Hey david, how many years is it going to take you before you figure out this shit is dead and no one in their right mind will every trust you or invest in this shit.
Just give up and shoot yourself already man.
Fuck off theif, the only person who deserve to be shot is you. Can't you tell when you aren't welcome? Give back the 700 btc you put in your pocket you useless theif. Have fun selling your soul Bob. Unlike you I honor my word. |
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Can someone point me to a summary of use cases for BitBay?
Cash for coins with trustless cash payments, unbreakable employment contracts immune to deception, international trade contracts with self assurance, barter, farm co-ops, unilateral agreements, p2p python contracts, telcom without wire problems, 2 party escrow, real estate cash deals, microtrading, anonymous unbreakable contracts, with pegging we have backing of a coin at any volume, large credit swaps, trustless lending, economic stability(decentralized), voting by miners, and really any contract that you can imagine without third parties or middle men. |
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Thanks Munti! Also there are a few more things about the client. It's very user friendly compared to all the other clients out there.
There is a setup wizard, it translates to 92 languages supports utf-8, joint accounts are automated and can use two computers for signing transactions, there are templates, filtered chat in escrow, and also advance sending like time locks and voting with stake is on the way.
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David, are you coding alone or did you hire a team to code with you?
Alone, never been able to find coders to help. I've tried but unfortunately most devs are lazy or lack the ability. I attempted to hire in SE Asia and they were way too slow and didn't even commit a single line. It would waste more time to teach them than to do it myself. A few other coders have been very slow to reply to emails or have tried a refactor and quit after about a day of work leaving me with nothing to commit. So I've done 100% of the code. As for the daemon we use Blackcoin source which has been very reliable. Rat4 added some nice cold staking commands so that was helpful. And I was one of the people to message the Bitmessage dev and encourage Aetheros to fix the source of Bitmessage which is what I use to make decentralized markets. The code itself is almost 50k lines. I could reduce it by making it more modular but it's a bit late for a refactor. I don't host on github since I've got doubts that enough people would commit and it would more likely get forked and cloned with dubious ideology. So we host on github after we finish. Also you can download source directly in my server and build from that with variable names changed which is good enough for audits. Any plans to start the peg? I think templates are great, but pegging is where we attract most of the people to our coin. They will see a price increase and go whaaaa? And this interest will go. I'm a bit worried since, talking about the details is one thing, but implementation may be hard? Can you start the peg or at least spec it out first? Thank you Templates are great and all but to all other outsiders. It means nothing. The reason is because there is no marketing or explanation about it. Ideally, you want your marketing team to take screen shots of the new templates and explain what they do and paint a story about how its used. Or videos about it. So far I see none of that, which is why the coin is illiquid. And stagnant and outside of top 100 on coinmarketcap without any volume, so I think shifting gears to peg may be better. No the client needs to be finished completely first. Investing is a game of patience and coding requires extreme patience. I've already delivered decentralized markets and totally transformed the client as promised. The rest will come soon enough. |
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David, are you coding alone or did you hire a team to code with you?
Alone, never been able to find coders to help. I've tried but unfortunately most devs are lazy or lack the ability. I attempted to hire in SE Asia and they were way too slow and didn't even commit a single line. It would waste more time to teach them than to do it myself. A few other coders have been very slow to reply to emails or have tried a refactor and quit after about a day of work leaving me with nothing to commit. So I've done 100% of the code. As for the daemon we use Blackcoin source which has been very reliable. Rat4 added some nice cold staking commands so that was helpful. And I was one of the people to message the Bitmessage dev and encourage Aetheros to fix the source of Bitmessage which is what I use to make decentralized markets. The code itself is almost 50k lines. I could reduce it by making it more modular but it's a bit late for a refactor. I don't host on github since I've got doubts that enough people would commit and it would more likely get forked and cloned with dubious ideology. So we host on github after we finish. Also you can download source directly in my server and build from that with variable names changed which is good enough for audits. |
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David's Back!!!! This is great news
Sounds like he never left, just took a few days off. Well deserved I should think. I was moving, had to fly to Mexico City for a week to take care of some personal stuff, had to organize the new house and have been selling my trailer and stuff. There was a bunch of other things too. In order to keep my freedom and avoid 9-5 had to come up with a strategy to lower my expenses so I lost a month or so. I did some coding but it wasn't enough. I did code a really cool anti-keylogger password thing. It's badass. Say bye bye to screen recorder and loggers. Plus I fixed allof the bugs and sync problems so the software is really robust. I started hosting the nodes myself since I noticed the old ones were down. Anyways I'm on the contract now lol my friend is managing me. I'm also doing one for him we have a list of habits to break... no eating out, hitting the gym daily etc. Stuff we are forced to do or lose our deposits. Most importantly many hours of coding daily. I have to sign off on it daily applying for daily time extensions and report back how many lines of code I contributed and what the code was. He's working on a different project related to construction. It's a spreadsheet with a cost breakdown of all the alternative building heating cooling methods for low cost decentralized housing. Such as 3d printed housing, Aircrete(Google it, it's amazing), Silo Homes, Earthbags and about 20 other awesome types of construction. Actually anyone who is interested in that can PM me especially if you have feedback on new techniques or want to see the sheet. Anyways so I might force myself to report here every few days but for now I'm keeping the requirements realistic. Ya know, what you are describing here as a contract with your friend could be a whole new use case for smart contracts (and BitBay). An entire eco-system could be set up around something like this, one-on-one fitness contracts, weight loss contracts, health maintenance contracts, child care, etc. Might want to think about it a bit more! Yeah and so far it's working out well. The rules were 15 min of exercise, 10 min meditation, 10 min stretch, can only eat out once every two days and contribute at least 10 lines of code. The goals are set modest, but that's the whole idea. I know someone who wants to use it for weight loss lol. |
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David's Back!!!! This is great news
Sounds like he never left, just took a few days off. Well deserved I should think. I was moving, had to fly to Mexico City for a week to take care of some personal stuff, had to organize the new house and have been selling my trailer and stuff. There was a bunch of other things too. In order to keep my freedom and avoid 9-5 had to come up with a strategy to lower my expenses so I lost a month or so. I did some coding but it wasn't enough. I did code a really cool anti-keylogger password thing. It's badass. Say bye bye to screen recorder and loggers. Plus I fixed allof the bugs and sync problems so the software is really robust. I started hosting the nodes myself since I noticed the old ones were down. Anyways I'm on the contract now lol my friend is managing me. I'm also doing one for him we have a list of habits to break... no eating out, hitting the gym daily etc. Stuff we are forced to do or lose our deposits. Most importantly many hours of coding daily. I have to sign off on it daily applying for daily time extensions and report back how many lines of code I contributed and what the code was. He's working on a different project related to construction. It's a spreadsheet with a cost breakdown of all the alternative building heating cooling methods for low cost decentralized housing. Such as 3d printed housing, Aircrete(Google it, it's amazing), Silo Homes, Earthbags and about 20 other awesome types of construction. Actually anyone who is interested in that can PM me especially if you have feedback on new techniques or want to see the sheet. Anyways so I might force myself to report here every few days but for now I'm keeping the requirements realistic. |
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By the way crazy news that is of direct interest to investors. I've been busy with life past few weeks so to force me to more productive, I've put myself on double deposit contract with a friend. If I fail to code daily I will lose my deposit a few hundred dollars. Another use case for Halo... ideas in action. So I'm now forced to meet productivity deadlines. If I start to fall behind I will enter in to a few more of these so there are extra peers to confirm I'm working (most likely with someone I trust to manage me). It's a good way to crush procrastination I recommend it to any of you if you guys have unmet new years resolutions lol.
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buy now or regret later :-))
When people become aware of bitbay it will be a rocket! David we thank you
Honestly thank you for the support. It would have been hard to code without it. This is a great community. United by a lot of strong ideologies. Thanks to crypto, I've made some great friendships. It's not just crypto that is the common link, it's a lot of the progressive ideas that are similar to it. Anyways with a little bit more patience, the next update will have the exotic spending features followed with another template. And we will be primed to finish the rest. |
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Of course we want people to copy it, when its the right time. The whole idea is to give investors time to benefit from their investment. The point of changing variable names is to allow audits and deter cloning. Eventually the variable name obfuscation will also be removed.
Currently you can build from source by downloading the Bitbay source code obfuscated package and occasionally people have done that. It's fairly easy to audit and guarantee that the code itself is secure.
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you can guarantee price of a coin through deflation/inflation? rather big assumption wouldn't you say?
Nothing big about that assumption. It's done everyday in fiat, and it works. David said currencies don't deflate, and that's mostly correct in the long term for several reasons -one of them being inflation target above zero. But they do deflate short term all the time.
seems to me like a secondary market will be created one which is related to demand or volume
A secondary market will also be part of this.
You cannot guarantee that volume will rise thus it really is just circling back to the same issue...its a cool solution to a general problem but not sure if it will do what you intend but hey lets see it go should be interesting.
We are in the infancy of crypto, so no one can guarantee anything for any coin. BitBay and syscoin can both be dead two years from now for reasons none of use are able to foresee. Or one or both of them can become biger than bitcoin. There is no telling.
I can imagine it will deflate pretty quickly as people want higher prices and then wait for new money to come in to take volume higher so old money can get out of their stuck coins.
I def see why you envision a scenario like that. But the whole point of the peg is to provide stability, so there are limits to how fast it will be allowed to move. I don't think monetary policy in central banks is for price discovery of their currency, it is to stimulate economic growth or velocity (volume) of that currency or try to curb growth or slow down velocity, which has an affect of setting the market rate of the instrument, along with other affects. It's not the only factor which sets price thus you cannot guarantee a certain price. This is why I was saying the market will deflect into a volume based market where trading will happen based on projections of volume peaks instead of price... it will be interesting to see if volatility can be avoided this way since there is always a herd affect near peaks and troughs which bring in volatility... so instead of price crashing you might see volume crashing instead and then the question is what would bring about new volume again. Who knows what the actual price will be when these peaks are found. A whitepaper will go along way in describing the phenomenon when expected peaks and troughs are reached and how stability is actually achieved through some mathematical models. Yeah that's partly true. It depends on how miners vote. However my assumption is, miners will vote for whatever makes them more money. So if they see low volume and very low price they will deflate. If they see high volume they inflate. But remember, investors can also watch those global deflation rates correct? So miners aren't doing anything that won't be seen coming a mile away. Also perhaps if the software itself cast votes automatically by an algorithm then chances are miners will not be able to go against the algorithm just like it's hard to swim against a tide. Finally, you can guarantee an exact dollar price if you deflate a lot. I'm not recommending it, but in theory that means a group of miners can do it like Tether but self backed and if one backer disappears then someone else can freeze gradually to their comfort level and take their place. Extreme example: Deflate from 1 billion to 1000 coins, back with 1000 dollars and now it's exactly a dollar a coin. If that backer leaves anyone can take his place. Also secondary markets for frozen coins is not a design flaw, it's one of the best features. Since frozen coins can be moved with a 3 month time lock, they serve as credit swaps, bonds, and even trustless loans. So we hope to see that happen As to not having a whitepaper the community specifically asked me not to do this since it would give way too technical of a breakdown of how it's coded. And we want to be the first to release it. It certainly will be open source. |
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Tether is literally just as simple as saying "we back 100k coins with 100k USD" I assume the increase in supply was due to increase in capital. The problem? When the centralized backer disappears, bye bye Tether and bye bye money.
BitBays peg doesnt need to worry about hard fixed price, just a stable price. If they vote by an algorithm it's still elective. That's enforced on the client side so it's still Democratic and decentralized.
The voting freezes supply that can also be unfrozen. It's strange to me that currency's (only) inflate. Currencies should be able to deflate as well. Coins freeze so that early investors get benefits of being early since they hold their frozen coins to be deployed as volume increases.
Finding a target price might take a long time. But the most important guarantee is survival of a HEALTHY price of the coin. We can guarantee this because if it becomes unhealthy we deflate.
Glad you brought up Tether also. Because we can do what they do but decentralized. Imagine Bill wants to back Bitbay but he's poor. So he and others vote for deflation. Now he decreases supply to 30k coins. He wants to guarantee a price of 30k so he takes 30k in btc and he places a buy wall. Now nobody can break his peg unless they vote to inflate. But Bill will see if the voting becomes unsustainable and remove the wall. Also he won't need 30k to hold it at a dollar anyways because it's a fallacy of proposition to think everyone will sell.
Regardless the price will always be healthy and unlike a hard peg price can grow and is not stuck to the weakening dollar.
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Yeah it's crazy. Okay well so I will mention pegging but not go into much detail.
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Why don't you get in touch with Ronnie at CCDEK (obits, btsr). and become part of their ICCO monthly venture. They have their own ad company and blockpay and bitland just used them. You deal with coding and they will deal with promotion. I don't get any benefit from this other than I invest on Openledger and I also happen to own a small amount of Bitbay on BTER.
Okay, thanks for the advice. Also anyone who has trouble connecting to sync, I have a peers.dat file with lots of nodes in it, just let me know (i noticed some seed nodes were down) |
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I have been into Bay for long as I like to be into coins with superior tech. Also, agree that Eth is crap. There are many coins with superior tech that aren't doing as well as they should but I think you may be focusing too much on bashing other coins such as Eth. I see the same being done by Vcash dev. That doesn't help your coin.
What you are lacking is partnerships, marketing people and investors. Good tech alone won't help you go too far as we have seen with many coins before. The big shitcoin devs have people going into various conferences around the world and talking to people, forging partnerships and making deals. You are not doing any of that. That is why Bitbay isn't going much higher. Maybe you can't afford to go to conferences, but you can enter into partnerships.
Partnerships - Are there any authority people out there who would appreciate high end decentralized tech? You should do a video chat with them. Build the word slowly with the people who like this stuff. If they like it, they will talk about it in front of their audiences. These are the people looking for interesting content to share or they simply talk about you out of pure passion. You may consider doing interviews with anarchic talk shows, for example.
Marketing led by people - start a referral program where people can get paid in a decentralized way to promote various aspects of Bitbay such as getting new vendors and buyers. Website owners can then put up ads, tutorials, coupons of listings on the bitbay network and get paid in a decentralized way.
Private group of investors - they aren't in for the passion alone. They want to make a profit. Consider the siafund method. A second chain or maybe a token (bayfunds) built on top of another chain which gets X% of the bitbay network fees as taxes. Your investors can own the bayfunds. Now they have an incentive to promote bitbay and increase bitbay network activity.
Thanks, this is actually really good advice. I used to go to conferences and promote but git burned out because it distracted from coding. But I think it needs to be done more. Booths are expensive about 1-3k. I've got some people interested in partnerships but they just want the tech for a joint project. There is no way I can start new projects until this is done. But outreach to others I'm almost certain I can find an interview on anarchast or something similar. I had an interview on "pirate radio" which was at least a solid hour of talking. It was well received. From a marketing angle, this question has been mentioned multiple times. We are going to hire a PR place to do articles. These will be Bitbay exclusive. The whole cost is a few Bitcoins and we will get a press release in at least 20 publications, I think it might be even more. Will check. The question remains how much should we talk about rolling pegs. When we want to keep it confidential but also need a bigger community. |
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The thing about Bay is that we need to hop on these fads and ride them. Right now it's anonymous tech. It looks like any anon coin is rising. Even real poor examples.
I think the issue is most people never hear about bay and there are 1000's of ann threads now. 80% of these coins will die out but by then 10x more will spring up only to die pretty soon after.
All we are lacking is attention really.
I think a 2nd big ICO with road map would have really brought in some new interest.
The bay market place is an amazing creation but we need to get people on it and using it somehow.
Well a 2nd ICO would get attention but it dilutes your holdings so that's not fair. Also, it's funny because some of the most random things pump. There isn't anything in crypto even close to BitBay. Most coins don't even have 1/20th the feature here. So in reality it's totally ridiculous that this hasn't gone up significantly. I suppose it's a matter of visually showing people what this software can do. Screenshots, videos etc. Articles as well help and I'm looking into that. The problem with too many articles is giving away trade secrets if pegging so there is a way to write about rolling pegs that won't give away too much? I dunno... |
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Then they audit the DAO, find a serious bug, and instead of TESTING the race to zero attack, they say "it's no big deal" and then allow the bug to happen. If that isn't an "inside job" then I don't know what is. They sold their coins pick them up for half and then dump again.
plus they who took a year to come out with their client by the next day of the DAO hack they had a soft fork and a hard fork ready for their loyal community to steal more money from them in the future . Right and that makes you wonder if one of their guys was the hacker. Statiscially that's the most probable outcome. But still one does not need to look far into ETH to see avarice. The question remains of which members of their team are honest. I'm sure they have good coders but at the end of the day the fork totally harms the public. Now when someone comes in to buy and they hardly know Bitcoin they will ask "Wait should I buy ETH or ETC?". |
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I've tried to read some of the posts, I can see that the developers are devoted to this project and are very keen on making it successful but one thing I noted here is that you guys don't talk about the marketing side of it, no matter how solid a project is if nobody is out there to use it the effort invested into it will not be rewarded. I read a post that the developer of Bitbay developed smart contract ahead of Ethereum but to me Ethereum guys get this right because they got marketing/publicity side of their project right and they become successful. I have no doubt there is a market gap for Bitbay to fill but we need to understand that marketing a product is a important as developing it if not more important.
I don't agree Etherum got it right unless you'r talking about p&d or devs getting rich. We are all working on software that is supposed to handle peoples money. That means we have to get it right first, and then market it. The damage that Eth has done to itself will be very hard to fix. Whales keeping Eth price at artificial high level after disaster only has effect amongst traders hoping to get rich. It has no relevance for adoption amongst ordinary people and businesses, and I can't see why they would use a coin with a dev team that is so reckless. That said, I totally agree marketing is just as (or more) important as developing. We even have a marketing tool built into our client, the pay to mail feature. True I actually agree with everything you say here. It was extremely irresponsible to investors what they did with DAO and did with pumping. We are doing it the right way, less volume now, we market a completed product that we test and can be proud of. However from a greed perspective ETH did everything to try and be a media darling and shake investors for money. Market first code later. It's a matter of principal. And we still have tons of room to market and grow. I disagree with you that Ethereum is a pump and dump coin, a pump and dump coin will not still have a strong community behind it after hack, don't let us deceive ourselves, the cryptoworld is a world of unknown to all of us, an experiment, we stumble, learn and rise even bitcoin was once $1000 and later dropped to $200+ range. Can you categorically say that Monero is a pump and dump coin, because of the recent rally in price. I believe investors in BitBay will not mind pump in their token price to $1. People do not invest in project because of strong code, they do because of the profit potential. Well actually the rise in Monero was because of pumpers. I'm sure if we asked around we could even figure out who pumped it. We can prove price doesnt rise because of tech based on the fact that Blackcoin had contracts years before ETH and Bitbay had markets yeahs before OB. We have the best tech here. The current price of Bitbay is almost an insult lol. Ethereum may not be pumpers they might be theives. The DAO was completely wrong. ETH raised 20 million to code their client. They had no product was vaporware for a year and then they release buggy product with serious security holes and absolutely no user interface. Months later the UI was a joke. Then by Vitaliks own admission, they dumped their premined coins on the market. Then instead of coding, they try to be media darlings hyping up their product which bloats the blockchain with no prospective resolution. Plus, they overblow what contracts can do unlike DDE which has many real world applications. Of course DDE is only one type of contract but it's the most important. Then they involve themselves in another crowdfund(when they should have been coding) which they didn't market and somehow got 100 million. It was obvious they bought their own DAO and refunded themselves (no different from our scandal but times 100)... so like 20 plus million wasn't enough for these greedy fellows they wanted more. If I had 40 mil I could build a frikkin UFO lol. Then they audit the DAO, find a serious bug, and instead of TESTING the race to zero attack, they say "it's no big deal" and then allow the bug to happen. If that isn't an "inside job" then I don't know what is. They sold their coins pick them up for half and then dump again. Then they violate all principalities and ethics of blockchain and reverse the transaction... causing a fork, screwing the community, and most importantly not taking responsibility for their actions. I like Vitalik from our conversations and I hope he is innocent pawn. But the Ethereum team as a whole are theives... or at best completely irresponsible. |
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That's really nice of you guys thanks for the support |
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I've tried to read some of the posts, I can see that the developers are devoted to this project and are very keen on making it successful but one thing I noted here is that you guys don't talk about the marketing side of it, no matter how solid a project is if nobody is out there to use it the effort invested into it will not be rewarded. I read a post that the developer of Bitbay developed smart contract ahead of Ethereum but to me Ethereum guys get this right because they got marketing/publicity side of their project right and they become successful. I have no doubt there is a market gap for Bitbay to fill but we need to understand that marketing a product is a important as developing it if not more important.
I don't agree Etherum got it right unless you'r talking about p&d or devs getting rich. We are all working on software that is supposed to handle peoples money. That means we have to get it right first, and then market it. The damage that Eth has done to itself will be very hard to fix. Whales keeping Eth price at artificial high level after disaster only has effect amongst traders hoping to get rich. It has no relevance for adoption amongst ordinary people and businesses, and I can't see why they would use a coin with a dev team that is so reckless. That said, I totally agree marketing is just as (or more) important as developing. We even have a marketing tool built into our client, the pay to mail feature. True I actually agree with everything you say here. It was extremely irresponsible to investors what they did with DAO and did with pumping. We are doing it the right way, less volume now, we market a completed product that we test and can be proud of. However from a greed perspective ETH did everything to try and be a media darling and shake investors for money. Market first code later. It's a matter of principal. And we still have tons of room to market and grow. |
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