls and haters are everywhere, but people without that level of fear and insecurity will realize that someone pursuing their own interests should have no effect or impact on anyone else.

Just thought I would put my two cents in. Also I just wanted to reinforce that AMT is legitimate. I can photograph my 80GH/s unit when I have some time, but as I said I am waiting for the other unit to do a full review. And lastly, I just wanted to know the status or any updates on my order #847.

Hope all is well with everyone in the Bitcoin community.

What a joke. Again, if you want to build a good reputation, refund their money. Contact them directly, DON'T POST A PERSONS REAL NAME ON A FORUM!!!! and work it out with the customer. How dumb can you be. Did they post their full name here? You really need to hire someone who knows how to respond to customers.

Thus, not a good reason for a refund...

You knew difficulty was going up... It has never gone down... period. Thus, the reason is truly that "you just want a refund, just because you don't think you will make as-much." Truth be told, it has actually gone up less-fast than ever projected. It is going up fast, these are faster miners!

However, difficulty is actually irrelevant to the situation. Since it applies to EVERY single miner being sold, being made, and in the future being thought-of. With every new THs model added to the network, there are thousands of GHs units removed from the network. We are near a technical limit here now. We used all available magic to create these things. They are not going to get much faster now. Until Aliens develop new technology for us.

End of the day, this miner will make close to 12-25 worth of BTC-value in two years, and again, it does not matter what the price is now. It matters what the price will be when you "cash-out". What will value be in two years? (That is when the reward switches from 25 coins per block to 12.5 coins per block, and this miner will possibly not make enough to cover operation costs at the time, but still produce coins for the future-value still.) On a safe estimate, that would be about $1200 x 2 = $2400. On a real estimate, price is closer to $6000+. On a hopeful-high, it is more like $12,000-$30,000 on a "modest trend".

Assume the worst... $900 per BTC x only 12 BTC = $10,800 Which would be about break-even with power consumption. (Now you know why BTC is so stable at about $900 now. For the new guys, that is about break-even, for the old guys, they can still go as low as $600 obviously. But now they have cashed-out. Which leaves... $900 as a realistic future value.)

Truth of the matter is... You see BTC low, and you would rather take that money back, to buy more BTC. Wouldn't it be interesting if they only gave you back your BTC as the return, since that is what you paid them with. (But I doubt they would do that.) That is exactly why they protected themselves from pull-out investors, the way they did.

You have a chance for a refund, and even gains now. Just got to sell the thing you asked them to create for you, when you made the purchase, after it is delivered. I am sure you can get $12,000 for it, once it is sitting in your hands. I see people have sold BFL's $1,000 units as high as $10,000. So anything is possible.

They don't have to reply here at all. Yet they do.

I fear nothing. I am not kissing any-ones ass. I complained and questioned them, just as everyone-else has. I got my answers, talked to them, and still have to read stupid crap like this in the forum.

What exactly are you looking for? You want a live video-feed from the shop?

They gave us an update. They are coming.

The forum is not where they conduct business. This was a courteous gesture, which was abused, and they rightfully abandoned the crazy troll-thread, initially. Then, they came back, with a PR guy. Who keeps communicating with us. (Then you came and starting trolling the same crap.)

Perhaps you should learn how to be a customer.

1: Buy/Pay
2: Wait
3: Get item

If 3 never happens, then you complain. There is no step between 2-3, where badgering them is a requirement to obtain step 3. Often, it has been my experience that if you do badger anyone, they tend to spit in your burger.

Order #1196 isn't even due for delivery for another week... Asking for a refund before it is even due to be shipped, on a pre-order, is not one of those "situations", few would honor for a refund.

"asking for weeks"... That order is only a few weeks old!

"with our mortgage at risk"... What! That is a poor decision of yourself, if that is your action, buying a pre-order with the HOPE that it will make you money in time to pay a mortgage. You need personal priority adjustment. If you HAD issues with your mortgage, they existed before you made the bad choice to buy a miner. A miner, I might add, that has a break-even (at best), within two months after owning it. If your mortgage is at risk, having gains in the third month wouldn't help much.

But I digress... Don't blame others for your poor decisions, and then attempt to hold them accountable for your poor decisions. They offered us miners, we accepted the terms, and now we are getting our miners.

If you want "off the shelf" equipment, that choice has always been there. Now these will be "on the shelf", and then you can complain how they will not make you rich, and want refunds as bitcoins falls again, or as it rises, so you can get your coins back to trade for more money. That is why all these places NEED irreversible transactions. Because buyers continually try to defraud these places. Again, that was a risk you agreed to, once you hit that SEND or submit button, or made that wire-transfer.

The PR guy is doing a great job. However, he needs to stop replying to obvious trolls, who are demanding answers to stupid questions that don't pertain to him. We don't need you (the troll) speaking for us, we have our own mouths, and have gotten the answers we need. (Even if they are not the answers we want to hear.)

I offered to buy peoples orders directly. No-one took me up on the offer. They had a chance for an instant refund, and passed. So, they must not be too anxious for a refund.

Also, last time I checked, most laws state... "Within 30 days of expected delivery." That is for existing items, where delivery was implicitly stated as a "sure thing". Not for "pre-orders", where it is implicitly accepted that any statement of delivery is an "estimate of expected delivery", thus the term "PRE" before the word "ORDER".

They are not refusing refunds. They are refusing unreasonable requests for refunds, without some kind of valid reason. They have that right, as you have chosen to "give them" money to use, as an "advance", on the creation of an "order" to be "filled in a reasonable time". (Unfortunately, it is not YOU who determines what is "reasonable", it is the LAW. Which, I believe, in most countries, is 30 days beyond expected delivery. That is also in paypal's agreement, and ebay's agreement, and UPS's agreement, and FedEx's agreement, and even your CC's agreement. Which I believe CC's extend to 60 and 90, in some instances, but LAW of consumer-protection rules over most of those aforementioned contracts.)

We would like our money back for Order #1196, as I've said many times before and through countless emails and phone calls.

All of the above being said, it's essentially a toy by comparison to the Bitmine.ch based miners that are soon to be in production. The two guys I've interacted with seem to be very tech savvy dudes, so I don't actually have much worries on the production end, other than supplier issues. Giorgio at Bitmine.ch has confirmed as recently as yesterday that AMT are indeed their American business partners. Their CS has not been stellar either. In fact, the only ASIC company I can say has been totally upfront is Bitmain, and they are doing very well because of it. But the Antminer is not really much better than the HEX16B's in my AMT Steadfast 80, and at least so far, Bitmain has not announced or indicated that they are moving to a lower process node. I do believe that AMT is legit. I think they are rank amateurs in the world of business, and they have done some things in this thread that made them look rather bad, such as offering discounts for positive posts, etc.

Giving me the miner may have been a bad move for them as well, though having somebody review a machine is not uncommon. I hope it's helped them, and I will deliver a much more comprehensive report. I am somewhat biased. I wasn't going into it, but I like these guys. They do very much need to resolve their front of the house issues. We all knew the machines were going to be delayed, since we new they were based on the Coincraft A1, which was delayed. They should have announced this the minute they knew. It's a hard thing to do, since you want to be positive in all things about your business, but it would have allayed a lot of suspicion.

Fortunately, the thread has calmed down a lot. This community treated them poorly, and they responded poorly. I have a thick skin, but I do understand how awful it feels to be blasted before you've even had a chance to perform, and I can understand the desire to hide. But business is not a discipline that allows an emotional response from vendors.

Jim, if you're reading this, I highly suggest you invest in a heavy punching bag and a good CS rep

Yes, people should have paid with credit cards and paypal. However, if they did pay with bitcoin, their recourse is through the courts, not whining on a forum. Nobody ever bothers filing the lawsuit, they just sit around waiting for the magic mining machines to someday appear. Look at all the BFL customers who waited a YEAR for shipment! It doesn't cost much to file in small claims court, you don't need a lawyer, and while it can be difficult, it is not impossible to collect on a judgement.

I said what to do if you paid with something other than a credit card, or did you skip right over that?

AMT you haven't earned any trust, you started things out by being insulting and nasty, deleting your posts, and having to apologize for it. You have a few people who stick up for you because they are afraid if they don't, you will run away with their preorder funds. Instead of asking more people to make preorders, with no chance of refund as you just said, why don't you focus on running a proper business, getting a product shipping, and treating your customers with respect and honesty.

AMT you HAVE to give a customer a refund if they ask on the preorder. Don't worry about what other companies do, most of them are shit. If you don't have the money to refund a few customers who aren't patient, you shouldn't be running this business. There are laws about this, call the FTC and ask them if you can indefinitely keep customer funds for preordered product that you are using to finance your startup business when they ask for refunds...  Don't be another scammer, when a customer wants a refund you give it to them and sell their "spot" to someone else. Anything less makes you suspect. You should not have entered this business without enough financing to secure the product before sales.


Also, people. If you don't get a refund on a product like this, initiate chargeback proceedings with your credit card immediately. If you paid in bitcoin, go to your local courthouse and file a lawsuit in small claims court for the amount you paid. Don't be stupid and wait for someone else to do it for you. Make noise, get noticed, and watch how quickly the company sends you that refund.