Though all exchanges warn you won't get coins back from the wrong addresses and have a disclaimer saying so, some will sort you out. I can't remember which one it was, but one exchange bills customers $200 an hour for the work required to recover wrongly sent coins.

Even if it does happen it's worth contacting them to see if they're willing to do anything.

Let's wait and see.

Even if it makes a full recovery and starts to boom again in a few years many things will have permanently changed. A lot of companies that have been part of the landscape since forever will have gone.

And even if the virus is no more than a bad memory before the end of this year every economy is going to have a huuuuge bill that otherwise wouldn't have existed. It's going to be trillions of dollars worldwide. How they choose to address that is going to have effect for a long time to come.

And people looked upon those who bought at $32 in 2011 or $1200 in 2013 with great pity for long periods of time. Until those who arrived later started to dream of buying at those prices.

It's all about your appetite for time. If you're a believer and you're in no hurry you have a chance of looking like a champ a while down the line. There's still a lot of growth left, a lot of people yet to comprehend it.

Even when it has reached saturation and literally not one extra person will ever get on board the deflation will be starting to get into swing.

Eh? Of course it's airborne. How else do these church choirs who all die a few weeks after getting together catch it? They're not all going to touch the same surfaces. They are all going to breathe the same air.

Once things have settled down there'll be lots of talk about 'bringing manufacturing home' and then they'll realise it costs too much so they'll stockpile. Then they'll realise maintaining the stockpile costs too much so they'll deplete it. Then the cycle will begin again.

Proper OTC means there's a broker in the middle of the transaction who matches buyer to seller.

That means that unless they're insane they are not going to allow an anonymous transaction. I guess there are those brokers who seem to be on Okex and Binance who have laundered the money from every crypto crime ever carried out but I wouldn't know how to find them or trust them.

What is a large amount? Binance allow 2 BTC in withdrawals a day without ID, though they can rescind that whenever they want.

Some may suggest decentralised exchanges but hardly any of them are and hardly any of them will have anything above volume that's comatose.

I support any action that hastens the demise of a site that has become way, way too powerful and probably unintentionally too. I doubt they had any idea what a monster it would become when they started it.

The more shit Binance pulls the more turned off people will become until it eventually fades away. Bring it on and speed it up.

I think we underestimate the amount of money in hardware wallets these days. Ledger have mentioned selling over a million of them and that was years ago now. Also it's rather like Bitcoin itself, once something reaches the forefront of a market like this it's not going to be deposed. The trust builds up and sticks so they're only going to grow from here. On top of that I'm sure both enjoy ginormous funding rounds and maybe have an eye on being bought out some day for untold amounts.

With all that in mind I'm not surprised they highlight a bit of dirt on occasion. I own both but stick with Trezor as I prefer their more open and approachable attitude to things. Ledger are snooty fuckers and some day that might bite them, and their users, but they are French.

The best outcome is that this forum fades away into irrelevance until it dies a barely noticed death. That'll mean Bitcoin has become something you simply... use.

Most people do not go on dollar or Android forums. I guess Bitcoin is deep and wide enough to throw up eternal discussion for a small number, plus scams always need a platform, but the moment it never occurs to any normalton to seek this place out is when we know Bitcoin's really going places.

I regard r/cryptocurrency as effectively a goner too.

They live in a world where 'partnerships', one second block times, and zero fees take precedence over stuff that is secure, tested, competently developed and, y'know, works.

Most of the posts display total and wilful incomprehension of the fact that you need a rock solid foundation before you can do anything else. If you point that out they start to turn on you like the freaky children in Village of the Damned.

The only comfort is that all of the shitcoins they wallow in will never get beyond that whining.

I prefer it as a place to confine them in their walled garden. It does feel a bit like entering a parallel universe when you go there.

I've noticed a resurgence of Tether threads which bubbles up every few months on r/btc. They have fixated on USDT being the thing that will 'take down' CoreBorgStreamBilderbergAxaCoin despite it being bleedin' obvious that it'll mangle their pet too. It's unquestionably more dependent on it.

If that level of blinkerdom can be maintained on there then I'd rather leave them to it.

Giving this a bump as a thread on Reddit pointed out that GBTC now has 351,000 BTC. The last time I paid any attention it was around the 90,000 mark which must've been a long time ago now.

I can't imagine any other entity ever managing to accrue an amount this large in future.

What do we reckon the endgame will be? Will they look to dominate Bitcoin investment and move the coins into different and less clunky wrappers as legislation evolves? Will they have an OTC monster sale? Will consumer demand for GBTC keep them where they are and continually growing?

I have seen 'L shape' bandied about which is even less appealing.

The thing about this event that's impossible to call is that economies are basically in suspended animation. It's only when they come out of that that we get a sense of the actual damage. The workers lucky enough to be in countries that are paying their wages probably feel relieved at the moment. They may be less relieved not realising their job is withering and dying off screen and may not be there when the subs end.

And you can have a market that appears healthy and a real world economy that bears little to no resemblance to it. That's what it's been like in recent years already. If you were heavily involved in the markets there've been high after high. If you were working an actual job you would've noticed your cost of living going ever up while your quality of life was slowly sliding downwards.

There might be an even more stark delineation after this of that nature.

You were doing business through a personal bank account. You were money transmitting without a licence or checking anything about where customer money was coming from or where it was going. Those are exceptionally dim moves.

A bank would get its arse fined off operating that way. Why would they let a customer do it?

I don't see how any bank can keep your money unless law enforcement is somehow involved. Go and ask someone legal.

That's good stuff.

Another of the main things anyone can do is attempt to get a handle on their emotions. That's the number one thing that destroys people in this space.

If you do the opposite of what your emotions want you to do you're likely to finish up vastly better off. The hard part is managing it and very few can. If a ATH buyer is still here then they might already be doing better than the average person who would've dumped at the absolute bottom.

On the other hand buying at the tippy top is a classic FOMO move. At least it hasn't cratered completely and they've had a long time to process things and be better set up for next time.

Going through a complete boom and bust cycle is massively beneficial to your attitude to everything. You see things much more clearly the next time around. If there was a way of injecting that experience into new arrivals there'd be far less ruination.

If someone is insane enough to sell to you for Paypal then they will charge you a massively large premium to make up for the inevitable scam attempts.

Literally anything other than Paypal will be a better option. Send it to your bank and buy normally. If you don't have a bank find someone who does and pay them to use it. It'll still work out cheaper.

Anyone capable of reading in bursts of up to 10-20 seconds can figure that out. It has the potential to operate without your real identity being known but you certainly have to work for it and most people can't be bothered or will be near guaranteed to slip up and blow it at some point.

As ever, Bitcoin has the potential to be whatever its users choose or allow it to be. The possibilities are there for it to be a tool of exclusion and surveillance but it can also be the polar opposite if the will exists to create and maintain it.

If they didn't create it government could still be attempting to influence it. It doesn't take much for that to slip away if it's taken in a direction the majority don't agree with.

I think his true fame will eventually be found as a psychological specimen. He will be wheeled from conference to conference and told he's headlining crypto happenings. The audience will be made up of students and psychologists who will coo at his silverback-style lumbering as he spouts his stream of nonsense. Everyone wins which is how it should be.

And there's a business somewhere in those red socks. Either retail or fetish/camgirl.

There is something very obsequious and nauseating about those threads.

If I were a fresh arrival and for whatever reason felt I deserved a world of merit I'd go about it in a rather more crude manner and either threaten suicide, threaten other posters or a bunch of kittens. And then there's burger shots of course.

You might live in a country where there is no tax on it. There are a few.

If I were you I would double check that if you don't fancy jail time should you live in a place where it is taxable.

As for OP, no reputable service has ever mentioned a tax like this, and there is no 9% tax rate in the UK, so it's the same old scamminess.

Shame they didn't include a wee message to add extra irritation. If it were me I would've included 'CSW is a penis' in the transaction.

Is anyone keeping count of the other listed Tulip addresses that have moved? I presume they're slowly adding up as time goes by.