Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[El duderino_]

Government debt as share of GDP:

-snip-

Governments solution? Print more money.

The real solution? Bitcoin.

https://twitter.com/alecziupsnys/status/1103390612412354560?s=21

I'm not sure how or if Bitcoin can solve the problem of government debt.

Printing money is done by central banks, not governments. And government debt is created by politicians bribing naive voters with worthless promises.

Even if Bitcoin was the de facto world currency governments would surely be borrowing money to fund all the garbage promised during elections.

We are living in a time were the word is

BTC can solve anything
Save us from everything

[El duderino_]

802,750 more bitcoin will be created before the next halvening event.

That's only $3 billion worth of new bitcoin in the next 445 days.

Recognizing the scarcity now will be greatly rewarded.

https://twitter.com/alecziupsnys/status/1102957909389033472?s=21

#buyNOW
Thank later!

[action21]

Do you think the price of Bitcoin will now be piercing this diagonal line again?

[JayJuanGee]

There isn't enough bitcoin for all of today's millionaires to own an entire bitcoin each.

We won't call them millionaires anymore though, they will be known as "wholecoiners".

This may be the last chance for the average person to acquire a full bitcoin and that title.

https://twitter.com/alecziupsnys/status/1102908165719506947?s=21

I boldly claim to be the first one who came up with this observation. Must have been in 2015 or 2016 and i think it was in this forum.  


It is funny since I remember that back then this observation did not receive much attention, but in the last two years it appears in twitter, reddit and even crypto media outlets quite regularly.

July 3, 2014.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=676030.msg7664884#msg7664884

There were 29 million millionaires in the world in 2012 (probably more now). Each of them cannot get even a single bitcoin.
It is typical for millionaire home offices to allocate at least 5% to alternative investments.
If, instead of 5%, bitcoin will become just 1% of millionaires investment, the price at the equilibrium would have to be $40000 to achieve this allocation (1%).
This does not even take into consideration the other 99.4% of the humanity.

I'm sure that there are lots of examples of scarcity claims, and that it will become difficult for all millionaires to own a whole bitcoin.  I recall those kinds of claims on a regular basis since I started in BTC in late 2013. I don't even consider it worth the effort to go back and show quotes because there were many variations of those kinds of BTC scarcity claims..... including dividing the whole world's population up in order to show what the average BTC holding would be if BTC holdings were equally distributed - certainly small amounts of BTC (hundredths of a BTC at best), and just hypothetical exercises to show the value of BTC accumulation, even such small amounts as 1BTC or even less than that in order to be ahead of the game and ahead of the average person in the world.

[JayJuanGee]

By the way, fuck your attempt at NOT defining that scenario as spamming the network - even if there were a lot of transactions with fees, those transactions were malicious attempts to block transactions, increase fees facilitating BIG BLOCKER nutjob talking points.  Therefore, spam (even though quite costly) done for political attack and sabotaging purposes rather than legitimately attempting to use bitcoin's blockchain.   So fuck your attempts to categorize attacks on the bitcoin blockchain as legitimate uses just because they are paying fees.

There's no thought-police in Bitcoin. You send me a clean tx with standard fees and I'll mine it. I couldn't care less about your "purpose".

We are not talking about that.  Of course, miners are going to process transactions including fees; however, if there is a purpose to systematically undermine the bitcoin network in order to send bullshit propaganda (and by the way incorrect) messages that bitcoin is broken because fees are too high and transactions are too slow, then that systematic attack can fairly and legitimately be classified as spam rather than some purported innocent and legitimate use case.

So one thing is whether you see those transactions for what they are, and another thing is the extent to which the bitcoin network has incorporated various mechanisms and incentive structures in order to deal with spam. 

Surely, the small block size and even lightning network are tools in the quiver, and in the end, I could give a shit if some of the BIG blocker nutjobs want to spend their money in such attack attempts because it seems that the BTC network has become more and more resilient and able to deal with their nonsense and not to lose security over their phoney baloney smoke and mirror attempts ... so largely in the last year or so, it seems that BIG blockers have not been ready, willing or able to carry out systematic and longer term (more than a few days) attempts at spam attacks on bitcoin because they likely find such attacks to be a BIG ass waste of money.. just like some of their bcash forkening shenanigans seem to be turning out to be, too.

[vapourminer]

There isn't enough bitcoin for all of today's millionaires to own an entire bitcoin each.

We won't call them millionaires anymore though, they will be known as "wholecoiners".

Nice! And "multicoiners" if double digits. 

I think that three or more meets the definition of multi-,but hey what do I know.  Double digits is some way higher levels, that's for sure.  The 21 club is becoming more and more prestigious, too.

heres to all of us reaching "fuckyoucoiner" levels.

That sounds like a poll in the making. "How many coins does it take to reach fuckyoucoiner levels?"

sounds good to me. im curious as to the numbers myself.

[JayJuanGee]

Do you think the price of Bitcoin will now be piercing this diagonal line again?

I don't know.  What do you think?  Provide us with some analysis rather than just asking a question.  Do you have ideas?

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

Over 9000? Billionaire before 1m per BTC.

[jojo69]

the fuc is wrong with captchas on this board?
maybe I am a robot.

EDIT: f-n moron, presumably robot, does not know how buses look like.

https://bitcointalk.org/captcha_code.php

theymos made us a backdoor

[JayJuanGee]

There isn't enough bitcoin for all of today's millionaires to own an entire bitcoin each.

We won't call them millionaires anymore though, they will be known as "wholecoiners".

Nice! And "multicoiners" if double digits.  

I think that three or more meets the definition of multi-,but hey what do I know.  Double digits is some way higher levels, that's for sure.  The 21 club is becoming more and more prestigious, too.

heres to all of us reaching "fuckyoucoiner" levels.

That sounds like a poll in the making. "How many coins does it take to reach fuckyoucoiner levels?"

sounds good to me. im curious as to the numbers myself.

Agreed I am curious what people think.

Earlier, today, I made a claim that as a general principle, having 1,000 BTC would be sufficient, but I would like to revise my projected number of sufficient BTC "fuck you" money to 320.307495 BTC.  

I understand that active WO participants are going to have other projections and particular circumstances and justifications, but based on current BTC circumstances, that is my general "fit everyone" number as of today based on my beliefs about bitcoin, prudent financial strategies and what it takes for anyone to live comfortable in the modern world.  

The number will likely change with changes in the market conditions and/or changed beliefs about BTC fundamentals or prudent financial strategies..

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

That sounds like a poll in the making. "How many coins does it take to reach fuckyoucoiner levels?"

sounds good to me. im curious as to the numbers myself.

Agreed I am curious what people think.

Earlier, today, I made a claim that as a general principle, having 1,000 BTC would be sufficient, but I would like to revise my projected number of sufficient BTC "fuck you" money to 320.307495 BTC.  

I understand that active WO participants are going to have other projections and particular circumstances and justifications, but based on current BTC circumstances, that is my general fit everyone number as of today based on my beliefs about bitcoin, prudent financial strategies and what it takes to live comfortable in the modern world.  

The number will likely change with changes in the market conditions and/or changed beliefs about BTC fundamentals or prudent financial strategies..

Are you basing your 320 BTC on today's price or future estimates? Because at today's valuation I wouldn't even consider that close to "fuck you money", unless you're into a very very simple life or very very old.

[action21]

I don't know.  What do you think?  Provide us with some analysis rather than just asking a question.  Do you have ideas?

I don't have much idea, more and more hope of increasing the price of Bitcoin. However, I think that when the Bitcoin price crosses this dynamic line, it will start moving towards $4200. Besides, I think we are already fixed above the 0.6 Fibonacci mark and should go to 0.7.

[Biodom]

There isn't enough bitcoin for all of today's millionaires to own an entire bitcoin each.

We won't call them millionaires anymore though, they will be known as "wholecoiners".

Nice! And "multicoiners" if double digits.  

I think that three or more meets the definition of multi-,but hey what do I know.  Double digits is some way higher levels, that's for sure.  The 21 club is becoming more and more prestigious, too.

heres to all of us reaching "fuckyoucoiner" levels.

That sounds like a poll in the making. "How many coins does it take to reach fuckyoucoiner levels?"

sounds good to me. im curious as to the numbers myself.

FYC poll-good idea.
My 2c. the "f you money" was in the movies. Stated as $2.5 mil here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdfeXqHFmPI
Somewhere expensive (Silly valley?) it could be more (maybe $10mil)

$2500000/$3860=648 BTC, only probably two-five thou people have that worldwide.
At 19780/btc it was 126 btc.
How times change.

[vapourminer]

~330.. ~650..

??

man the numbers im thinking of are considerably higher.. like at least 10k btc. as in $40 million USD. as a starting number.

am i THAT decadent?

i SUPPOSE i could deal with 10 million USD, so 2.5k btc. but man thats gonna cramp my style and really limit who i can say "fuckyou" to.

EDIT: using $4,000 USD to make maths easier

[Danslip]

I don't know.  What do you think?  Provide us with some analysis rather than just asking a question.  Do you have ideas?

I don't have much idea, more and more hope of increasing the price of Bitcoin. However, I think that when the Bitcoin price crosses this dynamic line, it will start moving towards $4200. Besides, I think we are already fixed above the 0.6 Fibonacci mark and should go to 0.7.

Any idea about timing? I also wait for a pullback but no idea about the time.

[El duderino_]

Good i’m living 7 hours @a different timezone, so i can live the small pumps and sleep the small dumps
Home its the other way around lately

[mirakal]

Good morning everyone, I slept last night and wake up now and still the price is good to my eyes.
Hopefully this will continue... Have a green day everyone!

[El duderino_]

Good morning everyone, I slept last night and wake up now and still the price is good to my eyes.
Hopefully this will continue... Have a green day everyone!

So kind of same timezone you having there....
Let the day be as green as the phillipine nature is
That would be awesome

Good morning as well brother-coiner(s)

[JayJuanGee]

That sounds like a poll in the making. "How many coins does it take to reach fuckyoucoiner levels?"

sounds good to me. im curious as to the numbers myself.

Agreed I am curious what people think.

Earlier, today, I made a claim that as a general principle, having 1,000 BTC would be sufficient, but I would like to revise my projected number of sufficient BTC "fuck you" money to 320.307495 BTC.  

I understand that active WO participants are going to have other projections and particular circumstances and justifications, but based on current BTC circumstances, that is my general fit everyone number as of today based on my beliefs about bitcoin, prudent financial strategies and what it takes to live comfortable in the modern world.  

The number will likely change with changes in the market conditions and/or changed beliefs about BTC fundamentals or prudent financial strategies..

Are you basing your 320 BTC on today's price or future estimates? Because at today's valuation I wouldn't even consider that close to "fuck you money", unless you're into a very very simple life or very very old.

Hahahahaha

Thanks for asking, even though I can recognize that you are in a bit of a combative mood on this topic.      I anticipate that some of your combativeness has to do with what I perceive to be your unrealistic expectations about both how much you need in order to reasonably live passively in terms of your "fuck you" definition.

You may be able to see that I feel some of my own oats, too, with some of my own self-righteousness on this topic, as well.

I am basing my 320.307495 BTC "fuck you" money on a kind of minimum amount that will put "any" person into a far above average expectation with 1) sufficient passive income possibilities to sustain our current storm and 2) decent future prospects, so long as such "any person" retains some flexibility to live within the means and the income generation of the 320.307495 BTC.

Of course, my level of "fuck you" does not suggest that you are going to be able to say "fuck you" to everyone at this moment, and/or to act with impunity because there are still going to be a lot of people who are way fucking more rich than you, at least for the moment, but instead the 320.307495 BTC will allow for you to live currently with a kind of modest lifestyle with a large amount of future income possibilities, based on your already have had established a 320.307495 BTC starting base in which you have enough for financial independence. 

Once you start with the 320.307495 BTC base, I presume that every quarter, you are going to cash out 1% of your BTC in order to pay for all living expenses, with a bit of a presumption that BTC is going to appreciate in value, on average, more than 4% per year in the coming years.

Of course, my suggested 320.307495 BTC amount is NOT fool proof, but I have a certain presumption that at this time, BTC is quite likely to appreciate in value considerably in the coming few years and also that even if $3,122 is not the exact bottom, any time that BTC spends below $3,122 is not going to significantly impact future passive living off of the 320.307495 BTC.

By the way, if you are curious about how I arrived at 320.307495 BTC, then let me tell you that $1million divided by our current local low BTC price of $3,122 = 320.307495 BTC. 

Accordingly, a largely baseline of $1million starts any person out with an annual passive income of $40k per year, which is $3,333 per month.  I presume that with BTC's likely increase in value in the coming years, your passive income is quite likely to be going up in coming years, even if the first few years of your "fuck you" status might be a bit more of a struggle with a mere piddly passive income of only $3,333 per month.  Many people would kill to have such a $3,333 level of passive income as their starting baseline income and to be removed from the ratt race, aka having to work. In the beginning, the only work that you would have to do with such $3,333 passive income is to manage your money and to live within your means.. otherwise you are free to do whatever the fuck you want.. aka "fuck you" status.   

[JayJuanGee]

I don't know.  What do you think?  Provide us with some analysis rather than just asking a question.  Do you have ideas?

I don't have much idea, more and more hope of increasing the price of Bitcoin. However, I think that when the Bitcoin price crosses this dynamic line, it will start moving towards $4200. Besides, I think we are already fixed above the 0.6 Fibonacci mark and should go to 0.7.

Yeah, but even if BTC price breaks higher above these various price points that you mentioned (including .6 and subsquently .7 fibonacci levels), that does not signify that we are out of our current correction cycle, and therefore, there remain decently high chances (so long as BTC prices are below $6k-ish) that our current BTC price is within reasonable striking range of the $3,122 mid-December low that could be retested.