GekkoScience BM1384 Project Development Discussion

[bmoscato]

I know that preorders are taboo, but I have no issue with it with Novack and Sidehack.  They seem like pretty straight shooters and tell it like it is. I'd rather support a small shop US than some random place in China.

[VirosaGITS]

I don't like taking in money on things I can't deliver immediately or awful close to it. But sometimes it's necessary to get enough cash in hand to buy parts for a full batch.

It's all about trust IMO. Since we all know you can deliver a quality product in time, it's not a problem for me. If it was 6 month pre-order that would different. 2 weeks it's no big deal, if the trust is there. We all know that the money will be in good hands and is needed for the good of the project.

I think so too, but its a bit of an awkward time since a few companies are starting a competition that can devolve in another price war pretty quick. We know Bitmain is quick to respond to those, though they will probably ignore Bitfury and SP if they keep off the small miner and try to just attack them with batch orders while leaving the individual unit expensive. If either start making offering to the small miner, i think they'll fight it out again.

What i mean is IF SP sell a batch of chips that let sidehack make a 500gh pod for 1BTC and meanwhile for example bitfury release a 250gh pod for 0.25BTC in response to SP or Bitmain's whatever, then sidehack will be left with tons of hardware that now costed twice more what they're worth currently.

Anyways that's the reason why I would be worried about starting to take money ahead of time.

Not a matter of capability, just the reality of the ASIC market is also volatile.

[notlist3d]

We've done preorders for two products so far, the first batch of DPS2000 PSU boards and the first batch of Compacs. The DPS2000 boards started shipping I think 7 days behind schedule, but the PCBs arrived from the etch house 9 days late (2 days after our product's ship date). The Compac started shipping 10 days late, but the pick-and-place arrived about 50 days late (seven days after our product's ship date) and the heatsinks arrived 14 days late (three days after ship date).

I don't like taking in money on things I can't deliver immediately or awful close to it. But sometimes it's necessary to get enough cash in hand to buy parts for a full batch.

The problem I'm running into right now is having enough money to fund the development process. I really don't want to take on debt for that. Hopefully I can get everything working in short enough time and when sales on 750W PSUs and Compacs are doing good that we aren't put in a bind.

Also, the rough numbers we're looking at right now would put an S1-sized miner at 28 chips, about 4TH topend.

Well i would chip in for development of a new home miner based on the work from sidehack and novak 

I love hearing about a possible 4TH miner from you guys.  That would be kinda a game changer if you get up and running on that scale.   The compacs seem pretty rock solid so definitely interested in 4TH depending on price.

One thing you might do is a design it to use one or two of your 750 PSU's depending on it's needs.   That way you might get some sales on miners and PSU's at same time.    Which means more profit and hopefully more money for even further development.

[sidehack]

Whatever we build would be able to run at least one off our 750W PSU. We've been rolling around the idea of a discount or bundle purchase, probably five bucks off the PSU with a purchase of two boards.

[Mudbankkeith]

If we get a 4Th upgrade for our S1/S3/S5 chassis, then what do we do with the old boards?

[VirosaGITS]

If we get a 4Th upgrade for our S1/S3/S5 chassis, then what do we do with the old boards?

You scrap them. Not S5's though, those are still good until S9 or such. The S3's board are still of interest for people, i would even take a whole S3 myself. The S1, you could run them at super low clock with nofan at 0.9J/GH.

Thats what i'll do during this winter. I will make a stack of them, maybe with that plastic egg crate thing and use it as a heater for my room.

[Meech]

Also, the rough numbers we're looking at right now would put an S1-sized miner at 28 chips, about 4TH topend.

Exciting!  KickStarter is a great medium for inviting the world to fund your research and development but in this type of
business, and what GekkoScience stands behind I hope the community could back this instead.  I realize we all didn't jump in
first thing on the Compac sales but it's understandable since some see it as just a toy.  It was a test ground for future sales and
development.  If you can make a miner that kicks the big boys in the ass you will have all the funding you need but I understand
it's the development money you need now.
How about ( I know we have heard this before from companies before...but) if you pre-order and are in the first 250 orders there will
be a hashrate increase, or a discounted price.  After that maybe something for the next 250 pre-orders.  Hey it worked for BlackArrow!
How confident are you on acquiring SPT chips?  And how certain are you on the S1 frame, so I can start buying them back. 

[sidehack]

If you check the very first post of this 99-page thread, you'll see an intention already stated to build boards for the S1 frame. That intention has not and will not change.

I hope to hear more info from SPTech tomorrow. Right now nothing is certain. At all. About anything. But we're working on it.

Also, it seems pretty likely that the first 20 miners sold would probably be all the budget I needed for dev so I don't really want to make deals about hundreds. We'll see when I have a prototype and timelines.

[AJRGale]

If you check the very first post of this 99-page thread, you'll see an intention already stated to build boards for the S1 frame. That intention has not and will not change.

I hope to hear more info from SPTech tomorrow. Right now nothing is certain. At all. About anything. But we're working on it.

Also, it seems pretty likely that the first 20 miners sold would probably be all the budget I needed for dev so I don't really want to make deals about hundreds. We'll see when I have a prototype and timelines.

Well, as long as SPTech helps with the layout on the BGA (unless the new chipset is not?? I haven’t put the time into looking into it) and setting up the rest.. So Guy, i know you're here.. play nice with Side, he don't bite

If we get a 4Th upgrade for our S1/S3/S5 chassis, then what do we do with the old boards?

I'd almost consider a buy-up on these just to do the downclock/volt them, and maybe resell them? but considering S1's are going for $35-50 as a full working unit..

If not, Marketplace/ebay them, Starting bid at $5.. there will be people buying them up I thinks.. if not I will

[Mudbankkeith]

If you check the very first post of this 99-page thread, you'll see an intention already stated to build boards for the S1 frame. That intention has not and will not change.

I hope to hear more info from SPTech tomorrow. Right now nothing is certain. At all. About anything. But we're working on it.

Also, it seems pretty likely that the first 20 miners sold would probably be all the budget I needed for dev so I don't really want to make deals about hundreds. We'll see when I have a prototype and timelines.

I have anticipation smoke rising from my bitcoin wallet, those babies are getting to hot to hold onto.

[klondike_bar]

We've done preorders for two products so far, the first batch of DPS2000 PSU boards and the first batch of Compacs. The DPS2000 boards started shipping I think 7 days behind schedule, but the PCBs arrived from the etch house 9 days late (2 days after our product's ship date). The Compac started shipping 10 days late, but the pick-and-place arrived about 50 days late (seven days after our product's ship date) and the heatsinks arrived 14 days late (three days after ship date).

I don't like taking in money on things I can't deliver immediately or awful close to it. But sometimes it's necessary to get enough cash in hand to buy parts for a full batch.

The problem I'm running into right now is having enough money to fund the development process. I really don't want to take on debt for that. Hopefully I can get everything working in short enough time and when sales on 750W PSUs and Compacs are doing good that we aren't put in a bind.

Also, the rough numbers we're looking at right now would put an S1-sized miner at 28 chips, about 4TH topend.

4TH, or ~800W?

sounds like that could be slightly tricky on an S1 (which was 180-220W originally) without secondary heatsinks for the PCB.  I was expecting 4-5 chips/board (500+GH) and 2 boards/S1.

[sidehack]

Why would it be 800W? Posted chip specs are 0.14, not 0.2

The S5 can push upward of 500W without chipside heatsinks.

The S1 was 350-400W originally. The S5 uses the same heatsinks so we know more heat is possible. 5 chips is more like a small pod miner than an S1 blade.

[philipma1957]

Why would it be 800W? Posted chip specs are 0.14, not 0.2

The S5 can push upward of 500W without chipside heatsinks.

The S1 was 350-400W originally. The S5 uses the same heatsinks so we know more heat is possible. 5 chips is more like a small pod miner than an S1 blade.

Sptech would be smart to hand over a small (under 10 chip ) board/miner to you.  It would not hurt their big boy 110th  but could hurt bitmintech's s-7.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

Count me in for a piece of this.

[sidehack]

A lot of things are still up in the air. I haven't given up talking to Bitmain and Avalon yet, and maybe if InnoSilicon starts being nicer about sample quantities of whatever they're working on would be good too.

Something about baskets and eggs, I guess.

[Searing]

Why would it be 800W? Posted chip specs are 0.14, not 0.2

The S5 can push upward of 500W without chipside heatsinks.

The S1 was 350-400W originally. The S5 uses the same heatsinks so we know more heat is possible. 5 chips is more like a small pod miner than an S1 blade.

Sptech would be smart to hand over a small (under 10 chip ) board/miner to you.  It would not hurt their big boy 110th  but could hurt bitmintech's s-7.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

Count me in for a piece of this.

Ditto

 (hey he is the lone ranger I'm tonto!)

[philipma1957]

Why would it be 800W? Posted chip specs are 0.14, not 0.2

The S5 can push upward of 500W without chipside heatsinks.

The S1 was 350-400W originally. The S5 uses the same heatsinks so we know more heat is possible. 5 chips is more like a small pod miner than an S1 blade.

Sptech would be smart to hand over a small (under 10 chip ) board/miner to you.  It would not hurt their big boy 110th  but could hurt bitmintech's s-7.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

Count me in for a piece of this.

Ditto

 (hey he is the lone ranger I'm tonto!)

Hi Ho Silver!

[klondike_bar]

Why would it be 800W? Posted chip specs are 0.14, not 0.2

The S5 can push upward of 500W without chipside heatsinks.

The S1 was 350-400W originally. The S5 uses the same heatsinks so we know more heat is possible. 5 chips is more like a small pod miner than an S1 blade.

oops, you're totally right, S1 could handle 400W

in that case would love to see 2.5TH that i can use with an S1 frame and not worry about excessive noise

[sidehack]

My intent is to design to a 250W per board stock setpoint, with a practical upperbound of up to 320W per board. Full adjustment of course, so you can crank it down to 200W and it'd run less hashrate of course but it'd also be more efficient. That's the idea anyways. Folks without volume constraints, or folks with waterblocks, would appreciate the higher hashrate capability.

[thefix]

My intent is to design to a 250W per board stock setpoint, with a practical upperbound of up to 320W per board. Full adjustment of course, so you can crank it down to 200W and it'd run less hashrate of course but it'd also be more efficient. That's the idea anyways. Folks without volume constraints, or folks with waterblocks, would appreciate the higher hashrate capability.

Very interested in this project, will be following!

[sidehack]

Oh hey look, one hundred pages. How 'bout that. Maybe I should actually get around to demonstrating progress beyond a stickminer, eh?