Congrats on the re branding! I like it, and as an early adopter I will continue to support this team with using the new and improved Margin.

Leonardo is a well known trading bot for cryptocurrencies. Even the demo version works good enough as analysis software.

However I found this topic in Romanian forum and it looks fishy to me: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3058407.0

First of all the official site of leonardo is http://marginsoftware.de
The one from the thread is http://marginsoftwares.com
Whois data is completely different for the sites, first returns real owner data, second returns hidden owner data.

The pages look identical in both sites with small differences:
official marginsoftware.de
1. pages end up with .html
2. product page has 2 options: buy and demo
3. pricing page has 3 offers: 129$, 249$ and 39$ and the buttons actually work
4. rebranding information is visible on all pages: News: leonArdo is rebranding as margin

fake? marginsoftwares.com
1. pages end up with .php
2. product page has 3 options: buy, demo and try license key
3. pricing page has 3 offers: 89$, 179$ and 29$ and the buttons don't do anything
4. rebranding information is missing

On a closer look I found out that the guy who posted the topic did the same thing in a lot of other boards.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=122290;sa=showPosts

Well there's my problem, without the clear step by step tutorials, I was unable to have a strategy nor did I make any money. I am in the same boat as you are, in the minus.

Cryptocurrency value tracker Coindesk places the value of one bitcoin on January 1, 2017, at the price of $997.69. On December 16 of the same year, it reached $19,343, a near-2,000 percent increase in value.

Hey Jonathan,

Please let us know if this change/switch to margin will be taking place in the next day or two.

I'm interested in purchasing leonArdo but would only want to do so knowing that I can receive the 50% discount on the continued subscription after the free trail. However I would like to look at it tomorrow in detail before making a decision and just want to get a better idea of how soon the launch will be taking place.

Thanks!

I do NOT recommend anyone to buy anything from this developer.

I bought the unlimited edition just a couple of weeks ago FOR 249 USD (my decision was based on their false claims) and all I can have now is just 6 month of supported product. I mean... seriously?

Yes maybe "lifetime support" doesn't literally mean lifetime, but when I invested I chose this product and paid for it based on that information - to get at least 1, maybe 2-3 years of supported product.

What I've got instead, is 6 month of supported product for $249. Integrity? Anyone? You do what, when and how you want and that's ok for you. What you promised just a couple weeks ago is now... well, not valid. You guys lied to me. 

to get at least 1, maybe 2-3 years of supported product.

Where did you read a promise for lifetime UPDATES? If they stated that, you may have a case, otherwise you DO have acquired a lifetime license. You can use your product forever. Yes, yes, APIs can change, the old product won't be updated anymore etc., but that would fit in a "lifetime updates" model.

There's simply almost no business that can survive without either charging for updates, support, or subscription, unless they have a constantly growing user base, which is not the reality. Almost all software that come to my mind fit in one of the models I mentioned.

And calling them "greedy", "misleading", "cheaters" or whatever else you called them is absolutely unfair. First because they didn't break a promise. Second because they listened to the users and offered a very good deal for existing ones. And third, because everyone here who have done business with them, used support etc. know they are extremely honest and decent people.

If i signup for the discount offer,will i loose my remaining free subscription (in my case 6 months) and have to start paying right away ?Just want to make sure.

And IMO for those who r complaining,for the love of god,this is crypto trading we are involving in.We loose money from time to time (and am sure it is a lot more than what u paid for Leonardo) with no compensation at all.Leonardo on the other hand gave u a great compensation, if u decided not to support them anymore,just use there free trail to make back what u paid them and just look for an alternative that suits your needs,plus u will get to keep their original app.
 

Not updates... he's referring to "Lifetime License" as Margin STILL states on their order page, even though they've decided to pivot to a Subscription base. How could anyone think this is not deceiving to unsuspecting new licensees?

When development ceases on a product, an honest developer should be forthcoming and disclose that they are selling you and EOL product license.



My suggestion would be to have a notice or direct link to the press release on the "BUY" page so that people know exactly what they are getting.

How to subscribe to the new offer with discount?
On the website there is still the old offer.

For example when I decided to pay them, I saw a nice button "Be awesome" to pay a maximum amount of $249. And I paid. A couple of weeks ago. But it doesn't look awesome to me now. (Coinigy would give me more than 1 year of subscription for this money.)

If I'd pay $129 I'd still receive the same 6 month on the same plan. No matter I paid $249. How is that fair?

I sent them this email 4 days ago and they don't even bother to reply to me.
So I decided to post it here to let you guys know...
=============================================================

I just read that Leonardo will no longer be supported and you will
change your company name. I must confess that it does not make me feel
very happy and a bit foolish.

You should know that I made the decision to buy your software was for 2 reasons:
1) It was not necessary to pay monthly for support.
2) I expected several features to be added, as you promised me by email.

In both cases, this is not going to happen as I expected. I've read
your answers on the support forum and your attitude towards your
existing customers doesn't seem to be appropriate.

Before I even bought your software, I asked many questions about the
future development of the software. Your team seemed to be in complete
agreement with my feature requests and let me believe that they were
on the roadmap. As I mentioned in a previous email, I still don't use
my license because I was waiting for my applications to arrive one
day, which will never happen. I bought a license to encourage you in
Leonardo's development!

Suddenly changing your business model from a single cost to a monthly
cost shouldn't impact your existing customers in any way. Having
bought Leonardo, I trusted you and I thought I could use this tool for
at least 5 years! Please stop saying that we will be able to use the
old software until the end of time, it is totally absurd because we
are dependent and at the mercy of API updates from trading platforms.
Please, at least don't take us for fools.

That said, I appreciate that you will offer 50% to all existing
customers even if this decision was not initially considered. Although
I can understand that the support and improvement of a software
requires sufficient financial resources, this discount is not enough
and your customers have let you know on the forum. Your hero badge
story is felt like a joke and unnecessary.

Please revise your strategy before it is too late and trust is
completely broken. I still believe in your product and your team.

An existing customer.
=============================================================

Too bad we couldn't stay on with free lifetime subscription and only charge subscription fees to new customers, but I understand the subscription fee might become inaccessible in that case. I'm not unhappy with $15/mo for the standard plan (with discount), I just hope it doesn't go up later.

Do we have to keep a continuous subscription for the 50% discount? Can I pay for one month subscription, take a 1 year break, and still pay the discounted rate when I come back?

You are absolutely right on your comment TOPBILL !!

Imagine those idiots who bought Ultra-lifetime license just a few weeks ago.
I'm one of them.

Some of us, also bought equipment to run leoNardo, like pc, raspbery etc

But don't worry, Mr Jonathan says we can keep leoNardo for life...without exchanges API updates or any kind of support.

...and use it for what ? Trading with my dog ?

Maybe all this time, we were beta testers for the new margin software. Not paid but paying beta testers.

I'm buying software and scripts more than 20 years, never saw such a business tactic before for already customers.

If you want to abandon ship on a product you're still selling and switch to an almost identical product. You'll need to wave the subscription fees to existing customers that paid for your "World class support" and lifetime licenses.

You're making it clear you have no intention on honoring your so-called "World class support" and your lifetime license is now worthless.

Disappointing as it may sound, im sure you guys had to make a hard decision for sustainability.

I just wish you gave us early adopters a better deal moving forward though because I see the new plans to be too restrictive. for most of us at entry level than 3k USD limit is limiting and will heavily depend on BTC to USD value which can swing massively up (preferrably) or down few times within a year.. i mean it's crazy to have to deal with this USD value cap. I mean the free trial and discount is great but perhaps extend that a bit for us small-fry early adopters? say free stage upgrade from starter to standard, that would be reasonable and i'd personally be on board. Standard to Pro offers i believe is fine as it is coz people dealing with that amount of money can definitely afford your subscription fees no problem.


I do wonder about this line though:
"Catastrophic events like what happened in mid January, where a lot of cryptos lost up to 70% of their value, have a huge effect on our revenue."

How did the massive correction affect your revenue when your software isn't taking any % from trades anyway?


Anyway more power to you guys.

sure we can keep it on our HDD for life. Will leonardo is going to further   function   as it does at the moment?   Please, specify this for us.

Well it sure is out of the blue for me.

I just bought 3 weeks ago.  Is a prospective customer seriously supposed to read through a 198 page thread to find that nugget before purchasing to find out they are bait and switched?  I just read it now and find out I paid almost double to most everyone else.  There was absolutely nothing on the website.  I purchased a 'perpetual' license with a website full of plans for the future.

This really feels like a kick in the gut.

I demo'd the product for a while before purchasing.  Found it was a little buggy, crashed daily, but it looked like it had an interesting future and had a committed developer.  There was talk about upgrades with a strategy editor, back testing and support for decentralized exchanges.  All things I wanted, so I figured I'd support the effort and wait to see what emerged.  When I purchased the product I emailed asking about the timeline of these features and was told "We try and push a release every 3-5 week with new features".  Support helped me learn the undocumented right click on the knight to save your strategies so they don't all disappear when it crashes.

I'd been on cryptotrader where the greedy folks there saw me as an annuity rather than a customer, so this was a refreshing change. 

And now three weeks later I discover that all marketing should be untrusted. There will be no more releases, no strategy editor, no decentralized exchanges, and I blew a bunch of money on abandoned software.  They probably won't even fix the bloody tooltips that don't fit in the popups.

Microsoft gives 10 years notice when they are going to discontinue a product.  Here we're told - hey that single update you had, that's it...  ...sucker.

And now three weeks later I discover that all marketing should be untrusted. There will be no more releases, no strategy editor, no decentralized exchanges, and I blew a bunch of money on abandoned software.  They probably won't even fix the bloody tooltips that don't fit in the popups.

Seriously, who DIDN'T see this coming?

I purchased my LeonArdo bot early December 2017.  Jonathan and the team were very upfront about the upcoming changes and that my lifetime purchase NOW would only apply to this particular program, not the one they were working on.

I'm cool with that.  Hell, Microsoft and Apple charge for software release changes, games and their ever growing sequels you have to buy..... Fricking DLC.....buy.  Everyone does it.  It's nothing new.
I will be upgrading, probably not straight away, but I will definitley try the new software for sure!

We have had an introductory offer on leonArdo for over 2 years now and in order to be able to provide the best possible service and to improve leonArdo with lots of new features and markets we need to end it and find a new business model going forward. This will allow us to hire new team members to add to our team of 8 people and will ensure the survival of leonArdo.

Until we figure out the best business model for us over the long term, from this Friday (22nd Dec) leonArdo will be priced as follows:

Hi,

I just looked over your demos and do not see the option to paper trade with leverage (margin trading)

Is there a reason?



Thanks