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Author Topic: KnCMiner Openday Wednesday 5th & Monday 10th June  (Read 78317 times)
idee2013
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June 04, 2013, 06:14:13 PM
 #521


I don't know WTF the are doing with VAT, but UNLESS the have a VAT number in each and every country they charge a different rate for, they have to charge the Swedish VAT and declare it in Sweden. They OBVIOUSLY need to state their VAT number for the country they charge the VAT for. They can't charge 19% for Germany and have their Swedish VAT ID on the invoice.

If they don't follow protocol, they risk ending up in a world of hurt.

As far as I notices during their ordering process, they ask for your VAT-Tax-No. and if you have one, the invoice is issued without VAT. If not, they tax swedish VAT.

Everything seemed to be accurate.


No, this is not right. This is only right if they want to stay under these thresholds posted much times. But if they sell only 19 jupiters to germany for example
they are not allowed to use swedish vat.
http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/resources/documents/taxation/vat/traders/vat_community/vat_in_ec_annexi.pdf

These thresholds only apply to distant selling (shipment directly to consumers), not for pickup in Sweden. And they don´t apply, if the buyer is a VAT-registered company. If the buyer has a VAT-Tax-No. the invoice will be free of VAT. In this case, the seller has to check the VAT-No. and needs proof of identity. We often buy large quantities of goods form other companies within the EU (single orders beyond the German threshold of 100.000 EUR) and never pay VAT. But we have to declare these buys monthly to the German tax-authority.

But i have ordered it without pickup in sweden. I have chosen the ups delivery...so this is a distance sell!
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June 04, 2013, 06:18:22 PM
 #522

Q: will fully working asic not FPGA systems be shown?
idee2013
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June 04, 2013, 06:40:36 PM
 #523

Got an answer from Sam a few minutes ago:

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Hi we have simply not sold enough to be over the 100,000 Eur limit yet so we have to charge Swedish VAT until then

Sam


I have asked him    especially  for germany....i think, they did not reach 100,000€ with sells to germany
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June 04, 2013, 06:48:57 PM
 #524

Talking of VAT, is there any information on KncMiners VAT number? Maybe in the receipt upon paying for a preorder or a public swedish trade directory? I vaguely remember someone posting a link to their swedish company registration in the original thread, can't find it now though...

Should be on their site by now. I saw one of the two yesterday when I was pissing about with ordering...

EDIT: Co. number is on the bottom of every page (standard per rules I think). VAT haven't time to dig out, heading to the gym! Buuuut, I imagine it's on every invoice of those that have made an order! (as it has to be!!)

Found the company registration (http://www.bolagsverket.se/) but no details on the VAT no (I assume it's in the certificate of registration, but that one's locked behind a paywall)

Can anyone with a paid-for preorder post their VAT no? Being an ecommerce website it's weird that they haven't posted it online, but then again the legal situation is different in Sweden. (eg. if you're running an eCommerce website in Germany your VAT no has to be clearly stated online)

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June 04, 2013, 06:51:37 PM
 #525

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501

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idee2013
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June 04, 2013, 06:54:08 PM
 #526

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...
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June 04, 2013, 07:02:43 PM
 #527

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?

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June 04, 2013, 07:03:26 PM
 #528

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?

Sam@kncminer.com

BTW, you sure that VAT site is legit?

They have a bizarre take on English!!


"Tranactions with this custummer can't be VAT exempted"

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idee2013
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June 04, 2013, 07:07:36 PM
 #529

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?

could it be to new to be shown at the vat check sites? in some times servers a very slow at synchronizing between other servers and computer systems
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June 04, 2013, 07:12:25 PM
 #530

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?

Checked as well with our ERP system via "German Bundeszentralamt", the VAT number returns invalid... hmmm
ujka
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June 04, 2013, 07:16:06 PM
 #531

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?
Invalid VAT. EU commision webpage:
http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/vies/vieshome.do?selectedLanguage=EN/
TheSwede75
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June 04, 2013, 07:19:19 PM
 #532

I seriously doubt that they would have an open day, produce a fpga miner and work with a reputable developer (orsoc) just to scam someone with a fake vat number. Prob just a relatively new vat number and not in any system yet.
ujka
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June 04, 2013, 07:22:05 PM
 #533

Q: will fully working asic not FPGA systems be shown?
This thread strayed into VAT discussion.
But yes, what's the point of an openday if Mars miner is not for sale, and there is no ASIC prototype to show?
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June 04, 2013, 07:23:50 PM
 #534

I seriously doubt that they would have an open day, produce a fpga miner and work with a reputable developer (orsoc) just to scam someone with a fake vat number. Prob just a relatively new vat number and not in any system yet.
FAQ
Q4 : How up-to-date is the data?

The data is real-time. Each time you make a request, a message is sent to the Member State which issued the VAT identification number asking if the number quoted is valid.
HeRetiK
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June 04, 2013, 07:25:14 PM
 #535

KnCMiner VAT number: SE556931972501


same here...

Thanks. Not trying to spread any FUD here, but this VAT no seems to be invalid...

http://www.vatcheck.eu/

Checked it in two other sites as well (one being a government page), both saying that this VAT no is in fact non-existent.

Any theories?

Sam@kncminer.com

BTW, you sure that VAT site is legit?

They have a bizarre take on English!!


"Tranactions with this custummer can't be VAT exempted"


I'm not, but also checked using the online service of the BMF (Austrian Buerau of Finance) which should be fairly reliable given that their information is legally binding (at least you can use it as proof that you have checked if the VAT of your partner is valid)

So far I've given them the benefit of the doubt, but this smells really fishy.

Also you only get your VAT no once your application has been approved, it's not like you get a temporary VAT no that has to be validated. At least it's that way in Austria, might be different in Sweden but... eh... confidence slipping.

I'll be checking again later, but from my experience a newly registered VAT no should be checkable immediately, or 1-2 days later the least. (someone else may correct me on this)

Bitcoinorama
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June 04, 2013, 07:29:24 PM
 #536

Q: will fully working asic not FPGA systems be shown?
This thread strayed into VAT discussion.
But yes, what's the point of an openday if Mars miner is not for sale, and there is no ASIC prototype to show?

Obviously, the development requires funding, hence the pre-order...

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ujka
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June 04, 2013, 07:31:51 PM
 #537

Obviously, the development requires funding, hence the pre-order...
In some countries selling pre-orders is considered a fraud.
In my eyes - always.
Mota
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June 04, 2013, 07:35:31 PM
 #538

That is simply not true. I alone had preoders for 85k to germany. No way in hell they are not over the 100.000 treshhold. And, they are not allowed to charge vat if they state in their ToS that they that it is strictly b2b. It is the problem of the customer and the custom in their respective countries if they order without paying vat and have no legal reason to.

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pitchbend
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June 04, 2013, 07:36:28 PM
 #539

The VAT number cheks out in Sweeden:

https://snr4.bolagsverket.se/snrgate

Try searching this on the left chosing "Foretang" from the dropdown: 5569319725 (the number minus the ISO code and the last two digits, as shown in my invoice under "organization number")

I'm guessing they are waiting for their government to include their EU VAT number in the databases. Here in Spain I have requested a EU VAT number for my company and although I know what the number will be it isn't active still.

I seriously doubt that they would have an open day, produce a fpga miner and work with a reputable developer (orsoc) just to scam someone with a fake vat number. Prob just a relatively new vat number and not in any system yet.
FAQ
Q4 : How up-to-date is the data?

The data is real-time. Each time you make a request, a message is sent to the Member State which issued the VAT identification number asking if the number quoted is valid.
bobsmoke
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June 04, 2013, 07:37:49 PM
 #540

For those who might want to read the Sweden VAT essentials :
http://www.kpmg.com/Global/en/services/Tax/GlobalIndirectTax/Documents/vat-gst-essentials-2012/sweden-2011-vat-gst-essentials.pdf
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