[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[Anon136]

As long as they accept one crypto of any kind we can just shapeshift.io

This is all just so exciting! I'm so glad to be here and be part of what can only be called the beginnings of a new (peaceful) revolution.

that if they ever add Monero to shapeshift...

I just mean it as a concept. Not meaning to make it about that exact website specifically.

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[vokain]

Since the emission mostly happens in the first 4 years (?), I'm not really in agreement regarding fewer people accumulating.
If we are to succeed, besides places to spend Monero (which might just amount to plugins in the near future), we need a wide disbursement.

Here's my consideration: at this point in time, it is also not without strong hands accumulating and holding that the price rises to reflect/organically attract a larger network effect. Strong hands that hold are another simple component of the power law, and are also more likely to be able to hold a position without contributing to the emotional roller coaster that traders create in the market (because considering the long term, they have less of a tendency to trade in a panic), and those disciplined will contribute to lowering volatility through market making. A wide distribution would be welcome, but without more fundamental developments aside from the already considered community development track record and non-user friendly though decreasingly so privacy software, we don't yet have anything concrete (referring to dev and research goals graphic) so this organically widening just won't happen until you have something a wide userbase could scalably use—til then it's still just speculation, and strong hands typically speculate to invest.

[Its About Sharing]

Any plans to give an interview on the Let's Talk Bitcoin network (alt channel so to speak). I just listened to an interview with the creator of DRK/dash and it was interesting to say the least. I would have liked a Monero guy on there to give an opposing/alternaive viewpoint. I think a little debate will help the stronger coin out. I'm in XMR's corner of course, but not reading much these days on its main competitor makes me feel a bit out of touch.

Related, can we ever have a wallet app on e.g. Android, for XMR as opposed to a web wallet- is there anything creative we can do?

IAS

Thanks for the replies. I do think more factual comments about Monero and how it compares to Dark will help us. I get that Dark/Dash may be a scam to some, but for those that don't know the differences, name calling doesn't really help the cause. (Not saying everyone does that.)

Any idea on Monero being on LTBTC (one of their shows) or the like? I really think this can give us some exposure.

Since the emission mostly happens in the first 4 years (?), I'm not really in agreement regarding fewer people accumulating.
If we are to succeed, besides places to spend Monero (which might just amount to plugins in the near future), we need a wide disbursement.

Some readings for you:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=939072.msg10291319#msg10291319
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=939072.msg10299280#msg10299280
If you have time, just read the whole topic of the above links.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=279249.msg6804719#msg6804719
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=978447.msg10696989#msg10696989
http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/29471/are-there-any-true-anonymous-cryptocurrencies
http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/2nu9rg/darkcoin_anoncoin_shadowcash_monero/cmh5ekr

Folks,

If you are a Monero holder or thinking about being one (Dark Dash as well), you should really have a look at the links dEBRUYNE's posted above.
I went through everything and then some, learned quite a bit. It is not all facts as is usual some name calling between camps takes place but
what I came away with is MANY questions regarding what is behind DRK/Dash. I have some questions for Monero as well, but they don't have
to do with the security of the coin, cryptography, etc.

At this point there are really just two anonymous coins worth mentioning, Monero and Dark/Dash. Dash has the market cap lead but to be honest, beyond
that I would say XMR is the much bigger risk to reward (If I was a Dash holder it would be cheap to hedge with XMR, but the other direction just ain't there.)
Unless BTC dies, I don't know if the reward (at this point) with Dash is there. One can argue the same for XMR, but that would take BTC using XMR like sidechains
in the near future and that isn't happening in the next 2-3 years.

I worry about how Dash was put together (more computer scientists and less cryptographic experts behind the technology - more complicated that this),
not that it isn't good/great for person to person transfers, but once you take into account privacy with the alphabet agencies, that is where Monero shines
(for starters, but a newb like me can't do it justice here).

I do hope Monero can find a way to make the size of the blockchain manageable though perhaps that remains reasonable due to the ever increasing size of disk space
(but it will get in the way of a smartphone wallet, unless they get creative, which I think will happen in time (tough point)).

Who knows, perhaps Monero (or Dash) integrates some of the experimental technology when proven in the near future, to solve some current "problems". Since
Moneros current "problem" is more about the size of the blockchain (if indeed a problem), I'm not too worried. But Dash has questions that run much deeper, again,
not that it isn't good or won't come out the winner - first mover advantage is huge I know. Not sure how many more hard forks Dash can handle though before the user
base is gone.

Thanks again,
IAS

[smooth]

I do hope Monero can find a way to make the size of the blockchain manageable though perhaps that remains reasonable due to the ever increasing size of disk space
(but it will get in the way of a smartphone wallet, unless they get creative, which I think will happen in time (tough point)).

My smartphone has 128 GB. I guess cheaper ones have less, but in a year or two it seems this might be fairly common. The current blockchain is 5 GB stored inefficiently (pretty much everything is duplicated; over time we can improve that, although I'm not sure how how high it ranks as a priority).

I've seen smartphone games that are similar in size to the Monero blockchain, and people install those.

I'm not sure that running full node on a smartphone is what people will necessarily want to do, as other options exist with some partial privacy compromises, but if you really want to do it, the size of the blockchain doesn't get in the way really.

[fluffypony]

My smartphone has 128 GB. I guess cheaper ones have less, but in a year or two it seems this might be fairly common. The current blockchain is 5 GB stored inefficiently (pretty much everything is duplicated; over time we can improve that, although I'm not sure how how high it ranks as a priority).

I've seen smartphone games that are similar in size to the Monero blockchain, and people install those.

I'm not sure that running full node on a smartphone is what people will necessarily want to do, as other options exist with some partial privacy compromises, but if you really want to do it, the size of the blockchain doesn't get in the way really.

Case in point:)

The problem with deduplication is we sacrifice performance, which is critical on a smartphone...so the compromise will probably always tend towards less storage efficiency for the sake of performance. I'd be VERY interested to see how the lmdb-vl32 version performs on an ARM phone.

[iCEBREAKER]

I'd be VERY interested to see how the lmdb-vl32 version performs on an ARM phone.

...I'd be happy with XCN's mini-blockchain running on my phone.  Monero is for hloding, not spending on candy and popcorn.

[smooth]

...I'd be happy with XCN's mini-blockchain running on my phone.  Monero is for hloding, not spending on candy and popcorn.

Yes but with a smartphone wallet you can receive more Monero everywhere you go!

[iCEBREAKER]

...I'd be happy with XCN's mini-blockchain running on my phone.  Monero is for hloding, not spending on candy and popcorn.

Yes but with a smartphone wallet you can receive more Monero everywhere you go!

Right, but if I'm there *in person* so much for anonymity.   

Besides, a QR.png of my address works for receiving.

Or why not just point the browser at MyMonero?

[smooth]

...I'd be happy with XCN's mini-blockchain running on my phone.  Monero is for hloding, not spending on candy and popcorn.

Yes but with a smartphone wallet you can receive more Monero everywhere you go!

Right, but if I'm there *in person* so much for anonymity.  

Besides, a QR.png of my address works for receiving.

With just that you can't tell if it was actually sent.

Or why not just point the browser at MyMonero?

Works for me

I'm not sure that running full node on a smartphone is what people will necessarily want to do, as other options exist with some partial privacy compromises

[Joshuar]

The purpose of "e cash"/Monero is to give you anonymity/privacy on online transactions. Like cash, but without the centralization. If a account app was there for Monero on the appstore, you could use it to buy w/e and retain financial privacy. Blockchain size is irrelevant concerning such things.

[cAPSLOCK]

The purpose of "e cash"/Monero is to give you anonymity/privacy on online transactions. Like cash, but without the centralization. If a account app was there for Monero on the appstore, you could use it to buy w/e and retain financial privacy. Blockchain size is irrelevant concerning such things.

Well..  It's technically relevant.

Lets say we scale to 100x our current transaction traffic (And we better hope we do).  How long will it take to fill up a 32G SD card with the blockchain.

This reality will dictate the solutions to these problems...  it's relevant,  But not insurmountable IMHO.

[smooth]

The purpose of "e cash"/Monero is to give you anonymity/privacy on online transactions. Like cash, but without the centralization. If a account app was there for Monero on the appstore, you could use it to buy w/e and retain financial privacy. Blockchain size is irrelevant concerning such things.

Well..  It's technically relevant.

Lets say we scale to 100x our current transaction traffic (And we better hope we do).  How long will it take to fill up a 32G SD card with the blockchain.

This reality will dictate the solutions to these problems...  it's relevant,  But not insurmountable IMHO.

All true, but 32 GB sd cards are pretty low end at this point. There are 512 GB sd cards already (expensive, for now).

Obviously there are other solutions too, besides just storing the whole blockchain, as you say.

[cAPSLOCK]

The purpose of "e cash"/Monero is to give you anonymity/privacy on online transactions. Like cash, but without the centralization. If a account app was there for Monero on the appstore, you could use it to buy w/e and retain financial privacy. Blockchain size is irrelevant concerning such things.

Well..  It's technically relevant.

Lets say we scale to 100x our current transaction traffic (And we better hope we do).  How long will it take to fill up a 32G SD card with the blockchain.

This reality will dictate the solutions to these problems...  it's relevant,  But not insurmountable IMHO.

All true, but 32 GB sd cards are pretty low end at this point. There are 512 GB sd cards already (expensive, for now).

Obviously there are other solutions too, besides just storing the whole blockchain, as you say.

And I think it's important that we cater to the lowest common denominator.  And that may be indeed much higher than a 32G SD card, but even though we are technophiles (mostly) here now, we want to shoot for the broadest acceptance possible.  Bitcoin is still a mystery to too many.  And just disseminating why Monero is worthy is a challenge of it's own.

I have been more interested in DRK since the recent drama...  and I did a renewed level of DD over it.

The fact there are SO MANY people who are willing to buy into a platform with SEVERE problems worries me.  Because if people can't understand why DRK is bad, then how will they understand why Monero is good?

Just musing a little...

[Joshuar]

Oh I believed that you wouldn't have to download the blockchain on a monero app/webaccount, like blockchain.info?

[cAPSLOCK]

Oh I believed that you wouldn't have to download the blockchain on a monero app/webaccount, like blockchain.info?

I think this is a good idea.  It is the way crypto as a whole will go.  Not only Monero.

It's the one reason I use Electrum over Armory.

[GreekBitcoin]

The purpose of "e cash"/Monero is to give you anonymity/privacy on online transactions. Like cash, but without the centralization. If a account app was there for Monero on the appstore, you could use it to buy w/e and retain financial privacy. Blockchain size is irrelevant concerning such things.

Well..  It's technically relevant.

Lets say we scale to 100x our current transaction traffic (And we better hope we do).  How long will it take to fill up a 32G SD card with the blockchain.

This reality will dictate the solutions to these problems...  it's relevant,  But not insurmountable IMHO.

All true, but 32 GB sd cards are pretty low end at this point. There are 512 GB sd cards already (expensive, for now).

Obviously there are other solutions too, besides just storing the whole blockchain, as you say.

And I think it's important that we cater to the lowest common denominator.  And that may be indeed much higher than a 32G SD card, but even though we are technophiles (mostly) here now, we want to shoot for the broadest acceptance possible.  Bitcoin is still a mystery to too many.  And just disseminating why Monero is worthy is a challenge of it's own.

I have been more interested in DRK since the recent drama...  and I did a renewed level of DD over it.

The fact there are SO MANY people who are willing to buy into a platform with SEVERE problems worries me.  Because if people can't understand why DRK is bad, then how will they understand why Monero is good?

Just musing a little...

It doesnt matter much. Because those who really need to have privacy will use the one that gives them privacy. They wont even dare to use the one that have obvious problems.

[smooth]

Oh I believed that you wouldn't have to download the blockchain on a monero app/webaccount, like blockchain.info?

Yes of course. I've mentioned alternatives to the whole blockchain a few times.

I guess this discussion about the blockchain size got started over the question of whether having a full blockchain on a smartphone was feasible at all. Obviously it's problematic but since there are games that are roughly the same size, it seems it isn't totally non-feasible.

But none of that is meant to suggest there wouldn't be lighter weight approaches too.

[mrkavasaki]

if GUI comming out soon, than i think drk  will be pointless

[David Latapie]

ripple (though im not sure its really a crypto currency, you have to decide yourself

They are not.

There are also a small number of digital currencies, the most prominent of which is Ripple, that seek consensus through non-cryptographic means

[Joshuar]

if zerocash comming out soon, than i think drk and xmr will be pointless

I've given this huge thought. I believe almost the opposite. Monero offers both transparency and anonymity. That is especially crucial for a decentralized currency, so that if it ever gets popular and widely used, there can still be optional ways for you to be transparent if you wish.