definetly a winner hense the

each country is different. in the UK bitcoins are being treated like assets.
EG pieces of artwork, (personal possessions with a store of value), your car.

lets say you won the olympics. you received a gold medal worth $2000 of gold. until you sold that medal, you dont pay tax on holding the medal. same as a painting etc.

check with your tax office. they are not there to whip you at every turn, they are always approachable and can explain things. most tax accountants even give away a free first hour consultation.. so abuse that too.. get a list of 5 local tax accountants. go to each, ask your questions and when the time is up, go to the next accountant.

is smells like you have not read the reports or know what fincen actually is...

try researching them..

they only care about FIAT and can only control the flow of FIAT in BANK ACCOUNTS. the whole 'virtual currency' term is about the digital dollar on computer screens/database tables of liberty exchange, bitstamp etc which represents / is a "convertable virtual currency" of the actual dollar in their bank account. nothing to do with bitcoin balances of those companies or of blockchain.info, bitcoin-qt, armory, etc, etc.

the sooner people get their head out the sand that fincen/FSA etc can only control the FIAT. and not scare monger about bitcoin dying.. the sooner the people can create legitimate fiat exchange platforms.


the government only tax FIAT you have, so it will only affect bitcoins when you put it into fiat. just like the last 100+ years. if you buy a piece of artwork they dont request 20% of the painting to be ripped from its frame as tax.. they wait for you to sell it. and then tax you on the FIAT

i have an idea to reduce fee's for UK pub's which is still in development. but at the moment the important thing is that pubs get 100% fiat return + extra.

compared to credit/debit cards which leaves them at a loss.

yes its at a cost of a little extra bitcoin to customers. but then again with bitcoin UK being early days still. its the convenience that matters.

atleast we are not paying 10,000btc for 2 pizza's. so its not that bad. but things will get better

i been telling people on the other threads for the last month fincen is american and only interested in american money.

thy have about as much power regulating bitcoin as they have regulating the heat production of a toaster oven made in taiwan.

fincen dont care about health and safety of food preparation machines. all they care about is the FIAT in bank accounts

when reading the european banks/fincen reports. it no where says that authorities want to regulate bitcoin. (hopefuly a few smart people read that too and not just took forum post summaries as gospel)

its not their financial products, its not in their remit. and its not in their interest.

what is in their interest is the gateways between their financial product (fiat) and bitcoin, and if they had a 100% solution to crime risks involved around digital transmission of both money and bitcoin. they would see bitcoin actually helps them, which some of the authorities have already noted

this particular thread is great britain. although theres nothing stopping you starting a new topic.


im still trying to work it out. im in the south west and there isnt much action here.

theres a couple other people who have formed 'groups' in area's like manchester, london, birmingham. but a few of them seem to just be social gatherings rather then business networking.

i personally am looking more for the business networking groups, although social gatherings are a bonus.

no matter what country you are in Maco, im pretty sure if you start a thread mentioning your location you will soon find some like minded people

ok ill take this on as an example of the savvy thing to do

buyng 1k at the end of 2011, id trade bitcoin hard for a week and cash back out within the last 24 hours of the financial year end. withdrawing only 1k. leaving the profits in bitcoin. making financial year end 2011 - flat, no profit/no loss

then day 1 of 2012 financial year id put that 1k back in and trade like crazy all year round. then in the last few hours of financial year 2012 id cash out 1k - again flat for 2012.

then day 1 of 2013 financial year id put that 1k back in and trade like crazy and cash out 1k. i would then go on vacation. buying a cheap rate flight. no suitcases, no extra's.. just a £30 cheap flight to spain.. once in spain check out the local-bitcoins.com website and swap my bitcoin PROFITS for euros. buy myself a hotel room and some nice clothes. and live a happy life on vacation for a few weeks.

once back home i decide do i spend that 1k on real life stuff or put it back into bitcoin to add more bitcoins to my nxt vacation pot. remembering to cash out 1k before year end to stay profit/loss flat

fail.
based on a 10 minute timeframe the total 21mill bitcoins will be found beyond 2200, but the dates at which the block reward decreases to such a small amount of satoshi's per block to even be worthy of mining, will come sooner

but before we get to that lets address the quoted fail..

lets say based on todays difficulty. a number of ASICS far surpass the estimate of the last difficulty increase and so blocks are now found in 9 minutes or less.. the next change will push the difficulty to a 12 minute rate per block solution to ensure that the solving of blocks stay on their 4 year half life cycle.
and lets say there was a period where miners never exceeded the estimate. then the difficulty would not increase. it would stay the same or decrease, ensuring that at the end of the 4 year the allotment of coins for that 4 year period were rewarded.

what you will find is that in 2037 each 10 minute reward would be worth 1 satoshi meaning unless extra decimals are added, the end would be 2141 for reward mining. even though there is still only 20,999,999 btc in existence (not quite finished).

alot of miners will think its time to end mining in 2029-2033 when the reward moves from just over 1.5btc to 0.7812500 per 10 minutes but thats because they are basing the profitability etc on todays value and hypertheticals

many views, many idea's but im not much of a public face. (bad voice and ugly) so ill stick to text comments and suggestions.

the UK population seem a little smarter then the US counterparts. where for instance the "we use coins" video states that bitcoins are virtually fee free, instant, blah blah. are not actually fully true statements to make.

the main view of bitcoin in the UK is that with "faster payment" scheme UK banks offer, bitcoin does not give much benefit for wire transmitting to other UK residents or Euro residents. unlike bitcoin requiring 10 minute minimal confirm time, i have wire transferred many thousands of pounds to other UK banks in under 30 seconds.

the other view is that if i wanted to send £500 from lands-end to john o'groats. finding someone in lands end to convert £ to BTC incur's an above market value fee due to the guy on local-bitcoins.com or #bitcoin-otc-uk wanting to make a couple % profit. and the same again at the other end. also sending the coin itself may incur a transaction fee. thus turning  £500 into a £490 on just 1% profit at each end (but in reality and experience is more like 2%-5% (£470 receipt))

as for mining, electricity costs being double that of the US, this makes the UK priced out of profit mining anything. especially if you begin looking at the cheaper deals the US get on GPU equipment compared to the UK retail/2nd hand ebay market.

i have not talked about the whole banking/FSA/Tax as a negative thing, because, chats from talking to all of these departments has show me in actual fact bitcoin is not a negative thing to worry about.
now thats the short and sweet of the negatives.. my views on the positives and the ways bitcoin can benefit the country is a much longer story. but i will just title the idea's below for now
credit unions
teentrepreneurs (teenage entrepreneurs)
sending money abroad
contracts and loans
store of wealth
holiday travel money
retail
manufacturing
and much more

http://blockchain.info/charts/transaction-fees

about 31btc in fees went through in the last 24 hours with 144 blocks a day it works out as about 0.2BTC per block average.

to me once you spread it out between 100's of workers it does not represent much of an incentive, which leads on to the point of is transaction fee's really that important right now or are they just irritating people that want to send small amounts.

afterall its less then 1% of the block reward, knowing how pools work the workers probably wont even see a +1% increase in payout due to fee's.

i personally think fee's should come out when bitcoin is worth $1000 each and the block reward is under 6.125BTC

my brainwallet will be literally "i invoke my right to silence" with 0.001btc inside

so where they think i am saying i won't tell... im actually telling them.. their just not listening.

but thats all hyperthetical and a comedy moment for you armchair youtube anarchists. that think the world is out to get you at every turn.

in reality unless you personally are doing something illegal you have nothing to fear

(note: what i say next is not legal advice, just a tip)
stick to the under 1k FIAT per person per day rule and localbitcoins, bitcoin otc will have no issues as there no ID required and no regulation, as its classed as personal transactions not business transactions

can all the sofa anarchists please stop it now.

fincen do not control the australian dollar, the yen, the euro, the pound, the rupee, etc etc. they only control the american dollar.

so get your head out of the sand.. fincen only want to regulate the FIAT which places like liberty reserve, bitstamp, mtgox, bitinstant, etc touch.. because its dollars and it involves bank accounts.

they cannot stop bitcoin nor do they want to.

so i personally say. let them control the bank accounts of FIAT to ensure teentrepreneurs (teenage amateur entrepreneurs) with no finance experience dont attempt to open exchanges without licences which ends up with them running off with other peoples FIAT cash.

and leave bitcoin to be free

the simple path.. allow the banks /governements to regulate the bank account holders of FIAT. which includes liberty reserve and other FIAT handling exchanges that are within bitcoin community(as the FIAT has to sit in an account somewhere)

but to leave pure bitcoin users alone.

fincen only control US dollar. they do not control EURO, australian, japanese, UK FIAT.. so dont even give them the opportunity to control bitcoin

lol

let the banks regulate the fiat, and freeze accounts of child pornographers. leave the rest of us legit people to send bitcoins to each other without red tape.

i cant wait to be fully free of a bank account, even if i dont have any worries of my accounts being frozen

banks are not too big to jail. just well placed to do the actions of the account holders. namely government offices.

banks only receive money and send money. its the account holders that meant to go to jail for commiting crimes and a bank would be responsible if they were aware of the actions of the account holder, but not preventing it.

but what if the account holder was the department of defense selling jets to iraq under the orders of president obama as part of their developing relationships aiding iraq to set up their own police/defenses before removing the US soldiers out

it would read like this
Account holder: Barrack obama transfer 500million from saudi arabia (iraq new president off shore account)
products involved: ak-47, jet fighters, missile launchers.

what would the banks do? they have authorisation to let the money through, from the president. so the banks wont be jailed

if you deal with fiat and dont deal with regulation expect your bank account to be frozen.. .. but..only deal with bitcoin. they cant touch you.

fincen only care about fiat and bank accounts..

its not taking away any business from banks. when you put fiat into a payment gateway such as paypal. it sits in a bank account. banks love this as in the middle of the night they can play with your money on the stock markets making their profits in the miliseconds of the days. and you are unaware of this.

but putting fiat into an envelope to then send to another country does not allow the banks the same pleasure of playing with your money. so by bitcoin being the border crossing exchange changes this:

person A take money out of bank -> places in envelope -> send to another country -> poof bank note never seen by a bank again

into this
person A does bank wire to exchange in the same country -> money remains in the country -> bitcoins go where they want -> but fiat money still sits in the bank accounts of the same country

the only thing banks dont like is having to freeze accounts while DOJ/SOCA investigate it. because then even banks cant play with the money when its frozen. so do the banks a favour.. read the regulations about FIAT in your country, follow them and you will see that there is no big deal bitcoin related


again fincen is not after bitcoin people. they are after FIAT traders that are not licenced. the words virtual currency which they wish to regulate are the digital forms (virtual, not physical) of bank notes

worrying about the minute by minute high price changes will make your hair turn grey.

put into the prospective of the low price added to a chart and you instantly see its not as bad a scene as you first think.



the low price is what i use for the bases of natural growth.. the high price is pure speculation and profiteering.. so going by that logic i still see a healthy slow rise in the monthly price

(until the moment someone reads this and gets angry that i have cooled down the panic. and goes about on a crusade to dump the price on purpose)