Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[DaRude]

...

Edit:
And are you seriously calling for mass targeted killing of civilians at a huge scale towards the end there?

Don't waste your time on this character, this is a walking collection of propaganda clichés. A typical Ukrainian neo-Nazi, with every statement he makes an aggressive anti-advertisement to the Zelensky regime. The only benefit of his statements is that it becomes clear why Ukraine needs denazification.

You enjoying the new drones that I predicted to hit Moscow just one day ago and today it was the truth.Russia how funny they are,one of their generals said some time before that hardly any sky is shielded more than that of Moscow yet drones are hitting the financial district,Russia is incapable of protecting their own citizens and the so called elite which work in that institution that was hit.Ukraine never forget any war crimes Russia has made and will make them pay as Zelensky says it is only a natural process that the war will be felt inside Russia,inside Moscow.I am waiting for more strikes and devastation against a country which started a war out of nowhere and this is the end of malevolent countries.

I'm trying to find any military reason for these drone attacks on the business center, but unfortunately I can't. And a repeated strike on the same building in Moscow City refutes the version of the Russian Defense Ministry that the first drone was suppressed by electronic warfare, these were targeted Ukrainian attacks on a skyscraper in Moscow, in which there are no military facilities. Simply put, this is pure terrorist attack.

I understand why Ukraine resorts to terrorist tactics - because its counter-offensive is failing. I understand, but I don't condone it. It is impossible to defend democratic values by terrorist methods. Soon even its most zealous supporters in the West will turn their backs on Ukraine, because support for Ukraine already smells very shitty.

No.It is because Russia continuously strikes civilian targets not later than yesterday killing an 10 year old girl.This is a response to Russian terror and it is only natural that Russia feels the same what Ukrainians are feeling because of Russian barbarism.The Russians claim they hit no civilian targets yet today they hit a dormitory in Kharkiv,luckily without dead persons.Russian have killed children,have made mass graves and systematically hit civilian targets in Ukrainian cities so it is only a natural response and what I find the most funny is terrorists (Russia are the true ones starting a war out of nowhere and killing civilians as a sign of desperation in the battlefield,stalled invasion) are calling the victim who tries to defend a terrorist  .

@Branko , the US clearly has ask for forgiveness although it is not worthy after the damage they have done yet they have spend billions in help rebuilding Iraq after then,not justifying them,it was a mistake and they ask for forgiveness.

:

You keep moronically tip-toeing around a serious topic. Simple question, do you condemn attacks on civilians in RF without military justification (hint: response to what they did is NOT military justification)?

Oh, yes, let's not tiptoe... do you condemn Ruzzian attacks in schools, restaurants, civilian buildings including churches, hospitals, entertainment and shopping places?

I absolutely deplore any targeted attack on civilians without military justification, and fully condemn any idiot even hinting or joking about committing such atrocities. Furthermore, I think any civilian casualty is a tragedy be they Afghans, Iraqis, Yugoslavs, Libyans, Ukrainians, Yemenis or whatever, and only a deplorable waste of a human life would gloat or encourage such heinous crimes, no ifs and buts about this. There, super easy answer. Now to the big question, why such basic statement that is self evident to overwhelming majority of humans is so hard for UA supporters on this forum to say?

   There are millions of Ukrainians living/working in Russia as well as millions of mixed marriages/families. Despite all of the danger Russians are still gladly travel to Crimea with their families for summer vacation where majority of population was born in Ukraine/Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic. Tens of thousands born in Ukrain/UASSR are currently fighting on the side of Russia (old DRP/LRP) against current Ukrainian regime, and since the start of the war more Ukrainians refugees went to Russia than to any other country. As of 31July2023 2086 civilians were killed on the RU controlled territory and 7283 on UA controlled. So attacking force resulted in 249% more civilian losses on the UA side, from what i have gathered RU launched over 5000 missiles and 2000 drones (as well as significantly more artillery shells, and MLRS rockets) for every incoming missile/shahed you want to intercept on average of more than 1.0 air defense missile needs to be launched (defense in depth). with some air defense missiles deciding to go as far as Poland. Now seeing these numbers compare it to other conflicts, and then tell us if data shows any systematic targeting of civilian population (hint it shows exact opposite, civilian looses are much lower than expected for conflict of this scale)

...
Blowing the Nord Stream II looks like the RF army doing to kind of "make a point" on regards to EU aid and aligns well with a country that is under a Junta.

In my view, this is an act of war. The Orc army could have chosen any other target right? A bridge in France, a factory in Germany... Why do you think they would hit NS II? The answer is very simple: it is not in NATO territory and does not grant a NATO mobilisation which would end any expectation of even a technical "victory" in the invasion.

Now, what does YOUR critical thinking tell you about this?

So how about for some accountability of claims, knowing what we know now that there is irrefutable evidence of explosive residue leading directly to UA soldiers with information from EU that Gen. Zaluzhny was involved, are you going to stand by your words and still think that this was an act of war from Ukraine on Germany? Or going to backpedal on this? If you were mislead yourself, and thus inadvertently mislead other readers on this forum, what lead you to come to such wrong conclusion, or were you the one intentionally doing misleading? Guess in that case you'll just ignore everything and just jump on whatever is in the headlines this hour.

There is no irrefutable evidence. You are just stating non-facts without any evidence.

Please notice the "looks like" in my text before you try to accuse me of anything. You do not have any facts because there are no proven facts other than probably some archive somewhere that may be open in 50 years for now... if ever. The difference is that you do make firm statements with no base while I say "looks like".

I think still think there is a very high likelyhood of Ruzzia being behind this. Easy target, lots of damage, right time,...

Ahh yes dig yourself in deeper, approach, after all when you lost all your credibility there is really no more downside to making stuff up right? Here are some of your quotes:
Meanwhile, the disconnect between the RF army chief Psychos and the diplomatic and civil side of the government is show again in the terrorist attacks against Nord Stream II.
The Nord Stream was mainly a RF doing, because Ukraine asked for payment for the pass through their territory, paid with German money.
...Bottomline, as it is now, it looks like international terrorism from Adolf Putin's Psychos and the Chief Orcs.
as the RF has destroyed the Nord Streams "outside NATO territory". Seems that Mafia rules have found an equivalent response

Western officials no longer suspect Russia of ordering alleged attack against undersea gas pipelines
...

Ah yes denial, great strategy. I will thread crap all day long, but when confronted with it, instead of admitting that i was wrong I just won't believe anything that doesn't fit my narrative for 50years...wait maybe not even then, defense. The cope is really strong with this one

This is me waiting for your irrefutable evidence to contradict my views while you wonder around my posts - and keep quoting my "looks like" which means exactly that.

I am sorry you do not like how things work in the world, but the fact is that secret ops are secret, so no reason for you to run into baby rant. If you do not like that sometimes the truth will not be know, jump to a parallel universe where you are omniscient.

And by the wat, if you insist in judging other's credibility, start providing some sources or you will just be another of the wall-texters trolling here. As of now, you are pretty much at the bottom feeding end of the disinformation effort.

But... to things that actually matter, the breaking of the grain deal and the bombing of grain silos has fired back in the form of attacks on Ruzzian vessels. It seems that insurance costs (or even the possibility of insuring) cuts both ways.

Who is the volunteer to explain to Adolf Putin (thanks for reminding) how a country with no navy is damaging the Ruzzian ships so effectively.

The Wall Street Journal found that the company that rented the boat—a 50-foot pleasure yacht named Andromeda—was founded and controlled by Ukrainians who were Polish residents who used Polish bank accounts and an accountant and paralegal based in Krakow, according to interviews with people familiar with the company and corporate filings.
...
Poland, which is conducting its own, more limited investigation, has known about the role of the company, Feeria Lwowa, since March, Polish officials said. About three weeks ago, investigators visited its registered office in Warsaw for the first time, conducting a brief meeting that lasted only a few minutes
...
“You asked more questions than they did,” an office worker present during the raid told Journal reporters who visited.
...
German investigators have identified some of the six members of the sabotage crew on board the Andromeda. The suspects haven’t been named but investigators say they are Ukrainian citizens.

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

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[montaga]

The only winners any war have always been the Banks.

https://interestingengineering.com/culture/us-tech-powering-russian-military

[BADecker]

The only winners any war have always been the Banks.

https://interestingengineering.com/culture/us-tech-powering-russian-military

The only winners in any war are the Jesus-salvation believing Christians. If they win the war, or if they lose it, when they lose their lives, they gain eternal life in the next age, in glory and joy.

[1miau]

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Unfortunately, your claims are (once again) without any solid proof. There's exactly no proof pointing out that Ukraine is behind it. This boat story is just too weak and doesn't make really sense, like the expert in the ZDF article has explained. But you just ignore it...
Everything could be faked by Russia to have a false flag, where Ukraine is accused.
No wonder, pro-russian trolls are always jumping on that unproven story.
You are a good example for that.
After 1.5 years of war against Ukraine, Putin knows he can trust his apologists. 

It's a big shame that you are trying so vehemently to discredit Ukraine and throw Ukraine under the bus.
It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so. It's just pointless for Ukraine to blow up this useless pipeline, where already way before it happened, everyone knew, that NordStream 2 would never deliever any gas to Germany as long as Putin or his war crimes friends are waging war in Ukraine. No need for any western actor to blow it up...
And when the war is over, Germany will have 100% renewable energy and just don't need any Russian gas.
Russia has failed miserably.
Deal with it.   

[BADecker]

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Unfortunately, your claims are (once again) without any solid proof. There's exactly no proof pointing out that Ukraine is behind it. This boat story is just too weak and doesn't make really sense, like the expert in the ZDF article has explained. But you just ignore it...
Everything could be faked by Russia to have a false flag, where Ukraine is accused.
No wonder, pro-russian trolls are always jumping on that unproven story.
You are a good example for that.
After 1.5 years of war against Ukraine, Putin knows he can trust his apologists. 

It's a big shame that you are trying so vehemently to discredit Ukraine and throw Ukraine under the bus.
It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so. It's just pointless for Ukraine to blow up this useless pipeline, where already way before it happened, everyone knew, that NordStream 2 would never deliever any gas to Germany as long as Putin or his war crimes friends are waging war in Ukraine. No need for any western actor to blow it up...
And when the war is over, Germany will have 100% renewable energy and just don't need any Russian gas.
Russia has failed miserably.
Deal with it.   

Your ideas are missing so much. Russia doesn't really care if Germany gets their gas or not. The pipeline to China is joining the two largest countries of the world in trade agreements. Who really cares about Europe and Nato? Russia doesn't need them, but they will ultimately need Russia... when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

[1miau]

when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

Well, only in case your deranged Trumpturd can fool enough Trumptards to vote for him...

[BADecker]

when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

Well, only in case your deranged Trumpturd can fool enough Trumptards to vote for him...

Kinda right. If Trump wins, we will have peace in Ukraine and Russia, and probably in the China-Taiwan thing, and in many other places in the world. Then, the US will probably resign from Nato, and there will be even more peace.

[1miau]

when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

Well, only in case your deranged Trumpturd can fool enough Trumptards to vote for him...

Kinda right. If Trump wins, we will have peace in Ukraine and Russia, and probably in the China-Taiwan thing, and in many other places in the world.

Once Putler has deported all Ukrainians from Ukraine to Siberia, yes. 
But well not actually peace, see below:

Then, the US will probably resign from Nato, and there will be even more peace.

I doubt it. Once Putin realizes he can burn down half of Europe without much resistance, he'll certainly do it. 
Or haven't Russians said "we'll march to Warsaw / Berlin / Paris / London"? It's just one of my nightmares, I guess... 

[paxmao]

...

Edit:
And are you seriously calling for mass targeted killing of civilians at a huge scale towards the end there?

Don't waste your time on this character, this is a walking collection of propaganda clichés. A typical Ukrainian neo-Nazi, with every statement he makes an aggressive anti-advertisement to the Zelensky regime. The only benefit of his statements is that it becomes clear why Ukraine needs denazification.

You enjoying the new drones that I predicted to hit Moscow just one day ago and today it was the truth.Russia how funny they are,one of their generals said some time before that hardly any sky is shielded more than that of Moscow yet drones are hitting the financial district,Russia is incapable of protecting their own citizens and the so called elite which work in that institution that was hit.Ukraine never forget any war crimes Russia has made and will make them pay as Zelensky says it is only a natural process that the war will be felt inside Russia,inside Moscow.I am waiting for more strikes and devastation against a country which started a war out of nowhere and this is the end of malevolent countries.

I'm trying to find any military reason for these drone attacks on the business center, but unfortunately I can't. And a repeated strike on the same building in Moscow City refutes the version of the Russian Defense Ministry that the first drone was suppressed by electronic warfare, these were targeted Ukrainian attacks on a skyscraper in Moscow, in which there are no military facilities. Simply put, this is pure terrorist attack.

I understand why Ukraine resorts to terrorist tactics - because its counter-offensive is failing. I understand, but I don't condone it. It is impossible to defend democratic values by terrorist methods. Soon even its most zealous supporters in the West will turn their backs on Ukraine, because support for Ukraine already smells very shitty.

No.It is because Russia continuously strikes civilian targets not later than yesterday killing an 10 year old girl.This is a response to Russian terror and it is only natural that Russia feels the same what Ukrainians are feeling because of Russian barbarism.The Russians claim they hit no civilian targets yet today they hit a dormitory in Kharkiv,luckily without dead persons.Russian have killed children,have made mass graves and systematically hit civilian targets in Ukrainian cities so it is only a natural response and what I find the most funny is terrorists (Russia are the true ones starting a war out of nowhere and killing civilians as a sign of desperation in the battlefield,stalled invasion) are calling the victim who tries to defend a terrorist  .

@Branko , the US clearly has ask for forgiveness although it is not worthy after the damage they have done yet they have spend billions in help rebuilding Iraq after then,not justifying them,it was a mistake and they ask for forgiveness.

:

You keep moronically tip-toeing around a serious topic. Simple question, do you condemn attacks on civilians in RF without military justification (hint: response to what they did is NOT military justification)?

Oh, yes, let's not tiptoe... do you condemn Ruzzian attacks in schools, restaurants, civilian buildings including churches, hospitals, entertainment and shopping places?

I absolutely deplore any targeted attack on civilians without military justification, and fully condemn any idiot even hinting or joking about committing such atrocities. Furthermore, I think any civilian casualty is a tragedy be they Afghans, Iraqis, Yugoslavs, Libyans, Ukrainians, Yemenis or whatever, and only a deplorable waste of a human life would gloat or encourage such heinous crimes, no ifs and buts about this. There, super easy answer. Now to the big question, why such basic statement that is self evident to overwhelming majority of humans is so hard for UA supporters on this forum to say?

   There are millions of Ukrainians living/working in Russia as well as millions of mixed marriages/families. Despite all of the danger Russians are still gladly travel to Crimea with their families for summer vacation where majority of population was born in Ukraine/Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic. Tens of thousands born in Ukrain/UASSR are currently fighting on the side of Russia (old DRP/LRP) against current Ukrainian regime, and since the start of the war more Ukrainians refugees went to Russia than to any other country. As of 31July2023 2086 civilians were killed on the RU controlled territory and 7283 on UA controlled. So attacking force resulted in 249% more civilian losses on the UA side, from what i have gathered RU launched over 5000 missiles and 2000 drones (as well as significantly more artillery shells, and MLRS rockets) for every incoming missile/shahed you want to intercept on average of more than 1.0 air defense missile needs to be launched (defense in depth). with some air defense missiles deciding to go as far as Poland. Now seeing these numbers compare it to other conflicts, and then tell us if data shows any systematic targeting of civilian population (hint it shows exact opposite, civilian looses are much lower than expected for conflict of this scale)

...
Blowing the Nord Stream II looks like the RF army doing to kind of "make a point" on regards to EU aid and aligns well with a country that is under a Junta.

In my view, this is an act of war. The Orc army could have chosen any other target right? A bridge in France, a factory in Germany... Why do you think they would hit NS II? The answer is very simple: it is not in NATO territory and does not grant a NATO mobilisation which would end any expectation of even a technical "victory" in the invasion.

Now, what does YOUR critical thinking tell you about this?

So how about for some accountability of claims, knowing what we know now that there is irrefutable evidence of explosive residue leading directly to UA soldiers with information from EU that Gen. Zaluzhny was involved, are you going to stand by your words and still think that this was an act of war from Ukraine on Germany? Or going to backpedal on this? If you were mislead yourself, and thus inadvertently mislead other readers on this forum, what lead you to come to such wrong conclusion, or were you the one intentionally doing misleading? Guess in that case you'll just ignore everything and just jump on whatever is in the headlines this hour.

There is no irrefutable evidence. You are just stating non-facts without any evidence.

Please notice the "looks like" in my text before you try to accuse me of anything. You do not have any facts because there are no proven facts other than probably some archive somewhere that may be open in 50 years for now... if ever. The difference is that you do make firm statements with no base while I say "looks like".

I think still think there is a very high likelyhood of Ruzzia being behind this. Easy target, lots of damage, right time,...

Ahh yes dig yourself in deeper, approach, after all when you lost all your credibility there is really no more downside to making stuff up right? Here are some of your quotes:
Meanwhile, the disconnect between the RF army chief Psychos and the diplomatic and civil side of the government is show again in the terrorist attacks against Nord Stream II.
The Nord Stream was mainly a RF doing, because Ukraine asked for payment for the pass through their territory, paid with German money.
...Bottomline, as it is now, it looks like international terrorism from Adolf Putin's Psychos and the Chief Orcs.
as the RF has destroyed the Nord Streams "outside NATO territory". Seems that Mafia rules have found an equivalent response

Western officials no longer suspect Russia of ordering alleged attack against undersea gas pipelines
...

Ah yes denial, great strategy. I will thread crap all day long, but when confronted with it, instead of admitting that i was wrong I just won't believe anything that doesn't fit my narrative for 50years...wait maybe not even then, defense. The cope is really strong with this one

This is me waiting for your irrefutable evidence to contradict my views while you wonder around my posts - and keep quoting my "looks like" which means exactly that.

I am sorry you do not like how things work in the world, but the fact is that secret ops are secret, so no reason for you to run into baby rant. If you do not like that sometimes the truth will not be know, jump to a parallel universe where you are omniscient.

And by the wat, if you insist in judging other's credibility, start providing some sources or you will just be another of the wall-texters trolling here. As of now, you are pretty much at the bottom feeding end of the disinformation effort.

But... to things that actually matter, the breaking of the grain deal and the bombing of grain silos has fired back in the form of attacks on Ruzzian vessels. It seems that insurance costs (or even the possibility of insuring) cuts both ways.

Who is the volunteer to explain to Adolf Putin (thanks for reminding) how a country with no navy is damaging the Ruzzian ships so effectively.

The Wall Street Journal found that the company that rented the boat—a 50-foot pleasure yacht named Andromeda—was founded and controlled by Ukrainians who were Polish residents who used Polish bank accounts and an accountant and paralegal based in Krakow, according to interviews with people familiar with the company and corporate filings.
...
Poland, which is conducting its own, more limited investigation, has known about the role of the company, Feeria Lwowa, since March, Polish officials said. About three weeks ago, investigators visited its registered office in Warsaw for the first time, conducting a brief meeting that lasted only a few minutes
...
“You asked more questions than they did,” an office worker present during the raid told Journal reporters who visited.
...
German investigators have identified some of the six members of the sabotage crew on board the Andromeda. The suspects haven’t been named but investigators say they are Ukrainian citizens.

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Finally we have something to discuss, it takes you a while to get of the irate responses and actually say something even if you have just one source and even if it is behind a paywall.

So, you base you accusation to the Ukrainian government of blowing up the NS because:

- A small vessel was around (definetly not at "the scene" which is 80 m below the water).
- That small vessel was rented by an Ukrainian company and sailed / operated from Poland.
- The vessel was in the area for 12 hours.
- Intelligence sources (take with plenty of salt) say that the US told Ukraine not to blow it up.

Anything else? Because that is not enough.

Other sources say:

German investigators now believe that six individuals using fake passports rented a sailing yacht in September, embarked from Germany and planted explosives that severed the pipelines, according to officials familiar with that investigation. They believe the operatives were skilled divers, given that the explosives were planted at a depth of about 240 feet, in the range that experts say helium would be helpful for maintaining mental focus.

So this is now from Germany.

The June plot differs from the September attack in some respects. The European intelligence report notes that the Ukrainian operatives planned to attack the Nord Stream 1 pipeline, but it makes no mention of Nord Stream 2, a newer line. The intelligence report also says that the saboteurs would embark from a different location in Europe, not Warnemünde, a German port town on the Baltic, where the Andromeda was rented.

What I see in here is lots on unreliable information and "may be 's". Certainly nothing "irrefutable" or beyond doubt... unless you really need to believe it of course.

So, go doggy, search for more posts and wall-text to cover the issue: You are giving credit to anything that supports your view, while actually claiming those same sources are biased when they do not. I guess that is what you call "credibility"?? I am good without, thanks.

when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

Well, only in case your deranged Trumpturd can fool enough Trumptards to vote for him...

Kinda right. If Trump wins, we will have peace in Ukraine and Russia, and probably in the China-Taiwan thing, and in many other places in the world. Then, the US will probably resign from Nato, and there will be even more peace.

Oh... BA you are doubting now? Your post usually say "when Trump wins" but this time is "If Trump wins". Are you loosing your faith? Is it because of the indictments that you are no longer sure?

https://www.politico.com/interactives/2023/trump-criminal-investigations-cases-tracker-list/

2 felony counts (including one conspiracy count) of obstructing an official proceeding under 18 U.S.C. § 1512 | 1 felony count of conspiracy to defraud the United States under 18 U.S.C. § 371 | 1 felony count of conspiracy against rights under 18 U.S.C. § 241

One alleges a scheme to defraud the United States through a sustained effort to impede the collection, counting and certification of votes in the 2020 election. And the fourth charge accuses Trump of a conspiracy to deprive citizens of a right secured under federal law — specifically, the right to vote and to have one’s vote counted.

On Aug. 1, 2023, the grand jury approved an indictment against Trump, charging him with an extraordinary conspiracy that threatened to disenfranchise millions of Americans.

And I hear you say this a man-hunt, all politically motivated?  When you are the f**ing president of the USA you have to behave exceptionally well, because you hold exceptional power. This is something that Trump does not seem to understand and is bringing shame to the nation.

A pity that the best the dems could put together was Biden.

[crypto_trader#43xzEXrP]

All this russianian terroristics shit is just an idea of Yanukovich and Khuilo. Just Google the "Yanukovich's letter".
Russians are not RSFSRanians and not a russianians, who stolen a weapons of USSR, and betrayed the people of USSR, and real democracy in USSR.
Let's fuck them all, with all their generalitetes.

[BADecker]

when the US cuts them all off... like it is slowly cutting dumb, noisy, little Ukraine off.

Well, only in case your deranged Trumpturd can fool enough Trumptards to vote for him...

Kinda right. If Trump wins, we will have peace in Ukraine and Russia, and probably in the China-Taiwan thing, and in many other places in the world.

Once Putler has deported all Ukrainians from Ukraine to Siberia, yes. 
But well not actually peace, see below:

Then, the US will probably resign from Nato, and there will be even more peace.

I doubt it. Once Putin realizes he can burn down half of Europe without much resistance, he'll certainly do it. 
Or haven't Russians said "we'll march to Warsaw / Berlin / Paris / London"? It's just one of my nightmares, I guess... 

Nobody - not even Putin - wants to burn down the people he wants to trade with.

[DaRude]

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Unfortunately, your claims are (once again) without any solid proof. There's exactly no proof pointing out that Ukraine is behind it. This boat story is just too weak and doesn't make really sense, like the expert in the ZDF article has explained. But you just ignore it...
Everything could be faked by Russia to have a false flag, where Ukraine is accused.
No wonder, pro-russian trolls are always jumping on that unproven story.
You are a good example for that.
After 1.5 years of war against Ukraine, Putin knows he can trust his apologists.  

It's a big shame that you are trying so vehemently to discredit Ukraine and throw Ukraine under the bus.
It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so. It's just pointless for Ukraine to blow up this useless pipeline, where already way before it happened, everyone knew, that NordStream 2 would never deliever any gas to Germany as long as Putin or his war crimes friends are waging war in Ukraine. No need for any western actor to blow it up...
And when the war is over, Germany will have 100% renewable energy and just don't need any Russian gas.
Russia has failed miserably.
Deal with it.  

Another anonymous forum investigative journalist uncovering false flag operations without a single citation. You funny, yes yes now Putin controls all western media. It's your right not to believe what every single major newspaper says, or their quotes of gov officials. Just don't expect anyone to believe your silly conspiracy theories. I fully expect Germany to issue arrest warrants for those Ukrainians soon, then you'll have two options either claim they're RU double secret agents or Putin brainwashed all Germans with his alien ray gun. What's even more hilarious is that you're not even original in this thought, as covering your ears and ignoring everything is pretty much the current official position  

Biden administration officials now privately concede there is no evidence that conclusively points to Moscow’s involvement. But publicly they have deflected questions about who might be responsible. European officials in several countries have quietly suggested that Ukraine was behind the attack but have resisted publicly saying so over fears that blaming Kyiv could fracture the alliance against Russia. At gatherings of European and NATO policymakers, officials have settled into a rhythm; as one senior European diplomat said recently, “Don’t talk about Nord Stream.”

...
The European intelligence made clear that the would-be attackers were not rogue operatives. All those involved reported directly to Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s highest-ranking military officer, who was put in charge so that the nation’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, wouldn’t know about the operation, the intelligence report said.

...

Finally we have something to discuss, it takes you a while to get of the irate responses and actually say something even if you have just one source and even if it is behind a paywall.

So, you base you accusation to the Ukrainian government of blowing up the NS because:

- A small vessel was around (definetly not at "the scene" which is 80 m below the water).
- That small vessel was rented by an Ukrainian company and sailed / operated from Poland.
- The vessel was in the area for 12 hours.
- Intelligence sources (take with plenty of salt) say that the US told Ukraine not to blow it up.

Anything else? Because that is not enough.
...

You can pretend that you're an investigative journalist all you want, but unlike your claims made without any citations, these are not my accusations, you're not arguing with me but with Washington Post, WSJ, Spigel, Guardian, New York Times, CNN etc etc etc...(which are really not known to sympathize with Russia, in fact i don't know what major publication did NOT pick up on this story). So instead of posting your opinions on anonymous forum i suggest you write a strongly worded letter to all these newspapers and let them know how they're all wrong and that they should retract their story, because paxmao just refuses to believe it, and together with 1miau have another theory of how it all went down with Putin on the narwhal. Post a link and I'll gladly read it if you'll get them to published it. I hate to be the one breaking it to you this way, but without citing more credible sources, no one really cares if an anonymous user is not convinced that the world is spherical.

[paxmao]

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Unfortunately, your claims are (once again) without any solid proof. There's exactly no proof pointing out that Ukraine is behind it. This boat story is just too weak and doesn't make really sense, like the expert in the ZDF article has explained. But you just ignore it...
Everything could be faked by Russia to have a false flag, where Ukraine is accused.
No wonder, pro-russian trolls are always jumping on that unproven story.
You are a good example for that.
After 1.5 years of war against Ukraine, Putin knows he can trust his apologists.  

It's a big shame that you are trying so vehemently to discredit Ukraine and throw Ukraine under the bus.
It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so. It's just pointless for Ukraine to blow up this useless pipeline, where already way before it happened, everyone knew, that NordStream 2 would never deliever any gas to Germany as long as Putin or his war crimes friends are waging war in Ukraine. No need for any western actor to blow it up...
And when the war is over, Germany will have 100% renewable energy and just don't need any Russian gas.
Russia has failed miserably.
Deal with it.  

Another anonymous forum investigative journalist uncovering false flag operations without a single citation. You funny, yes yes now Putin controls all western media. It's your right not to believe what every single major newspaper says, or their quotes of gov officials. Just don't expect anyone to believe your silly conspiracy theories. I fully expect Germany to issue arrest warrants for those Ukrainians soon, then you'll have two options either claim they're RU double secret agents or Putin brainwashed all Germans with his alien ray gun. What's even more hilarious is that you're not even original in this thought, as covering your ears and ignoring everything is pretty much the current official position  

Biden administration officials now privately concede there is no evidence that conclusively points to Moscow’s involvement. But publicly they have deflected questions about who might be responsible. European officials in several countries have quietly suggested that Ukraine was behind the attack but have resisted publicly saying so over fears that blaming Kyiv could fracture the alliance against Russia. At gatherings of European and NATO policymakers, officials have settled into a rhythm; as one senior European diplomat said recently, “Don’t talk about Nord Stream.”

...
The European intelligence made clear that the would-be attackers were not rogue operatives. All those involved reported directly to Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s highest-ranking military officer, who was put in charge so that the nation’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, wouldn’t know about the operation, the intelligence report said.

...

Finally we have something to discuss, it takes you a while to get of the irate responses and actually say something even if you have just one source and even if it is behind a paywall.

So, you base you accusation to the Ukrainian government of blowing up the NS because:

- A small vessel was around (definetly not at "the scene" which is 80 m below the water).
- That small vessel was rented by an Ukrainian company and sailed / operated from Poland.
- The vessel was in the area for 12 hours.
- Intelligence sources (take with plenty of salt) say that the US told Ukraine not to blow it up.

Anything else? Because that is not enough.
...

You can pretend that you're an investigative journalist all you want, but unlike your claims made without any citations, these are not my accusations, you're not arguing with me but with Washington Post, WSJ, Spigel, Guardian, New York Times, CNN etc etc etc...(which are really not known to sympathize with Russia, in fact i don't know what major publication did NOT pick up on this story). So instead of posting your opinions on anonymous forum i suggest you write a strongly worded letter to all these newspapers and let them know how they're all wrong and that they should retract their story, because paxmao just refuses to believe it, and together with 1miau have another theory of how it all went down with Putin on the narwhal. Post a link and I'll gladly read it if you'll get them to published it. I hate to be the one breaking it to you this way, but without citing more credible sources, no one really cares if an anonymous user is not convinced that the world is spherical.

Again, making things up - I did not ever say I am a journalist.

I do not make any claim, I clearly stated that I am expressing my view based on my reasoning on who has to gain from the event. I am not blind and I understand that there are other reasons why this could have been done by others. The Nordstream by-passed Ukraine, that is there for everyone to see.

However you are effectively making a claim stating that there is "irrefutable proof" - that is not an view or an opinion, is an statement of facts -  thus you do have to provide such evidence. But you cannot, because whether you like it or not secret ops are mostly secret unless Snowden shows himself around.

[BADecker]

The Ukraine leaders don't mind so much when their soldiers are wounded or killed by Russians. They have found a good use for dead or wounded soldiers. More than likely, any dead or wounded Russians that Ukraine grabs, wind up in the same position.


Kiev covering up illegal organ trade – Moscow


https://www.rt.com/russia/580958-russia-ukraine-organ-trafficking/
Russia's Foreign Ministry spokeswoman has alleged that members of Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky's administration are personally engaged in, and are covering up, the illicit export of human organs.

In an article published on the Foreign Ministry's website, Maria Zakharova cited media reports suggesting that the organs of killed Ukrainian soldiers, such as hearts, kidneys and livers, have been appearing on some of the biggest marketplaces of the dark net, with prices starting at €5,000 ($5,500). One dealer allegedly claimed that it takes 48-60 hours to receive any desired organ in a medical box, with deliveries limited to EU countries.

Zakharova noted that organs were also being traded offline, citing reports from June that representatives of a health ministry in a NATO country had struck a deal with some "private businessmen" who were assisted by Ukraine's Health Ministry and Presidential Office to deliver a refrigerated train car full of human organs and body parts.

According to the spokeswoman, organ trafficking in Ukraine has boomed since the authorities in Kiev passed a number of laws that "drastically simplified the work of transplant specialists in the country."

Specifically, Zakharova pointed to last year's Law No. 5610, which exempted transplantation from value-added tax, and the December 2021 Law No. 5831, which removed the need to notarise the written consent or authenticate the signature of a living donor to give up their organs.
...

[1miau]

Another anonymous forum investigative journalist uncovering false flag operations without a single citation.

You should read less Putin propaganda, you are already lying like Russian propagandists from Putler TV.
So, the expert Göran Swistek from my post above is "no citation"?  
Seriously?

Göran Swistek, an expert in maritime security, has enormous doubts about the one-ship theory:

https://www.zdf.de/nachrichten/politik/nord-stream-andromeda-segeljacht-anschlag-sabotage-ukraine-krieg-102.html

Are you accusing me of plagiarism now? It's not a "citation"?
You are just delusional.

But to disappoint you even more, here's another German investigation where your "Ukrainian boat" theory gets rejected:

Putin's secret convoi

You funny, yes yes now Putin controls all western media.

Nope, except bombing and destroying Ukrainian cities, fooling idiots like you is everything, Putin has "achieved" so far. What a shameful record...  

I fully expect Germany to issue arrest warrants for those Ukrainians soon

Luckily Putin's clowns are far away from getting into power in Germany, so I have to disappoint you.  

It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so.

I stand corrected, it's your 6th post where you are defending war criminal Putler...  

[DaRude]

Another anonymous forum investigative journalist uncovering false flag operations without a single citation.

You should read less Putin propaganda, you are already lying like Russian propagandists from Putler TV.
So, the expert Göran Swistek from my post above is "no citation"?  
Seriously?

Göran Swistek, an expert in maritime security, has enormous doubts about the one-ship theory:

https://www.zdf.de/nachrichten/politik/nord-stream-andromeda-segeljacht-anschlag-sabotage-ukraine-krieg-102.html

Are you accusing me of plagiarism now? It's not a "citation"?
You are just delusional.

But to disappoint you even more, here's another German investigation where your "Ukrainian boat" theory gets rejected:

Putin's secret convoi

You funny, yes yes now Putin controls all western media.

Nope, except bombing and destroying Ukrainian cities, fooling idiots like you is everything, Putin has "achieved" so far. What a shameful record...  

I fully expect Germany to issue arrest warrants for those Ukrainians soon

Luckily Putin's clowns are far away from getting into power in Germany, so I have to disappoint you.  

It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so.

I stand corrected, it's your 6th post where you are defending war criminal Putler...  

Seriously i have provided citations from major international publications with quotes of their sources in intelligence agencies all over the world, and best you could come up with is a quote from a German public-service television broadcaster with 16% reach in Germany citing an "expert in maritime security"? Pretty weak from the start but if your whole hypothesis is resting on this, lets take a look.

In order to blow up the pipelines, investigators estimate that around 500 kilograms of TNT equivalent would be needed per explosion. Exactly how much was used cannot be said because it is unclear which explosive was used was used.

Published 16 March 2023 with "enormous doubts about the one-ship theory" of your expert mostly resting on the half a ton of TNT equivalent. And just two month later on 26 May 2023 this was published, completely destroying your little theory.

According to SPIEGEL information, the metadata of an e-mail that was sent when the Andromeda 5+ sailing yacht allegedly used to transport the explosives was rented leads to Ukraine.
…
There is also repeated talk of a so-called "false flag" operation by Russia. Among those familiar with the process, this is considered extremely unlikely. Behind the scenes, it was even said early on that Moscow had no real motive for the crime.
…
In the cabin of the "Andromeda" the remains of an explosive suitable for use under water were found over a large area. It is said to be octogen, an explosive that is widespread in both the West and the former Eastern bloc. Investigators have described the explosive power of the explosive charges used as equivalent to 500 kilograms of TNT.
…
Oktogen is much lighter than TNT, could be transported by a relatively small boat, and could have been taken to the bottom of the Baltic Sea by experienced combat divers. The often-put-up thesis that the assassins could only have brought the explosives to the site of the attack because of its weight with a larger ship and possibly a mini-submarine is no longer applicable Intelligence services suspect Ukrainian perpetrators

Do you do any research at all before posting something? Or you just enjoy being embarrassed? Are you saying SPIEGEL is Russian propaganda now? Do you think they're lying to you? Did you contact them explaining how you disagreed with their theory and told them what you thought really happened? Did they laugh?

Tip about the boat came from the source inside of Ukraine of one of the EU intelligence agencies, boat was placed at the scene of explosions, explosive residue on the pipe matched to the residue found on the boat, 6 members of the sabotage crew are Ukrainian citizens. travel agency booking the boat was founded and controlled by Ukrainians with Polish bank accounts accountants and paralegals. CIA director and German intelligence officers are on record saying that evidence don't point to Russia. And found DNA matched (through his son in Germany) to a 26yr old Ukrainian soldier (not yet identified), who left Germany for Ukraine. At this point too many people are involved, and with every fifth person in Germany supporting AfD (and presumably many more in police/military circles) that they won't be able to keep this under covers. But nothing gets past your critical thinking, because through your hallucinations you just know that it was aliens Putin placed those explosives himself while riding a trained narwhal, you should contact all these publications immediately with your theory, so they can all publish corrections!

You've demonstrated that you're not even able to read your own quotes, to notice that most don't have "looks like" in them. So i don't really expect you to be able to read this either. And I'm sorry, but I just don't have the coloring pencils to draw it out in color pictures for you. But continue, do tell us what else looks like "Russia did it" to you, after all with your track record we're all very interested in hearing your next, spot on unbiased, carefully cited, predictions.

Unfortunately, your claims are (once again) without any solid proof. There's exactly no proof pointing out that Ukraine is behind it. This boat story is just too weak and doesn't make really sense, like the expert in the ZDF article has explained. But you just ignore it...
Everything could be faked by Russia to have a false flag, where Ukraine is accused.
No wonder, pro-russian trolls are always jumping on that unproven story.
You are a good example for that.
After 1.5 years of war against Ukraine, Putin knows he can trust his apologists.  

It's a big shame that you are trying so vehemently to discredit Ukraine and throw Ukraine under the bus.
It's already your 5th post, where you are trying to accuse Ukraine for something, you have no valid proof for and Ukraine has no profit to do so. It's just pointless for Ukraine to blow up this useless pipeline, where already way before it happened, everyone knew, that NordStream 2 would never deliever any gas to Germany as long as Putin or his war crimes friends are waging war in Ukraine. No need for any western actor to blow it up...
And when the war is over, Germany will have 100% renewable energy and just don't need any Russian gas.
Russia has failed miserably.
Deal with it.  

Another anonymous forum investigative journalist uncovering false flag operations without a single citation. You funny, yes yes now Putin controls all western media. It's your right not to believe what every single major newspaper says, or their quotes of gov officials. Just don't expect anyone to believe your silly conspiracy theories. I fully expect Germany to issue arrest warrants for those Ukrainians soon, then you'll have two options either claim they're RU double secret agents or Putin brainwashed all Germans with his alien ray gun. What's even more hilarious is that you're not even original in this thought, as covering your ears and ignoring everything is pretty much the current official position  

Biden administration officials now privately concede there is no evidence that conclusively points to Moscow’s involvement. But publicly they have deflected questions about who might be responsible. European officials in several countries have quietly suggested that Ukraine was behind the attack but have resisted publicly saying so over fears that blaming Kyiv could fracture the alliance against Russia. At gatherings of European and NATO policymakers, officials have settled into a rhythm; as one senior European diplomat said recently, “Don’t talk about Nord Stream.”

...
The European intelligence made clear that the would-be attackers were not rogue operatives. All those involved reported directly to Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s highest-ranking military officer, who was put in charge so that the nation’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, wouldn’t know about the operation, the intelligence report said.

...

Finally we have something to discuss, it takes you a while to get of the irate responses and actually say something even if you have just one source and even if it is behind a paywall.

So, you base you accusation to the Ukrainian government of blowing up the NS because:

- A small vessel was around (definetly not at "the scene" which is 80 m below the water).
- That small vessel was rented by an Ukrainian company and sailed / operated from Poland.
- The vessel was in the area for 12 hours.
- Intelligence sources (take with plenty of salt) say that the US told Ukraine not to blow it up.

Anything else? Because that is not enough.
...

You can pretend that you're an investigative journalist all you want, but unlike your claims made without any citations, these are not my accusations, you're not arguing with me but with Washington Post, WSJ, Spigel, Guardian, New York Times, CNN etc etc etc...(which are really not known to sympathize with Russia, in fact i don't know what major publication did NOT pick up on this story). So instead of posting your opinions on anonymous forum i suggest you write a strongly worded letter to all these newspapers and let them know how they're all wrong and that they should retract their story, because paxmao just refuses to believe it, and together with 1miau have another theory of how it all went down with Putin on the narwhal. Post a link and I'll gladly read it if you'll get them to published it. I hate to be the one breaking it to you this way, but without citing more credible sources, no one really cares if an anonymous user is not convinced that the world is spherical.

Again, making things up - I did not ever say I am a journalist.

I do not make any claim, I clearly stated that I am expressing my view based on my reasoning on who has to gain from the event. I am not blind and I understand that there are other reasons why this could have been done by others. The Nordstream by-passed Ukraine, that is there for everyone to see.

However you are effectively making a claim stating that there is "irrefutable proof" - that is not an view or an opinion, is an statement of facts -  thus you do have to provide such evidence. But you cannot, because whether you like it or not secret ops are mostly secret unless Snowden shows himself around.

I concede, you got me, you're absolutely correct! I said that Ukraine did it, but Ukraine is a country and as such technically unable to perform terrorism, which only humans are capable of doing.

[suchmoon]

I concede, you got me, you're absolutely correct! I said that Ukraine did it, but Ukraine is a country and as such technically unable to perform terrorism, which only humans are capable of doing.

You seem to be enormously agitated by this pipeline that was made useless by your glorious leader long before it was damaged. What happened to the whole "let Europe freeze" strategy?

Anyways, even if "Ukraine" had done it, how the fuck would it be terrorism if they're at war with Putinstan... are we still pretending that it's just a "special operation" and it's super unfair for the special operators to suffer any consequences?

[paxmao]

...

...

Finally we have something to discuss, it takes you a while to get of the irate responses and actually say something even if you have just one source and even if it is behind a paywall.

So, you base you accusation to the Ukrainian government of blowing up the NS because:

- A small vessel was around (definetly not at "the scene" which is 80 m below the water).
- That small vessel was rented by an Ukrainian company and sailed / operated from Poland.
- The vessel was in the area for 12 hours.
- Intelligence sources (take with plenty of salt) say that the US told Ukraine not to blow it up.

Anything else? Because that is not enough.
...

You can pretend that you're an investigative journalist all you want, but unlike your claims made without any citations, these are not my accusations, you're not arguing with me but with Washington Post, WSJ, Spigel, Guardian, New York Times, CNN etc etc etc...(which are really not known to sympathize with Russia, in fact i don't know what major publication did NOT pick up on this story). So instead of posting your opinions on anonymous forum i suggest you write a strongly worded letter to all these newspapers and let them know how they're all wrong and that they should retract their story, because paxmao just refuses to believe it, and together with 1miau have another theory of how it all went down with Putin on the narwhal. Post a link and I'll gladly read it if you'll get them to published it. I hate to be the one breaking it to you this way, but without citing more credible sources, no one really cares if an anonymous user is not convinced that the world is spherical.

Again, making things up - I did not ever say I am a journalist.

I do not make any claim, I clearly stated that I am expressing my view based on my reasoning on who has to gain from the event. I am not blind and I understand that there are other reasons why this could have been done by others. The Nordstream by-passed Ukraine, that is there for everyone to see.

However you are effectively making a claim stating that there is "irrefutable proof" - that is not an view or an opinion, is an statement of facts -  thus you do have to provide such evidence. But you cannot, because whether you like it or not secret ops are mostly secret unless Snowden shows himself around.

I concede, you got me, you're absolutely correct! I said that Ukraine did it, but Ukraine is a country and as such technically unable to perform terrorism, which only humans are capable of doing.

I have no interest whatsoever in "getting you", I do have interest in providing the right information (better, information that is right). You did not just say "Ukraine did it" (which I freely translate for the Ukrainian Government organised it), you said there was irrefutable proof of it. You showed some articles that mention very loose connections and mostly suspicions (even the titles of some say "suspicion").

Bottom line, there is no proof. My personal view - Russia most likely did it. My guess is that Ukraine would not damage infrastructure that mostly benefits Germany - an ally - and could stop EU aid if detected. Yes, I will write it again, the NS benefited mostly Germany.

[swogerino]

I concede, you got me, you're absolutely correct! I said that Ukraine did it, but Ukraine is a country and as such technically unable to perform terrorism, which only humans are capable of doing.

You seem to be enormously agitated by this pipeline that was made useless by your glorious leader long before it was damaged. What happened to the whole "let Europe freeze" strategy?

Anyways, even if "Ukraine" had done it, how the fuck would it be terrorism if they're at war with Putinstan... are we still pretending that it's just a "special operation" and it's super unfair for the special operators to suffer any consequences?

That is funny.The terrorists are yelling,look out,terrorist attacks against our country.As Zelensky said,the war will come to Russia,especially to those parts supporting the unprovoked illegal war at the maximum and it has started yesterday with a boom in that optical factory,of course the Russians said it was the boiler room taking fire but Ukraine presidential advisor said from the images and videos shown it does not look like it was the pyrotechnics who got fire claiming may be some other reason.It is good for the Russians to feel the same pain Ukrainians have so maybe they react and call to the reason to act upon and stop Putler.

[paxmao]

I concede, you got me, you're absolutely correct! I said that Ukraine did it, but Ukraine is a country and as such technically unable to perform terrorism, which only humans are capable of doing.

You seem to be enormously agitated by this pipeline that was made useless by your glorious leader long before it was damaged. What happened to the whole "let Europe freeze" strategy?

Anyways, even if "Ukraine" had done it, how the fuck would it be terrorism if they're at war with Putinstan... are we still pretending that it's just a "special operation" and it's super unfair for the special operators to suffer any consequences?

That is funny.The terrorists are yelling,look out,terrorist attacks against our country.As Zelensky said,the war will come to Russia,especially to those parts supporting the unprovoked illegal war at the maximum and it has started yesterday with a boom in that optical factory,of course the Russians said it was the boiler room taking fire but Ukraine presidential advisor said from the images and videos shown it does not look like it was the pyrotechnics who got fire claiming may be some other reason.It is good for the Russians to feel the same pain Ukrainians have so maybe they react and call to the reason to act upon and stop Putler.

Fat chance... I think Ruzzian society has "embraced the suck". They are mostly apathic and just either believing or pretending that nothing is happening or just accepting it like a fact of life and go about their business or to the front if they are enslaved enlisted to go.

For example, I saw a video of a big "boom" in Sevastopol... filmed by someone sunbathing in a nearby beach, and it was not deserted precisely, people just kept about their stuff... nothing new, no problem, nothing to worry about Vania. Or during Prigozin's "lobbying to influence legislation" with an armed column, people just went to the streets to see the tanks as if a carnival parade (well, short of was I recon).

I think they do not see how the change is possible, it could only come from the military and that is probably not a change. How could it happen? If the economy really goes down the drain very badly and there is a serious problem in the front.