[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[anonymousxx1503]

The summary thus far of my analysis of Darksend is that Evan has put into place adequate mechanisms to disincentivize theft of the collateral payments and to disincentivize Sybil attacking the inputs to a Darksend with legitimate Darksends.

The weaknesses (w.r.t. to anonymity) are that Masternodes can be purchased and if the adversary has too many of them, they can reduce your probability of anonymity unless you send your funds through dozens of Darksends between each receipt or spend transaction. If the adversary controlled 90% of the Masternodes, it would nearly impossible to be anonymous more than say 99% of the time, i.e. 1 in 100 of your spends would lose anonymity. Evan argues that attaining a lot of Masternodes is too expensive. Well probably so for the common criminal, but I am not convinced that is so for the NSA.

1 in 100 may not sound bad, but remember that loss of anonymity tends to domino cascade (for the holistic reasons I pointed out in my reply to LimLims on this page). And that is for the person who is extremely diligent to do dozens of Darksends between each spend. Most users are not so perfectionist. So for them anonymity could drop significantly if the adversary has such huge resources.

The other weakness is that it is not yet mandatory to use an IP mixer such as Tor with Darksend, and if not all of the participants to the Darksend are obfuscating their IP, then the anonymity probability declines. Note that even if Darksend makes Tor mandatory, Tor is not the best we can do for an IP mixer. It is unknown how effective Tor is. Some might estimate 80 - 95%. Others might pull 50% out of their arse. I really don't know, but I don't trust Tor entirely. This combined with say 20% of the Masternodes compromised (and a little bit of normal human error on your part such as forgetting to send dozens of Darksends for each coin your receive) can also make it unrealistic to repeatedly sustain very military grade strength of anonymity. (But who said you wanted military grade assurance? Some do, some may not require it)

Darksend has anonymity. Darkcoin is an anonymity coin. The strength of the anonymity depends on the resources and resolve of the adversary versus the Darkcoin user.

I am still trying to think of suggestions to improve it.

In recent posts you seem to have changed the tone of your suggestions and I think that's great. You may be a paranoid tinfoil hat wearing nsa fearing lunatic, but you definitely add to the discussion. I don't claim to know enough about cryptocurrencies to know if you're helping or not but it looks like you are so thanks.

[Kai Proctor]

Some people are comparing scrypt coins to Darkcoin in term of turnover when the profit (turnover - costs e.g. the electrical bill) is the key element.

[AnonyMint]

I was forced to change my tone because Evan cleverly used collateral payments to break anonymity in terms of giving the identity to the random Masternode, but anonymity is regained probabilistically as we already explained upthread.

So if something works, I can't be an engineer if I say it doesn't work.

My summary stated caveats and issues notwithstanding.

I hope slyA will allow me one slight transgression. I want to be on the record as stating I had already designed a similar algorithm that gains anonymity probabilistically (which is why I was immediately familiar with LimLim's points), so Evan came up with something very similar independently. But mine has some unique differences. But mine isn't applicable to the random Masternode concept, so I am not going to share it because it couldn't be used without drastically changing Darksend. So far I don't see anything I can extract from it to make Darksend better, although I feel our discussions helped clarify for both Evan and myself so I hope we both appreciate the exchanges. Now I reiterate, AnonyMint will not be announcing anything with this. So please don't get negative on me.

Evan when did you conceive of yours? Mine was written down in November 2013.

[thelonecrouton]

Am I the only one wondering who certain people in this thread are working for?

Whether they know it or not.

 

[httpb]

I just discovered this coin and since this is my first mining attempt using X11 I'm wondering if I made correct setup for my GPU (Sapphire 280x).

I used same config as for Vertminer and I'm getting 2Mhash/s.

Is this speed what is expected from 280x?

[Equate]

I just discovered this coin and since this is my first mining attempt using X11 I'm wondering if I made correct setup for my GPU (Sapphire 280x).

I used same config as for Vertminer and I'm getting 2Mhash/s.

Is this speed what is expected from 280x?

you will get above 2Mhash/s. with little overtune.

[coins101]

China just screwed everyone.

This is a bump in the road, but bloody hell what a bump.

http://www.coindesk.com/btc38-suspends-trading-cites-china-central-bank-guidance/

[doona38317]

As I'm thinking more of it, perhaps the greatest weakness of the system is the requirement to have hundreds of thousands of DRKs online: If a network exploit is found at some point that allows the hacking of the master nodes, then every single node can be emptied of their money and a hacker will end up with something like half a million DRK... wallets and stuff are relatively safe due to the encryption, offline protection etc, but networks have a much weaker reputation: Exchanges, pools, even dice games -as reported above- are getting hacked.

[AlexGR]

The crypto in Zerocash is really neat (quadratic span programs, et al). But both Zerocash and Zerocoin are not immune if ever the NSA (or any one) has a quantum computer because they use bilinear pairings and double discrete logarithm trapdoors respectively which are factorable with Shor's algorithm. We would need instead Zero Knowledge employing a McEliece or Niederreiter binary Goppa codes style trapdoor instead, which so far remain theoretically immune to complexity reduction with a quantum algorithm.

Remember this. It is impossible to do Zero Knowledge Proof without a trap door. Thus a one-way hash (like SHA256) can't be used to do ZKP. Zerocash uses hashes but these are not the trapdoor.

I could explain this and Fiat-Shamir's transform to the average reader here, but I don't have time. And I think they don't really need to know.

I think there will be 2 terms that will be "large" - or larger in the future:

AI-proof
QC-proof

AI = Artificial Intelligence that performs transaction analysis
QC = Quantum Computing that breaks the encryption

[c-cex]

This is owner of C-CEX.com and I am contacting you to bring you up to date with the exchange in reference to the stolen BTC we suffered on February 23rd.

We are working hard to pay back the stolen coins but as you will fully understand you cant please all the people all of the time and we have a few members that are going around bad mouthing the site and giving out false information. If you have any questions or concerns please contact us direct and we will answer you fully and honestly.

We developed much better security and made many improvements to exchange and didn't have any issues since accident.

[hyeoam]

Charts here: http://crypto-prices.com/DRK

[A1ex]

24/7 MONITORING, ONLINE SUPPORT, AUTOMATED PAYMENTS,
Stratum, 0% FEE , PPLNS, VARDIFF, SSL, POWERFULL SERVERS

DRK.FORKPOOL.COM - DARKCOIN POOL

[pym002]

hello
I wonder if it really was impossible to trace the transaction with this money?
and this is the case admits what he planned to not that this part is prohibited not state?

[humanitee]

China just screwed everyone.

This is a bump in the road, but bloody hell what a bump.

http://www.coindesk.com/btc38-suspends-trading-cites-china-central-bank-guidance/

I am actually glad.

2 reasons:
1) Bitcoin was designed to overcome this, it will further encourage decentralized exchange between regular Chinese folk.
2) No more vague guidelines from China that spook the market. It's over.



3) A fully implemented Darkcoin + Chinese economic implosion == Moist pants

[fearcoka]

How do we know other countries wont do the same...

[humanitee]

How do we know other countries wont do the same...

lol, IDGAF.

Keep it legal in your country and get the increase in taxes and business, or shoot yourself in the face and give it all to the black market. You can't stop crypto-currency.

There are only a few countries that have banned it and none of the bans were surprising. I wouldn't worry about it.

[eduffield]

The next stage of DarkSend

The design of Darkcoin is all about economic incentives, I've tried to bake as much of that in as possible. I've been thinking about the reliance on master nodes in our new design for securing the network and I see some room for improvement.

With the current design we will require 1000DRK to operate a master node. That requires you putting 1000DRK in a hotwallet (dangerous) only to collect the collateral fees which won't amount to much.

So what do we want?

- We want as many master nodes as possible (the more nodes the more secure the network)
- We want them to be profitable to run
- We want it to be very expensive investment to operate a master node

So I propose the following solution, each block the last master node will receive 10% of the mining reward (in addition to the reward given to the miner). So for example, if the mining reward was 19DRK the last master node will automatically receive 1.9DRK.

This also has some really great side effects:

- It creates a completely new type of investor that buys DRK and holds it (where as miners create dark coin and sell it for the most part)
- It adds a ton of full nodes to the network
- It creates demand and scarcity, which should provide a nice return for our investors

Also, these payments are completely secure. New blocks with the dividend payment made out to the incorrect master node will be rejected (the whole network knows who won the election).

At the present moment we have a chicken and egg problem. We need master nodes to support darksend and we don't want to go live with 1 or 2 master nodes. To solve this we will implement the election code into the main client, along with the payments to master nodes while DarkSend is still beta.

What type of return will you see?

- If there’s 1 capable master node, you’ll receive all payments 576*(AverageReward/10) per day

Capable Nodes, Daily Reward
1, 1094DRK
2, 547DKR
5, 218DRK
10, 109DRK
20, 54DRK
50, 21DRK
100, 11DRK

As you can see, we’ll quickly reach equilibrium with the price and at the same time this will create buying pressure raising the price more and causing the network to become increasingly secure.

Also, we can build our master node network now in the immediate. Users can buy the darkcoin needed to run one and they will just run the beta client. We'll open source the election code and hard fork to add the payments to master nodes in and our network will be secure by the time we're ready to do a full launch.

I really love the idea, thoughts?

[illodin]

Sounds awesome imo.

Requirements for running a master node?
- windows ok?
- does it have to be guaranteed to run 24/7 or can it be a desktop computer that's on 2 hours a day?
- public ip?
- static ip?
- is the ip compiled into the wallet?
- possible to run multiple nodes on the same computer?
- etc

[minersday]

The next stage of DarkSend

The design of Darkcoin is all about economic incentives, I've tried to bake as much of that in as possible. I've been thinking about the reliance on master nodes in our new design for securing the network and I see some room for improvement.

With the current design we will require 1000DRK to operate a master node. That requires you putting 1000DRK in a hotwallet (dangerous) only to collect the collateral fees which won't amount to much.

So what do we want?

- We want as many master nodes as possible (the more nodes the more secure the network)
- We want them to be profitable to run
- We want it to be very expensive investment to operate a master node

So I propose the following solution, each block the last master node will receive 10% of the mining reward (in addition to the reward given to the miner). So for example, if the mining reward was 19DRK the last master node will automatically receive 1.9DRK.

This also has some really great side effects:

- It creates a completely new type of investor that buys DRK and holds it (where as miners create dark coin and sell it for the most part)
- It adds a ton of full nodes to the network
- It creates demand and scarcity, which should provide a nice return for our investors

Also, these payments are completely secure. New blocks with the dividend payment made out to the incorrect master node will be rejected (the whole network knows who won the election).

At the present moment we have a chicken and egg problem. We need master nodes to support darksend and we don't want to go live with 1 or 2 master nodes. To solve this we will implement the election code into the main client, along with the payments to master nodes while DarkSend is still beta.

What type of return will you see?

- If there’s 1 capable master node, you’ll receive all payments 576*(AverageReward/10) per day

Capable Nodes, Daily Reward
1, 1094DRK
2, 547DKR
5, 218DRK
10, 109DRK
20, 54DRK
50, 21DRK
100, 11DRK

As you can see, we’ll quickly reach equilibrium with the price and at the same time this will create buying pressure raising the price more and causing the network to become increasingly secure.

I really love the idea, thoughts?

Count me in, I have dedicated vmware machine with dedicated 100mbit con.

[eduffield]

Sounds awesome imo.

Requirements for running a master node?
- windows ok?
- does it have to be guaranteed to run 24/7 or can it be a desktop computer that's on 2 hours a day?
- public ip?
- static ip?
- is the ip compiled into the wallet?
- possible to run multiple nodes on the same computer?
- etc

- windows ok? Yes
- does it have to be guaranteed to run 24/7 or can it be a desktop computer that's on 2 hours a day? 24/7 is required, otherwise you'll get the percentage your computer is on.
- public ip? port 9999 will need to be open
- static ip? doesn't matter
- is the ip compiled into the wallet? no, it's discovered
- possible to run multiple nodes on the same computer? each 1000DRK would be entered as a "ticket" for the election, so one daemon is fine.