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2361  Economy / Speculation / Re: A brief history of exponential trends on: December 18, 2013, 09:30:52 AM
I don't put much stock in chart extrapolation, but I'm curious: Isn't it odd to draw a trendline that the price is constantly above?

I think people are trying to establish a baseline price, that it will never go below.

Exactly, since bitcoin fluctuates wildly and noone can predict how high the speculation would drag it in each rally, I'm more interested in the baseline support price. This has quadrupled yearly since 2011.

sgbett, this seems also valid and the low of 200 makes more sense at this point.

Without being able to prove it, I really feel like you are undershooting there. It's got to be between $400 and $500 in my opinion, unless of course America bans Bitcoin or something like that.
2362  Economy / Speculation / Re: Now we crash up! on: December 18, 2013, 09:20:49 AM
$500 bitcoins is still way overpriced and not sustainable and especially without china.
Bullshit  Smiley
2363  Economy / Speculation / Re: Everyone knew about China already on: December 18, 2013, 09:11:45 AM
I was wrong with previous estimates regarding prices.

But this is mad panic behaviour! Everyone has known for days that China is tightening its grip (very small one relative to Bitcoin's early stage) on Bitcoin.

This chance for a cheap price won't come again soon!  I just wish my fiat had arrived at Bitstamp by now  Angry

Fiat -> Chinese exchanges has been temporarily suspended.  The CNY exchanges might disappear for all we know.  This is news.  And if you haven't noticed already, the news has been getting progressively worse out of China.  Who knows what other regulations they might have in store?  The market will have to flush out all but the most dedicated Chinese bitcoiners.

Yes but we knew about this grip-tightening for days already.

People act like Bitcoin's future is tied to China. Why? It's simply not true.
2364  Economy / Speculation / Now we crash up! on: December 18, 2013, 09:09:18 AM
Hold on to your hats!
2365  Economy / Speculation / Re: Good Morning, Europe! on: December 18, 2013, 09:00:45 AM


Did you expect to wake up to this?
Do you have to go to work/school and miss the excitement?



Good morning sir!  Cheesy
2366  Economy / Speculation / Re: HOLY CRAP!! BITCOIN at $400's on Mt Gox. CRASH HAS NO END IN SIGHT!!!! on: December 18, 2013, 08:56:40 AM
Bitcoin broke $500, falling fast. Will probably stabilize under $300!

This is getting as good as that drop to $2.00!

Edward50 just can't wait for your coins people! Me neither  Grin
2367  Economy / Speculation / Everyone knew about China already on: December 18, 2013, 08:52:44 AM
I was wrong with previous estimates regarding prices.

But this is mad panic behaviour! Everyone has known for days that China is tightening its grip (very small one relative to Bitcoin's early stage) on Bitcoin.

This chance for a cheap price won't come again soon!  I just wish my fiat had arrived at Bitstamp by now  Angry
2368  Bitcoin / Press / Re: Edison's Revenge on the Dollar (?) - WHAAAAT???? on: December 17, 2013, 10:22:30 PM
You can't deny, they must have had fun writing this Edison scenario!
2369  Economy / Speculation / Re: Who is buying bitcoins at what many said in the past are cheap prices now? on: December 17, 2013, 08:45:26 PM
I'm not a big buyer. Hundreds of USD is a large buy for me.

Bought .225BTC at 680 Will buy more if it drops under 400.

I also Buy $50 weekly at spot price.

Do you honestly think its going to go below 400?

Do you honestly think its going up from here?

Yeah, in a few weeks time. And in my humble opinion most people think that. That's why there is a general hold going on.

I agree that most people think that. But that doesn't mean it's right.

But it does look like there's a better chance than ever before of it being right. Countries are pronouncing their verdicts now and they will continue to do so in January. And when you think about it, so far so good really. Tech start-ups are jostling to be the first to provide a foolproof wallet your grand-dad could use. Things have changed gears and with the whiff of mainstream adoption big companies want to be the first in. And they will race each-other to do it. That's why the next few months actually look the rosiest by far when compared to the tail end of all the previous bubbles. Things actually looked bad then while they look good now, which is why this bubble tail-end is going to stabilize high.
2370  Economy / Speculation / Re: Who is buying bitcoins at what many said in the past are cheap prices now? on: December 17, 2013, 08:30:56 PM
I'm not a big buyer. Hundreds of USD is a large buy for me.

Bought .225BTC at 680 Will buy more if it drops under 400.

I also Buy $50 weekly at spot price.

Do you honestly think its going to go below 400?

Do you honestly think its going up from here?

Yeah, in a few weeks time. And in my humble opinion most people think that. That's why there is a general hold going on.
2371  Economy / Speculation / Re: Serious bitcoin price discussion. Bears only please. How far will it drop? on: December 17, 2013, 08:26:53 PM
Honestly none. But I'm getting some money to an exchange somewhere near you pretty quick.  Grin

Ok.

Them BTC must be looking pretty cheap right now. Almost half the price of little over a week ago.

But does the big China Bitcoin wind-down not worry you?

I don't think it is nearly as bad as it seems. It's not as if China had adopted Bitcoin, a billion people were using it, then it got banned. It sounds stupid, but it's this kind of semi-conscious thinking that is creating a "China goes, we all go" illusion. It's not like that. Bitcoin was growing at the same exponential rate before China, and there are billions of other people to keep this rate going for a good long while. That's why the price isn't dropping as much as you might think it would - because the real market for Bitcoin is not just a reflection of the China hype we are getting.

And with all that, it is not even banned in China and I very much doubt it will be. They simply want to control the flow of money into it like they try to do with other assets.

Now aside from the China stuff, Bitcoin is being accepted in many countries now. Not a day goes by now without it being touted as an asset by some European country or another; and it doesn't matter that it's as an asset - it's being accepted and that will allay the principal fear of any average would-be investor. As for the other fears - security, price volatility, etc. - companies are working fast to make it easy and secure to buy and use Bitcoin with a simple username and password, and hedge funds are busy preparing the same graphs you have looked at showing exponential growth, logarithmic rates, etc. to show their clients. A small but significant handful of Wall Streeters and hedge fund people have already put their own money in.

I may be wrong but I bet nobody here thinks Bitcoin will be sub-$1000 at the end of next year; the vast majority think it will actually be much higher. Don't forget, even just a $300 rise from $700 to $1000 in one year is a superb return on investment. Put your $700 in a bank for a year and there's actually a chance with fees you will have less than that in a year's time! A good interest rate might give you a $15 bonus on the money after a year if you are lucky.

People realise that other people are thinking the same. That's why there is less mad panic and more hesitant "dumping" going on. No-one wants to dump and then see the price go up and not come down again. If it doesn't go much lower then trying to trade now is foolish and everyone knows and feels that. It's not worth the stress. So more people than ever before are holding on for next year.

I hope I didn't bore you all!  Smiley
2372  Economy / Speculation / Re: Serious bitcoin price discussion. Bears only please. How far will it drop? on: December 17, 2013, 07:56:04 PM
Who in their right minds anywhere who has anything to do with Bitcoin (except maybe one or two poor Chinese noobs) really believes that it would stay at a price like $300 for anything more than a minute before bouncing right back up and right out of there? Who thinks Bitcoin is going to have an average price of $300 next year? If such people exist, quite a few of them exist, then he's in with a small chance. If not then forget it - $300 will not happen.

Ok T.Stuart.

Come clean. How many BTC are you holding and at what average price did you get them at?

Honestly none. But I'm getting some money to an exchange somewhere near you pretty quick.  Grin
2373  Economy / Speculation / Re: Serious bitcoin price discussion. Bears only please. How far will it drop? on: December 17, 2013, 07:53:12 PM
I believe the next days will see greed turn into fear, as the buyers look weak, and more coins will appear in the ask sum, building up seller pressure.
The sellers also look "weak" - people are hesitant to sell now. Just as important.
2374  Economy / Speculation / Re: Serious bitcoin price discussion. Bears only please. How far will it drop? on: December 17, 2013, 07:48:35 PM
Looks like bitcoins stabilized at a new temporary price of $750. I think this is another temporary stop before it lowers again to a more sustainable level.

I see no reason why bitcoins won't fall back to $300 or lower now.

And this is why bears like you always miss the bottom. Earlier in this thread you kinda accepted that maybe you should buy at $500-600 and not at $400 since you usually undershoot the target. Now when there is a little panic and fear in the air you are back pedaling towards $300 and lower. You know that this way you will be sure to miss the bottom again don't you? Wink

Who in their right minds anywhere who has anything to do with Bitcoin (except maybe one or two poor Chinese noobs) really believes that it would stay at a price like $300 for anything more than a minute before bouncing right back up and right out of there? Who thinks Bitcoin is going to have an average price of $300 next year? If such people exist, quite a few of them exist, then he's in with a small chance. If not then forget it - $300 will not happen.
2375  Economy / Speculation / Re: Analysis never ends on: December 17, 2013, 03:24:17 PM
I have a sneaking suspicion that there are just as many analysts keeping quiet as they make losses. The short-term movements seem difficult to predict, no matter how many different types of charts get wheeled out (and of course in the end one of them will probably be right and we will certainly hear about it if it is). For everyone who pipes up after a crash claiming to have "caught the knife" there are more who didn't manage it despite analysis.

Please excuse my layman's bullshit intuition  Smiley
2376  Economy / Speculation / Re: How low will she go? on: December 17, 2013, 02:35:15 PM
I hope £17 per BTC like at the start of the year before sudden rise so I can buy 20 BTC at that price. (£17 * 20BTC =£340 worth) or even lower than that Smiley
"The truth, not what you want". I've got that written on a post-it note on my desk to stop me thinking stupid things about Bitcoin prices.  Sad eh? Grin
2377  Economy / Speculation / Re: Fake China news or not, by now it doesn't matter anymore. on: December 17, 2013, 02:31:14 PM
a new generation of Joes market makers will replace the current ones.

They're coming quicker than you think, that's all  Cheesy
2378  Economy / Speculation / Re: What happened after the last bubble? Check out these charts on: December 17, 2013, 02:25:08 PM

 Now, there is much more money per person and those people aren't going to all take out their money at once.
[/quote]

There are many more people. That's what will keep things going up for a while and also smooth things out at the same time.
2379  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bear market confirmed? Bear market confirmed! on: December 17, 2013, 02:20:16 PM
I believe now, after the chaff, most people mean to be in until the middle of next year minimum.

I believe traders are having a difficult time predicting things to their advantages, and in any case the majority try to ride uptrends (not short) and generally bank on Bitcoin going up.

Whatever is happening today and tomorrow, I believe most here believe Bitcoin is going up substantially from January next year.

This makes me believe that at best for the bears, we will go "sideways" (700 - 900 in Bitcoin terms!) for a short time (2 weeks).

A lot of "believing" from me - maybe you "know" better?  Grin
2380  Economy / Speculation / Re: Double top, double bottom? on: December 17, 2013, 01:06:58 PM
How about Wink Murder, one of my favourite games  Grin
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