[ANN] [VIA] ★ Viacoin ★ ~ the future of digital currency ~ ★

[btcdrak]

Looks interesting. Which library are you using?

pycoin

Oh yeah, I remember submitting a PR for this project.

The only thing I don't like about BIP32 is if a the public master key is published and any private key of any subkey is leaked, all private keys for all possible key in the HD chain can be derived. Makes me very wary of publishing the master public key.

I know, I suppose the trick here is... not to publish your private keys .
One of bitcoins biggest appeals to me is that it forces us to take responsibility for ourselves, and if you intend to use the address purely for ID then you wouldn't care any way.
[/quote]

So overall, how does your system prove identity?

[1713514166]

1713514166

[derrend]

So overall, how does your system prove identity?

Keys are associated with urls, we return a string encrypted with the cert from the url (if available) which can be submitted for verification. Anyone can register as say google.com though and be unverified. Only key and url are required.
The site keeps a count of the number of searches for each key, authenticity is inferred from this number
 

[btcdrak]

So overall, how does your system prove identity?

Keys are associated with urls, we return a string encrypted with the cert from the url (if available) which can be submitted for verification. Anyone can register as say google.com though and be unverified. Only key and url are required.
The site keeps a count of the number of searches for each key, authenticity is inferred from this number
 

I don't understand how this cryptographically proves identity. What am I missing?

[derrend]

I don't understand how this cryptographically proves identity. What am I missing?

Read the [ANN] dude.

[btcdrak]

I don't understand how this cryptographically proves identity. What am I missing?

Read the [ANN] dude.

So unless I am missing something obvious I dont see how this works: For a start, anyone with the BIP32 public master can derive all possible keys. Are you storing the public master keys? Because if it's a closed database the entire system relies on your security, if you get hacked all keys are leaked. You are using the term "proof of publication" but I didn't see that anything was being published in a provable manner. Proof-of-publication usually refers to data published and timestamped on the blockchain. There is no proof-of-publication under your model because you cannot prove/validate your own data which (appears to be stored privately) has not been tampered with because there are no cryptographic proofs published on a blockchain ledger. This is why I said don't understand the security model because unless I have missed something because there isn't much in the way of technical details on the ANN.

[derrend]

This is why I said don't understand the security model because unless I have missed something because there isn't much in the way of technical details on the ANN.

Don't try and pretend you read the [ANN] Drak, you're fooling no one .

It's the public key that gets submitted and there is no block chain to speak of.
It's a matter of likelihood based on the number of times the subkey has been searched for .
Production, not publication.

[btcdrak]

This is why I said don't understand the security model because unless I have missed something because there isn't much in the way of technical details on the ANN.

Don't try and pretend you read the [ANN] Drak, you're fooling no one .

It's the public key that gets submitted and there is no block chain to speak of.
It's a matter of likelihood based on the number of times the subkey has been searched for .
Production, not publication.

I read the ANN and it's technical unsound. The whole point of cryptography is that you dont need to reveal any secrets in order to make cryptographic proofs. Per se, there is nothing wrong with a centralised trusted service which yours appears to be, but it is presenting technologies as being cryptographically secure when in fact it's not. It is simply not a sound proposition. Calling it cryptographic proof-of-publication is entirely misleading and is vulnerable to a wide range of attacks and information leaks.

[derrend]

I read the ANN and it's technical unsound. The whole point of cryptography is that you dont need to reveal any secrets in order to make cryptographic proofs. Per se, there is nothing wrong with a centralised trusted service which yours appears to be, but it is presenting technologies as being cryptographically secure when in fact it's not. It is simply not a sound proposition. Calling it cryptographic proof-of-publication is entirely misleading and is vulnerable to a wide range of attacks and information leaks.

It's not 'publication' it's 'production' and you reveal no secrets when you divulge a public key (apart from its subkeys in this case).
'cryptographic probability of production' would be technically correct but since Heisenberg showed us that all certainty is a matter of likelihood I don't feel guilty about using the word 'proof' because a measure of likelihood is what it provides.

[btcdrak]

I read the ANN and it's technical unsound. The whole point of cryptography is that you dont need to reveal any secrets in order to make cryptographic proofs. Per se, there is nothing wrong with a centralised trusted service which yours appears to be, but it is presenting technologies as being cryptographically secure when in fact it's not. It is simply not a sound proposition. Calling it cryptographic proof-of-publication is entirely misleading and is vulnerable to a wide range of attacks and information leaks.

It's not 'publication' it's 'production' and you reveal no secrets when you divulge a public key (apart from its subkeys in this case).
'cryptographic probability of production' would be technically correct but since Heisenberg showed us that all certainty is a matter of likelihood I don't feel guilty about using the word 'proof' because a measure of likelihood is what it provides.

I'll reply in the ANN thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1059474.msg11401446#msg11401446

[btcdrak]

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/35hpkt/please_remind_me_once_again_why_we_cant_decrease/cr4wk0g

What is your opinion on this Drak ? What's about current VIA capacity (transactions per second).

Thanks.

I'm going to give a purist reply. While Viacoin has a slightly larger tps at the moment this is irrelevant because the issue being discussed is a matter of scalability not parameters. Viacoin has the same scalability issues a Bitcoin. Namely you cannot just continue to increase blocksize to and achieve linear scalability. If Bitcoin were to increase to 20MB blocks and they get full, then what? The more you increase blocksize, the more you are likely to change the incentives of the network as well as hit up against bottlenecks. The knock-on effects are that the requirements to run a full node increase to the point of knocking out participants. There will be more propagation delays, potentially more orphan blocks, potentially different miner incentive attacks (attacking other miners). The UTXO set is likely to balloon. Fundamentally increasing blocksize (while it will probably have to happen at some point), is not a long term solution to bitcoin's scalability issues which by design are O(n^2). It seems likely that some kind of off-chain solutions will have to be developed if Bitcoin is going to scale up to hundreds or thousands of tps. This is where things like OP_CHECKLOCKTIMEVERIFY will come in handy because it helps power such solutions.

[btcdrak]

Any plans to add Masternodes to this? It would open up a stream of possible cooperation with other projects like BCR and SPR, in fact every coin that is using my adaptation (i.e every coin cloned from CRAVE).

DS and IX are not necessary, just the MN implementation.

I'd like to know more about what you are aiming towards. I am not overly enthused by the whole masternodes design, DS or IX (which is technically unsound). Masternodes create a two tier network destroying the true decentralised model so introducing them or not would have to be weighed benefits to risks.

[bitcreditscc]

Any plans to add Masternodes to this? It would open up a stream of possible cooperation with other projects like BCR and SPR, in fact every coin that is using my adaptation (i.e every coin cloned from CRAVE).

DS and IX are not necessary, just the MN implementation.

I'd like to know more about what you are aiming towards. I am not overly enthused by the whole masternodes design, DS or IX (which is technically unsound). Masternodes create a two tier network destroying the true decentralised model so introducing them or not would have to be weighed benefits to risks.

There is no change in the network actually, a MN is simply a node with an extra few jobs it can do. if ten people are running normal nodes..how does adding an extra MN flag to those nodes ruin the decentralization? True IX can do with an over-haul, and we can throw DS in the trash. 

Masternodes have created a window through which we can allow limited and monitored cross chain communication there by opening us to new and far reaching innovations, it is simply a major breakthrough. Imagine, cross chain reinforcement, atomic trades, contracts and more.

Each chain's master nodes have their internal purposes, in my case they are called Bank nodes, insurance nodes or escrow nodes depending on what extra flag will be enabled and what new code this activates.

Take a look at my use case fro cross chain event/outputs tracking:-

Say you want a loan of 100K BCR and meet all the requirements, the Bank node owner and the internal system however stipulate that you offer collateral or ask for more proof of your solvency. You can then send a message to the BN signed with your VIA address, the BN then contacts MNs from the VIA network and using it's local copy of the VIA blockchain, calculates your trust rating and credit score based on similar metrics used on the BCR chain.

Now the chain agrees you can be trusted and ups your rating, poof, you have your loan! Or it can require you deposit some VIA into insurance node as collateral and again , you have your loan.

Essentially, we will be building apps on top of the normal client software that will govern new types of behavior on the network, and this behavior can use data or resources of multiple chains. In my case , i have already finished a rudimentary credit calculator, the internal messaging is glitchy but once it is operational, it will allow secure communication between all types of nodes, and by using special formats for messages, we can even automate some of the functions.

Imagine the use cases each individual (real) developer can come up with and the sheer scalability of such simple yet powerful tools. Using filtered messaging and monetizing multi-chain support, we can say that if BCR , DGC, STK and VIA have 10 nodes respectively, and three on each are fully active MNs then each network will show a total of 19 nodes!!!! Apart form the great advantages of security, we can also relay transactions faster and further that we have been doing all along.

Each coin that joins only adds a small bit to the overall resource footprint, but brings in a ton of advantages. Monetizing this incentivizes users to build a larger , stronger more resilient network and (with extra work) we can being chain tethering of transactions. (meaning, that with the right signatures, even IX will be slower than our transactions)


So much potential for growth. The first step, is agreeing to cooperate.

[stormia]

Listen to Drak tell you not to hold any altcoin, or BTC for that matter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHYjxdvbuwI&feature=youtu.be&t=2703

Skip to around 50:35

Funny he can say something like this with a straight "face" after selling an altcoin ICO.

But yeah, go ahead and keep holding his coin.

[spartak_t]

Listen to Drak tell you not to hold any altcoin, or BTC for that matter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHYjxdvbuwI&feature=youtu.be&t=2703

Skip to around 50:35

Funny he can say something like this with a straight "face" after selling an altcoin ICO.

But yeah, go ahead and keep holding his coin.

He expressed his honest opinion. VIA crowdsale buyers had the chance to sell x10-12, but that doesn't mean that VIA is dead.. Bitcoin too for that matter.
If I always knew when to buy or sell Bitcoin/altcoins, I should be now reading book and drinking mojito on Bora-Bora, instead reading this forum and drinking cheap coffee.

[styn234]

Damn this coin seems promising, and loved. How about bringing it to c-cex?

[altcoinUK]

Listen to Drak tell you not to hold any altcoin, or BTC for that matter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHYjxdvbuwI&feature=youtu.be&t=2703

Skip to around 50:35

Funny he can say something like this with a straight "face" after selling an altcoin ICO.

But yeah, go ahead and keep holding his coin.

That's fine in the altcoin world. It is perfectly normal if the collector of a US$ 300K ICO tells you that holding his coin or any digital currencies in fact does not make sense at all as well as the fanboys will explain to you that it if a guy create a coin, sell it as a long term project, it is still normal that the very same guy (the creator of the coin) says that don't hold it at all ... and as we see you didn't have to wait for very long to read that.

No wonder the whole altcoin movement became a shamble.

[scambust]

Listen to Drak tell you not to hold any altcoin, or BTC for that matter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHYjxdvbuwI&feature=youtu.be&t=2703

Skip to around 50:35

Funny he can say something like this with a straight "face" after selling an altcoin ICO.

But yeah, go ahead and keep holding his coin.

That's fine in the altcoin world. It is perfectly normal if the collector of a US$ 300K ICO tells you that holding his coin or any digital currencies in fact does not make sense at all as well as the fanboys will explain to you that it if a guy create a coin, sell it as a long term project, it is still normal that very same guys says that don't hold it at all ... and as we see you didn't have to wait for very long to read that.

No wonder the whole altcoin movement became a shamble.

https://twitter.com/btcdrak/status/600236822153703424

Altcoins are not viable because they cannot reproduce that which gives Bitcoin an overwhelming competitive edge: its market cap. It is unethical to create an altcoin with the purpose of making money off of it for this reason. They should not be taken seriously. The way to defeat them is to keep demanding of the altcoin promoters that they spell out why their altcoin makes sense as an investment. The more that this demand is made, the worse altcoins will look.

This point needs to be made in a variety of ways, again and again. This article and the few others that have been written are not enough. It needs to be restated in as many different ways as possible until the altcoin movement is over.

RIP Viacoin. I bet 1 satoshi he lost all the bitcoins at Okcoin. LOLZ! Anonymity is so beautiful, people like us get away with anything.

[btcdrak]

https://twitter.com/btcdrak/status/600236822153703424

Altcoins are not viable because they cannot reproduce that which gives Bitcoin an overwhelming competitive edge: its market cap. It is unethical to create an altcoin with the purpose of making money off of it for this reason. They should not be taken seriously. The way to defeat them is to keep demanding of the altcoin promoters that they spell out why their altcoin makes sense as an investment. The more that this demand is made, the worse altcoins will look.

This point needs to be made in a variety of ways, again and again. This article and the few others that have been written are not enough. It needs to be restated in as many different ways as possible until the altcoin movement is over.

Scambust I expected a bit more intelligence from you than this because you clearly missed the point.

In the same was as pundits have been declaring the death of bitcoin for years, bitcoin maximalists have been declaring the death of altcoins for years. Yet here we are, with hundreds of altcoins and no sign of abating. Sure alts volume isnt great, but then neither is bitcoin's. That's exactly the point. This is a bear market where the common denominator (USD) is additionally in a bull market - what can you expect? It's curious that people like Scambust and AltcoinUK would rather have people telling them to hold buy and hold bitcoin when it's clearly the timing is not right, than people actually explain how things really are. This is the difference between professional and retail.

Second point is relating to bitcoin maximalism is the unrealistic all or nothing. They completely fail to understand that no one product can ever get 100% of the market unless of course it's a government monopoly.  Diner's Club was the first credit card, but now we have Visa, Mastercard and a bunch of others. The more interesting part is they offer *exactly* the same services. That's just how it is. So how Bitcoin maximalists can ever think Bitcoin will be the only coin left standing has me flummoxed (especially when the long term future of Bitcoin itself is unknown).

You can see how markets think, during the 2013 November bubble bitcoin became so "expensive" that people started searching for cheaper alternatives.... that's why Litecoin went to the moon along with a bunch of other alts. Psychologically people wanted to own "whole units", so 1 BTC was unaffordable, so they went to buy LTC... and then others after that went crazy.  While alts cycle much faster than BTC because the market cap is much smaller. But it's pretty clear that alts are faring badly *because* bitcoin is also - because for altcoin trading the common denominator is BTC. For alts to succeed, so must bitcoin.

We are still in a bear market. Calling bottoms is a retail game, professional traders, as explained in that Google Hangout but several professional traders, will go bull when the market clearly turns bull. To do otherwise is nothing more than gambling.

[altcoinUK]

... It's curious that people like Scambust and AltcoinUK would rather have people telling them to hold buy and hold bitcoin when it's clearly the timing is not right, than people actually explain how things really are. ...

I would rather don't care what people are telling me about holding or buying something. Mainly I was just wondering how ironic it is that the money collector (you), the facilitator of one of the largest ICOs admits that the whole thing does not make sense at all (and actually I agree with that observation of yours). Since you are one of the largest money collector in this place, your comment fits well in this irrational altcoin thing, the fact that you said it just frames quite nicely how nonsensical and fucked up this whole thing.

[btcdrak]

In case anyone had any doubts about Scambust, he is a self confessed troll


https://twitter.com/scambust/status/600301772381425664

And he clearly knows I am talking sense because he's tweeting the same opinions about trading trends.


https://twitter.com/scambust/status/600093601108865024