Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[Spaceman_Spiff_Original]

Looking good.  Another upleg incoming?

[ragnar0k]

I thought Putin was positive on cryptos, although I guess it would all make sense if they really want to go ahead with this 'brics' crypto.
But I still dont understand what is the point of a government crypto... Aren't credit cards close enough already? 

[rjclarke2000]

ps ....Ledger X tomorrow ? 

That's a very good point I'd forgotten about this. I thought it was Oct 5th? I've heard nothing about this since August/ early Sept.

What's going on with it?

[savetherainforest]

I thought Putin was positive on cryptos, although I guess it would all make sense if they really want to go ahead with this 'brics' crypto.
But I still dont understand what is the point of a government crypto... Aren't credit cards close enough already? 

The idiots don't know or understand that with other cryptos they are backing the other cryptos(including BTCitcoin!).


So... 75 trillion market cap here we come!!!

[vroom]

Breaking: Russia Will Block Bitcoin Exchange Websites, Says Central Bank Official

source: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/breaking-russia-will-block-bitcoin-exchange-websites-says-central-bank-official/

russia "bans" bitcoin and no one cares

[Torque]

Breaking: Russia Will Block Bitcoin Exchange Websites, Says Central Bank Official

source: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/breaking-russia-will-block-bitcoin-exchange-websites-says-central-bank-official/

russia "bans" bitcoin and no one cares

[ragnar0k]

I thought Putin was positive on cryptos, although I guess it would all make sense if they really want to go ahead with this 'brics' crypto.
But I still dont understand what is the point of a government crypto... Aren't credit cards close enough already? 

The idiots don't know or understand that with other cryptos they are backing the other cryptos(including BTCitcoin!).


So... 75 trillion market cap here we come!!!

The problem I see is that if this is a brics thing, India is next...
In the end though people will go where the money are, so the 75tn cap might happen :p

[bitserve]

In aprox. 7 hours Catalonia regional president Puigdemont is scheduled to speak. Nobody knows if he will do as promised and unilaterally declare independency or cowardly back-off on his word.

Let's see if it has any impact on price... or maybe we are already experiencing its influence.

What you say has no relevance or what any political shill will say. The people of Catalunya have spoken!

It will take probably some time for them to crash the whole economy of Spain, or maybe less(or more.. looking at you EU     ). But they will achieve, they will be unattractive for any forceful intervention. Then they will slowly adopt bitcoin or their own version of crypto money backed by other cryptos. Then they win!

Spain could have played nice and said: "Sure! We give you independence but you pay us the same taxes with 1% less every year until it reaches 0% and you have your independence!"

And they could have kept Catalunya a cash cow and a prosperous untouched value region for the next 20-30 years.

The relevance on price is because many people in catalonia have been (and keep doing it) withdrawing from banks as some sort of boycott after they have exited the region. So I speculate that a percentage of that withdrawn savings may be coming to Bitcoin as some sort of hedge and also as a way to avoid their savings being seized in case of an eventual "corralito".

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

I do agree that whatever long term consequences of this will need time to settle, but reactions of people when it comes to protect their savings are way more inmediate so the relevant thing here is if it will fuel current rally or not. Even if a minimal percentage of those savings end up in Bitcoin that would be a huge impact in price.

I would bet it will at least have some effect, if not having it already.

P.S.: Also there is a high probability that Puigdemont gets arrested during or after his speech. And that sort of somewhat "shocking" news usually do have a (positive) impact on Bitcoin price.

[savetherainforest]

In aprox. 7 hours Catalonia regional president Puigdemont is scheduled to speak. Nobody knows if he will do as promised and unilaterally declare independency or cowardly back-off on his word.

Let's see if it has any impact on price... or maybe we are already experiencing its influence.

What you say has no relevance or what any political shill will say. The people of Catalunya have spoken!

It will take probably some time for them to crash the whole economy of Spain, or maybe less(or more.. looking at you EU     ). But they will achieve, they will be unattractive for any forceful intervention. Then they will slowly adopt bitcoin or their own version of crypto money backed by other cryptos. Then they win!

Spain could have played nice and said: "Sure! We give you independence but you pay us the same taxes with 1% less every year until it reaches 0% and you have your independence!"

And they could have kept Catalunya a cash cow and a prosperous untouched value region for the next 20-30 years.

The relevance on price is because many people in catalonia have been (and keep doing it) withdrawing from banks as some sort of boycott after they have exited the region. So I speculate that a percentage of that withdrawn savings may be coming to Bitcoin as some sort of hedge and also as a way to avoid their savings being seized in case of an eventual "corralito".

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

I do agree that whatever long term consequences of this will need time to settle, but reactions of people when it comes to protect their savings are way more inmediate so the relevant thing here is if it will fuel current rally or not.

I would bet it will at least have some effect, if not having it already.

So... That part you got wrong.

All that money and wealth they had before, bought expensive cars, expensive equipment for business to repair those expensive cars, 3-4x 4K+ Tv's, expensive high tech equipment in factories, etc...

Their recovery would be very fast after they cut the ties they have with Spain. (And Syria 2.0 will not happen in Catalunya)

[Torque]

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

The great lie that Average Joe doesn't fully understand, is that our world's interconnected, dependent, fragile financial system is literally teetering on the edge of knife. The supposedly "wealthy" countries and regions are just one minor panicky bank run away from complete and total financial meltdown.

Why do Catalonians think that an anti-independence "Unity" rally just magically appeared out of nowhere just a few days after the independence referendum? Do they actually think this was a spontaneous act of the people? Pffft. The people there are being played like a fiddle by the politicians and the banksters.

[bitserve]

In aprox. 7 hours Catalonia regional president Puigdemont is scheduled to speak. Nobody knows if he will do as promised and unilaterally declare independency or cowardly back-off on his word.

Let's see if it has any impact on price... or maybe we are already experiencing its influence.

What you say has no relevance or what any political shill will say. The people of Catalunya have spoken!

It will take probably some time for them to crash the whole economy of Spain, or maybe less(or more.. looking at you EU     ). But they will achieve, they will be unattractive for any forceful intervention. Then they will slowly adopt bitcoin or their own version of crypto money backed by other cryptos. Then they win!

Spain could have played nice and said: "Sure! We give you independence but you pay us the same taxes with 1% less every year until it reaches 0% and you have your independence!"

And they could have kept Catalunya a cash cow and a prosperous untouched value region for the next 20-30 years.

The relevance on price is because many people in catalonia have been (and keep doing it) withdrawing from banks as some sort of boycott after they have exited the region. So I speculate that a percentage of that withdrawn savings may be coming to Bitcoin as some sort of hedge and also as a way to avoid their savings being seized in case of an eventual "corralito".

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

I do agree that whatever long term consequences of this will need time to settle, but reactions of people when it comes to protect their savings are way more inmediate so the relevant thing here is if it will fuel current rally or not.

I would bet it will at least have some effect, if not having it already.

So... That part you got wrong.

All that money and wealth they had before, bought expensive cars, expensive equipment for business to repair those expensive cars, 3-4x 4K+ Tv's, expensive high tech equipment in factories, etc...

Their recovery would be very fast after they cut the ties they have with Spain. (And Syria 2.0 will not happen in Catalunya)

But that's not how the GDP of a region is calculated.

Of course there is PEOPLE with individual wealth there. And those are the people I SPECULATE might be moving some of its savings to Bitcoin.

It's the business what are leaving the region, but it's the people who might buy Bitcoin in order to protect their current wealth/savings.

About the recovery of the region itself... Well, I do not agree, especially not after seeing the BRUTAL reaction of the main catalonian business. Now I can't even see how do they plan to finance their debt that is now 1.5x their GDP.  But... I can't say I am completely sure of that. Time will tell.

[bitserve]

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

The great lie that Average Joe doesn't fully understand, is that our world's interconnected, dependent, fragile financial system is literally teetering on the edge of knife. The supposedly "wealthy" countries and regions are just one minor panicky bank run away from complete and total financial meltdown.

Why do Catalonians think that an anti-independence "Unity" rally just magically appeared out of nowhere just a few days after the independence referendum? Do they actually think this was a spontaneous act of the people? Pffft. The people there are being played like a fiddle by the politicians and the banksters.

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

I think there are very few banks that could sustain more than 10-20% of the people deposits being withdrawn before going bankrupt.

[Torque]

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

Seemed pretty spontaneous to me. Who would benefit to make that up?

[ragnar0k]

About the recovery of the region itself... Well, I do not agree, especially not after seeing the BRUTAL reaction of the main catalonian business. Now I can't even see how do they plan to finance their debt that is now 1.5x their GDP.  But... I can't say I am completely sure of that. Time will tell.

Isn't that what EU is doing these days? Vote this or business will leave, vote that or banks will leave, vote this other thing or we close your accounts...
Democracy is worth nothing nowadays, you just have to spread terror saying that economy will die. Happened all over south EU and Brexit. Except that Brits had the guts to ignore that and so far nothing happened...

[savetherainforest]

In aprox. 7 hours Catalonia regional president Puigdemont is scheduled to speak. Nobody knows if he will do as promised and unilaterally declare independency or cowardly back-off on his word.

Let's see if it has any impact on price... or maybe we are already experiencing its influence.

What you say has no relevance or what any political shill will say. The people of Catalunya have spoken!

It will take probably some time for them to crash the whole economy of Spain, or maybe less(or more.. looking at you EU     ). But they will achieve, they will be unattractive for any forceful intervention. Then they will slowly adopt bitcoin or their own version of crypto money backed by other cryptos. Then they win!

Spain could have played nice and said: "Sure! We give you independence but you pay us the same taxes with 1% less every year until it reaches 0% and you have your independence!"

And they could have kept Catalunya a cash cow and a prosperous untouched value region for the next 20-30 years.

The relevance on price is because many people in catalonia have been (and keep doing it) withdrawing from banks as some sort of boycott after they have exited the region. So I speculate that a percentage of that withdrawn savings may be coming to Bitcoin as some sort of hedge and also as a way to avoid their savings being seized in case of an eventual "corralito".

Take into account that with this shitshow Catalonia not only have lost banks but has already lost corporates representing more than 35% of its GDP and that only during the past 7 days. That myth of catalonia being one of the "wealthiest" regions of Spain is (sadly) now something of the past. But the individuals that had money/savings are still in control of it and need to find ways to secure it before the situation gets worse.

I do agree that whatever long term consequences of this will need time to settle, but reactions of people when it comes to protect their savings are way more inmediate so the relevant thing here is if it will fuel current rally or not.

I would bet it will at least have some effect, if not having it already.

So... That part you got wrong.

All that money and wealth they had before, bought expensive cars, expensive equipment for business to repair those expensive cars, 3-4x 4K+ Tv's, expensive high tech equipment in factories, etc...

Their recovery would be very fast after they cut the ties they have with Spain. (And Syria 2.0 will not happen in Catalunya)

But that's not how the GDP of a region is calculated.

Of course there is PEOPLE with individual wealth there. And those are the people I SPECULATE might be moving some of its savings to Bitcoin.

It's the business what are leaving the region, but it's the people who might buy Bitcoin in order to protect their current wealth/savings.

About the recovery of the region itself... Well, I do not agree, especially not after seeing the BRUTAL reaction of the main catalonian business. Now I can't even see how do they plan to finance their debt that is now 1.5x their GDP.  But... I can't say I am completely sure of that. Time will tell.

GDP does not matter when it comes to the standards or lifestyle the catalans have created for themselves. It will still be the same roads, same internet, same health services, same people.

And "business moving" that is just codded message for "digital banks are moving", they will not take their buildings with them. And if they stop their business activity there, basically they would have to sell the building and create some kind of dumping on the market. And they will probably not do that, they will stay and continue their activity of blood sucking the population with their services! Every drop squeezed is precious for them and adds up!

And contrary to your beliefs, business want the prices to fall so they can give lesser wages to the people of that region. So everything is good!

[bitserve]

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

Seemed pretty spontaneous to me. Who would benefit to make that up?

Those corrupt politics that have been instigating the people for years (for their own benefit), mainly.

[bitserve]

About the recovery of the region itself... Well, I do not agree, especially not after seeing the BRUTAL reaction of the main catalonian business. Now I can't even see how do they plan to finance their debt that is now 1.5x their GDP.  But... I can't say I am completely sure of that. Time will tell.

Isn't that what EU is doing these days? Vote this or business will leave, vote that or banks will leave, vote this other thing or we close your accounts...
Democracy is worth nothing nowadays, you just have to spread terror saying that economy will die. Happened all over south EU and Brexit. Except that Brits had the guts to ignore that and so far nothing happened...

Yup. That's how the system works... worldwide. Economy is so fragile nowadays that money runs away at the slightest sign of "instability".

The Brexit will have consecuences for UK but... the catalonia "issue" is going at full speed in comparison because that's how catalonian leaders have scheduled it. I guess many others are watching closely what the outcome is as an example for themselves.

[savetherainforest]

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

Seemed pretty spontaneous to me. Who would benefit to make that up?

The anti-independence was spontaneous. The pro-independence was boiling for over 10 years! And especially since the civil war in Spain was not long ago and fresh into the mothers and grandfathers political mind.

But there is a trend on a global scale to refuse to give money to a central government for services that don't happen. It has become more and more expensive for big projects to happen, like tunnels through mountains, huge highways or bridges. People don't understand why it has to be so expensive and their money does not feel used properly. So the systems all around the globe will fail because of this issue.

[Torque]

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

Seemed pretty spontaneous to me. Who would benefit to make that up?

Those corrupt politics that have been instigating the people for years (for their own benefit), mainly.

From what I saw, the corrupt politics you speak of were the first to emerge and denounce the referendum as illegal. They were also the ones who sent in the brute squad police.

The politicians in power and the banksters are working together to keep Spain intact. They want status quo. And they use threats (of economy imploding, of businesses and banks leaving, etc.) as blackmail.

What am I missing?

[bitserve]

You mean as if the pro-independence movement was an spontaneous act of the people instead?

Seemed pretty spontaneous to me. Who would benefit to make that up?

Those corrupt politics that have been instigating the people for years (for their own benefit), mainly.

I think you are missing something here. The corrupt politics you speak of were the first to emerge and denounce the referendum as illegal. They were also the ones who sent in the brute squad police.

The politicians in power and the banksters are working together to keep Spain intact. They want status quo.

What am I missing?

I am referring to the policitians that started the anti-spanish hate a couple of decades ago. Mainly Jordi Pujol. I am calling him corrupt because he extortioned a few thousands of million of EUR from business concessions (3%) over the years. But that's just one example. Current ones are scared because 1 January 2018 the banking secret of Andorra will be lifted... Wanna bet on any names that will show?

That said, I am sure there are many other corrupt politicians all over Spain, but I have to recognise that my opinion about politicians in general (no region or country in particular) is pretty bad anyways.

About the referendum it is indeed ilegal, as anyone that knows spanish law and constitution do inmediately realize. It was the Judges and not the government who sent the police to seize the ballot boxes.

Anyway, I think it is more interesting the possible impact on Bitcoin price and we are not really talking about that... Only 1 and a half hours to the speech.