[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[webgypsy]

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

% network share is the same BTC ROI regardless - and with BTC price increases we've got just as good a chance as before regardless of difficulty.

I think you, and others, need to grow a pair.

The only problem being this:  To secure the same percentage of the total hashrate, you now need many more chips, many more cases, many more power supplies.
Grow a brain.

Isn't it lucky the price of BTC has gone up so substantially since the first estimates were made.

bye troll

Vinny, please remember that you have invested BTC, not dollars.  This has been discussed to death.
If you invest 1BTC to get .1BTC back, you're being a fool, regardless of the exchange rate.

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[minerpart]

re: Trendon Shavers - Ponzi schemes world-wide are always prosecuted - it's got nothing to do with the currency used.

I'll say again. The SEC are not prosecuting Ukyo, they are guiding and instructing this industry not prosecuting it.

[VinceSamios]

FYI - there is a limit on the number of shareholders in a private company under which they would have a lot of freedoms.

I believe it is currently still a limit of 500 shareholders however legislation is in process to increase that to over 1000 through the "Jumpstart Our Business Startups Act" which has been approved but will be added to the JOBS Act and therefore requires another vote and presidential signature (I'm not sure if this has happened yet)

The latest list of ActiveMining investors shows 323 people (http://bitfunder.firstitinc.com/asset-list/assetlist-2013-12-07-01:40.txt) although we need to take into consideration that a lot of people tendered shares prior to this.

Searching for a pre-bitfunder shutdown list (http://bitfunder.firstitinc.com/asset-list/assetlist-2013-11-01-23-50.txt.bz2) shows 768 investors. We can guestimate this is higher as not all BTCT.co investors would have moved across prior to this. (if I understand correctly)

It might have been recommended, possibly even by the SEC, for Ken to delay listing the shares until the amendment to the JOBS Act has been passed (it may already have been, I haven't bothered googling it).

Get your facts straight. Ken has illegally issued shares.

1. SEC doesn't care where you are, if you sell shares to US persons you follow their rules or face prosecution.  If you live in Shenzen province you might get a pass, but that isn't going to help you or Ken.
2. To legally sell securities publicly, ALL investors must be accredited and you must have proof of their status.
3. You must file a schedule D with the SEC
4. Timing: the government moves slow. I expect prosecution will happen after the SEC gains a conviction against Trendon Shavers.  If you haven't found a new bag holder for this disaster by the spring, expect to be trapped in it until all legal proceedings end.

Technically you are wrong on all counts...

[DoloresHazed]

re: Trendon Shavers - Ponzi schemes world-wide are always prosecuted - it's got nothing to do with the currency used.

I'll say again. The SEC are not prosecuting Ukyo, they are guiding and instructing this industry not prosecuting it.

Sure Pirateat40 case is relevant.  It takes away the "it's just a game, nothing of value is being traded" rationalization that Burnside tried using on his gameserver.  How old are you, bro?

[minerpart]

Sure Pirateat40 case is relevant.  It takes away the "it's just a game, nothing of value is being traded" rationalization that Burnside tried using on his gameserver.  How old are you, bro?

It's relevant as to what? He ran a Ponzi scheme and de-frauded investors of 150k BTC. That is why he's in trouble and every Ponzi scheme operator is a serious criminal. Are you saying that's news bro? It's not bro. OK bro? See ya crumbs.

[Mabsark]

With US investors getting screwed by ActM and the SEC being there to protect US investors, why would the SEC not take action against Ken?

Because they don't prosecute legitimate businesses unless they have deliberately flaunted legislation to scam, defraud, or avoid taxes.

The SEC have already shown their colours here. They have troddon softly with cease and desist letters instead of Police raids or InterPol/extradition requests. The Bitcoin economy now has official sanction in the US, no legitimate BTC mining business will be closed down if they follow SEC guidance after direct contact. Ken appears to be doing that.

A lot of people are claiming that ActM are ripping them off and Ken seems to be going out of his way to give such claims legitimacy. If someone claims Ken has stolen their shares, could that not be interpreted as true if they have no access to those shares? If someone claimed Ken had stolen their dividends could that not be interpreted as true if Ken hasn't paid divs for weeks?

[webgypsy]

Sure Pirateat40 case is relevant.  It takes away the "it's just a game, nothing of value is being traded" rationalization that Burnside tried using on his gameserver.  How old are you, bro?

It's relevant as to what? He ran a Ponzi scheme and de-frauded investors of 150k BTC. That is why he's in trouble and every Ponzi scheme operator is a serous criminal. Are you saying that's news bro? It's not bro. OK bro? See ya crumbs.

Pirateat40 claimed that nothing of value changed hands, so the laws which applied to money did not apply​ to him.  This was a hackneyed, popular claim at one point in time.​  Burnside used it in his TOS.  Ken, not being as smart, creative or eloquent as Burnside, chose to call Active Mining of Belize a "Virtual Identity."  That one just grated on the ears, but heck - Ken's Ken, gotta make allowances.  If Pirateat40 is convicted, that line won't need to be revisited when Ken & Co get their day in court.

[minerpart]

A lot of people are claiming that ActM are ripping them off ................if they have no access to those shares?

Errr HELLO!

The SEC closed down BF! They took our shares off the market!

They are probably guiding Ken on this issue hence the delays and his mention of sorting out the legal side of CT. Please keep up Mabsark.

And NO-ONE but Trolls say Ken has ripped them off. Keep trying Mabsark.......but the days of cheap ACtM shares are OVER.

 

[DoloresHazed]

A lot of people are claiming that ActM are ripping them off ................if they have no access to those shares?

Errr HELLO!

The SEC closed down BF! They took our shares off the market!

They are probably guiding Ken on this issue hence the delays and his mention of sorting out the legal side of CT. Please keep up Mabsark.

And NO-ONE but Trolls say Ken has ripped them off. Keep trying Mabsark.......but the days of cheap ACtM shares are OVER.

 

No amount of shouting is going to change things, minerpart.
If the SEC chooses to go after Ken, he will be V&.
It's that simple.
The only guidance the SEC will provide is "stand behind the yellow line."

[minerpart]

If Pirateat40 is convicted, that line won't need to be revisited when Ken & Co get their day in court.

Instead of speculating on what the SEC do, look up Securities and Exchange Commission v. Banc de Binary Ltd

Banc de Binary were charged in 2013 with offering  securities transactions (binary Options) to US customers without holding the relevant broker/dealer licence.
There was no accusation of any fraud involved.

'The SEC's complaint seeks disgorgement plus prejudgment interest, financial penalties, and preliminary and permanent injunctions against Banc de Binary '

So worst-case scenario is the SEC seek to re-coup funds raised from Bitfunder (700k USD?) plus a fine and an injunction against ACtM listing on an unregistered exchange in the future.

It's not the end of the world if it happens, but I'd say it is  very unlikely. This is a new industry with many grey-areas. For the SEC to have a good chance of winning a case against any legitimate BTC company for incorrect listing on an un-registered exchange they would likley have to have a cease and desist instruction go ignored.


http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=b3fc9cc9-822b-4a29-938b-b48278adece4

http://www.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/2013/lr22718.htm


NB -  the rationale behind the above court-case was the economic protection of the regulated US Binary Broker/Dealer industry - protecting US business. That's fair enough. But how would taking ACtM to court protect US business or jobs? It wouldn't.

[Edser]

The amount of shareholders in here is scary. Quit fluffing and quantifying the poor updates and 'news'. I have read no real reason people are backing Ken other than the fact they are a share holder. Please do not reply or retort if you have money to lose if this company goes under. I have money to lose as well since I ordered and requested a refund. I have lost my little remaining faith in these updates after coming here from watching the site for any news.

Even being a CEO (loose term here for owning a "business"), there is a responsibility if you are also the PR person. I guarantee even a decent PR person would have made the company double even with this many delays. He is not running some 5k employee Forbes 7000 business. It is what, 5 guys? The responses from the company are so lack luster that even drive thru fast food people give you a better status.

[Mabsark]

A lot of people are claiming that ActM are ripping them off ................if they have no access to those shares?

Errr HELLO!

The SEC closed down BF! They took our shares off the market!

They are probably guiding Ken on this issue hence the delays and his mention of sorting out the legal side of CT. Please keep up Mabsark.

So what if the SEC took the shares off the market? Does that mean Ken doesn't need to refund those shareholders and can just keep all the dividends for himself? Of course not.

Probably, probably probably! In other words you know fuck all!

I have provided  a scenario that is actually occurring as we speak. Someone could legitimately make those complaints because they are factual. Ken took everyone's shares and gave them nothing in return and dividends haven't been paid in weeks. People are asking Ken to explain himself and he's simply ignoring them. The the sycophants like yourself come on and start having a go at them for their very valid complaints.

How long will it be before these people get sick of being ignored by Ken and report him to the SEC?

And NO-ONE but Trolls say Ken has ripped them off. Keep trying Mabsark.......but the days of cheap ACtM shares are OVER.

 

Plenty of people are complaining and their complaints are legitimate. You just can't accept that fact. Even Kynbe's joined the ranks of "trolls".

[minerpart]

Mabsark you get really shirty and vulgar with anyone who crosses you don't you?

How about less of the name calling huh?

You don't use the word 'probably' because you clearly always know all the facts? I see. Well done.


EDIT - fine Mabby, go complain to the SEC. After a 2year court battle you might get your shares swapped back out for your initial FIAT investment. Meanwhile all the other shares holders who decide not to contest will keep their shares, keep their divs, and will be sitting very pretty. I'm sure that will make perfect sense to you.

[Bargraphics]

The amount of shareholders in here is scary. Quit fluffing and quantifying the poor updates and 'news'. I have read no real reason people are backing Ken other than the fact they are a share holder. Please do not reply or retort if you have money to lose if this company goes under. I have money to lose as well since I ordered and requested a refund. I have lost my little remaining faith in these updates after coming here from watching the site for any news.

Even being a CEO (loose term here for owning a "business"), there is a responsibility if you are also the PR person. I guarantee even a decent PR person would have made the company double even with this many delays. He is not running some 5k employee Forbes 7000 business. It is what, 5 guys? The responses from the company are so lack luster that even drive thru fast food people give you a better status.

Surprisingly you are not a sock of Crumbs,

Please keep us up to date with your refund process.

[minerpart]

Worst case scenario is reimbursement to shareholders of initial fiat investment (should they request it) made on Bitfunder and a fine.

The company will survive. If you think the repercussions are vastly more serious than that for a legitimate business please show us the relevant test-case/court case raised by the SEC.

Thanks.

[Edser]

Surprisingly you are not a sock of Crumbs,

Please keep us up to date with your refund process.

Oddly enough I do understand your reference to the mass of clones of said person, but never saw the original posts.
I actually got 2 replies on the refund since I contacted them on multiple levels.
Both with no details other than they wanted my address that is already linked to my account and shipping address.... Will be sure to post on updates.

[DoloresHazed]

Surprisingly you are not a sock of Crumbs,

Please keep us up to date with your refund process.

..etc..

I see this leech has moved on to another scam.  Just a note for anyone who is not aware about Bargraphics, this a**clown single handily cheerleadered terrahash scam all the way to the end, made many people lose their money, and attacked anyone who expressed doubt or asked about a refund.

After terrahash ran with the money, he went back and deleted/edited out all his old cheerleading posts in the thread, then pretended to lead a group lawsuit against terrahash sucker in the legit people who lost their money. Of course nothing ever happened. (some of the victims started filing their own small claim suit in court later on, but lost a lot of valuable time & money due to this guy)

I dont know what the deal with VMC is, but just becareful, i would not trust anything coming out of this con artist's mouth.

The worst kind of scum.

[Vigil]

Bargraphics was definitely a major cheerleader for TerraHash. The thought has definitely crossed my mind as to what his involvement may be (if any) with ActM. Not trying to point fingers here, but...

[Bargraphics]

Worst case scenario is reimbursement to shareholders of initial fiat investment (should they request it) made on Bitfunder and a fine.

The company will survive. If you think the repercussions are vastly more serious than that for a legitimate business please show us the relevant test-case/court case raised by the SEC.

Thanks.

Out of what money will this reimbursement come?

These cases run for 3-5 years.  The lawyers collect their pound of flesh, then secured creditors are reimbursed, then unsecured creditors (the suckers who ordered from Ken), then whatever is left would be distributed to shareholders.

1 / 25 000 000 of what is left after that process isn't going to be a Satoshi.

1 / 10,000,000 minus Kens own Shares.

[minerpart]

No problem entropy,

you say the case will run 5 years, meanwhile ACtM are trading - we are fine.

I say the actual case I quoted show if ACtM did not contest the case it will be over in weeks, they would get a fine, have to pay back (maximum 700k USD) and agree not to do again - we are fine.

Either way it's not an issue that would threaten the solvency or day to day operation of the company.

Again, if you have evidence otherwise i.e. test-case material, please share it. I quoted you an actual SEC case, you are just speculating on nothing factual.

Thanks.