BitBay |Decentralized Marketplace|Smart Contracts|IoT Tech|Markets Open

[dzimbeck]

.. After the debut of the markets, we will fork the coin into a hedging coin. This will greatly reward investors who get in on the ground floor, and it will eliminate volatility using a similar system to NuBits...

Why is currency pegging good for investors? One would expect just the opposite. If the currency is pegged to something (like fiat), then its value can't rise.  

Merchants may not want the volatility associated with cryptocurrency. It's a way of attracting a wider audience. It also serves as a hedge against risk. ie. Bitshares BitUSD. It's a necessity if you're going after mass adoption imo.

Once again. I'll put this simply. I am not a user. I am a speculator. Why should I speculate on a crypto pegged to US dollars? Where is my profit? Why should I take the risk and buy Bitbay coins now, why not to keep my dollars, if not bitcoins?

And this thread is useless to help me to make a decision. It' s just full of technology promises and vague business plans. Let' s copy blackcoin, get some chinese businessmen on board etc.

Its not copying Blackcoin, the only Blackcoin devs are rat4 and myself. This project will help us develop more for Blackcoin especially since I'm setting up and training devs in Asia. Also, maybe you should realize that if this coin gets pegged at a dollar its a billion dollar market cap. Is that enough money for you? If that was the market cap, you would instantly gain tons of money. Furthermore, we can easily adjust the peg by changing the parameter of the network. So if Bitcoin grows in volume and scope we can peg to Bitcoin. Its just a hedge, the network can use whatever hedge it wants.

As far as tech promises, if you are familiar with Blackcoin subreddit you will know that I always honor my word. The reason they fork Blackcoin is because its the best coin and it supports my contracting software. The markets already are integrated because Bitmessage already works in BlackHalo. Don't trust me? Download it and do a contract with me in Bitmessage. I was approached and asked to do this. It was not the other way around. Lastly, if you think you can run a cryptocurrency business better, then go ahead. Nobody is stopping you.

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[Coingrab]

I'm in with 4800 BAY

I'm in with 22000 Bay! "Let it Rip!"

[CryptoBull]

Good evening,
so just finished reading the thread, got back from work.Well i can see some strong hand in the Dev team for sure.
i like the simple way of explaining things,open dev is always a good sign.I would love to hear some future plans for this project it sounds promising for me personally.Can somebody provide a link to the reddit Q&A i re-installed my PC and i lost my history.(thank you in advance for that)

I want to hear about the technology, if somebody is good lad and explain to me how exactly is BitBay working will be helpful for me,this smart contracts sounds interesting for example.
With that nobody can scam me with a trade right?
maybe i didnt understand it quite right i guess, thats why i could use some help understanding the Tech better.


Ok thank u in advance with the help


P.S
Btw merry btc rise 

You should check out BitHalo and BlackHalo. This is my program that has been out and tested for almost a year. And yes, nobody can ever scam these contracts. They are by far the most secure way to do business. Check out blackhalo.info. You can read my whitepaper there its very exciting tech.

Well i don't like when i read about anything which is good technology and me not knowing about it  
i really like your site, i think i will need some more info before getting in with some btc but i wont have to wait long i hope.
I saw 3 points in the features which personally for me are Game Changers so keep up the good work i will follow BitBay thread more

Thank you for your answer

[Momimaus]

Currently I just hired 4 devs here in Cambodia and im paying out of pocket. They are totally new to Bitcoin but im training them. Cambodia does not have a lot of python devs so its been very slow getting them started. Has I not wasted time with devs, I could have coded the markets myself already.

Regardless I knew I needed help and refuse to work alone for the rest of next year. So this deal with Bitbay will help set up my dev team. That was part of the deal.

Can i ask why you hired a team from Cambodia
Im thinking cost was the prime reason which is fine. Just curious

Unfortunately, because im broke. Its too bad because i could have had so much money had i sold all my coins before the horrible summer. But once the summer ended i had nothing. The only way to expand Halo was to pay for it myself. For some ridiculous reason, we could not get funding. We just fell through the cracks. I did not want to have my "hat in my hand" looking for investors so I was just like "Screw it, I'm going to Cambodia and hiring myself a bunch of  devs". It was between Cambodia and India. But i thought Cambodia may be a hidden treasure because its so underdeveloped. And its cheaper. Although now, I wonder also about Bangladesh.

What i learned was, India may have been a better deal because finding devs here without jobs is a really slow process. So better to pay about 20-40% more and get a HQ Indian dev.

Although some of the sources here I talked to said it was the same.

About 150-300 per month for a beginning level dev (although here is most C# and little python)
         300-500 for middle level dev
         800 for senior dev

Now I get it.
You are using lots of BC code, that´s why you are so fast.
The other remaining anonymous guys won´t show up, cause they are related to BC too.
And you have no money left to develop this for BC. Of course because BC lost 90% of their value.
So you are running another ICO and start a new coin and get new funding.

If I am right, you should communicate this cleary from the beginning, cause this will bounce back badly if it comes out later.
Tell us right now, we invest and we are fine with that, if we know it.

[hossy]

How many BTC have been invested up to date now

[choeymethod]

I dont quite understand, how would one peg BitBay to the US Dollar and make 1 BB = 1$ by hedging?

[chicken65]

How many BTC have been invested up to date now

Around 1400

[godzirra]

How many BTC have been invested up to date now

It's actually about 950 btc or so now.

[Djinou94]

Is it a Syscoin bis?

[thcmakaveli]

decided to invest, been reading about it the last few days and I can see crazy potential in this. lets do this!

[Oops]

decided to invest, been reading about it the last few days and I can see crazy potential in this. lets do this!

It is pretty crazy potential I agree. Finally to be in on something at the start!

[dzimbeck]

I think, I also decided not to invest - except if the DEV answer my questions about real time hardware control and outlines how that will be possible at all with the Blackhalo solution?

I am mainly interested in the IoT offering, but it seems to me the IoT concept does not even exists on conceptual level. If there is not even conceptual solution, I can't see how this project will release a working, blockchain enabled, peer to peer Internet of Things software that controls hardware in real time.

I believe I already answered this, im not able to monitor this thread constantly because I'm usually working. But yeah you can do zero confirmations with multisig because your device or you hold the raw transaction. It depends on the application/hardware. Best that you give me some example or use case and I can explain to you how I would approach it.

This isnt dissimilar from NightTrader multisig engine which I have made. I just dont have any front end for it. Controlling hardware in real time is fairly easy when you know multiple signatures are involved. Add this to checklocktimeverify and you can have outputs convert to different things based on blocks. Handling raw transactions where you hold the other signature can leave you secure with the fact that you can do zero confirmations.

Thanks for your reply.

I am familiar with the green address concept of Bitcoin that requires a third party and allows instant transactions and I believe you are not referring to that. So if your solution conceptually is not that, let see a concrete use case: open a gate in a sport venue where users use their wallet to enter the venue and the gate controller device charges 10 BitBay coin for opening the gate. My understanding is, prior to opening the door the device must know if the 10 BitBay Coin is available for the buyer. The device must ensure the balance is available, it's not a double spending and it's a legitimate transaction, otherwise the door cannot be opened. Once the gate controller device is satisfied the balance is available, and only in that case it opens the gate. How long it takes for the device to verify if there is a sufficient balance on the address, because prior verifying the balance the gate cannot be opened?  In other words, how long the user must stand for waiting the device to perform the service?

If you say so you have worked this out and willing to explain this, I am sure that's the case, and you will have a working solution :-))

One working solution is to have your funds locked before you get to the gate ...  Thus your primary account would have locked funds set aside for public events and interaction with IOT ... So they cant hold your money hostage because the funds are set to convert back to a regular account on the expiration of the lock ... The gate only signs with parties that were confirmed in advance to be honest. Those parties would hold a double deposit contract with the manufacturer too.

All due respect David, this solution isn't practical and such implementation would make the use case completely uncompetitive to existing FIAT or even digital currency payment solutions. Currently payment systems, even the Bitcoin network with green addresses works in ad-hoc manner: you pay at the time of the purchase. In order to buy a pizza, hotel room, concert ticket  there is no requirement to lock the fund to the seller prior to the transaction, not even with Bitcoin. I think such system that you have suggested wont be adopted at all.

I understand your solution would be still anonymous and decentralized, but having so much complication to make a payment to IoT devices would make the solution impractical in my opinion.

This starts boiling down more to logistics.

I disagree. This is not a logistical but a conceptual issue. What you have described is a workaround by asking users to comply with your work around in order to have the luxury of involving with a very-very complicated process.

Anyway, thanks for answering, apart from the IoT part, your solution will be great and I have no doubt you will roll out an excellent smart contract system. I suggest don't involve the IoT it at all. Firstly people have no idea what is it so it doesn't mean anything :-)) and no one is investing in this because the IoT feature, but once someone take a closer look at it, the reaction will be that it is not acceptable for businesses and that reaction could cause more harm than good for the project. Your decentralized market solution is flawless, it is obviously a viable use case, but the hardware industry and hardware integrators will be taking apart the IoT concept and such publicity will hurt your and the project's reputation.

Well this was just an example. Also I should mention that your client would be locking the funds. And its not dissimilar from "Parking" funds in Nubits, we can offer incentive for parking with manufacturers. One method is to use only one manufacturer at first to simplify the distribution. I'm mostly interested in mesh networks to be honest. That is exactly what I discussed with the other players. My solution works, its not "green addresses" per se but I agree even though it works it may not get adopted. That solution works around bitcoins weakness of trustless doublespend problems. What you are describing is a problem inherent in Bitcoin itself so the only other way is to make the device are party to the transaction in some way so it can trust the RAW transaction is valid. This way it doesnt have to wait for confirmations since it knows its holding a signature, hash or something that would prevent you from spending otherwise. Time locks are not permanent, they are only needed to create a connection with the hardware manufacturers server to prove you arent double spending on one of their devices.

So, no offense taken. I have yet to see a better solution. Perhaps I can come up with an additional one later and PM you when I do. After all knowledge should be free. So we are taking baby steps. Just start with what works and let the industry evolve. That solution works for your particular use case. Users can also do a double deposit contract with device manufacturers in advance. Then they would not need to use my above proposed method.

Bitcoin itself is highly flawed anyways, it doesnt have a very advanced scripting system, there is malleability which always needs to be worked around by protocols, there is major problems with botnets and sybil attacks, there is a scalabiity issue that is very complex to confront (im speaking of bandwidth issues in securing the blockchain) and so on.

With that said, they liked my ideas with mesh networks and added it as IoT which is a misnomer. The mesh netowork idea I had was working with hardware but not necessarily in real time. A good example is Blackcoins COLD Staking. This is something rat4 added some RPC calls for. Now I can do multisignature staking in Halo. We could then, use a device with the staker to sign the second sig. So this is a case where you dont need instant confirmations.

 To me, mesh networks are a dream goal if we even get close to that point this project will be a smash hit. So really my impression in starting this project was to start in mesh. If they really want to do this with me, we can change the world so its of great interest to me to see this follow through.

Lets be clear about this roadmap again:

*DEMO Smart contracting client(from BlackHalo)  --- Within a week. Trying to get it before ICO ends but not 100% sure.
*Markets(beta without advanced whitelists but with a kill switch/mod key) --- Within a month or two max. I've been working on this for Blackcoin, they coincide

The last two get worked on simultaneously with Hedging taking precedence:
*Hedging transition with the checklocktimeverify --- this is about a month... we can pull from NuBits, but we are dealing with a larger supply so that math has     to work out to manage all of everyones funds properly. If they pay my dev team I can have them work on this fork BEFORE I finish my markets which would greatly increase the speed in the fork.

*Markets with whitelists/double back on server --- one month after the main markets release. Its not a difficult implementation, its very elegant but there would also be some user interface feedback and bugs we want to respond to. This could delay one additional month so we will have to ask users to behave in our decentralized markets so we don't have to shut it down.

So give the above a total of 3 months. Realize I'm trying to underpromise and overdeliver. And you know I deliver if you read blackcoins subreddit

ONCE we are hedged, we can go for the mesh networks. We will now be capped at a billion dollars(thats my target price anyways) and be able to afford and utilize our connections to the hardware markets and we will indeed create an incentive system for setting up these networks.

Right now I can see what you are trying to achieve and thanks for the clarification.

So far a few of us, potential users and investors posted that the IoT concept seems a bit vogue and it's very questionable how that such hardware integration would work with the Balckhalo system, and generally with decentralized blockchain solutions. You have described a workaround, but also said yourself that your original suggestion to the BitBay team was a mesh network idea, and then it was called IoT. So why don't call it "mesh network" if the focus will be in fact ... on mesh network :-)) I had involved with several crypto projects at investment level that went very wrong for the same reason, the objectives were identified incorrectly, the team delivered different solution what was promised. It's your project and you do as you wish, but why to disappoint (perhaps mislead people) by promising IoT when your goal - very understandably - related to a bigger picture and you will work on mesh network?

I have been involved with IoT related design and implementation projects for years, this area is close to me, but for the given technology, the peer to peer network and the decentralized blockchain the mesh network sounds a more sensible goal. I fully agree with you that it could be game changer. (the very-very smart people of Skycoin work on the same thing) I would change the IoT in the project description to Mesh Network. Right now no one really cares, people who knows you will still believe in the project, but you could avoid lot of problems by defining the goals and deliverables accurately. Later, when the price inevitable drop (see Viacoin) investors start to complain, FUD, etc., and then it will be a huge issue why you work on mesh network if you promised IoT.

Anyway, good luck, I will throw in a few BTCs and look forward to see the mesh network implementation some times next year.

Well thanks for the well thought out reply. I can't help but think your experience in this field and possible an IoT coin gives you a vested interest in saying the above. Anyways, we can certainly change our roadmap to more accurately reflect what I'm planning to do here at Bay. I know they put something on their website too. Like I said before the multisignature solution does in fact work in real time with devices as does being on long term contracts. Its probably not the most consumer friendly solution because either the user or the client software would have to make some sort of arrangement with a manufacturer in advance either contract or lock.

Anyways, yeah I can update the roadmap to reflect my investors interest in Hardware and mesh and tell them about your feedback. Be patient though, im really busy right now and I can't promise you will see their site updated before the ICO ends.

On another topic, Skycoin is a fantastic project and we are watching it very closely. It may be more feasible to do it if Bitcoin was rewritten completely.

[Mig-23]

Is it a Syscoin bis?

what do you means?

[spookycoins]

About 10BTC of buys on BTER over the last few minutes.
Big pockets are getting into this coin.

[dzimbeck]

Currently I just hired 4 devs here in Cambodia and im paying out of pocket. They are totally new to Bitcoin but im training them. Cambodia does not have a lot of python devs so its been very slow getting them started. Has I not wasted time with devs, I could have coded the markets myself already.

Regardless I knew I needed help and refuse to work alone for the rest of next year. So this deal with Bitbay will help set up my dev team. That was part of the deal.

Can i ask why you hired a team from Cambodia
Im thinking cost was the prime reason which is fine. Just curious

Unfortunately, because im broke. Its too bad because i could have had so much money had i sold all my coins before the horrible summer. But once the summer ended i had nothing. The only way to expand Halo was to pay for it myself. For some ridiculous reason, we could not get funding. We just fell through the cracks. I did not want to have my "hat in my hand" looking for investors so I was just like "Screw it, I'm going to Cambodia and hiring myself a bunch of  devs". It was between Cambodia and India. But i thought Cambodia may be a hidden treasure because its so underdeveloped. And its cheaper. Although now, I wonder also about Bangladesh.

What i learned was, India may have been a better deal because finding devs here without jobs is a really slow process. So better to pay about 20-40% more and get a HQ Indian dev.

Although some of the sources here I talked to said it was the same.

About 150-300 per month for a beginning level dev (although here is most C# and little python)
         300-500 for middle level dev
         800 for senior dev

Now I get it.
You are using lots of BC code, that´s why you are so fast.
The other remaining anonymous guys won´t show up, cause they are related to BC too.
And you have no money left to develop this for BC. Of course because BC lost 90% of their value.
So you are running another ICO and start a new coin and get new funding.

If I am right, you should communicate this cleary from the beginning, cause this will bounce back badly if it comes out later.
Tell us right now, we invest and we are fine with that, if we know it.

This is not entirely true, although its a good theory. The reason I'm so fast is because I'm using Halo source(a minor difference). Which is technically BC and Bitcoin. Since I wrote it on my own, its really easy for me to adapt it since I know it so well. As for the parties and finding a way for funding it wasnt a decision that really was that much foresight for me. These 4 guys approached me, some of them are well known and they wanted to hire me and make sure "talented devs were sufficiently funded and protected". We then talked at length and i realize they will do most of the fundraising, marketing, management, hiring, and also get me a dev team. They explained they were in it for the long haul, they explained their contacts and even introduced me to a few. So I agreed to license my code to them because it was beneficial to my projects to get some cash flow. My dev cycle was just too slow so having the extra help made sense for Blackcoin and Halo projects.

[spookycoins]

dzimbeck - Just wanted to say thanks for being so readily available and up for discussion.
Very refreshing.
It's easy to see you are very confident in this coin.
Cheers to everyone who is wise enough to get in now.
-spooky

[dzimbeck]

I dont quite understand, how would one peg BitBay to the US Dollar and make 1 BB = 1$ by hedging?

Check NuBits for inspiration for an answer on that otherwise my reply will be pretty long. As for the $1 value that is the target price. Since the techniques rely on using parking to control supply and demand the answer to your question boils down to volume and what we project it to be.

[Don Flamenco]

dzimbeck - Just wanted to say thanks for being so readily available and up for discussion.
Very refreshing.
It's easy to see you are very confident in this coin.
Cheers to everyone who is wise enough to get in now.
-spooky

I'll second that.  It's really great seeing David post so many well thought out replies.  It has answered many questions I've had.

[dzimbeck]

dzimbeck - Just wanted to say thanks for being so readily available and up for discussion.
Very refreshing.
It's easy to see you are very confident in this coin.
Cheers to everyone who is wise enough to get in now.
-spooky

Thanks no guarantees that I will be here all the time, there may be posts I overlook or a day or two that goes by because I'm just busy coding but its the least I can do right now especially since there are some really new topics being raised by the coin. You guys are forming a community so its best to keep the debate alive now that you are all starting to understand the ideas behind it. People who disagree with the methods are good to spark discussion and interest and to help others learn the why and how.

[wonkafarts6669]

While you're throwing money at an ICO claiming to have smart contracts sometime in the future (although there is not even a working wallet)

You should be looking at counterparty - which is working and has working smart contracts.


http://counterparty.io/news/counterparty-recreates-ethereums-smart-contract-platform-on-bitcoin/

Oh, and look at counterparty's price.  

5   Counterparty Counterparty   $ 24,470,004   $ 9.24   2,647,077 XCP *   $ 289,689   UP 60.08 %

Oh, and it's on BTER

https://bter.com/trade/xcp_btc