dzimbeck
Legendary
 Offline
Activity: 2412
Merit: 1044
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November 13, 2014, 04:49:08 PM |
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i dont get how you can peg it to $1 / coin ....billion dollar market cap.
because ppl who bought in the ico will dump on you and ruin the peg
everyone is going to want to exit at $1 / coin...so how is this possible
can you talk more about mechanic behind this? david you seem like a genius, please explain some more than kyou
I believe he was stating that the $1B cap was his 'goal' not that it would become a reality in any specific timeframe... even ebay and Alibaba started out small-ish (though not as small as this is). As far as pegging the coin to a currency that's possible without requiring $1B in actual capital however. You can see an example with NuBits and a few others. I believe he mentioned a fork for a hedging coin as a later possibility, but he also mentioned coin-parking as a possibility as well. I'm not really qualified to explain probably, but I believe that simply involves a community that is enough involved in the 'business' of the coin to commit to park (make unavailable for spending - like is done with staking but for much longer timeframes) in order to severely limit the float in the market. So if you have 1B coins in mintage, but 900M parked - the actual market is only 100M coins at any given time. Adding in the fact that parking prevents 90% of the dumps at peaks, and allows for hard buy-sell walls to remain in place to provide liquidity with limited volatility... you can pretty much peg any coin to any value. The trick is having enough capital for the walls, having enough cooperation from the holders, and some form of automatic arbitrage bot to assure that all active markets operate within the range. You can always have off-market sales/buys without concern... just like you do with stocks or bonds. In reality the biggest trick is coming up with enough incentive for those with large portfolios to keep the majority of their coins parked indefinitely, while still maintaining adequate liquidity in the market for trade to occur readily. Hopefully David can comment on the (probably numerous) ways I've misunderstood how this works, but I think that's it in a nutshell. Yeah well the gears in my head have been turning on this. I'm very familiar with NuBits and wanted to do something like this for as long as I can remember. The key to it is this, we fork the network and people can trade however that ability can be limited by splitting the network into two. However its the same port and everything its just there are new mining rules. One way is to take the NuBits method another way(and the way I'm planning to do it) is like this: Its funny, I got a lot of emails asking about this so here is what my reply was: "No it wont be possible to dump coins that way. The network will get split and the rules will be different for people who want to sell liquid coins. On an exchange, you will not be able to sell liquid coins. However people will be able to sell their coins on an exchange by waiting in a Queue to hedge their coins. The amount of time they wait in the queue will depend on the supply and demand and the buy and sell walls. So basically it would be impossible to sell below certain prices like .98 cents would always be a losing sell and 1.03 would always be a losing buy. Arbitrage bots can even trade exactly on the margins and give the profits to the people who hold liquid asset(more good news). Additionally, people who hedge would get higher interest rates since they are leaving the network in a slow time. It will be a popular choice to cash but we will reward people holding liquid assets. The most amazing part is, IF you want to sell your liquid coins you CAN! Just sell it in the markets that I'm making. Of course eventually we can even get a major company to buy off that market too since people may want to exit and the company may like the quick return. Once you cash out, someone buys in at the bottom so the floor MUST meet the ceiling or else arbitrage will smash the market hard. So dumping on an exchange is impossible because we now have a system for controlling supply and demand. Now one concern is that even if the free market of liquid coins is not a federated order book, it would still be possible to offer a lower price for quicker exit. But here is the thing, we can force those exchanges off the NightTrader market by setting a hard cap on the price we allow in the client. Besides, you would not want to sell so short liquid coins at .75 cents when you could wait a month, get some interest and sell at a dollar. Again, this is the reason why that floor rises because the entrance price must meet the hard capped ceiling within a certain range below. Right now, I'm discussing with another member of the project who is a real math wizard. We are deciding the best price(my target is a dollar but we have to consider volume and how much we want to take off market), supply in the hedge/liquid network and some of the minor details. So yeah, if my partners work with me, this coin is by far the best coin to invest in right now." Note there is one more spin to this. Allow paying interest on time locked coins. So if you are a backer, we would make its very much worth your while to not keep your funds liquid or tradable. Instead you literally choose to sit out. This can give you an interest bonus. Most people using markets will want liquid funds, long term bulls will take one of two positions, they will punish bears for short sales or they will take the modest interest rate and sit out. We can require people to sit out coins also by having a rule to deflate the liquidity pool into locks. So the deal is, somebody should sit out, or everyone deflates %2. The one who sits out gets 2%. (Thats just an example) The thing im going to want our team to work on while im coding is the numbers based on predicted volumes. So we assume everyone is a bear and that our volume is suboptimal and we go from there. This gives us the best projection for how hard the rules have to be. And just like difficulty in the bitcoin network, we can adjust these parameters every block. Most importantly we have may have an advantage over NuBits here because we are going to keep the funds more liquid with a higher market cap. Luckily, we have good source to reference and time locks in the outputs are not available so we just add some mining rules and really just adjust and fine tune the details over the coming months. I can't even imagine how much this coin will rise before this pegging transition. Its going to be craziness. |
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meccaflare0
Sr. Member
Offline
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
Do the thing and you'll have the power.
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November 13, 2014, 04:53:17 PM |
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Very promising coin. I will keep an eye on this one.
Once BTC stabilizes a bit I will grab some.
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thcmakaveli
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November 13, 2014, 05:03:59 PM
Last edit: November 13, 2014, 05:21:18 PM by thcmakaveli |
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When does the ICO end?
In ~3 days good to see you here thcmakaveli:) we both have some good/bad adventures with Cloak xD Thanks  Yeah, closed page already ... Things looking good with bay though. Nearly half coins sold  |
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The Minion
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 40
Merit: 0
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November 13, 2014, 06:21:08 PM |
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Very promising coin. I will keep an eye on this one.
Once BTC stabilizes a bit I will grab some.
I sold more a 455 and bought some more BitBay! I'm going balls deep on this! |
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Piston Honda
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2702
Merit: 1064
Juicin' crypto
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November 13, 2014, 06:37:13 PM |
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i dont get how you can peg it to $1 / coin ....billion dollar market cap.
because ppl who bought in the ico will dump on you and ruin the peg
everyone is going to want to exit at $1 / coin...so how is this possible
can you talk more about mechanic behind this? david you seem like a genius, please explain some more than kyou
I believe he was stating that the $1B cap was his 'goal' not that it would become a reality in any specific timeframe... even ebay and Alibaba started out small-ish (though not as small as this is). As far as pegging the coin to a currency that's possible without requiring $1B in actual capital however. You can see an example with NuBits and a few others. I believe he mentioned a fork for a hedging coin as a later possibility, but he also mentioned coin-parking as a possibility as well. I'm not really qualified to explain probably, but I believe that simply involves a community that is enough involved in the 'business' of the coin to commit to park (make unavailable for spending - like is done with staking but for much longer timeframes) in order to severely limit the float in the market. So if you have 1B coins in mintage, but 900M parked - the actual market is only 100M coins at any given time. Adding in the fact that parking prevents 90% of the dumps at peaks, and allows for hard buy-sell walls to remain in place to provide liquidity with limited volatility... you can pretty much peg any coin to any value. The trick is having enough capital for the walls, having enough cooperation from the holders, and some form of automatic arbitrage bot to assure that all active markets operate within the range. You can always have off-market sales/buys without concern... just like you do with stocks or bonds. In reality the biggest trick is coming up with enough incentive for those with large portfolios to keep the majority of their coins parked indefinitely, while still maintaining adequate liquidity in the market for trade to occur readily. Hopefully David can comment on the (probably numerous) ways I've misunderstood how this works, but I think that's it in a nutshell. Yeah well the gears in my head have been turning on this. I'm very familiar with NuBits and wanted to do something like this for as long as I can remember. The key to it is this, we fork the network and people can trade however that ability can be limited by splitting the network into two. However its the same port and everything its just there are new mining rules. One way is to take the NuBits method another way(and the way I'm planning to do it) is like this: Its funny, I got a lot of emails asking about this so here is what my reply was: "No it wont be possible to dump coins that way. The network will get split and the rules will be different for people who want to sell liquid coins. On an exchange, you will not be able to sell liquid coins. However people will be able to sell their coins on an exchange by waiting in a Queue to hedge their coins. The amount of time they wait in the queue will depend on the supply and demand and the buy and sell walls. So basically it would be impossible to sell below certain prices like .98 cents would always be a losing sell and 1.03 would always be a losing buy. Arbitrage bots can even trade exactly on the margins and give the profits to the people who hold liquid asset(more good news). Additionally, people who hedge would get higher interest rates since they are leaving the network in a slow time. It will be a popular choice to cash but we will reward people holding liquid assets. The most amazing part is, IF you want to sell your liquid coins you CAN! Just sell it in the markets that I'm making. Of course eventually we can even get a major company to buy off that market too since people may want to exit and the company may like the quick return. Once you cash out, someone buys in at the bottom so the floor MUST meet the ceiling or else arbitrage will smash the market hard. So dumping on an exchange is impossible because we now have a system for controlling supply and demand. Now one concern is that even if the free market of liquid coins is not a federated order book, it would still be possible to offer a lower price for quicker exit. But here is the thing, we can force those exchanges off the NightTrader market by setting a hard cap on the price we allow in the client. Besides, you would not want to sell so short liquid coins at .75 cents when you could wait a month, get some interest and sell at a dollar. Again, this is the reason why that floor rises because the entrance price must meet the hard capped ceiling within a certain range below. Right now, I'm discussing with another member of the project who is a real math wizard. We are deciding the best price(my target is a dollar but we have to consider volume and how much we want to take off market), supply in the hedge/liquid network and some of the minor details. So yeah, if my partners work with me, this coin is by far the best coin to invest in right now." Note there is one more spin to this. Allow paying interest on time locked coins. So if you are a backer, we would make its very much worth your while to not keep your funds liquid or tradable. Instead you literally choose to sit out. This can give you an interest bonus. Most people using markets will want liquid funds, long term bulls will take one of two positions, they will punish bears for short sales or they will take the modest interest rate and sit out. We can require people to sit out coins also by having a rule to deflate the liquidity pool into locks. So the deal is, somebody should sit out, or everyone deflates %2. The one who sits out gets 2%. (Thats just an example) The thing im going to want our team to work on while im coding is the numbers based on predicted volumes. So we assume everyone is a bear and that our volume is suboptimal and we go from there. This gives us the best projection for how hard the rules have to be. And just like difficulty in the bitcoin network, we can adjust these parameters every block. Most importantly we have may have an advantage over NuBits here because we are going to keep the funds more liquid with a higher market cap. Luckily, we have good source to reference and time locks in the outputs are not available so we just add some mining rules and really just adjust and fine tune the details over the coming months. I can't even imagine how much this coin will rise before this pegging transition. Its going to be craziness. Liking the confidence I see here and if this all holds up everyone in the coin should be in a great spot in the coming weeks and months. I assume it's a simple (and safe) thing to say that it'd be VERY difficult for this coin to ever fall back under it's final 300 sat ITO price, right? I like the fact you can adjust the parameter every block in order to change on the fly so to speak. Network of the coin itself seems it'll be pretty secure too. These target prices would be nice if it came to fruition. |
$ADK ~ watch & learn...
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spookycoins
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November 13, 2014, 06:40:37 PM |
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 355 BTC volume on BTER |
That's me on twitter --> @spookycoins
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weret
Member
Offline
Activity: 61
Merit: 10
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November 13, 2014, 07:25:35 PM |
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Sell orders
---Price ------- Amount(BAY) ---- Total(BTC)
0.00000279 - 522946367.031 - 1459.02036 So this is how much is left on the ICO, yes? |
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vindyne8
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1009
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November 13, 2014, 07:36:41 PM |
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Sell orders
---Price ------- Amount(BAY) ---- Total(BTC)
0.00000279 - 522946367.031 - 1459.02036 So this is how much is left on the ICO, yes? Yes, over 1300BTC has sold. That is what remains. About 41 hours 23 minutes left in the ICO. |
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spookycoins
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November 13, 2014, 08:06:10 PM |
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About 11 BTC of BAY bought in the past 20 minutes or so.
Deep pockets are coming in.
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That's me on twitter --> @spookycoins
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vindyne8
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1009
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November 13, 2014, 08:08:23 PM |
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chicken65
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November 13, 2014, 08:09:28 PM |
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Nothing wrong with a little bit of healthy plagiarism now and then. Like that new song that souns so familiar |
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spookycoins
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November 13, 2014, 08:13:41 PM |
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Glad to see this community coming together.
Can't wait for the wallet and to help with some testing!
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That's me on twitter --> @spookycoins
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vindyne8
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1009
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November 13, 2014, 08:22:38 PM |
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MemoryShock
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November 13, 2014, 08:29:45 PM |
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Is there going to be a forum for Bitbay or will the only place to converse be in this thread/reddit/etc.?
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4theLOVEofCrypto
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November 13, 2014, 08:56:26 PM |
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Once it goes live, can we expect BAY to be available for trade at some of the other exchanges? Have you received any word of interest from the other exchanges?
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Piston Honda
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2702
Merit: 1064
Juicin' crypto
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November 13, 2014, 09:01:56 PM |
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Once it goes live, can we expect BAY to be available for trade at some of the other exchanges? Have you received any word of interest from the other exchanges?
Given the potential, BTC involved and hype with this coin I'd guess bittrex is a given ASAP after launch...who knows about Craptsy, Polo or Ccex and if they'll want to play as well. |
$ADK ~ watch & learn...
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4theLOVEofCrypto
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November 13, 2014, 09:03:57 PM |
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Once it goes live, can we expect BAY to be available for trade at some of the other exchanges? Have you received any word of interest from the other exchanges?
Given the potential, BTC involved and hype with this coin I'd guess bittrex is a given ASAP after launch...who knows about Craptsy, Polo or Ccex and if they'll want to play as well. Thanks. Bittrex is the one I was interested in. |
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