Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[mymenace]

I've been reading anonymint's writings for the past week or so, which also prompted me to dive into some other rabbit holes.

I'm more convinced now of the dangers of segwit. Don't mistake that for being a promotion of bcash.

Could you provide me with a link where I can read about that? I remember anonymint's post, but I did not pay enough attention and now I can not find it.

Geeze, guys. We've been discussing these very same aspects of segwit since years. Have you had your fingers in your ears and blinders on up 'til now?

No the other side was just shouted down and accused of all types of things as well as name calling until now they can fight back

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[Ibian]

Even if so: LN is by design centralized.

This is the big fallacy. Bro, Lightning Network does't make bBitcoin centralized because Lightning Network ISN'T BITCOIN.

So it's not bitcoin being moved around?

Sorry you are right. FTFY

Is that a yes or no?

Well it's a yes to my original statement but once I revised my statement it became a question that doesn't apply to what I'm saying. But uh yes, it does move around small letter b bitcoin. So do I if I hand a funded open dime to my friend, that doesn't make me a force for centralization in the big B Bitcoin network.

So what you are saying is that you are useless. Please convince me otherwise, there are too many of you lately.

[Ibian]

That's ok. Everybody's merits are worth more now.

You'd be surprised the number of merits that have been sent to deleted posts: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;u=1762404 (check the received section)

When it's financially worthwhile to do so, someone will get together the required processing power and buy off the proper authorities and make an honest attempt to steal segwit coins. Whether it succeeds or fails, it will be a big blow to the faith people have in the system (bitcoin in all its forms, authorities, moneyed people (us, even if simply by association)).

But in what scenario would this be viable? Perhaps, if we're at a situation where Bitcoin is seconded by another coin with the same mining algorithm, it would be a way to 'surpass' it (provided the ones doing the takeover had a large enough investment in the second) but this seems like an unlikely event.

When there is enough value in segwit addresses to be worth it. What are you confused about?

[bitserve]

For the current leg, and I repeat myself yet again, why was segwit better than simply doubling the blocksize? Nobody seems willing to explain that bit, for whatever reason.

Answer why doubling the block size is even needed at this point in time. With actual logic and facts to back your argument.

Because using LN requires opening channels on chain. To do this in a decentralized fashion, LN can onboard no more than several hunnert thousand peeps per day.

Several hundred thousand peeps opening/closing LN channels per day seems a bit overkill currently, don't you think?

P.S.: No, not saying we should reduce blocksize either. It's good to have some extra capacity for the future.

[Last of the V8s]

Hundred dollars off the low. still 33,000 longs

[Anon136]

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

[jbreher]

The base layer has to stay VERY comfortably within Moore's law.

If one is to use Moore's law as the metric, computing power has increased by a factor of 64 in the time of Bitcoin's existence.

Lessee.... what's 1MB times 64? Humm....

[bitserve]

I've been reading anonymint's writings for the past week or so, which also prompted me to dive into some other rabbit holes.

I'm more convinced now of the dangers of segwit. Don't mistake that for being a promotion of bcash.

Could you provide me with a link where I can read about that? I remember anonymint's post, but I did not pay enough attention and now I can not find it.

Geeze, guys. We've been discussing these very same aspects of segwit since years. Have you had your fingers in your ears and blinders on up 'til now?

Agreed. It's unbelievable how people are coming NOW with points that were debated for years and were (even if slightly) a concern until a few months ago. And now that those are completely debunked they act as if they just discovered em.... Or maybe infofront is just trolling us all. That would make more sense.

[mymenace]

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

 I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

[Anon136]

So what you are saying is that you are useless. Please convince me otherwise, there are too many of you lately.

If my answering your question makes me useless than perhaps you should ask more useful questions.

[Anon136]

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

 I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

I like how your response sounds like it could have been written by a computer algorithm.

[winsumbtc123]

Do you guys think Bitcoin will rebound? Or is it a true bubble pop?

[Ibian]

The base layer has to stay VERY comfortably within Moore's law.

If one is to use Moore's law as the metric, computing power has increased by a factor of 64 in the time of Bitcoin's existence.

Lessee.... what's 1MB times 64? Humm....

Nope. Actual use of computers over that time says nope. It's not a fucking universal principle, it was a trend until it wasn't, and now it isn't.

[Ibian]

Do you guys think Bitcoin will rebound? Or is it a true bubble pop?

Sell everything immediately.

[mymenace]

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

 I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

I like how your response sounds like it could have been written by a computer algorithm.

thanks for the compliment satoshi would be proud

and yes i am a russian bot 

[jbreher]

- Non-segwit transactions require 51% of the hashpower and a private key to steal. Segwit transactions just require 51% of the hashpower.

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?

[Ibian]

Might wanna fix your quotes there Yogi.

[jbreher]

The hard fork should be left for huge emergencies like finding a bug that makes Bitcoin vulnerable to collapse (as was done in the past). Upgrades should be done via soft fork if possible.

The choice of using the so-called 'soft fork' kluge was what introduced the gaping security hole into The Segwit Omnibus Changeset. If it would have been a hard fork, they would not have overloaded anyonecanspend, but rather just made a simple segregated witness upgrade free of side effects.

IOW, you may wish to rethink your position.

[fluidjax]

- Non-segwit transactions require 51% of the hashpower and a private key to steal. Segwit transactions just require 51% of the hashpower.
Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?

 51% attacks require nothing more, and they can do anything....ANYTHING.
They can make every bitcoin address contain an mp3. The whole discussion about Segwit is bollox.

Of course if you are running a full node you wouldn’t accept the mp3 invested junk, but then, non segwit people don’t run nodes, they rely on miners.

[jbreher]

Might wanna fix your quotes there Yogi.

Sorry. Reworked it. We good now?

Thanks, BTW.