[ANN][AUTO-SWITCH] Profit-switch auto-exchange pool: CleverMining.com

[coinflow]

I think, you did not understand what I meant. I wasn't referring to the overall hashrate of the whole clevermining-pool including all users, but the single hashrate of one user.
Why is it dropping, if you count each and every submitted share even of the previous mined coins, after the pool switched? If it was like this, the hashrate could not drop from let's say 80 MH/sec to 60 MH/sec. for some time (sometimes 5 minutes or more), right?

Then I think you don't understand what is “hashrate reported by the pool”. Let me explain.

The pool doesn't know your hashrate. It can only estimate it based on number of shares which your miner submits, so what the pool shows is only an estimation. You miner knows your exact hashrate because it knows how many hashes it calculated. But it only sends to the pool hashes that meet required difficulty (they're called shares) and the pool estimates your hashrate based on these submitted shares (based on knowledge than it takes X MH/s to find one Y-difficulty share per second). But number of shares which your miner finds varies wildly as mining is a kinda-random game. Sometimes you find 10 shares in a minute, sometimes you won't find even a single share in a minute. If you look at 5-minute values then your hashrate estimated based on shares submitted can jump between 60 and 80 MH/s and even more. The shorter the timespan the bigger the variance.  Just like in throwing a dice. If you throw a dice three times and look at each result individually then you can get 1, 3 and 6. If you throw 30 times and take 10-throw averages then you can get 3, 3.6, 4.1. If you throw it 300 times and take 100-throw averages then you can get 3.4, 3.5, 3.6. It's the same with checking 5-minute, 1-hour and 24-hour mining averages. What you want to compare is 24-hour average, anything less is just too vulnerable to variance.

Nothing new here to me.
I'm talking about the reported hashrate over at least 24 hrs. On other pools 80 MH/sec. out of the miner means ~79 MH/sec. reported at the pool side. On your pool it means ~76-78 at best, caused by the massive break-ins (presumably when the coins switch?) and times when the hashrate drops seriously (sometimes even below 70 MH/sec. for a longer time). Wafflepool is the best example on how to use the hashrate the most effective - at least for switching pools (on P2Pools with only one coin the miners output is 82-84 MH/sec. and yields 80-82 net/pool-side hashrate, only to mention it). Aside from the problem, that they only have a reported profitability of ~72% for Scrypt-coins at the moment. But that's another story and not related to the difference between submitted and paid-for hashrate (I hope so, at least ...).

Edit: Just tested your US-server for several hrs, but the result seems to be worse (of course, presumably because of the longer latencies, but you never really know in advance and have to test it), so now switched back to your EU-one.

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[Xenocyde]

(this will change soon as I will be adding more algorithms very soon, but for now it's scrypt-only).

Good news So what algos are you planning to add and how soon is that? 

[Terk]

Hey Terk, I've been mining at your pool continuously for more than 24 hours and according to my statistics given at CM it states my earning as: 0.0031, but I'm mining with 5.5mH/s miner(on an avg 5.33mH/s); so how come my earning is so low? Even if BTC/MH/Day is 0.00066, my 24 hours earning should be 0.000363(0.00351 @ 5.33mH/s). Please care to explain(already the hash-rate displayed at CM for my miner is wrong!).

Thanks

P.S. If the given statistics are true than it seems mining LTC directly is more profitable.

Mining at CM is definitely more profitable than mining straight LTC. I can't really comment on your numbers if you don't tell me your address so that I could check them. Most of the time when people have issues like this it's because they read something on their stats page wrong.

Hello Terk, thanks for replying. Here's my BTC address: 1CfapZ4MW1GGCeW4U4Q6BEFUBYnR7kegB6 .

Thanks

Amount of your hashrate sent to CM is very inconsistent. This is your daily chart. Your earnings at CM are consistent with your hashrate multiplied by BTC/MHs/day as seen at http://www.clevermining.com/profits/30-days



And this is your last 24 hours hourly chart - you've been mining for most of the day at 2.6-2.7 MH/s and jumped to 5.3-5.4 only two hours ago.



Perhaps you have two 2.7 MH/s miners and one of them is switching to some other pools every now and then? The hourly chart suggests this - this is not some random 10-30% off, it simply looks like one miner connected or two.

[Terk]

I think, you did not understand what I meant. I wasn't referring to the overall hashrate of the whole clevermining-pool including all users, but the single hashrate of one user.
Why is it dropping, if you count each and every submitted share even of the previous mined coins, after the pool switched? If it was like this, the hashrate could not drop from let's say 80 MH/sec to 60 MH/sec. for some time (sometimes 5 minutes or more), right?

Then I think you don't understand what is “hashrate reported by the pool”. Let me explain.

The pool doesn't know your hashrate. It can only estimate it based on number of shares which your miner submits, so what the pool shows is only an estimation. You miner knows your exact hashrate because it knows how many hashes it calculated. But it only sends to the pool hashes that meet required difficulty (they're called shares) and the pool estimates your hashrate based on these submitted shares (based on knowledge than it takes X MH/s to find one Y-difficulty share per second). But number of shares which your miner finds varies wildly as mining is a kinda-random game. Sometimes you find 10 shares in a minute, sometimes you won't find even a single share in a minute. If you look at 5-minute values then your hashrate estimated based on shares submitted can jump between 60 and 80 MH/s and even more. The shorter the timespan the bigger the variance.  Just like in throwing a dice. If you throw a dice three times and look at each result individually then you can get 1, 3 and 6. If you throw 30 times and take 10-throw averages then you can get 3, 3.6, 4.1. If you throw it 300 times and take 100-throw averages then you can get 3.4, 3.5, 3.6. It's the same with checking 5-minute, 1-hour and 24-hour mining averages. What you want to compare is 24-hour average, anything less is just too vulnerable to variance.

Nothing new here to me.
I'm talking about the reported hashrate over at least 24 hrs. On other pools 80 MH/sec. out of the miner means ~79 MH/sec. reported at the pool side. On your pool it means ~76-78 at best, caused by the massive break-ins (presumably when the coins switch?) and times when the hashrate drops seriously (sometimes even below 70 MH/sec. for a longer time). Wafflepool is the best example on how to use the hashrate the most effective - at least for switching pools (on P2Pools with only one coin the miners output is 82-84 MH/sec. and yields 80-82 net/pool-side hashrate, only to mention it). Aside from the problem, that they only have a reported profitability of ~72% for Scrypt-coins at the moment. But that's another story and not related to the difference between submitted and paid-for hashrate (I hope so, at least ...).

Edit: Just tested your US-server for several hrs, but the result seems to be worse (of course, presumably because of the longer latencies, but you never really know in advance and have to test it), so now switched back to your EU-one.

Well you were writing about

the hashrate could not drop from let's say 80 MH/sec to 60 MH/sec. for some time (sometimes 5 minutes or more), right

so I didn't have a chance to guess you're talking about 24h averages.

In that case you should read the following post and experiment with manual difficulty which might help: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=448649.msg7360436#msg7360436

In short: there are some ASICs with faulty chips which tend to go dead/frozen if new work is sent very frequently (and CM switches coins more aggressively than other pools). Miner's controller probably restarts them if they don't send a share within reasonable time but that reasonable time is probably based on difficulty and expected time to find a share by the chip. The pool's vardiff adjusts difficulty so that your miner find a share very 10 seconds, but if you have dozens of chips inside one miner then it means each of your chip finds a share once per 5-15 minutes. If the miner restarts dead chips after 3x this time of not producing a share, then your chips can be frozen for half an hour before being restarted. If your miner has lot of frequently faulting chips then this will result in lower hashrate (because some of your chips are not working) and hashrate going up and down randomly. This doesn't happen on single-coin pools and doesn't happen on coin-switching pools which are switching coins slower than CM. This also doesn't happen on CM with miners which don't have faulty/freezing chips. Read the above post and try manual difficulty according to what the posts recommends depending on number of chips and check if this will help. It helped most of people who had similar issue.

[imall4btc]

Hey Terk, I've been mining at your pool continuously for more than 24 hours and according to my statistics given at CM it states my earning as: 0.0031, but I'm mining with 5.5mH/s miner(on an avg 5.33mH/s); so how come my earning is so low? Even if BTC/MH/Day is 0.00066, my 24 hours earning should be 0.000363(0.00351 @ 5.33mH/s). Please care to explain(already the hash-rate displayed at CM for my miner is wrong!).

Thanks

P.S. If the given statistics are true than it seems mining LTC directly is more profitable.

Mining at CM is definitely more profitable than mining straight LTC. I can't really comment on your numbers if you don't tell me your address so that I could check them. Most of the time when people have issues like this it's because they read something on their stats page wrong.

Hello Terk, thanks for replying. Here's my BTC address: 1CfapZ4MW1GGCeW4U4Q6BEFUBYnR7kegB6 .

Thanks

Amount of your hashrate sent to CM is very inconsistent. This is your daily chart. Your earnings at CM are consistent with your hashrate multiplied by BTC/MHs/day as seen at http://www.clevermining.com/profits/30-days



And this is your last 24 hours hourly chart - you've been mining for most of the day at 2.6-2.7 MH/s and jumped to 5.3-5.4 only two hours ago.



Perhaps you have two 2.7 MH/s miners and one of them is switching to some other pools every now and then? The hourly chart suggests this - this is not some random 10-30% off, it simply looks like one miner connected or two.

You might be correct as I've a secondary pool configured for my miners. However it doesn't reports my miners being connected to it. Anyway, I'll reconfigure my miners(deleting secondary pool) and then update after 24 hours of running.

P.S. I don't know what happened(even without reconfiguring my miners) but now my hash-rate is being displayed correctly!!

[jekv2]

0.0 last hour hashrate.

http://www.clevermining.com/users/12NcNYb2oEh6ANo95AakEjPqQdgbcxh4m9

[MobileWill]

0.0 last hour hashrate.

http://www.clevermining.com/users/12NcNYb2oEh6ANo95AakEjPqQdgbcxh4m9

Same here, I was freaking out for a second.

[Rimba]

0.0 last hour hashrate.

http://www.clevermining.com/users/12NcNYb2oEh6ANo95AakEjPqQdgbcxh4m9

Same here, I was freaking out for a second.

same happens in my account, something wrong? are we mining or not?

[XxEnigmaticxX]

0.0 last hour hashrate.

http://www.clevermining.com/users/12NcNYb2oEh6ANo95AakEjPqQdgbcxh4m9

Same here, I was freaking out for a second.

same happens in my account, something wrong? are we mining or not?

same here, probally just a minor glitch. dont see it happen oftn but terk handles it quickly

[alienesb]

Look at the line chart below and you should be fine. Sometimes the circle gets screwed up.

[Terk]

There was some lag in aggregating shares data from all regional servers and hourly round was created with delay. It should all be fine right now. Nothing has been lost - it just was displayed with delay. The website takes literally previous clock hour to display and if it doesn't have data for this hour yet it will display zeros. I might need to add some notice in these rare cases when our stats are delayed to don't create confusion. Sorry for that.

[forseed]

Hi!
I am buying hashpower for at least 10%, up to 20%, less than CM pays, but I'm loosing money.
Any personal opinions?

[byt411]

Hi!
I am buying hashpower for at least 10%, up to 20%, less than CM pays, but I'm loosing money.
Any personal opinions?

I doubt you are. Why would people sell hashpower at lower than market price?
What site are you using?

[suchmoon]

Hi!
I am buying hashpower for at least 10%, up to 20%, less than CM pays, but I'm loosing money.
Any personal opinions?

I doubt you are. Why would people sell hashpower at lower than market price?
What site are you using?

Actually I've seen that too, BetaRigs, LeaseRig yesterday were renting below CM profitability, around 0.0007 when CM was showing 0.0008+ (or whatever the number of zeroes is, we should switch to GH/s pricing, save on typing). The problem might be that CM shows profitability for the LAST 24 hours, whereas the renter is paying in advance and the NEXT 24 hours can be very different, plus there are fees on both ends and all sorts of variances to deal with.

[jekv2]

Hi!
I am buying hashpower for at least 10%, up to 20%, less than CM pays, but I'm loosing money.
Any personal opinions?

I doubt you are. Why would people sell hashpower at lower than market price?
What site are you using?

Actually I've seen that too, BetaRigs, LeaseRig yesterday were renting below CM profitability, around 0.0007 when CM was showing 0.0008+ (or whatever the number of zeroes is, we should switch to GH/s pricing, save on typing). The problem might be that CM shows profitability for the LAST 24 hours, whereas the renter is paying in advance and the NEXT 24 hours can be very different, plus there are fees on both ends and all sorts of variances to deal with.

Someone spoke to me how CM is not that transparent. Is this bad news suchmoon? Is CM skimming the miners?

Even a little goes a long ways. = little from lots of ppl =  big profit.

[suchmoon]

Hi!
I am buying hashpower for at least 10%, up to 20%, less than CM pays, but I'm loosing money.
Any personal opinions?

I doubt you are. Why would people sell hashpower at lower than market price?
What site are you using?

Actually I've seen that too, BetaRigs, LeaseRig yesterday were renting below CM profitability, around 0.0007 when CM was showing 0.0008+ (or whatever the number of zeroes is, we should switch to GH/s pricing, save on typing). The problem might be that CM shows profitability for the LAST 24 hours, whereas the renter is paying in advance and the NEXT 24 hours can be very different, plus there are fees on both ends and all sorts of variances to deal with.

Someone spoke to me how CM is not that transparent. Is this bad news suchmoon? Is CM skimming the miners?

Even a little goes a long ways. = little from lots of ppl =  big profit.

Conspiracy theories aside - since no one can really prove one way or the other - it's currently one of the best performing Scrypt pools and my actual payouts are spot on with what CM shows at the top of every page. So if Terk were to skim, he's either cleverly (see what I did here) avoiding skimming from me, or making even better returns per MH/s than what's showing publicly. And fooling 80+ GH/s worth of miners in the process. Highly doubtful


Edited 2020-11-27 to fix a broken image

http://cryp.today/

[stevie1981]

hi, i'm totally new to mining and have just set my miner up for clevermining. I'm using my amd r9 270x and my current hashrate is about 308 kh/s. i'm hoping somebody will beable to give me an estimate on what i can expect to earn with that and give me some advice on the best way i can gain a higher hashrate withought spending loads of money

[byt411]

hi, i'm totally new to mining and have just set my miner up for clevermining. I'm using my amd r9 270x and my current hashrate is about 308 kh/s. i'm hoping somebody will beable to give me an estimate on what i can expect to earn with that and give me some advice on the best way i can gain a higher hashrate withought spending loads of money

Well, multiply BTC/MHs/Day by 0.308. Also, I get 470kh/s with my R9 270, try finding the optimal settings.

[stevie1981]

lol i'm lost. i only started reading about mining yesterday. what is btc/mhs/day?  and how do i find my optimal settings

[jekv2]

lol i'm lost. i only started reading about mining yesterday. what is btc/mhs/day?  and how do i find my optimal settings

lol. btc/mhs/day = btc per mhs per day.

So, if you have 1 Mh/s per day, just figure out the math.