-

[Flashman]

Even the shitty shopping channel infomercials TELL you what the bonus is if you order in the next 10 minutes.

[LostDutchman]

Even the shitty shopping channel infomercials TELL you what the bonus is if you order in the next 10 minutes.

That one cracked me up!

My $.02.

[countduckula]

The final agreement is that copy/pasted contract that a child could get from any those so called legal websites, its funny tho that it took weeks to the lolyer to write it.

I don't want to transfer my purchased bonds to any of what you claim original contract or that you call new contract, without solid information on what changes, how and when, with clear examples and proyections, i bought bonds tied to the company hashrate, not fixed speed ones.

[ksenter]

From the past few days experience.  1) There is no way to answer questions on here reasonably as text becomes misconstrued and the individuals here are either looking to pick a fight or have been screwed over by too many people in the BTC community.  If you would like to email me, feel free at labrat@labratmining.com and if you would like to request a call feel free to do so by the same means.

It appears that the only way to attempt to gain the trust of those who will not listen is to just show people how it's going to be.  Please note that the Bonus will be paid out to all people who have transferred to the New Contract on May 10th and 2) any and all Bonus that has accumulated or will be earned in the future will not be held for any individual.  You will begin receiving the Bonus at that time (if you have already accepted) or the time of your acceptance (if later than May 10th) of the New Contract.

I will be providing a link to the Old Contract exactly as it has existed since the beginning of the company via email, the website, and these forums as well as a transcript of the AMA and a link to the New Contract as soon as they are all prepared.

1) That's just not true. There has been a plethora of clear, concise questions which unfortunately for everyone you chose to ignore while actually responding to the people who are looking to pick a fight. It appears to my simple mind that you may very well be trying to create the misconception that there cannot be any rational discourse here by carefully choosing to reply to emotionally charged posts containing wild exaggerated accusations while ignoring the questions and posts that could clear everything right up. Is it really that hard to see how this leads to ever greater mistrust between you and the bond/shareholders? No it is not. Another reason why I no longer trust you.



2) Please clarify what exactly you mean when you say the bonus will not be held for any individual. Perhaps I misunderstood. Are you saying that whoever doesn't accept the contract change within the next 10 days will forfeit the accumulated bonus and then all subsequent bonuses until complying with your new rules?  PLEASE tell me that you aren't trying to force people into accepting your new terms by way of coercion.
    
What is your reasoning behind this? WHY in the world should their dividends not be held? And if so what do you plan on doing with the dividends you steal from them by employing this scare tactic? This is rather disconcerting considering the fact that these dividends are right after a large increase in hashrate and will be one of the rare valuable dividends since difficulty will continue to rise....
    
We are growing VERY tired of being presented with these UNNECESSARY horrible dilemmas. Just hold on to the dividends you owe people UNTIL this is resolved. How difficult is that? Being honest is just as easy as being dishonest. It's a choice. You can still demonstrate your plan without just taking skeptic bond/shareholders money! Just payout whoever still trusts you and decides to move to the new contract the precise amount that is analogous to their rightful share and quit playing games with us...

I completely agree with this. 

Labrat, try to put yourself in our shoes.  How would you react to a hardware provider that told you there was a problem with the hardware you had ordered, they couldn't tell you yet what the problem was but they'd get back to you.  And then they went silent for weeks no matter how much you begged for an update.  All you wanted to know was what the problem was, but they refused to tell you.  Then one day they came back with a lawyer and a change to the terms of your order that sounded vaguely like what you originally agreed to, but you weren't really clear on what the differences were, except that it added a clause that you couldn't sue them if they were unable to provide what you originally ordered.  And they told you, you must accept these terms immediately or your order will be cancelled and you will forfeit your down payment.  But they still wouldn't tell you why the terms had to be changed, nor what the problems were.  Would your first reaction be:

1) Oh well, they must know what's best for me.  I guess I'll just agree to it.  I certainly have no reason to doubt them.
2) What the fuck is going on here?  How can they treat me like this?  Why won't they answer any of my legitimate questions?  How can they expect me to blindly trust them after all of this?

This is a bit of an oversimplification.  There are way more issues that just that one.  But just think on that one example.  I have a feeling that if you don't stop treating your early supporters/investors like they're the enemy you're going to find that people are less willing to go along with your desires (even if they actually were what's best for everyone, since they have no way of knowing that) and more willing to say "fuck it, lets burn this shit to the ground".

[PoUpA]

So first of all sorry for my emotionnal and badly written english (this is not my mothertongue).
After a little break to think and read the contracts more carefully ( the capped one, the new one and also the first page aka IPO ) the only way we get screwed is if we stay with the old contract. All the old contracts never guarantied more than 100MH/bonds, there was a trust agreement that the new hardware will be added but nothing contractual.
So if you stay with the old contract he will use his right to fullfil this contract and give you the minimum hashrate and stay in the legal bonds or you go with the new contract and can benefit of the bonus that will be the hashrate shared between new contractors for the new hardware (but lab_rat cannot say that in thoses terms to avoid klegal pressure). I know we paid for it but he just clarify his situation, and hopes we jump to the new contracts.
We are in the same boat ( perhaps leaking a bit) but nothing changed that much.


BTW i'm a little bit drunk, not a big shareholder (45 shares) so if you wanna respond or troll i'm open ^^ but tomorrow i'll have a headache so i will not be that much sympathic

[Jolest]

LR, very simply:
    (under performance)
 + (lack of explanation for under performance)
 = distrust

If LRM were delivering on the original planned schedule, hashrate would be steadily increasing, every bond holder would be receiving x20 higher (or more) dividends than what they are seeing, and their bonds would have a decent exchange value.  If that were the case, you wouldn't be seeing 99% of the fear in this thread and people would be MUCH more likely to accept contract changes without all the FUD.

Instead, hashrate (as far as WE can tell anyway) has been almost constant for many months.  Almost every dividend is significantly less than the previous dividend.  And we can't seem to get answers from you as to why this is happening and when the situation will improve.

Asking people to accept unilateral contract changes when LRM hasn't been delivering -and- then wondering why people are grouching about your lack of explanation for the situation doesn't show much understanding for the motivations of your investors.

LRM's lack of performance and YOUR lack of communication has built this situation.  ONLY by rectifying these factors can you earn back the trust of the people who invested in your dream.

[Endlessa]

OMG was playing elder scrolls online and realized LRM IS the mad god. . .

[Jolest]

OMG was playing elder scrolls online and realized LRM IS the mad god. . .

This is cute, but is not helping the situation.

We want Zach to start working WITH us.  Not for him to find more reasons to be alienated from us.

[Endlessa]

OMG was playing elder scrolls online and realized LRM IS the mad god. . .

This is cute, but is not helping the situation.

We want Zach to start working WITH us.  Not for him to find more reasons to be alienated from us.

I couldn't resist, the keywords were too similar. . .but in all honesty, if he's going to alienate us, he will find reasons regardless.

[countduckula]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

[LostDutchman]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

[Endlessa]

This is what causes the trust problem.  It seems that LRM is looking out for LRM.  There's no noble reason that I see for an extended amount of trust towards this company.  I mean a couple months ago we were all about to get 1-2 gh/s per share of hash and LRM was sellign extra shares on the premise.  Now, without reason or explanation, we are getting capped at 100 mh/s per share.  USB from last summer was better than that.  . . .

[Endlessa]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

If you have real information don't be all mystical look how superior I am BS about it.  Tell where and what you know.  This is worthless unless you present the facts.  If you do know something you aren't sharing then you're just protecting the problem.

[1247364403]

From the past few days experience.  There is no way to answer questions on here reasonably as text becomes misconstrued and the individuals here are either looking to pick a fight or have been screwed over by too many people in the BTC community.  If you would like to email me, feel free at labrat@labratmining.com and if you would like to request a call feel free to do so by the same means.

It appears that the only way to attempt to gain the trust of those who will not listen is to just show people how it's going to be.  Please note that the Bonus will be paid out to all people who have transferred to the New Contract on May 10th and any and all Bonus that has accumulated or will be earned in the future will not be held for any individual.  You will begin receiving the Bonus at that time (if you have already accepted) or the time of your acceptance (if later than May 10th) of the New Contract.

I will be providing a link to the Old Contract exactly as it has existed since the beginning of the company via email, the website, and these forums as well as a transcript of the AMA and a link to the New Contract as soon as they are all prepared.

The new terms just robs our btcs, and Lab_rat is just a big robber!
How will you plan to buy back the bond if bondowners refuse the terms?

[LostDutchman]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

If you have real information don't be all mystical look how superior I am BS about it.  Tell where and what you know.  This is worthless unless you present the facts.  If you do know something you aren't sharing then you're just protecting the problem.

Lab_Rat is not registered as a Money Service Business or as a Money Transmitter.

Check it out.

The current IRS and FIN-Cen rulings require him to do so.

He ain't got the money to accomplish this feat of legerdemain, not to mention that he may well be dealing in unregistered securities, which brings in the SEC.

To do so requires a couple of million $ in bonds and registration as such in each and every of the states in tha USA in which he does business.

There has been enough noise and sufficient number of complaints to a multitude of government agencies that The Powers That Be are now sniffing about.

Get your money back if you can before time runs out and circumstances shut down any efforts whiwch you may make to do so.

It will be noted that in this thread I asked about Lab_Rat"s registrations as a Money Transmitter or a Money Service Business and received no reply.  This is not my problem, so don't cut off the head of the messenger.

Lab_Rat is done.

My $.02.

[bobfranklin]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

If you have real information don't be all mystical look how superior I am BS about it.  Tell where and what you know.  This is worthless unless you present the facts.  If you do know something you aren't sharing then you're just protecting the problem.

Lab_Rat is not registered as a Money Service Business or as a Money Transmitter.

Check it out.

The current IRS and FIN-Cen rulings require him to do so.

He ain't got the money to accomplish this feat of legerdemain, not to mention that he may well be dealing in unregistered securities, which brings in the SEC.

To do so requires a couple of million $ in bonds and registration as such in each and every of the states in tha USA in which he does business.

There has been enough noise and sufficient number of complaints to a multitude of government agencies that The Powers That Be are now sniffing about.

Get your money back if you can before time runs out and circumstances shut down any efforts whiwch you may make to do so.

It will be noted that in this thread I asked about Lab_Rat"s registrations as a Money Transmitter or a Money Service Business and received no reply.  This is not my problem, so don't cut off the head of the messenger.

Lab_Rat is done.

My $.02.

This line implies you have knowledge of his current financial situation/running sheets. Or is this just a guess?

[LostDutchman]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

If you have real information don't be all mystical look how superior I am BS about it.  Tell where and what you know.  This is worthless unless you present the facts.  If you do know something you aren't sharing then you're just protecting the problem.

Lab_Rat is not registered as a Money Service Business or as a Money Transmitter.

Check it out.

The current IRS and FIN-Cen rulings require him to do so.

He ain't got the money to accomplish this feat of legerdemain, not to mention that he may well be dealing in unregistered securities, which brings in the SEC.

To do so requires a couple of million $ in bonds and registration as such in each and every of the states in tha USA in which he does business.

There has been enough noise and sufficient number of complaints to a multitude of government agencies that The Powers That Be are now sniffing about.

Get your money back if you can before time runs out and circumstances shut down any efforts whiwch you may make to do so.

It will be noted that in this thread I asked about Lab_Rat"s registrations as a Money Transmitter or a Money Service Business and received no reply.  This is not my problem, so don't cut off the head of the messenger.

Lab_Rat is done.

My $.02.

This line implies you have knowledge of his current financial situation/running sheets. Or is this just a guess?

Figure it out.

Do your own research.

Follow the thread.

Add up the funds required to become totally compliant.

They are not there.

My $.02.

[bobfranklin]

I'm seriously having problems to understand those that claim WE're the problem in here.. can anyone explain me why WE are the ones causing all this? and oh poor Zach, don't alienate him... he has more than a million dollars in equipment bought by our payments for shares and 25% collected during months and 2 weeks of hardware and we're the ones causing this?

Haven't figured it out yet, have you?

I predicted this very thing.

There is much more going on than you know but I'm certain you will find out and my comments are not based on speculation.

My $.02.

If you have real information don't be all mystical look how superior I am BS about it.  Tell where and what you know.  This is worthless unless you present the facts.  If you do know something you aren't sharing then you're just protecting the problem.

Lab_Rat is not registered as a Money Service Business or as a Money Transmitter.

Check it out.

The current IRS and FIN-Cen rulings require him to do so.

He ain't got the money to accomplish this feat of legerdemain, not to mention that he may well be dealing in unregistered securities, which brings in the SEC.

To do so requires a couple of million $ in bonds and registration as such in each and every of the states in tha USA in which he does business.

There has been enough noise and sufficient number of complaints to a multitude of government agencies that The Powers That Be are now sniffing about.

Get your money back if you can before time runs out and circumstances shut down any efforts whiwch you may make to do so.

It will be noted that in this thread I asked about Lab_Rat"s registrations as a Money Transmitter or a Money Service Business and received no reply.  This is not my problem, so don't cut off the head of the messenger.

Lab_Rat is done.

My $.02.

This line implies you have knowledge of his current financial situation/running sheets. Or is this just a guess?

Figure it out.

Do your own research.

Follow the thread.

Add up the funds required to become totally compliant.

They are not there.

My $.02.

Cool, so guestimate.

[tabbek]

I think LRM should buy back the shares/contracts/wishful-thinking/whatever theyre called now from any holder who does not agree to the contract changes forced upon them since the original buy in.

LRM changed the terms unilaterally, to ones that I did not agree to nor would have agreed to had they been set forth at onset.

LRM is the one left holding and owning the gear in the end, as he has made it very clear none of us have any actual stake in the business or hardware.  All we have are "contracts" that LRM will pay us.  "Contracts" LRM willfully changes after the agreement was struck.


Buy my shares back at the cost I paid you LRM, since you decided to break the contract.

[bobfranklin]

I think LRM should buy back the shares/contracts/wishful-thinking/whatever theyre called now from any holder who does not agree to the contract changes forced upon them since the original buy in.

LRM changed the terms unilaterally, to ones that I did not agree to nor would have agreed to had they been set forth at onset.

LRM is the one left holding and owning the gear in the end, as he has made it very clear none of us have any actual stake in the business or hardware.  All we have are "contracts" that LRM will pay us.  "Contracts" LRM willfully changes after the agreement was struck.


Buy my shares back at the cost I paid you LRM, since you decided to break the contract.

That was the case from the outset though so nothing changed in regards to that.