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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3008677 times)
eestimees
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April 20, 2013, 08:02:32 AM
 #521

bla bla bla..

someone should go to their office ask some in deep but not secret revealing questions and we all would know is this scam or not. as i recall a handful of ppl volunteered to go by their office.

IHMO all this mambo-jambo about companies relations and stuff does not matter, if they are working on something they should have designs or maybe protos if they are that far. if it is a scam they will refuse visitors and are hiding behind "nda"s or whatever "clever reasons" they can think of.

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April 20, 2013, 08:42:17 AM
 #522

Did everyone read the announcement carefully?
http://orsoc.se/orsoc-and-kncminer-are-partnering-up-to-develop-bitcoin-mining-products/langswitch_lang/en/

Quote
"ORSoC will be responsible for product development, including design, production and testing."
the announcement continues:

Quote
Our technical expertise together with excellent vendor partnership we feel confident we quickly can design and produce an affordable high performance mining product

The nature of the partnership is plain: a fgpa company new to ASICS (but aware how much they sell for) has hired two local 'entrepeneurs' to get the money to develop something that hasn't even been given a chalkboard outline yet.

Kncminer are following the BFL business model.

Quote from: kncminer.com
Even when we have made enough progress we will open up our order books with two possible purchase methods. The first will be a standard payment in advance allowing customers to enter as far down the queue as possible (based on a first come first serve bases). The first 500 KNCminers will be sold this way, as soon as the first 500 are sold we will close that order book.

The second order type which will be available at the same time is a 50% upfront payment method. Customers enter the queue as low as possible (first come first serve) with the miner numbers starting at 501 the rest of the 50% payment is then due 3 weeks before shipment.

We will then close that method as soon as we ship our first miner and return to the standard upfront payment method.

An interesting payment plan: let me restate it.

When "enough" has been done the following happens.

    • A starting pistol is fired!
    • The two categories are both available for payment, paying all of your <500 order or half of your >500 order gets your order shipped before later payments in the category
    • Category 1 shuts after 500 units are paid for
    • Category 2 still accepts the aforementioned half payment
    • A second starting pistol is fired, category 2 orders will need to pay the other half because the first unit will ship in 3 weeks from today
    • The back of the queue will still be open to anyone who pays 100% of the unit cost on a new preorder
    • Unit 1 leaves the KNCminer HQ after the 3 week window passes
    • KNCminer consequently "returns" to the standard 100% upfront payment policy
     
    • Luke-Jr's designated delivery address- the KNCminer office in Stockholm- takes receipt of the unit and notifies him it is hashing with a polite email+IMG attachment
    • Units 2 and above reach their owners quickly and with absolute deference to payment order
    • These units work without major faults according to realistic but impressive specifications for a period of time that exceeds BFL's total shipping delays

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    April 20, 2013, 11:48:40 AM
     #523

    Best scam yet.

    They say they won't accept payment first but they will allow it. Of-course the people who pay first will the ones to get it first.
    But that's the scam. Those first 500 people who pay will get jipped of their money.

    Sure 80% might pay by Paypal and 20% might pay by bitcoin. At least they get 20% of 500 orders (Let's just guess 40BTC a unit).
    So that's about 4000 BTC (100 orders x 40BTC) or about $324K USD in today's value.

    Not too bad of a pay for an easy 1 month scam work.

    Done.

    If they have such a sort turn around time they don't even need pre orders. Just have people order and then in 2 weeks get your miner. They still haven't proven who they are with many requests.


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    April 20, 2013, 01:21:06 PM
     #524

    Just a thought as a newbie looking in, perhaps they don't feel the need to jump through hoops satisfying all the questions on here.

    If they do have a product not far off getting rolled out they will sell them as fast as they can produce them, so why waste time answering a never ending grilling on here?


    As soon as the first couple of units roll out people on here would be climbing over each other get one anyway.

    don't shoot me down, just my observation  Smiley





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    April 20, 2013, 01:41:17 PM
     #525

    A question to kncminer:

    If bitcoin price crashed back to single digits and many people abandoned bitcoin, are you still believe in bitcoin and want to make ASIC devices?

    I think that current ASIC device manufacturers all have this belief when they started the project one year ago

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    April 20, 2013, 02:02:54 PM
     #526

    GG

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    April 20, 2013, 02:10:32 PM
     #527

    Just a thought as a newbie looking in, perhaps they don't feel the need to jump through hoops satisfying all the questions on here.

    If they do have a product not far off getting rolled out they will sell them as fast as they can produce them, so why waste time answering a never ending grilling on here?


    As soon as the first couple of units roll out people on here would be climbing over each other get one anyway.

    don't shoot me down, just my observation  Smiley

    Lulz, "jump through hoops"

    You call this jumping through hoops?!? : reply to a few questions that any normal company wouldn't have much problem replying to and would be to their advantage to reply if the company was for real.

    Though yeah it can take an entire day to post a simple reply and then they'd be able to blame bitcoin talk for not making their deadline ... rather than the fact that it can't be done anyway without, at this stage, already having chips or a prototype.

    13 days and counting ...

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    April 20, 2013, 04:29:37 PM
     #528

    Just a thought as a newbie looking in, perhaps they don't feel the need to jump through hoops satisfying all the questions on here.

    If they do have a product not far off getting rolled out they will sell them as fast as they can produce them, so why waste time answering a never ending grilling on here?


    As soon as the first couple of units roll out people on here would be climbing over each other get one anyway.

    don't shoot me down, just my observation  Smiley

    Lulz, "jump through hoops"

    You call this jumping through hoops?!? : reply to a few questions that any normal company wouldn't have much problem replying to and would be to their advantage to reply if the company was for real.

    Though yeah it can take an entire day to post a simple reply and then they'd be able to blame bitcoin talk for not making their deadline ... rather than the fact that it can't be done anyway without, at this stage, already having chips or a prototype.

    13 days and counting ...

    Yet the difference between a real legit company who doesn't need to reply to every troll, and a BFL who comes on forums and calls people pieces of shit
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    April 20, 2013, 04:39:27 PM
     #529

    kncminer maybe answer our questions?

    Hi All,

    We have been busy which is why you have not heard from us, I will try to answer some quick questions.

    First the PayPal vs BTC question.

       We will accept both!

    Second hardware spec’s

       You are all correct we will publish stats on working prototypes with clear and unquestionable evidence (Video/ photograph/youtube/ newspaper reviews/personal checks) that we have working products. We will first publish this to the people who have registered on our site. They and only they (who have registered before publication date) will be given the ability to complete their preorders. Devices will then ship in the weeks after as they are made tested and sent.

    For other questions and ones that I have failed to answer form the forum

    We have started to add an FAQ to our site. We will build on that with the repeat questions we receive.  If I have not returned a personal response to your question look at our site first If you have a genuine question (we do get quite a few which are very strange) we will do our best to either publish the answer on our FAQ or reply to you directly

    Sam


    But they dont answer my questions directly on the forums and call me a scumbag. Ohhh noeez they haven't sent me a working hashing unit in the last 10 days of their announcement of being ready in the Summer. SCAMMM
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    April 20, 2013, 04:52:56 PM
     #530

    Just a thought as a newbie looking in, perhaps they don't feel the need to jump through hoops satisfying all the questions on here.

    If they do have a product not far off getting rolled out they will sell them as fast as they can produce them, so why waste time answering a never ending grilling on here?


    As soon as the first couple of units roll out people on here would be climbing over each other get one anyway.

    don't shoot me down, just my observation  Smiley


    Your completely right. They said when we are ready we will post all the proof and information needed. Yet if you read all the posts until now its the same shit, why dont you send me a unit. How many gh/sec? I wouldnt reply to these dumbass questions either nor would a legit company have time to do so.

    You don't see Microsoft or IBM posting and defending themselves every single second.

    Hey did you get those chips ready?
    BFL_Josh: No i was posting on forums

    Last timr i checked Avalon a legit company doesnt fucking respond to every dumb fucking question because unlike butterfly they are building units. I would be scared if a company kept responding.

    This thread needs to be closed and left only to KNC to post before it becomes 100 pages long of the same drivvel. Chill out when they put up their hardware then you can start with the scaming.

    I'm sure a 12yr old company who makes 1.5M a year, will want to scam 20% of pre order money makes so much sense.
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    April 20, 2013, 07:05:47 PM
     #531

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    http://www.idg.se/2.1085/1.229007/oppen-kallkod-for-kretsar-blir-nasta-linux (translated to English, then I broke up the large paragraph)

    Quote
    The hårdvarukod which is used to determine how a circuit works is becoming increasingly complex. This has led to a desire for open source even in this area, according to Marcus Erlandsson, one of the men behind the open source site OpenCores. - It has no longer afford to self-invent the wheel time and again. It all works just like Linux. Those who outsource their code gets help from all over the world with verification and verifying may use the code. It's a win-win situation, he says. Marcus Erlandsson is technical manager at Swedish ORSoC, a consulting firm that develops electronics. After a year and a half, the company owns OpenCores. - We have been working towards this site since it started in 1999. When the founders wanted to hand over to a company that had the right mindset, that is open source, we had the honor to buy the site of them.

    How do you earn money with it?

     - We have two hats. First, we use projects on the Open Core and picks code from them, and we run the Open Core for it to become the hardware equivalent of Linux. We have also opened OpenCores too little advertising, but it is marginal. Marcus Erlandsson believes that the fair value of the site for ORSoC located in the pr company gets. - Everyone in this area knows that we own the site and are experts in this technology . We are contacted by the world's largest companies, and that's pretty special for a small Swedish company.
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    April 20, 2013, 07:14:15 PM
     #532

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    http://www.idg.se/2.1085/1.229007/oppen-kallkod-for-kretsar-blir-nasta-linux (translated to English, then I broke up the large paragraph)

    Quote
    The hårdvarukod which is used to determine how a circuit works is becoming increasingly complex. This has led to a desire for open source even in this area, according to Marcus Erlandsson, one of the men behind the open source site OpenCores. - It has no longer afford to self-invent the wheel time and again. It all works just like Linux. Those who outsource their code gets help from all over the world with verification and verifying may use the code. It's a win-win situation, he says. Marcus Erlandsson is technical manager at Swedish ORSoC, a consulting firm that develops electronics. After a year and a half, the company owns OpenCores. - We have been working towards this site since it started in 1999. When the founders wanted to hand over to a company that had the right mindset, that is open source, we had the honor to buy the site of them.

    How do you earn money with it?

     - We have two hats. First, we use projects on the Open Core and picks code from them, and we run the Open Core for it to become the hardware equivalent of Linux. We have also opened OpenCores too little advertising, but it is marginal. Marcus Erlandsson believes that the fair value of the site for ORSoC located in the pr company gets. - Everyone in this area knows that we own the site and are experts in this technology . We are contacted by the world's largest companies, and that's pretty special for a small Swedish company.

    Companies do it all the time. Like kfc taco bell ect all owned by yum brands. Maybe if they fail their brand won't be tarnished, but failing doesnt mean scam, such as Basic refunding people. All and all this is wild speculation, someone can contsct OR and ask if they have any ownership stake or how the partnership came to be.

    Until then i would just wait for more info
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    April 20, 2013, 07:24:18 PM
     #533

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    Why don't you just look at the LinkedIn profiles of who's working at ORSoC and for the people behind KNCMiner, before posting nonsense like this?
    Do you seriously believe that a company of that size would risk everything, just to earn some extra pennies on a few thousands bitcoin rigs?
     
    It's all just wild speculations without any plausible or reasonable thought behind it.
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    April 20, 2013, 07:37:23 PM
     #534

    Quote
    Companies do it all the time. Like kfc taco bell ect all owned by yum brands. Maybe if they fail their brand won't be tarnished, but failing doesnt mean scam, such as Basic refunding people. All and all this is wild speculation, someone can contsct OR and ask if they have any ownership stake or how the partnership came to be.

    Until then i would just wait for more info

    Are you calling my theory wild speculations.

    https://twitter.com/m_erlandsson

    Check out his posts and who he follows. Been involved with Bitcoin since 2010.

    Ironically, the first person he followed was...wait for it...Gavin Andresen.

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    Why don't you just look at the LinkedIn profiles of who's working at ORSoC and for the people behind KNCMiner, before posting nonsense like this?
    Do you seriously believe that a company of that size would risk everything, just to earn some extra pennies on a few thousands bitcoin rigs?
     
    It's all just wild speculations without any plausible or reasonable thought behind it.

    Just did what you suggest, hence the above.
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    April 20, 2013, 07:37:45 PM
     #535

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    Why don't you just look at the LinkedIn profiles of who's working at ORSoC and for the people behind KNCMiner, before posting nonsense like this?
    Do you seriously believe that a company of that size would risk everything, just to earn some extra pennies on a few thousands bitcoin rigs?
     
    It's all just wild speculations without any plausible or reasonable thought behind it.

    Let's see, 3000x 500 = 1,500,000
    1500x 500 = 750,000
    150000+750000= 2,250,000

    Even if the sellers took half of net, that is a lot of fucking money they'd get in the space of a month. Once you have their money, you can just say (rightly) that you have set unrealistic targets and ship your first 1000 over the course of a year or however long it takes, BFL have proven you don't have to meet your targets to survive here because there will always be enough noobs with Stockholm syndrome holding out for that pot o'gold at the end of the mining rainbow. It's called the gambler's fallacy.

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    pizza
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    April 20, 2013, 07:51:29 PM
     #536

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    Why don't you just look at the LinkedIn profiles of who's working at ORSoC and for the people behind KNCMiner, before posting nonsense like this?
    Do you seriously believe that a company of that size would risk everything, just to earn some extra pennies on a few thousands bitcoin rigs?
     
    It's all just wild speculations without any plausible or reasonable thought behind it.

    Let's see, 3000x 500 = 1,500,000
    1500x 500 = 750,000
    150000+750000= 2,250,000

    Even if the sellers took half of net, that is a lot of fucking money they'd get in the space of a month. Once you have their money, you can just say (rightly) that you have set unrealistic targets and ship your first 1000 over the course of a year or however long it takes, BFL have proven you don't have to meet your targets to survive here because there will always be enough noobs with Stockholm syndrome holding out for that pot o'gold at the end of the mining rainbow. It's called the gambler's fallacy.

    Majority of people will pay with paypal and ask for refunds before 45 days. So i dont think a company making 1.5M a year is going to risk their company and jail time for 200-400k.

    And there's nothing wrong if they know eachother, a company doesn't have to advertise that we are friends. How do you think business partnerships and deals happen all the time through friends. Like all the google ex employees starting companies and partnering with google or selling back to them. Again theres absolutely no reason to make public their private or business relationships with one another.
    Phinnaeus Gage
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    April 20, 2013, 08:02:50 PM
     #537

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    http://www.idg.se/2.1085/1.229007/oppen-kallkod-for-kretsar-blir-nasta-linux (translated to English, then I broke up the large paragraph)

    Quote
    The hårdvarukod which is used to determine how a circuit works is becoming increasingly complex. This has led to a desire for open source even in this area, according to Marcus Erlandsson, one of the men behind the open source site OpenCores. - It has no longer afford to self-invent the wheel time and again. It all works just like Linux. Those who outsource their code gets help from all over the world with verification and verifying may use the code. It's a win-win situation, he says. Marcus Erlandsson is technical manager at Swedish ORSoC, a consulting firm that develops electronics. After a year and a half, the company owns OpenCores. - We have been working towards this site since it started in 1999. When the founders wanted to hand over to a company that had the right mindset, that is open source, we had the honor to buy the site of them.

    How do you earn money with it?

     - We have two hats. First, we use projects on the Open Core and picks code from them, and we run the Open Core for it to become the hardware equivalent of Linux. We have also opened OpenCores too little advertising, but it is marginal. Marcus Erlandsson believes that the fair value of the site for ORSoC located in the pr company gets. - Everyone in this area knows that we own the site and are experts in this technology . We are contacted by the world's largest companies, and that's pretty special for a small Swedish company.

    Companies do it all the time. Like kfc taco bell ect all owned by yum brands. Maybe if they fail their brand won't be tarnished, but failing doesnt mean scam, such as Basic refunding people. All and all this is wild speculation, someone can contsct OR and ask if they have any ownership stake or how the partnership came to be.

    Until then i would just wait for more info

    I guess companies change their contact information all the time, too.

    http://network-tools.com/default.asp?prog=express&host=opencores.org

    Quote
    Answer records
    opencores.org      NS    dns2.se   600s
    opencores.org      MX   
    preference:   0
    exchange:   mail.opencores.org
    600s
    opencores.org      A   92.43.36.68   600s
    opencores.org      SOA   
    server:   dns1.se
    email:   hostmaster@opencores.org
    serial:   1364907033
    refresh:   10800
    retry:   3600
    expire:   604800
    minimum ttl:   600
    600s
    opencores.org      NS    dns1.se   600s

    From March 28, 2013: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:q7rCnJI1E_QJ:network-tools.com/default.asp%3Fprog%3Dexpress%26host%3Dopencores.org+&cd=8&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

    Quote
    Answer records
    opencores.org      SOA   
    server:   dns1.se
    email:   marcus@erlandsson.gmail.com
    serial:   2011091501
    refresh:   28800
    retry:   7200
    expire:   604800
    minimum ttl:   600
    600s
    opencores.org      A   92.43.36.68   600s
    opencores.org      MX   
    preference:   0
    exchange:   mail.opencores.org
    600s
    opencores.org      NS    dns1.se   600s
    opencores.org      NS    dns2.se   600s

    Looks to me like more time is spent on covering tracks than in developing ASICs.
    John Self
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    April 20, 2013, 08:13:20 PM
     #538

    I'll tell you what! If it comes to light that ORSoC is truly behind this project, but opted for starting some other entity, namely, KNCMiner, to further development via distancing themselves, then that would not bode well, for it would have been best for ORSoC to come forward and declare their intent at the onset, unless I'm missing something as to why they can't do that.

    Why don't you just look at the LinkedIn profiles of who's working at ORSoC and for the people behind KNCMiner, before posting nonsense like this?
    Do you seriously believe that a company of that size would risk everything, just to earn some extra pennies on a few thousands bitcoin rigs?
     
    It's all just wild speculations without any plausible or reasonable thought behind it.

    Let's see, 3000x 500 = 1,500,000
    1500x 500 = 750,000
    150000+750000= 2,250,000

    Even if the sellers took half of net, that is a lot of fucking money they'd get in the space of a month. Once you have their money, you can just say (rightly) that you have set unrealistic targets and ship your first 1000 over the course of a year or however long it takes, BFL have proven you don't have to meet your targets to survive here because there will always be enough noobs with Stockholm syndrome holding out for that pot o'gold at the end of the mining rainbow. It's called the gambler's fallacy.

    Majority of people will pay with paypal and ask for refunds before 45 days. So i dont think a company making 1.5M a year is going to risk their company and jail time for 200-400k.

    And there's nothing wrong if they know eachother, a company doesn't have to advertise that we are friends. How do you think business partnerships and deals happen all the time through friends. Like all the google ex employees starting companies and partnering with google or selling back to them. Again theres absolutely no reason to make public their private or business relationships with one another.

    Trololol. Phinnaeus Gage has already shown that the orsoc guys and whoever runs this sockpuppet have known each other long before this "business" was set up in a room above a restaurant, not far from the orsoc office.

    The type of people who would throw their money at a stupid venture like this are already balls deep in BFL, and a little wiser for their experience, whilst the ones who want to gamble on miners can see where the difficulty is going and will find the new asics that actually work and have semi-reliable shipping dates are a huge financial risk as it is. This project is going to die, you were stupid to even try, now go get a real job.

    14GXJ3Q16PJNNF6v4iyxhvuhacuhvckMym
    chipd
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    April 20, 2013, 08:21:49 PM
     #539

    Quote
    Companies do it all the time. Like kfc taco bell ect all owned by yum brands. Maybe if they fail their brand won't be tarnished, but failing doesnt mean scam, such as Basic refunding people. All and all this is wild speculation, someone can contsct OR and ask if they have any ownership stake or how the partnership came to be.

    Until then i would just wait for more info

    Are you calling my theory wild speculations.

    https://twitter.com/m_erlandsson

    Check out his posts and who he follows. Been involved with Bitcoin since 2010.

    Ironically, the first person he followed was...wait for it...Gavin Andresen.

    Yes, they are wild speculations... at best.
    I've been involved in bitcoin since 2011... does that mean that my company with 300 employees is on a secret mission to rip of customers, going downtown to find some puppets that I can setup to take the fall, does that sound reasonable to you?

    More and more people get involved in bitcoin from all the buzz from the media, including companies. It's inevitable that people from different companies will know each other, as well as partnering because they have experience that the other doesn't. Remember that Sweden is relatively small, 4.5 mill working force... not that much.

    Also, the companies in Sweden don't have the power to run the politicians like they do in US and we aren't that big on conspiracies either (It's a cultural thing).
    pizza
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    April 20, 2013, 08:24:21 PM
     #540

    Since when is changing an email address a scam? I have 0 money in BFL, this company has not taken anyones money yet. When they do pay with paypal and get a refund in 45days if they dont deliver simple. You guys need to stop jumping to conclusions until they post some info lol
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