Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod]

[akhjob]

I think now days most captains are scared to enforce the follow-on after what happened to Australia when they enforced the follow-on against India and then India dominated the Australian bowlers and ended up winning the match. Since then there hasn't been many follow-on enforced by teams as they never know if the team following on bats well. We have seen in the past that teams chasing anything near 500 runs is almost impossible to win the match which is also why most captains decide to bat again.

That match between AUS and IND was an exceptional case, just like the last test match between AUS vs ENG, almost nobody thought that ENG would win that match yet they managed to win. Any team with right mind should enforce follow-on, unless there are external factors of concern like weather, pitch deterioration etc. Enforcing a follow-on will put immense pressure on the opponent, whose batting morale will be low considering that they didn't score much in the 1st innings.  But if you give them a chance to bowl, the morale might increase if they were able to restrict them to a meagre score. And defeating a team with lesser morale is easier than a team boosting in confidence.

[JSRAW]

I don't think it's related to gambling or commercial, India has a history to avoid follow- on numerous times be it home or away test matches. The only logical argument in this test match, Virat can give is net practice for Indian batsmen and resting Seamers.

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Out of 8, Virat didn't ask for follow on 5 times, well, I think he always wants to bat and have some scored besides his name   so that he can get enough chance to chase S. Tendulkar.
I was expecting a follow on yesterday when WI was 79/7.

I don't think if he cares about records much and surpassing Sachin's record is just a matter of time for him. I didn't see the press conference. So not aware what Virat said about not going with follow on, but I am sure the reason would be more or less same " enough rest for bowlers" we shouldn't disregard that India is playing with only 4 bowlers and in the test match every team wants to eliminate every possible scenario of losing a game first.  

2 full days left in the game, the odds are against Windies but imagine for a sec, If they win the Test match. This win can transform windies cricket for good. Chances are dim, but Again Cricket can hit you on guts sometimes.

I think now days most captains are scared to enforce the follow-on after what happened to Australia when they enforced the follow-on against India and then India dominated the Australian bowlers and ended up winning the match. Since then there hasn't been many follow-on enforced by teams as they never know if the team following on bats well. We have seen in the past that teams chasing anything near 500 runs is almost impossible to win the match which is also why most captains decide to bat again.

Fairy tale!! and it changed the Indian cricket tbh. Winning Test against the Mighty Australian team and ending their winning streak of 16 games.

[Haunebu]

In cricket is can be terribly wrong to underestimate your opponents. Indians probably wanted to enhance their batting stats and that may be the reason why they didn't enforced the follow on. But in test cricket, a win is the ultimate aim. You can't lower your chances for a win, just because you want to enhance your individual stats.

Firstly, Kohli usually places his team before himself just like Dhoni and the previous captains and India is going to win this one either way which is why the follow-on doesn't really matter in this case.

And whenever a team gets arrogant and overestimates itself, it suffers setback. At one point of time, India was struggling at 57/4, before half centuries from Ajinkya Rahane and Hanuma Vihari rescued them. Still they ended up with a mediocre score and it took almost 55 overs to score that many runs. had they enforced the follow on, then the match would have been over by now.

400+ lead is a mediocre score against a bowling lineup comprising of bowlers like Bumrah? Hilarious. West Indies have already lost 2 wickets and India is going to win this by a considerable margin.

[erikalui]

Not applying the follow-on rule was not a right decision as they already had a lead of 300+ runs and they could have batted again in the last innings in case they had any runs to chase. Looking for improving batting stats doesn't make sense here so Virat took a wrong decision. Kohli himself got out for 0 then with the poor performance of Rahul and Agarwal.

400+ lead is a mediocre score against a bowling lineup comprising of bowlers like Bumrah? Hilarious. West Indies have already lost 2 wickets and India is going to win this by a considerable margin.

He is talking about the 168 runs made in the second innings. Not the lead.

[UmerIdrees]

In cricket is can be terribly wrong to underestimate your opponents. Indians probably wanted to enhance their batting stats and that may be the reason why they didn't enforced the follow on. But in test cricket, a win is the ultimate aim. You can't lower your chances for a win, just because you want to enhance your individual stats.

Firstly, Kohli usually places his team before himself just like Dhoni and the previous captains and India is going to win this one either way which is why the follow-on doesn't really matter in this case.

And whenever a team gets arrogant and overestimates itself, it suffers setback. At one point of time, India was struggling at 57/4, before half centuries from Ajinkya Rahane and Hanuma Vihari rescued them. Still they ended up with a mediocre score and it took almost 55 overs to score that many runs. had they enforced the follow on, then the match would have been over by now.

400+ lead is a mediocre score against a bowling lineup comprising of bowlers like Bumrah? Hilarious. West Indies have already lost 2 wickets and India is going to win this by a considerable margin.

For a moment people thought that Kholi took a wrong decision and their batsmen may get out quickly in 2nd innings, but remember this is Indian team which have a strong batting line up. They scored 168 pretty easily and then declared. There is no way in the world West Indies weak batting line up can chase 400+ runs against strong Indian bowling.

[AB de Royse777]

He is talking about the 168 runs made in the second innings. Not the lead.

This did not make sense to me. Did Kohli think that they were only 168 runs short with the lead they had in the first innings? It seems like they wasted the 2nd innings. They could ask WI to follow on and can win the match from there. If needed then they could bat later but now it's impossible (assuming WI will not able to chase the run).

Imagine somehow WI managed to chase this run (Yeah, we all know it's not likely to happen but still)?

[JSRAW]

He is talking about the 168 runs made in the second innings. Not the lead.

This did not make sense to me. Did Kohli think that they were only 168 runs short with the lead they had in the first innings? It seems like they wasted the 2nd innings. They could ask WI to follow on and can win the match from there. If needed then they could bat later but now it's impossible (assuming WI will not able to chase the run).

Imagine somehow WI managed to chase this run (Yeah, we all know it's not likely to happen but still)?

Historically Virat doesn't like to give follow on to opposition, guess you missed my post ? he done that atleast 5 times so it makes sense why he didn't opt for follow on.

Windies need 3 big innings to pull this off. If they win then will criticise virat Kohli's decision and more importantly every one will go gaga ( including me ) and say finally cricket won.

[AB de Royse777]

~snip~
Historically Virat doesn't like to give follow on to opposition, guess you missed my post ? he done that atleast 5 times so it makes sense why he didn't opt for follow on.

Yeah, I did see your post the one you are talking about. But adding only 168 and then to declare did not make sense to me. Was he worried about not getting much time to all out WI 2nd innings, or he was worried that rain could interrupt the match?

If he was worried about rain interrupt then forcing WI for follow on was perfect decision since you know that they are not in good shape and you want to finish the match as early as you can without wasting time for your innings. If anything left then you always has chance to bat again.

If he was worried about not getting much time to all out WI 2nd innings then batting the 2nd innings before WI also does not make sense.

In cricketing common sense, it really did not make sense to me. It (the 2nd innings) was a wasted innings for India.

Windies need 3 big innings to pull this off. If they win then will criticise virat Kohli's decision and more importantly every one will go gaga ( including me ) and say finally cricket won.

This WI team does not have the caliber but that's not the excuse. You can not under estimate your opponent. You can slip anytime if you run out of your options.

[JSRAW]

But adding only 168 and then to declare did not make sense to me. Was he worried about not getting much time to all out WI 2nd innings, or he was worried that rain could interrupt the match?

I was expecting follow on too...

I still didn't check his press conference so I can make only educated guess, He might be thinking of giving seamers little more rest because it's hot and India playing with 3 seamers. 2 of them looked slightly uncomfortable in the first inning despite their short spells( Ishant due to heat and bumrah due to cramps) and by doing so giving batsmen another chance to get their forms back, which failed but they added 160+ runs on scoreboard. It ensures that India can't lose the game from here. Tiny chances for windies win.

India coming to bat again also means windies had to field for extra 50+ overs in heat, which is not easy deal considering the fact that they didn't get to rest much in this test match yet. In 3 days gameplay they spent max 3 hours in the dressing room.

There was no rain factor in his mind. And there was enough time to windies batsmen to comeback. There is always tiny possibility that some windies batsmen could fight back in case of follow on. Result tired bowlers leaking runs.

We are still in 4th day and I am expecting windies to show some resistance because pitch is becoming easy to bat on with little support for bowlers but they have 2 full day to get them out plus Indian seamers are fresh and got extra breathing time-out.

PS : ignore the typos using phone

[AB de Royse777]

He might be thinking of giving seamers little more rest because it's hot and India playing with 3 seamers.

The bowling team bowled only 47.1 overs before the wrapping up the WI first innings LOL
This excuse also does not adds up :-P

[JSRAW]

He might be thinking of giving seamers little more rest because it's hot and India playing with 3 seamers.

The bowling team bowled only 47.1 overs before the wrapping up the WI first innings LOL
This excuse also does not adds up :-P

Well was watching match live and Ishant -bumrah were looking uncomfortable. Bumrah went out when he got cramp and Ishant was taking fluid all the time with ice pack.

[Haunebu]

Windies need 3 big innings to pull this off. If they win then will criticise virat Kohli's decision and more importantly every one will go gaga ( including me ) and say finally cricket won.

I agree. Kohli has done an amazing job thus far and I don't really care about small stuff like follow on etc. He must have carefully thought about it which is why it is best to trust his judgement.

But adding only 168 and then to declare did not make sense to me. Was he worried about not getting much time to all out WI 2nd innings, or he was worried that rain could interrupt the match?

Do you guys actually think that West Indies can actually pull this off just like England? I don't get why people tend to focus on the pointless stuff like follow on etc when India has pretty much wrapped this up. My guess is that West Indies will wrap up their innings within 150.

[JSRAW]

^^ Bhai no one saying that windies going to win according to current scenario. But we were arguing about why Kohli didn't opt for follow on. We are trying to make sense or looking for at least one logical reason behind this decision.

[Ayiranorea]

Windies need 3 big innings to pull this off. If they win then will criticise virat Kohli's decision and more importantly every one will go gaga ( including me ) and say finally cricket won.

I agree. Kohli has done an amazing job thus far and I don't really care about small stuff like follow on etc. He must have carefully thought about it which is why it is best to trust his judgement.

But adding only 168 and then to declare did not make sense to me. Was he worried about not getting much time to all out WI 2nd innings, or he was worried that rain could interrupt the match?

Do you guys actually think that West Indies can actually pull this off just like England? I don't get why people tend to focus on the pointless stuff like follow on etc when India has pretty much wrapped this up. My guess is that West Indies will wrap up their innings within 150.

It is a big target for West Indies to defend, also it is important to think about the day at which match is being played. West Indies too performs good, and a strong partnership could change the match. Though there is no one to stand big partnership this time West Indies will surely score above 250 runs.

[erikalui]

This did not make sense to me. Did Kohli think that they were only 168 runs short with the lead they had in the first innings? It seems like they wasted the 2nd innings. They could ask WI to follow on and can win the match from there. If needed then they could bat later but now it's impossible (assuming WI will not able to chase the run).

Imagine somehow WI managed to chase this run (Yeah, we all know it's not likely to happen but still)?

May be he wanted to put up a score of 400+ but still it's not logical when you can chase it down. Now if by any chance WI chase it down (highly impossible looking at WI's state), India will lose the match.

But here's an interesting record:

Moving over to the longest format, India have not lost a Test series against West Indies since 2002 even though the number-one ranked team is still behind in the head-to-head series records.

https://www.indiatoday.in/sports/cricket/story/west-indies-vs-india-test-series-stats-preview-ind-look-to-maintain-17-year-unbeaten-streak-in-tests-vs-wi-1587261-2019-08-21

And again some weird decisions made by India in 2016 and 17:

    
2016-2017 India v New Zealand
2016-2017 India v Bangladesh

India declared their first innings after getting 587, 687 runs and then chose not to follow on after having 250-280+ runs for the other team to defend. They ultimately won both the matches by 321 and 208 runs respectively.

It's been only twice that a team who chose not to follow on have lost the match.

Edit:

Arrest warrant against India cricket star Mohammed Shami

Horrible man if it's true.

[UmerIdrees]

^^ Bhai no one saying that windies going to win according to current scenario. But we were arguing about why Kohli didn't opt for follow on. We are trying to make sense or looking for at least one logical reason behind this decision.

Logically there is no reason on why Kholi did not took follow on.  
Tell me one thing, which is considered as a more big win in test cricket ?

Wining a test match by  200 Runs and an innings ?
OR winning a test match by 600 runs   ?

Kholi must be out of his mind.

[Indymoney]

^^ Bhai no one saying that windies going to win according to current scenario. But we were arguing about why Kohli didn't opt for follow on. We are trying to make sense or looking for at least one logical reason behind this decision.

Logically there is no reason on why Kholi did not took follow on.  
Tell me one thing, which is considered as a more big win in test cricket ?

Wining a test match by  200 Runs and an innings ?
OR winning a test match by 600 runs   ?

Kholi must be out of his mind.

Kohli out of his mind its not problem for India as now they are 120 points and leading World Test Championship table after winning second test by big margin and now they have some good edge against all teams and in very strong position to win this inaugural World Test Championship congrats to them for this big and good win.

[UmerIdrees]

Even Virat did not knew why he did not took the follow ON  

[JSRAW]

^ lol this meme is funny.

And it's not the first time when Kohli took this decision.


@indy : Indian team made it look easy, the only time windies were in the game --first day first session-- After this they gave up against Indian middle-lower order and Indian bowlers. was expecting at least some fight in the final inning.

Yeah, i was checking the point table and as of now it's look weird TBH.

India won 2 match series and got 120 points
SL and NZ both won 1-1 game and have 60 points each
AUS and ENG both won 1-1 and 1 draw, they have 32 points each.

Soon India is going to have 4-5 match series as well. Less win in 4-5 match series - less points. So plenty of chances for every team to comeback, teams playing less game got extra edge IMO.

[Indymoney]

^ lol this meme is funny.

And it's not the first time when Kohli took this decision.


@indy : Indian team made it look easy, the only time windies were in the game --first day first session-- After this they gave up against Indian middle-lower order and Indian bowlers. was expecting at least some fight in the final inning.

Yeah, i was checking the point table and as of now it's look weird TBH.

India won 2 match series and got 120 points
SL and NZ both won 1-1 game and have 60 points each
AUS and ENG both won 1-1 and 1 draw, they have 32 points each.

Soon India is going to have 4-5 match series as well. Less win in 4-5 match series - less points. So plenty of chances for every team to comeback, teams playing less game got extra edge IMO.

India is going to play two series at home against South Africa and Bangladesh and then one away series against New Zealand this is very good time for them to widening gape from tough competitors as they can won these all three and two are two tests and one is three tests against South Africa in my view they can go through 3 - 0 so they will lead for some long time.