NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[Come-from-Beyond]

It's really that simple.

Genesis account passphrase is known to everyone. BCNext can't say anything officially anymore.

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[pinarello]

It seems people forget that the reason people have invested in NXT is due to the promised features, not the current incarnation. It would be downright fraudlent if the promised features don't come into existence.

Missing one's targets and fraud are two different things.

Apple can say that they will make X dollars in the 3rd quarter,  if they miss, then that's not fraud.

Nxt can say they will have Z features,  if they never deliver,  then that's not fraud.

So the price of Nxt is somewhat determines by the possibility that these features will become part of Nxt or not.   Well right now,  that doesn't look like a very high possibility.


The developers are bailing and I don't see any volunteers.  Did you see anyone volunteer after CfB bailed?

Will you take over from cfb for us?

[bitcoinpaul]

I would think BCNext too would have the insight to understand that having a common goal to work towards is healthy for the community

Well, we have 2 options:

1. Take current version of Nxt and keep develop it in our own way, without changes added by BCNext
2. Wait for 2nd and 3rd parts of BCNext's plan, read them and decide if we need to follow them. If we don't then see point 1.

In any case we lose nothing. Nxt already has more features than Bitcoin.

2 1+2 is the wise choice. This incredible community can create fantastic things. If we would solely rely on BCNext plans we would miss chances to develop great ideas and features BCNext wouldn't thought of. Why not merge OUR ideas with BCNext ideas?

I don't think BCNext can give us as much information as we want because someone else will simply copy his ideas before we can implement them. We are not ready yet. We are lucky to have cfb to answer all the questions.

I was not precise enough. Until BCNext talks about plan 2 and 3, we can develop great ideas, BCNext might never thought of. It is good we don't know about his plans.

[Zahlen]

Is anyone familiar with how DOGEcoin marketing is run?
How is it organized?

Who is in charge?

Decentralized. A redittor has an idea and makes a thread on /r/dogecoin. If people like, they will contribute ideas and maybe DOGE to it. Maybe the OP needs help making it happen, other people will contribute skills and materials.

The ideas are mainly sponsoring things (Save Dogemas, Sean's Outpost, Jamaican bobsled team, Indian luger), getting shops to accept DOGE (many have, after hearing about DOGE, or getting lots of e-mails from redittors), creating cool stuff like artwork (e.g Doge Inside animation, based on Intel Inside)


(There is a centralized Dogecoin Foundation, but I don't think they do marketing.)

I would like to get an understanding of how it functions.[/b]

Best way to understand is to make a reddit account, spend some on /r/dogecoin. And and remember to tip other shibes

[Uniqueorn]

It's really that simple.

Genesis account passphrase is known to everyone. BCNext can't say anything officially anymore.

Well you talk of his plans as if they are the official plan for NXT, so he can definitely speak from that POV.
"Official" is just a label. yes NXT is supposed to be 100% decentralized and we are going to have to make it so, but you cannot deny that currently this community is still LARGELY dependent on BCNext and yourself.

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

[nakaone]

it is hurting NXT no matter what.
it is hurting current price of 1 NXT no matter what.

Fixed.

translation:
"It helps the wide and easy distribution"

Yes. BCNext doesn't care about the price.

This is trivializing my question and misinterpreting my statements.
I said it hurts NXT, not the price, but NXT itself.

I would think BCNext too would have the insight to understand that having a common goal to work towards is healthy for the community, but perhaps he is truly that bad at reading people and markets. I don't know, I don't know anything about him really.

All I know is that YOU CfB talk about his upcoming plans as if they will change and make sense of everything and then when someone is even a tadbit critical, you get all defensive and accuse others of relying on BCNext. That is just wrong in my opinion.


Again: all I want is more info so we can collaborate as a unified community towards a common goal. Why you keep mentioning the price of 1 NXT is beyond me.

What specific info do you want?  I believe CFB has been pretty straight forward about what is being implemented in the future.  We have several features and more on the way, things take time to develop.  

Specifically I want more openness. CfB keeps talking about what will happen and mention BCNexts mysterious future plans as if they are the game changer, yet we, the people, get no knowledge of this until later on.
My question is basically: Why?

Why the need for secrecy and mystery? It simply cause confusion and uncertainty, which is the last thing you need in a new world that is ruled by scams, empty promises and paranoia. Hell BCNext who is so paranoid he wont even post anymore should understand this better than anyone.
NXT needs branding and marketing, it seems finally that everyone understands this, but then it shouldn't be hard to realize that the current atmosphere of uncertainty hurts NXT and lead important people away from NXT.
As someone who has worked in this area of NXT for almost 2 months now I can tell you that the biggest obstacle NXT has faced is to convince people it's not a IPO scam due to the very bad distribution. There is A LOT of uncertainty resting over NXT that hurts NXT.

Like CfB mentions over and over, we the community shouldn't rely on BCNext and that we need to develope ourselves. This is all fine and well, but then he turns around and says that the upcoming secret plans is where the real juice is at and just adds further uncertainty to everything which again lead the developers to view NXT as too uncertain to invest time and energy into. It's just one big mess.

If the reason is that he fears that someone will copy his ideas then that is obviously understandable, but why can't he then state that officially?
I just don't see why it is so hard for him to communicate to the community through CfB and remove all of this lingering uncertainty.

I have nothing against CfB, CfB knows this very well and noone is mad that things take time, but if we had more info on why certain things takes the time it does and so on then it would be easier for all of us to help out with things. It's really that simple.

+1
knowledge for decentralization

[bitcoinpaul]

Also CfB is gone in 2 months, if by then we haven't managed to quench all of this and become a unified community, well.... that wont be pretty

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

I say it one more time: CfB is NOT disappearing magically in april.

[Uniqueorn]

Is anyone familiar with how DOGEcoin marketing is run?
How is it organized?

Who is in charge?

Decentralized. A redittor has an idea and makes a thread on /r/dogecoin. If people like, they will contribute ideas and maybe DOGE to it. Maybe the OP needs help making it happen, other people will contribute skills and materials.

The ideas are mainly sponsoring things (Save Dogemas, Sean's Outpost, Jamaican bobsled team, Indian luger), getting shops to accept DOGE (many have, after hearing about DOGE, or getting lots of e-mails from redittors), creating cool stuff like artwork (e.g Doge Inside animation, based on Intel Inside)


(There is a centralized Dogecoin Foundation, but I don't think they do marketing.)

I would like to get an understanding of how it functions.[/b]

Best way to understand is to make a reddit account, spend some on /r/dogecoin. And and remember to tip other shibes

The thing about DOGE is that it managed to become a MEME. MEME's work like genes and is a evolutionary principle coined by Richard Dawkins.
It's fun to spread meme's, you feel like a part of a community when you do so.
And the meme is centered around a funny looking dog, the WOW SO MONEY MUCH stuff is just whimsical and dumb so people share it.

The big holders find things that they KNOW will make the media, like Jamaican bobsled team. The Jamaican bobsled story goes back decades and so it is beyond obvious that it'll reach frontpage.
This is really no big art, NXT can do the same and we are actually working on it, but we are currently trying to brand NXT more as something genuinely for the future and not just a funny MEME.

[Uniqueorn]

Also CfB is gone in 2 months, if by then we haven't managed to quench all of this and become a unified community, well.... that wont be pretty

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

I say it one more time: CfB is NOT disappearing magically in april.

I know, I have his assurance on this, but he stops being a developer then and starts working on his own currency, Qubic. At least that is what he has said up until now, so his heart and soul wont be dedicated to NXT. He simply wont have as much time anymore.
So in that sense he is "gone" from his position in NXT in 2 months and that is the way it should be. This community shouldn't be reliant on any single person and that is what all of this is about. I want to bring the community closer together toward common goals and I think that in order to do so we need to get rid of this mystical secrecy BS that perpeptually sticks around.

[PGPpfKkx]

CfB how can you be surprised to be thought of as the community leader as you have been *answering* questions for over 2-3 months in this forum and basically be the interface from users to creator BCnext?
How can you be surprised when whenever something new was about to be implemented you explained its inner workings and announced its launch date?
How stupid are the people saying lines like "people need leaders"? Projects need leaders and earth circles the sun.

So if you are actually making your own currency we can all but wonder is it going to be based on nxt or at least BCnext's ideas?
Will you be heavily invested in Ethereum cause I saw you posting alot in that thread?

Is anyone in contact with BCnext? It is crazy not to have someone central and dont get started with decentralized cause when Satoshi stopped his involvement Bitcoin had a clear leader and a team behing him. Peercoin also has a clear leader (Sunny) who is great and posting every week and update.

Without having any more nxt it's in your interest now to act against it. Thats pretty controvertial...

[gimre]

I love this coin
I have a lot of NXT coins
I believe NTX is second coin of the future.

cool, you can send me some

[Come-from-Beyond]

CfB how can you be surprised to be thought of as the community leader as you have been *answering* questions for over 2-3 months in this forum and basically be the interface from users to creator BCnext?
How can you be surprised when whenever something new was about to be implemented you explained its inner workings and announced its launch date?
How stupid are the people saying lines like "people need leaders"? Projects need leaders and earth circles the sun.

So if you are actually making your own currency we can all but wonder is it going to be based on nxt or at least BCnext's ideas?
Will you be heavily invested in Ethereum cause I saw you posting alot in that thread?

Is anyone in contact with BCnext? It is crazy not to have someone central and dont get started with decentralized cause when Satoshi stopped his involvement Bitcoin had a clear leader and a team behing him. Peercoin also has a clear leader (Sunny) who is great and posting every week and update.

Without having any more nxt it's in your interest now to act against it. Thats pretty controvertial...

Qubic won't be released very soon. Not even sure about 2015.

I won't invest into Ethereum until I get answers on my questions.

[voldemort628]

Also CfB is gone in 2 months, if by then we haven't managed to quench all of this and become a unified community, well.... that wont be pretty

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

I say it one more time: CfB is NOT disappearing magically in april.

I know, I have his assurance on this, but he stops being a developer then and starts working on his own currency, Qubic. At least that is what he has said up until now, so his heart and soul wont be dedicated to NXT. He simply wont have as much time anymore.
So in that sense he is "gone" from his position in NXT in 2 months and that is the way it should be. This community shouldn't be reliant on any single person and that is what all of this is about. I want to bring the community closer together toward common goals and I think that in order to do so we need to get rid of this mystical secrecy BS that perpeptually sticks around.

+1

[Zahlen]

The thing about DOGE is that it managed to become a MEME. (and other stuff)

Not quite. It started off, and took off as a meme. And yes, some people stick with it because they haven't found it old yet (I havent ). But that's not all there is to DOGE. DOGE also shares reddit culture, which is in general a lot more candid, respectful and down-to-earth than most places on the net. There's also a lot of generosity and goodwill. I don't mean mere tipping gestures, I mean serious amounts of USD in the form of DOGE that have been offered to fund things. This doesn't simply arise from the novelty of a meme, but from people feeling that they've found a good community and want to contribute to it.


EDIT: I'm not a marketer, but this is the main lesson I'd take away from doge: "from people feeling that they've found a good community and want to contribute to it". Right now, this thread isn't such a community. It has absolutely amazing moments. And absolutely appalling ones. And it's overwhelming and intimidating for most folks. What you end up seeing here are just those people who can keep up and feel like they can get a word in, rather than truly free expression and discussion.

There have been a lot of ideas for how to deal with this. Calls to split side discussions off. Nxt is now on reddit (/r/nxt) and diaspora, these may be places where discussion can be more manageable. And passion_ltc is working on improving the communication tools in nxtion. But all these will remain ideas unless people actually try them out.


(Sigh. There was so much I wanted to do tonight. Now it looks like there's even more that I should be responding to. And I don't think I can cover everything. This is how things remain unless we all start trying out better ways of communicating, that in particular will be more accessible to new nxters.)

[Labteck]

Im don't understand the mistery too.
That's why joking about skynet, because really dosent know where this go or clearly  what is the status of the project

[MarvellousMutant]

...
Anon136:
+ 1 Account + 1 solved captcha  ==   1Vote

MarvellousMutant:
+ 1 Account   ==  X Vote = X(TransactionFee)                             =  log(tractFee)+1
+ 1 Account   ==  X Vote = X(TransactionFee, TransactionNumber)  =  log(tractFee*TransactionNumber)+1


no claim to completeness!


We need to discuss selection options too:
[true]    [false]    [abstention]
I think [abstention] provides an important information too.
E.g. a high count of [abstention] tells the poll creator "interesting question buddy, but not this way!!!" ...

It makes sense to collect all ideas to keep the overview.
Please extent the "general options" and "voting models" and "selection options" ideas!!!



@ MarvellousMutant:

I was adding some assumptions based on your approach.
Please feel free to modify it or add something!!!

I like your assumptions, but need to think about it a bit. The log part is nice, but i think this can be gamed. Not without sognificant fees though.
 I also like captchas for voting!

Will post tomorrow, thanks for your work!

[voldemort628]

So is JL staying as one main dev after cfb leaves?
Generally we need some organisation to do and people stepping up to take up roles in our community.
Cheers

Ps keep it cool guys

[msin]

Also CfB is gone in 2 months, if by then we haven't managed to quench all of this and become a unified community, well.... that wont be pretty

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

I say it one more time: CfB is NOT disappearing magically in april.

I know, I have his assurance on this, but he stops being a developer then and starts working on his own currency, Qubic. At least that is what he has said up until now, so his heart and soul wont be dedicated to NXT. He simply wont have as much time anymore.
So in that sense he is "gone" from his position in NXT in 2 months and that is the way it should be. This community shouldn't be reliant on any single person and that is what all of this is about. I want to bring the community closer together toward common goals and I think that in order to do so we need to get rid of this mystical secrecy BS that perpeptually sticks around.

I understand your concerns, but what will full transparency solve?  BCNext is anonymous for a reason, he only communicates through CFB because if he didn't, he'd have about 1000PM's a day to answer.  Dan has this problem with eMu and it consistently delays his development of the client.  We are not Doge, we don't have that sense of humor and we shouldn't try to emulate them.  If we try we will come across as immature.  We are the true next gen currency and should rely on our tech.  I for one have been very impressed with the ideas of BCNext and encourage that he stay focused on development, not worry about pleasing those that don't have faith.

[BaiMangal]

It's really that simple.

Genesis account passphrase is known to everyone. BCNext can't say anything officially anymore.

Well you talk of his plans as if they are the official plan for NXT, so he can definitely speak from that POV.
"Official" is just a label. yes NXT is supposed to be 100% decentralized and we are going to have to make it so, but you cannot deny that currently this community is still LARGELY dependent on BCNext and yourself.

I am simply trying to fix this before you leave, because if this shit isn't resorted and the community finds a common plan, then this will just be one big mess

100% agree with Uniqueorn!!
Also how can a decentralized project be done in a centralized 1 threat forum post!
This is getting out of control and it becomes very vulnerable of collapsing.

[rickyjames]

as if we are some blind religion that should just have blindfaith in NXT and it's creator, no matter what.

Seems we r. BCNext does his best to influence as little as possible but we still ask for his Second Coming...

I am happy to ask for just his source code and some idea of what the starting point is to improve it.   That starting point is his ending point.  He won't tell us his ending point at this time.  Therefore we have to wait.

Once the source code is released in early April, it will be a disaster to continue the way we are.  We cannot plot as a community what additions to make to the released NXT baseline unless they are coordinated with the current core devs.  This is why I asked how many of them will still be working full time on NXT in May.  You said you don't know.  We certainly don't know.  So we've got to wait.

I've got to tell you, all this talk of tricks and traps and obscure gotchas embedded in the code does not inspire me that it is going to be straightforward for the community to extend NXT even as the main path, much less a competitor fork.