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Author Topic: Martin Armstrong Discussion  (Read 626813 times)
TPTB_need_war
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September 20, 2015, 06:09:05 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2015, 07:13:07 PM by TPTB_need_war
 #681

Help me stereotype.

American (USA)I Did It My Way.
BritishSpot of a bother, how about a cup of tea?
FrenchSoufflé à la crème.[1]
GermanMy steadfast orderly orderliness.[2]
ItalianViva romántico!
SpanishFiesta, siesta, dinner at midnight.[3]

[1] And off with their heads if our Marxist paradise goes awry and end up with the same again.

[2] Regardless how it has gone awry, it steadfastly must be followed to its million eugenics end game.

[3] Immigrant peasant laborers working the fields.

It is clear that the Americans have the most disrespect for class structure and authority (perhaps the Aussies at par but seems they retained too much of their heavily British influence). Even the Brits love status and orderly class structures. This European tradition of admiring authority stems from the various empires such as Rome, then the Vikings, then Spain, and finally England (France in competition). Germany is still trying, lol. Ditto China, empires, and admiration of authority. This may also explain the laziness (laid back, longer vacations, shorter work weeks, more time for culture and idealistic nonsense, more guilt and thus embrace of multiculturalism) of Europeans.

This is probably why the USA is one of the few states remaining in the world where the government could only confiscate guns from millions of cold dead hands.

The concept of authority and centralization of decision making power is so alien to me as I identify more as native being than as a person of European ancestry. This probably explains why I didn't always get along well with my relatives who were more into admiring social status. They never did quite understand me. I am the quintessential American of yore, cut from the chord of Thomas Paine or my ancestor Isaac Shelby.

I don't feel any guilt about what some of my ancestors did with slavery. They were not me and I am not them. The quintessential American of yore believes so much in the power of individualism that the errs of the past are not be idolized in either form (guilt nor admiration). The Europeans appear to be still caught lying to themselves that they want their cake and eat it too (i.e. they admire the benefits of imperialism yet want to pretend it can be all love and nirvana). The dependence on the excesses of imperialism is for example what retarded Spain's incentive to industrialize and thus set them back 400 years and they declined from the greatest world empire to a third world country! Amazingly I wrote the above on my own intuition then after writing the above, I found that Wikipedia supports my intuition:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Empire#The_Spanish_Habsburgs:_The_Sun_Never_Sets_.281516.E2.80.931700.29

Quote
Matters began to change in the 1520s with the large-scale extraction of silver from the rich deposits of Mexico's Guanajuato region, but it was the opening of the silver mines in Mexico's Zacatecas and Potosí in Upper Peru (modern-day Bolivia) in 1546 that became legendary. During the 16th century, Spain held the equivalent of US$1.5 trillion (1990 terms) in gold and silver received from New Spain. Ultimately, however, these imports diverted investment away from other forms of industry and contributed to inflation in Spain in the last decades of the 16th century: "I learnt a proverb here", said a French traveler in 1603: "Everything is dear in Spain except silver". This situation was aggravated by the loss of much of the commercial and artisan classes with the expulsions of the Jews (1492) and Moriscos (1609). The vast imports of silver ultimately made Spain overly dependent on foreign sources of raw materials and manufactured goods

The wealthy preferred to invest their fortunes in public debt (juros), which were backed by these silver imports, rather than in production of manufactures and the improvement of agriculture. This helped perpetuate the medieval aristocratic prejudice that saw manual work as dishonorable long after this attitude had started to decline in other west European countries.

I see frivolous yet extremist (even pompous) idealism in mainland Europe. The grandiose culture of imperialism lingers in Freudian dysfunction in Europe.

Interestingly the Brits managed their colonies by using the locals to do it for them and they had the smallest armies relying on the English Channel and the largest Navy, thus again we see the culture of the Brits of being more isolationist and less moved to drastic action. They want to get the results with the least effort. In fact, I encountered this British trait recently with the author of the Confidential Compact Transactions white paper. I was trying to get him to work with me back in June, but we just couldn't identify with each other on the level of effort versus the level of guaranteed reward. I just fling myself into it. Brits are much more calculating and cautious and want a certain large ROI. This explains why Americans are always going to statistically (after many failures) overall kick butt on the Brits in terms of entrepreneurialism. Americans are risk takers. We sailed across the ocean to reach the new World!

P.S. It will be interesting to see if Chinese can overcome English's momentum as the common language of international business.

Also this article from the perspective of a French lady shows how different the culture of Latin America is from Europe in terms of the woman's role. I remembered I was bothered by the staring too. By now I have learned to laugh. European women are married to this concept of egalitarianism as a natural right. This is some Frankenstein invention of culture that results from being able to conquer the world and live beyond your means. In a very competitive environment, sorry females are more productive producing male offspring. This is reality and Europe will have an ideologically difficult time adjusting to the reality coming.

Also note the differences in sequential versus synchronicity cultures.

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TPTB_need_war
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September 20, 2015, 06:13:54 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2015, 07:11:07 PM by TPTB_need_war
 #682

By your logic, there is no science because nothing can be determined. Planck's constant, the speed-of-light, the Heisenberg principle, and the Shannon-Nyquist sampling theorem all tells us that objective reality would only exist at infinite samples, but I have explained ad nauseum that if the speed-of-light was infinite (and thus Planck's constant infinitesimal) then the past would collapse into the present and nothing could possibly exist because there would be no relative perspective. You must have Ying to have Yang.

I am not going to go further into this with you now. Our universe is relativistic. This means reality is in the eye of beholder. Relativistic determinism exists at differing perspectives.

Again by your oversimplification, the sun wouldn't certainly rise tomorrow and no science could ever be tested and trusted.

Note from the perspective our humans, we all share the perspective of the reliability of the sun, but from the perspective of the Milky Way galaxy, I am confident the sun is quite a chaotic blip.

There's a whole bibliography of Physics behind this conversation and I can accept that you have a lot under your arms now to address certain scientific theories that will make you understand my point of view (clearly it's a bit confusing, even for someone like you). Other than that, I pretty enjoy such conversations with people who can understand what they're talking about. So pause it is. Smiley


Well the Greeks are known for being extremely hard-headed, that doesn't mean you are correct. And properly refuting you is going to take more effort and time than I want to put into this right now. I entirely disagree with your characterization above. (this doesn't mean I don't appreciate your efforts, sentiments, etc in other areas, I simply disagree with you on the science of chaos and relative determinism. You also in private can't seem to agree my M.S. stems from gut dysbiosis and you believe the crap they are teaching you at the university instead)

My simplest, best attempt would be to tell you again that just because there is indeterminism introduced in the microstates (i.e. that thermodynamics/entropy is not reversible), this says nothing about relative determinism in the macrostates relative to the perception manifested.

The fundamental matter of the universe is cyclical. Chaos can be viewed merely as the inexorable expansion of entropy interleaved with (layered within) the cyclical matter of the universe (the future rhymes with the cyclical past but is never an exact copy). Thus the strange attractor. As Armstrong has stated, "we are truly interconnected". He discovered the similar insight that I did. He apparently discovered it empirically and I discovered in my mind with some inspiration from other theoretical physics discoveries.

You are not factoring in the fact that perception is resonance for example. Without any cyclical repetition, i.e. patterns, nothing would be perceived. What is chaotic alone is statistically deterministic in the aggregrate, otherwise we'd have no macro state. A proper interpretation of Schrödinger’s Cat thought experiment applies in spades[1].

To review all the literature and formalize this (as much of it has already been done by others) is much more than I can possibly add to my plate right now.

[1] The point Eric makes is that a macro state such as the Cat can't exist without decoherence. Thus it can never exist in both states. There is an example of the determinism.

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September 20, 2015, 06:24:32 PM
 #683

Well the Greeks are known for being extremely hard-headed [...]

This is nothing but an urban myth. I refute your theory presenting facts:

PS: On the above picture it's me at the age of 20. Grin

Chaos could be a form of intelligence we cannot yet understand its complexity.
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September 20, 2015, 07:23:25 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2015, 07:54:45 PM by TPTB_need_war
 #684

I haven't done any research regarding the comparative rate of unemployment between Europe and the East but it's irrelevant to this matter because: when you need more labor to produce a given result, it's actually very bad. The incentives to improve were on Asia's side, but they didn't.

You are not considering all the variables. Your view is too simpleton.

Of course the end result was bad after over the hundreds of years that Asia fell behind the West in terms of industrialization. In that sense it was defeating and China ended up killing 57 million in a Cultural Revolution to deal with the adverse effects of the inefficiencies and further retarding their economic development. But now they've suddenly started to catch up, because they had no choice. And they offered the release value for the Westerners to be able to continue to live the high life with the least effort.

But over the 1000 or so years that it worked for China, it was because it provided social harmony. Rice production requires communal irrigation and thus very strong local social integration, sharing, and harmony. This is why the Chinese are innately collectivist and into political connections as a method of production.

You are not factoring in the geography of China. China can't be attacked from the West, only from the North (and of course Japan from the East), and thus the Great Wall. China was mostly isolated from the rest of the world by the Himalayan mountain ranges. It is impossible to run military supply lines over those mountain ranges. Thus it was sheltered from the relative competition, until finally in the modern era it no longer is and had to open up because the Chinese people could see on TV what they were missing.

Not incorporating geography[1] and all factors leads simpletons to their Dunning-Kruger behavior.

And I assure you I could refute all your other statements resoundingly, but I don't have time to devote to this.

I suggest you do more studying. And open your mind to many more variables than you are considering before you jump to erroneous simpleton conclusions.


[1] Don't forget my up thread point about the USA having the most ideal geography in the world for physical trade being bissected by navigable from North-to-South Mississippi River and having coasts on both Atlantic and Pacific. This advantage will fade as we grind into the Knowledge Age with localized production with 3D printing.




I address a few real quickly...

When you produce something efficiently that means that there is labor available to produce something else in the economy (a nascent new market) and that the output is cheaper so their is savings available to buy the products of the nascent new market. It's not bad, it's good.

Not at all. You follow Karl Marx in that you focus only on the labor value of an economy. You could have only 20% of the population producing 80% the GDP (most efficiently) and that wouldn't necessary make the rest of the people in the country more productive. They may instead become wards of the State. Saudi Arabia is perhaps an example.

Chineses and Europeans both lived in squalor because they where, as the whole wold, under a Malthusian economic reality (GDP per capita stagnant despite growth in GDP), until Europe starts to escape the Malthusian trap because of its creativity.

You've made no point.

Also Armstrong's chart that you have posted is misleading because it makes a comparison based on the GDP and not the GDP per capita. Under the Sung dynasty (from 950 to 1250) GDP per capita was higher in China than in Europe, but after China GDP per capital stop improving and soon Europe took the lead on that metric (the only relevant one).

GDP per capita is not the relevant statistic on which region becomes the next financial capital of the world. In fact, the very high GDP per capita of Europe is precisely what is enabling this dysfunctional outcome which I somewhat explained in my prior post about cultural stereotypes.

Europe's population is much higher now than it was then before the Black Death, so there wasn't any Malthusian check.

Europe's population right after the Black Death was much lower than before, so there was a Malthusian check.

Ahem. Do you not see your error in logic?

Mathusians claim the natural resources can't support a greater population. Yet the population is now higher than it was and we are not mining resources from outside planet Earth.

Please I am not going to respond any more to people who have such poor logic skills that I will end up in noisy nonsense.

The resource problems are always due to Coasian barriers (to human innovation and expansion of the entropy in the human economy) and there has never been and never will be a Malthusian point of truth. I wrote an essay about this:

http://unheresy.com/Information%20Is%20Alive.html

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September 20, 2015, 08:00:27 PM
 #685

To address your assumption of German = Order. Before the first world war (and still being a very young state) 'Made in Germany' was associated with mass produced crap- not necessarily orderliness and organisation. Thus cultures can change (albeit within a few generations with correct incentives). Perhaps that innate flexibility and motivation has been forever lost with multiple generations of nannystate, marxist emasculation throughout most of the west though. It has been over 30 years since Britain bought (whole-heartedly) into leftist rhetoric, so I hold some hope for my country of origin still. Even if by many measures David Cameron is Tony Blairs true successor.

I agree about the white guilt though. I believe it was 2% of the American population that even owned slaves, many other whites were conscripted by state law to hunt slaves- I imagine they were not fond of the immoral institution, seeing as it wasted their time and undercut their labour to boot. White guilt coveniently forgets that anti-slavery movements originated in old honkey Britain. Guilt or pride for actions you did not commit is simply an indulgence in ego or self flagellation- the bread and butter of modern political correctness and liberal cynicism.




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TPTB_need_war
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September 20, 2015, 08:00:55 PM
 #686


Only because the US stock market is weak waiting for the downgrades and contagion in Europe and Japan to gain enough momentum to send the stampede of capital into the USA. Be patient grasshopper, Oct 1 is laying the ground work...remember Oct 1 is the BIG BANG for the kickoff, not the finale.

I don't have time to dig for my post up thread where I wrote the market would drive the interest rates higher (the Fed isn't in control) when it stampedes out of bonds into US stocks.

Martin Armstrong has just repeated all my points (again I write what he is going to write before he writes it):

http://www.armstrongeconomics.com/archives/37256

Quote from: Martin Armstrong
Yellen Is Trapped in the Worst Nightmare Ever

Yellen has inherited a complete nightmare. Thursday’s decision to delay yet again the long-awaited liftoff from zero interest rates is illustrating that the world economy is totally screwed. There is a lot of speculation about why the Fed seems so reluctant to “normalize monetary policy”. There are of course the typical domestic issues that there is low inflation, weak wage gains in the face of strong job growth, a hike will increase the Federal deficit and then there is the argument that corporations that now have $12.5 trillion in debt. All that is nice, but with corporate debt, our clients are locking in long-term at these levels, not funding anything short-term. Those clients who have listened are preparing for what is to come unlike government which has been forced to shorten the average duration of their debts blind to what happens when rates rise, which will be set in motion by the markets – not Yellen.

Fed is really caught between a rock and a very dark place. Yes, they have the IMF and the world pleading with them not to raise rates for it will hurt other debtors who borrowed excessively using dollars to save money. The Fed is also caught between domestic policy objectives that dictate they MUST raise rates of they will bankrupt countless pension funds and international where emerging markets will go into default because commodities have collapsed and they have no way of paying off this debt that has risen to about 50% of the US national debt.
By avoiding the normalization of interest rates (hikes), the Fed has encouraged government to spend far more than they realize because money is cheap. This will eventually light the fire under the economy helping to fuel the Sovereign Debt Crisis. There appears to be no hope for the Fed and they will be forced to raise rates only when they see asset inflation in equities. Then they will have no choice. This is the worst possible mess and the longer they have waited to normalize interest rates, the worst the total crisis is becoming for they will have zero control over the economy and once that is seen, holy Hell will break lose.



To address your assumption of German = Order. Before the first world war (and still being a very young state) 'Made in Germany' was associated with mass produced crap- not necessarily orderliness and organisation.

You conflated orthogonal issues. The Germans didn't change culture, they just weren't good at manufacturing yet.

I agree about the white guilt though. I believe it was 2% of the American population that even owned slaves, many other whites were conscripted by state law to hunt slaves- I imagine they were not fond of the immoral institution

Your European interpretation of my statements makes me chuckle. You missed my point. I don't care even if every damn American was doing slavery gleefully, I still wouldn't feel guilty. I am not my ancestors. Europeans are so into their guilt with imperialism.



Therefore higher European real wages are not the caused of Industrialization since they are its consequences.

I don't have time to teach someone of your intellectual handicap right now. Sorry.

I already explained that the owners of farms had no incentive to industrialize because labor was too plentiful before the Black Death and thus it was cheaper to use labor than to use any hypothetical industrialization or technical improvement (that couldn't have existed otherwise).

If you can't wrap your mind around that very simple point, then I am sorry I don't have time for you. I'd prefer you shut up (because you are cluttering the threads with noise), but I can't force you too.

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September 20, 2015, 08:03:06 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2015, 08:17:32 PM by BldSwtTrs
 #687

You are not considering all the variables. Your view is too simpleton.
Dude, it's you who thinks a disease is the cause of the divergence between the East and the West and can explain 800 years of world history.
Quote
Of course the end result was bad after over the hundreds of years that Asia fell behind the West in terms of industrialization. In that sense it was defeating and China ended up killing 57 million in a Cultural Revolution to deal with the adverse effects of the inefficiencies and further retarding their economic development. But now they've suddenly started to catch up, because they had no choice. And they offered the release value for the Westerners to be able to continue to live the high life with the least effort.

But over the 1000 or so years that it worked for China, it was because it provided social harmony. Rice production requires communal irrigation and thus very strong local social integration, sharing, and harmony. This is why the Chinese are innately collectivist and into political connections as a method of production.
Real wage are 100% determined by the labor productivity(1), if real wages were higher in Europe than Asia, that means labor was more productive in Europe than in Asia.

If labor was more productive in Europe than in Asia, that means that Europe had already started its industrialization (2).

Therefore higher European real wages are not the caused of Industrialization since they are its consequences.

You can only refute this reasoning if you deny (1) and (2), but (1) and (2) an economic truth. If you don't understand why, then you have some learning to do.
Quote
I suggest you do more studying. And open your mind to many more variables than you are considering before you jump to erroneous simpleton conclusions.
I suggest you to stop having such a materialistic view of humans and history, and to learn more about economics.

Quote
[1] Don't forget my up thread point about the USA having the most ideal geography in the world for physical trade being bissected by navigable from North-to-South Mississippi River and having coasts on both Atlantic and Pacific. This advantage will fade as we grind into the Knowledge Age with localized production with 3D printing.
I don't say that environmental factors (such as disease or geography) don't have an impact. But they aren't the main driver of history, the main driver of history is the culture.



When you produce something efficiently that means that there is labor available to produce something else in the economy (a nascent new market) and that the output is cheaper so their is savings available to buy the products of the nascent new market. It's not bad, it's good.

Quote
Not at all. You follow Karl Marx I see. You could have only 1% of the population producing all the GDP and that wouldn't necessary make the rest of the people in the country more productive. Saudi Arabia is perhaps an example.
What I have said is 100% correct, there is no question about that. You should read this book to understand why: http://www.amazon.com/Economic-Sophisms-Fr%C3%A9d%C3%A9ric-Bastiat/dp/1452856095
I don't see why you are talking about Marx at all.

If you don't get what I have written that means you don't understand basic economics and I cannot help you, only you can make the work needed. I will re-quote myself with slight clarification because there is nothing more to say on that subject:
When you produce a product more efficiently (by saving labor) that means that there is labor available to produce something else in the economy (a nascent new market) and that means the product is cheaper on the marketplace (because prices converge to costs in a free market, and since there is less labor needed to produce the same result, the cost and price drop) so there is increase savings available in the pocket of customers (its cheaper to buy the product) which allows them to buy the products of the nascent new market.
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September 20, 2015, 09:08:25 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2015, 10:06:43 PM by BldSwtTrs
 #688

Europe's population is much higher now than it was then before the Black Death, so there wasn't any Malthusian check.

Europe's population right after the Black Death was much lower than before, so there was a Malthusian check.

Ahem. Do you not see your error in logic?

Mathusians claim the natural resources can't support a greater population. Yet the population is now higher than it was and we are not mining resources from outside planet Earth.
Europe escape the Malthusian trap some times before the Industrial Revolution. Nobody is claiming that Europe is still under Malthusian constraints. Hone your reading skills before worrying about my logic skills.
Quote
Please I am not going to respond any more to people who have such poor logic skills that I will end up in noisy nonsense.
Yeah focus on something where you  actually have a clue like coding or computer sciences.
Quote
The resource problems are always due to Coasian barriers (to human innovation and expansion of the entropy in the human economy) and there has never been and never will be a Malthusian point of truth. I wrote an essay about this:
I don't think you understand why I bring Malthus in the discussion. But whatever.

No need to insult me in MP as I don't care about what you think of me. But I am shocked someone of your gorgeous intellect (Cheesy) can be as petty as that.

Quote
I already explained that the owners of farms had no incentive to industrialize because labor was too plentiful before the Black Death and thus it was cheaper to use labor than to use any hypothetical industrialization or technical improvement (that couldn't have existed otherwise).
That's a nice story. That's a shame real wages fell in the aftermath of Black Death  Cheesy

https://mpra.ub.uni-muenchen.de/15748/

Reread my point on real wages and in the process learn some economics: Real wages are 100% determined by the labor productivity over the long run.

Quote
I don't have time to teach someone of your intellectual handicap right now. Sorry.
Nooooooooooooo. Please, please teach me grand master!
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September 20, 2015, 10:07:12 PM
Last edit: September 21, 2015, 03:06:59 AM by TPTB_need_war
 #689

I don't think there is a finer example of the differences between Europe and the USA than to watch this video of Elvis Presley in 1968. If you make it to the 25 minute point you will get a special treat:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QlliHSRh0A

(I wonder how many votes Clinton got due to his facial structure and mouth resemblance to Elvis)

Dean Martin had that look also (and Johnny Carson resembles POTUS Bush Jr) and he was performing around that same time the music that my grandparents were listening to (as they hadn't racially integrated with the blacks):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9yAFE2ccPs
(this music sounds better to me now than when I was in my youth, as I am now the age my grandparents were when they were listening to this)

In 1965 (year I was born) as Elvis was declining, the Beatles (who were inspired by Elvis) visit Elvis and inspire him to comeback which culminates in above 1968 comeback.

Robert Plant of the British rock band Led Zeppelin explains that Elvis was the source of most of the music creativity coming out of England:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP-zcXtiXhA

So this is why I say this is a fine example of the American melting pot where we not into guilt and collectivist crap, and instead just grabbing the creativity of the moment irregardless of color, creed, etc.. For example, here is the type of people Elvis might have been drawing inspiration from in the Mississippi "delta" (as Plant said):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFh-JqxvgMw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXZLgJJ7bhQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fa-OhPN3qU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sfl9KUBGQg

Here is Mississippi delta music which reminds me of fishing for crawfish with my father in the swamps of Lousiana when I was 5 years old (you can hear the source of British Led Zeppelin's style in this music):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucRZmqFxUaE

https://youtu.be/j3AKvDkdG-Y?t=173


Bands that come to mind from that time with this blues sound were Creedence Clearwater Revival and Guess Who:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulQTazgj9VE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aae_RHRptRg




America is unrefined and a melting pot. And that is what makes it creative.

But America has been flattened by the strip mall. It is evolving. I haven't been there for almost a decade. I don't know what is happening now. The music I am getting exposed to coming out of the USA doesn't have the same connection to the blues and realities of the Old South before modern times.

In short I think it is all become too commercialized.

Less prosperous times and people being more in touch with each other and the earth seemed to produce a different quality of experiences and thus music. Music these days doesn't have enough edge for me in most cases. It is lacking deep nuances of flavor. The short word is bland, as I see the British music even the Beatles to me were bland.

It is like mayonnaise has been poured on top.

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September 20, 2015, 10:25:37 PM
 #690

That's a nice story. That's a shame real wages fell in the aftermath of Black Death  Cheesy

https://mpra.ub.uni-muenchen.de/15748/

Read your own source:

Quote
Not until the later 1370s – almost thirty years after the Black Death – did real wages finally recover and then rapidly surpass the peak achieved in the late 1330s.

What do you expect short-term for an economy devastated by 40+% population kill off.

Once the crisis passed and the economy got back rolling again, it was the great reduction in the labor supply that allowed wages to rise as they hadn't before when laborers were substitute goods in an oversupply because grains farming other than rice is not as labor intensive.

And that spurned the demand for innovations which could once again reduce labor intensity.

Please do not continue your nonsense. You can protest all you want about me suggesting to you to stop splattering your Dunning-Kruger arrogance all over this thread.

Are you French? (see http://france-bitcoin.net/ in your signature line that makes me think maybe you are). If so, perhaps that might explain your arrogant attitude. I've heard but never experienced personally that the French are quite arrogant.


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September 20, 2015, 10:33:37 PM
 #691

Another very interesting revelation. I had traded discussions with this guy in the Scala discussion lists over the years:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Phillips_(poker_player)

He is extremely intelligent. Apparently he couldn't deal with Martin Odersky's (a German) orderly orderness and refusal to redirect the ship. But then again Paul was sort of crank. Typical American flippant loud mouth at times, but I also liked his humor.

Recently Martin told me to cool it, when discussing potential new directions for Scala in the Scala language mailing list. I just quit as he requested.

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September 21, 2015, 01:26:11 AM
 #692


In regards to your wondering what americans are listening to.

These sets have some amazing rock / jam funk that honor many rock musicians.

Careful , its an aquired taste, real masterful musicians that dont use an autotuner, and sell out every show consistently for years and years. This is not your pop tart music .

http://phishthoughts.com/nospoilers/






I don't think there is a finer example of the differences between Europe and the USA than to watch this video of Elvis Presley in 1968. If you make it to the 25 minute point you will get a special treat:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QlliHSRh0A

(I wonder how many votes Clinton got due to his facial structure and mouth resemblance to Elvis)

Dean Martin had that look also and he was performing around that same time the music that my grandparents were listening to (as they hadn't racially integrated with the blacks):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9yAFE2ccPs
(this music sounds better to me now than when I was in my youth, as I am now the age my grandparents were when they were listening to this)

In 1965 (year I was born) as Elvis was declining, the Beatles (who were inspired by Elvis) visit Elvis and inspire him to comeback which culminates in above 1968 comeback.

Robert Plant of the British rock band Led Zeppelin explains that Elvis was the source of most of the music creativity coming out of England:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP-zcXtiXhA

So this is why I say this is a fine example of the American melting pot where we not into guilt and collectivist crap, and instead just grabbing the creativity of the moment irregardless of color, creed, etc.. For example, here is the type of people Elvis might have been drawing inspiration from in the Mississippi "delta" (as Plant said):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFh-JqxvgMw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXZLgJJ7bhQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fa-OhPN3qU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sfl9KUBGQg

Here is Mississippi delta music which reminds me of fishing for crawfish with my father in the swamps of Lousiana when I was 5 years old (you can hear the source of British Led Zeppelin's style in this music):

https://youtu.be/j3AKvDkdG-Y?t=173


Bands that come to mind from that time with this blues sound were Creedence Clearwater Revival and Guess Who:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulQTazgj9VE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aae_RHRptRg




America is unrefined and a melting pot. And that is what makes it creative.

But America has been flattened by the strip mall. It is evolving. I haven't been there for almost a decade. I don't know what is happening now. The music I am getting exposed to coming out of the USA doesn't have the same connection to the blues and realities of the Old South before modern times.

In short I think it is all become too commercialized.

Less prosperous times and people being more in touch with each other and the earth seemed to produce a different quality of experiences and thus music. Music these days doesn't have enough edge for me in most cases. It is lacking deep nuances of flavor. The short word is bland, as I see the British music even the Beatles to me were bland.

It is like mayonnaise has been poured on top.
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September 21, 2015, 05:15:55 AM
Last edit: September 21, 2015, 05:28:32 AM by TPTB_need_war
 #693

In regards to your wondering what americans are listening to.

These sets have some amazing rock / jam funk that honor many rock musicians.

Careful , its an aquired taste, real masterful musicians that dont use an autotuner, and sell out every show consistently for years and years. This is not your pop tart music .

http://phishthoughts.com/nospoilers/

I just briefly sampled the first one. Don't worry I acquire music taste nearly instantly. Will need to spend more time on it when I have some more time.

I remember in 2003 in Corpus Christi I heard Zug Izland live and they were not bland (more impressive live):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwzWe08iuQM

Also I forgot there is one British performer from The Smiths who is unique (weird) enough for me to feel he is not bland:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaUUYV7wKos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZQWjKMQsQw

The German band Depeche Mode is very commercialized but they even mixed it up a bit with latest song, and they've been going strong for decades which is impressive:

https://youtu.be/YYtXCxtp6sQ?t=765

I don't know much about folk music in Europe. I've only seen what appears to be very bland what appears to be opera or that sort, which bores me.

I caught a Metallic concert in the early 80s before they became so popular at a small venue in the San Fernando Valley. It was an accident. We were drunk and cruising all around and happenstanced on the venue and landed inside and it was quite impressive the head banging and slam dancing. Pure guy thing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgJwXVaXUek&list=PL48E286795E97866B&index=6

Listen to this:

https://youtu.be/9B-qOSEwvxM?t=210

Here it is:

https://youtu.be/fq-oQgpVg4I?t=39

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September 21, 2015, 11:41:01 AM
Last edit: September 21, 2015, 11:58:15 AM by BldSwtTrs
 #694

Please do not continue your nonsense. You can protest all you want about me suggesting to you to stop splattering your Dunning-Kruger arrogance all over this thread.

Are you French? (see http://france-bitcoin.net/ in your signature line that makes me think maybe you are). If so, perhaps that might explain your arrogant attitude. I've heard but never experienced personally that the French are quite arrogant.
Yes I am French and I am arrogant only when I am talking subjects that I know I master and against people like you who are ahead of themselves, arrogance is the only healthy attitude in those particular circumstances.

But my arrogance is dwarfed by your delusion of grandeur. You think you know everything even in domains where you are not an expert. The idea that people can know more than you on a subject seems a completely crazy idea to you. You approach every debate with a judgmental and closed mentality where you think you are qualify to asses the IQ of people even if most of the time you don't even comprehend what they are saying.

Your delusion of grandeur and low empathy skills prevent you from incorporating feedback, cause your errors to persist over time and you conduct you to repeat false things with overconfidence. You are you own enemy.
--------------------------------
Now lets read together an article of Szabo on this subject:
http://unenumerated.blogspot.fr/2013/11/european-asian-divergence-predates.html

"Many of the economically important innovations in northwestern Europe long predate not only the industrial revolution, but also the Black Death ("

He says that innovations that lead to the Great Divergence (the rise of the West) predate the Black Death. Which is pretty much what I am saying.

"1) heavy dairying

(2) Co-evolution of human lactase persistence and cow milk proteins

(2) delayed marriage

(3) hay

(4) greater use of draft animals

These innovations all long predate the Black Death
"

He says it again.

"Higher labor productivity implies higher per capita income"
Exactly what I have written two time already. I will re-quote myself because it's the only thing to do with people who people overlook your wisdom because they think you are dumb:  "Real wage are 100% determined by the labor productivity"

"these seem not to have had an anti-Malthusian effect in increasing labor productivity "
He says that the West had start to escape the Malthusian trap before the Black Death because of these innovations.

"the increased efficiency of rice in converting solar power to consumable calories, for example, simply led to a greater population rather than a sustained increase in per capita income."
He says that the East failed to escape the Malthusian trap. He seems to wrongly attribute the cause of this to the rice cultivation, when a more robust explanation is a lack of creativity.
----------------------
So according to Szabo innovations, and therefore the labor productivity, and therefore real wages, were higher in the West before the Black Death.

It's undermine your thesis (high real wages in Europe were not caused by the mortality caused by the plague, but were caused by the innovations which predate the Black Death) and sustain mine (high real wages were caused by the West greater creativity, ie an internal factor whose origin can be found in its culture, not an external factor like the plague).
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September 21, 2015, 12:20:06 PM
 #695

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/09/16/why-chinas-yuan-may-be-set-for-15-devaluation.html

Sounds like the Chinese government is trying to warn the markets about the coming devaluation with this leak/soft-announcement. If China, Japan, and Korea get into a fully blown currency war while the EUR dies and emerging markets suffer from low commodities prices, then how will America deal with the resulting USD deflation? It sounds like the coming deflation might end up being worse than I've imagined.

Year 2021
Bitcoin Supply: ~90% mined
Supply Inflation: <1.8%
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September 21, 2015, 12:21:19 PM
 #696

Depeche Mode is an English band. The other singer you're thinking of is Morrissey.

I think Dark Wave is a movement you'd be interested in. Germany and Scandinavia became embroiled in that trend. Actually I really like the rock band Sisters of Mercy, from that era. The band is from Leeds, UK, but singer Andrew Eldritch is fluent in French and German and he spent many years living in Hamburg. He often gives interviews on TV and radio in German.
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September 21, 2015, 04:38:18 PM
 #697

Please do not continue your nonsense. You can protest all you want about me suggesting to you to stop splattering your Dunning-Kruger arrogance all over this thread.

Are you French? (see http://france-bitcoin.net/ in your signature line that makes me think maybe you are). If so, perhaps that might explain your arrogant attitude. I've heard but never experienced personally that the French are quite arrogant.
Yes I am French and I am arrogant only when I am talking subjects that I know I master and against people like you who are ahead of themselves, arrogance is the only healthy attitude in those particular circumstances.

But my arrogance is dwarfed by your delusion of grandeur. You think you know everything even in domains where you are not an expert. The idea that people can know more than you on a subject seems a completely crazy idea to you. You approach every debate with a judgmental and closed mentality where you think you are qualify to asses the IQ of people even if most of the time you don't even comprehend what they are saying.

Your delusion of grandeur and low empathy skills prevent you from incorporating feedback, cause your errors to persist over time and you conduct you to repeat false things with overconfidence. You are you own enemy.

I hope you read these lines VERY CAREFULLY Anonymint....
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September 21, 2015, 07:36:45 PM
 #698

Please do not continue your nonsense. You can protest all you want about me suggesting to you to stop splattering your Dunning-Kruger arrogance all over this thread.

Are you French? (see http://france-bitcoin.net/ in your signature line that makes me think maybe you are). If so, perhaps that might explain your arrogant attitude. I've heard but never experienced personally that the French are quite arrogant.
Yes I am French and I am arrogant only when I am talking subjects that I know I master and against people like you who are ahead of themselves, arrogance is the only healthy attitude in those particular circumstances.

But my arrogance is dwarfed by your delusion of grandeur. You think you know everything even in domains where you are not an expert. The idea that people can know more than you on a subject seems a completely crazy idea to you. You approach every debate with a judgmental and closed mentality where you think you are qualify to asses the IQ of people even if most of the time you don't even comprehend what they are saying.

Your delusion of grandeur and low empathy skills prevent you from incorporating feedback, cause your errors to persist over time and you conduct you to repeat false things with overconfidence. You are you own enemy.
--------------------------------
Now lets read together an article of Szabo on this subject:
http://unenumerated.blogspot.fr/2013/11/european-asian-divergence-predates.html

"Many of the economically important innovations in northwestern Europe long predate not only the industrial revolution, but also the Black Death ("

He says that innovations that lead to the Great Divergence (the rise of the West) predate the Black Death. Which is pretty much what I am saying.

"1) heavy dairying

(2) Co-evolution of human lactase persistence and cow milk proteins

(2) delayed marriage

(3) hay

(4) greater use of draft animals

These innovations all long predate the Black Death
"

He says it again.

"Higher labor productivity implies higher per capita income"
Exactly what I have written two time already. I will re-quote myself because it's the only thing to do with people who people overlook your wisdom because they think you are dumb:  "Real wage are 100% determined by the labor productivity"

"these seem not to have had an anti-Malthusian effect in increasing labor productivity "
He says that the West had start to escape the Malthusian trap before the Black Death because of these innovations.

"the increased efficiency of rice in converting solar power to consumable calories, for example, simply led to a greater population rather than a sustained increase in per capita income."
He says that the East failed to escape the Malthusian trap. He seems to wrongly attribute the cause of this to the rice cultivation, when a more robust explanation is a lack of creativity.
----------------------
So according to Szabo innovations, and therefore the labor productivity, and therefore real wages, were higher in the West before the Black Death.

It's undermine your thesis (high real wages in Europe were not caused by the mortality caused by the plague, but were caused by the innovations which predate the Black Death) and sustain mine (high real wages were caused by the West greater creativity, ie an internal factor whose origin can be found in its culture, not an external factor like the plague).

+1
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September 21, 2015, 08:08:28 PM
Last edit: September 21, 2015, 11:30:31 PM by TPTB_need_war
 #699

Depeche Mode is an English band. The other singer you're thinking of is Morrissey.

I was really into their album Black Celebration when it first arrived in the 1980s. I wasn't so much into their big hits before that. The music I really find boring is all that repetitive techno that seems to be popular in Europe and sounds the same to me. Other than that, opera, and various folk styles of music, I don't know of much coming out of Europe other than the occasional British band or artist and I shouldn't forget Led Zeppelin (I still have Led Zeppelin - How Many More Times in my regular workout playlist.) and Australia's AC DC which were both big for me as teenager. When I have time, I look into those suggestions you made. Brits apparently inject their nonchalance into their music, which typically is less appealing to me. But Morrisey is just weird (blunt, humor, outlandish, etc) enough to keep it interesting for me. Now when I listen to Elvis he was hard-edged mixed with soulful Deep South and just far enough away from pop R&B and closer to Mississippi delta blues to translate some of the full body aroma. Apparently though he wasn't creative enough to write his own music and looks like creatively he burned out fast and lost his direction as a result. He was all high energy, fan entertainment. When the song writers stopped making new hits for his style, he didn't have anything new to be excited about. Sad for me to see such a vocal and stylistic talent being so high on drugs in his last public performance that he couldn't recite the words of his famous song.

I like the Old America with its nuanced, non-commercialized flavors and blunt, unrefined, hard-edges. I want to listen to some of that new stuff coming out and see if there is still any deep chicory flavor or other influences. Maybe America is not (musically) dead.

The grunge rock out of Seattle in the early 90s produced some good music in my opinion. For example, Alice in Chains and one of my favorites from that period Stone Tone Pilots - Unglued (but the chorus is too bland). Also Nirvana - Very Ape instrumental.

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September 21, 2015, 09:22:47 PM
 #700

Yes I am French and I am arrogant only when I am talking subjects that I know I master...

Exhibit A:





I don't like misinformation. This graphic is misinformation....

It was used to emphasize a point that imported RAW milk cheeses are illegal in the USA (less than 60 days aged) whereas guns are not.

Of course the Europeans will frame the outrageous USA ban on RAW foods (that have all the healthy enzymes we need for proper health) as one of guns being bad because Europeans are so far into Communism they can't even seem to understand their multi-culturalism is their own Freudian desire to steal from someone while pretending it is love (formerly known as imperialism).

Europe will crash and burn severely. Mark my word.

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