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Author Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information  (Read 2756316 times)
bitcoinpaul
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February 24, 2014, 03:45:07 PM
 #37061

Below u'll find a short description of the Nxt communication system. This is the 2nd plan of our decentralization. 1st one you can find here.


hours and hours of communication

Did you ever send a copy of the signed form to Steven?

Did you fill it and sent it to Steven?

So, no, I did not send the form in to Steven.  I did not know I was supposed to.

  Cheesy
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Lawmaker
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February 24, 2014, 03:46:11 PM
 #37062

Just something that came to mind regarding the pooled forging issue.
Suppose someone leases forging power to a pool, and then forgets about it... Wouldn't he eventually own all nxt in existence? And the more it leases the lesser it would take. I'm still thinking many years but still....
I think transaction fees are ok as an anti-spam patch, but down along the road it could mean disaster...
Even when bitcoin mining won't generate any new bitcoins, someone mining and not spending bitcoins will eventually own all of them, but mining in bitcoin means power and hardware costs, while in nxt there are none or are incorporated in the forgin pool cut...
Am I missing something?
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February 24, 2014, 03:46:57 PM
 #37063

I dont see how this would increase forging with smaller account. unless I am missing something.
If you have one NXT and 999,999,999 others have one nxt, your chances of forging a block are pretty small.
forging is important, it will keep the network decentralized.

The idea is simply to make it more likely that even a forging account with 1 NXT has a pretty good chance.


Why?

possibilities can not be increased but can advance fees in time 2 3 days if your rights  fees share with people who have for example 99999 nxt

in the worst case in a year and 100,000 nxt  and 1440 blocks per day
would forging 52.6 blocks per year

nearly one per week. probably every 2 3 days
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February 24, 2014, 03:50:16 PM
 #37064

to put it in numbers
Account  1900 Nxt

1440 blocs per day
1 blocs per year with 1900 Nxt
fee per bloc (For example) 100
Profit per year 5.3%
5.3% must greater than cost of maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

If 1 Nxt = 1 dollar

Account  with 1900 Nxt will generate 100 Nxt = 100 dollar for maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

Keep thinking.  You had to run this node for a year, so the 100 dollars has to cover a monthly operations cost of 100/12 = $8.33 per month

So....

IF the block you capture once a year has 100 NXT in fees in it and
IF each NXT is worth $1 and
IF your monthly hardware amortization, bandwidth costs, and electricity costs are less than $8.33 per month

Then you made a monthly profit = $8.33 - monthly server costs

Anybody out there running a VPN for less than $8.33 per month?  


I pay 20 dollar per month for 2MB VPS. Because i belive in nxt ecosystem

The quetión is whether we can increase the number of transactions per block to 100
The question is whether a 1900 nxt node will want to wait a year to forge
The question is whether the value will rise soon nxt 1 dollar
The question is profitable to keep the funds in an account standing. which is the opportunity cost

Keep thinking.  You've got $1900 in cash.  How much can somebody make per month with $1900 spent on joining a DOGE pool instead of acquiring a stake in NXT?
NXT is in competition with the real world running on a profit motive.   Believers in the NXT ecosystem are going to be running at a loss, month after month...
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February 24, 2014, 03:51:43 PM
 #37065

Suppose someone leases forging power to a pool, and then forgets about it... Wouldn't he eventually own all nxt in existence?

Not possible as no reasonable person is likely to "spend their very last NXT" on a transaction fee.

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
Emule
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February 24, 2014, 03:52:16 PM
 #37066

Below u'll find a short description of the Nxt communication system. This is the 2nd plan of our decentralization. 1st one you can find here.


hours and hours of communication

Did you ever send a copy of the signed form to Steven?

Did you fill it and sent it to Steven?

So, no, I did not send the form in to Steven.  I did not know I was supposed to.

  Cheesy

THIS yes  Cheesy and that salsa dud laughing all the way to bter.

community is paying that salsa dude 40K a month, without all the other gifts and bybitcoin give him another 100k for "THE POOL" but he mistakenly put it on his account Cheesy

seriously guys
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February 24, 2014, 03:55:22 PM
 #37067

Throwing out some suggestions here on prevention of centralization due to leased forging power...

Set a hard limit on size of a pool's effectiveBalance consisting of leased power.  Maybe 5M or 10M NXT or something like that?  We may even want to set a limit to max size of a single account's effectiveBalance, such that if a single account's balance is higher than, say, 10M NXT, then its effectiveBalance is limited to 10M.  Users could then choose to split accounts and forge on different machines that would then provide a measure of redundancy.

And since these countermeasures *could* be broken via configurations of software/hardware if the pool operator or user *really* wanted to, I think we still should pursue the TF option of selecting secondary, tertiary and even 4th and 5th accounts that could quickly forge a block should higher priority accounts fail to forge in a quick manner.
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February 24, 2014, 03:58:26 PM
 #37068


Shut up, Emule. You have no sense of humor. Go drink your aperitifs with your friends.

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February 24, 2014, 03:58:41 PM
 #37069


Do we have an testreport from AE?

Is it ready to implement, what is the status?

Do our clients support the AE to devs satisfaction? wesleyh, marcus03, minusbalancer, etc...)

 Roll Eyes

igmaca
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February 24, 2014, 03:59:09 PM
 #37070

to put it in numbers
Account  1900 Nxt

1440 blocs per day
1 blocs per year with 1900 Nxt
fee per bloc (For example) 100
Profit per year 5.3%
5.3% must greater than cost of maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

If 1 Nxt = 1 dollar

Account  with 1900 Nxt will generate 100 Nxt = 100 dollar for maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

Keep thinking.  You had to run this node for a year, so the 100 dollars has to cover a monthly operations cost of 100/12 = $8.33 per month

So....

IF the block you capture once a year has 100 NXT in fees in it and
IF each NXT is worth $1 and
IF your monthly hardware amortization, bandwidth costs, and electricity costs are less than $8.33 per month

Then you made a monthly profit = $8.33 - monthly server costs

Anybody out there running a VPN for less than $8.33 per month?  


I pay 20 dollar per month for 2MB VPS. Because i belive in nxt ecosystem

The quetión is whether we can increase the number of transactions per block to 100
The question is whether a 1900 nxt node will want to wait a year to forge
The question is whether the value will rise soon nxt 1 dollar
The question is profitable to keep the funds in an account standing. which is the opportunity cost

Keep thinking.  You've got $1900 in cash.  How much can somebody make per month with $1900 spent on joining a DOGE pool instead of acquiring a stake in NXT?
NXT is in competition with the real world running on a profit motive.   Believers in the NXT ecosystem are going to be running at a loss, month after month...


is much better nxt ecosystem.

the cost of maintaining the network is a lot more economical.

inflation is a lot smaller.
bitcoinpaul
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February 24, 2014, 04:00:10 PM
 #37071

emule, dump your coins please.
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February 24, 2014, 04:04:44 PM
 #37072

Who is currently working on the Decentralized Marketplace / Auction system?
ChuckOne
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February 24, 2014, 04:05:24 PM
 #37073

This guy is the ideal Nxt citizen. Although I can hardly believe anybody is forging right now to make nxt money, the fees are more about preventing
spamming. Its a tricky balance we are faced with especially at this early stage. We anticipate a robust nxt economy where hundreds or thousands
of businesses are dependent on the nxt network with our 1000 tps. [...]


Well, if you think about it, if we lower the fees --- will this gain more acceptance from businesses and community? 

Not until we make it attractive to them. They need to have very, very, very good reason for building their business on top of NXT.

The current money system is far from perfect but it works for most people.

Give me 3 reasons for the average joe/entrepreneur to join us!
igmaca
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February 24, 2014, 04:05:54 PM
 #37074

to put it in numbers
Account  1900 Nxt

1440 blocs per day
1 blocs per year with 1900 Nxt
fee per bloc (For example) 100
Profit per year 5.3%
5.3% must greater than cost of maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

If 1 Nxt = 1 dollar

Account  with 1900 Nxt will generate 100 Nxt = 100 dollar for maintaining the node and remain immobilized the funds (oportunity cost)

Keep thinking.  You had to run this node for a year, so the 100 dollars has to cover a monthly operations cost of 100/12 = $8.33 per month

So....

IF the block you capture once a year has 100 NXT in fees in it and
IF each NXT is worth $1 and
IF your monthly hardware amortization, bandwidth costs, and electricity costs are less than $8.33 per month

Then you made a monthly profit = $8.33 - monthly server costs

Anybody out there running a VPN for less than $8.33 per month?  


I pay 20 dollar per month for 2MB VPS. Because i believe in nxt ecosystem

The quetión is whether we can increase the number of transactions per block to 100
The question is whether a 1900 nxt node will want to wait a year to forge
The question is whether the value will rise soon nxt 1 dollar
The question is profitable to keep the funds in an account standing. which is the opportunity cost

Keep thinking.  You've got $1900 in cash.  How much can somebody make per month with $1900 spent on joining a DOGE pool instead of acquiring a stake in NXT?
NXT is in competition with the real world running on a profit motive.   Believers in the NXT ecosystem are going to be running at a loss, month after month...


is much better nxt ecosystem.

the cost of maintaining the network is a lot more economical.

inflation is a lot smaller.


just have to finish polishing the idea of ​​maintaining the security of the network without penalizing the cost. but this I think with all these brainstorms will be achieved

 Wink
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February 24, 2014, 04:06:44 PM
 #37075

Should Nxt support the anti SOPA activism or not?

Nxt tips: NXT-R67P-6BZ2-XWAK-8RHZR | Nxt forum | Nxt Academy | Donate for Nxt at the Universities // BTCD: RVMLrnxYYy7uy8YZo9FcGfXbk1ZMnNifdg
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February 24, 2014, 04:09:41 PM
 #37076

From the text by BCNext/cfb, it seems so to me. don't know about the math

We really need the math - so if we have any math guys in our community there is an opportunity for you to earn some NXT or BTC for helping out with this and some other analysis.

Can you define (in simple terms) the math model and the question about it that you need answered?  I'm a mathematician (Probability/Stochastic processes), but understand little how cryptocurrencies actually work, I have to confess that I understand almost nothing of the tech talk over here...
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February 24, 2014, 04:09:47 PM
 #37077

I'm running 4 servers now!
But if it continues this way, may stop all!
I have more than $7000 in NXT but received 1 NXT per week after several weeks!!! It's really frustrating and community should consider it!

I know that it's about 430 peers on NXT Network now but what happening after frustration? God knows!

Network may not shape correctly and securely if this continues!

Just IMHO!

This is the PoS system. Less transactions, less fees. If you want more NXT out of your metal, promote NXT and stimulate transactions like hell.
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February 24, 2014, 04:10:57 PM
 #37078

Should Nxt support the anti SOPA activism or not?

I only speak for myself but I think it would better not to try tying the Nxt community itself to such causes (whether they be noble or otherwise) as you are always going to "turn off some potential users".

Wouldn't it be better for interested Nxt users to just form their own groups for that?

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
rickyjames
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February 24, 2014, 04:14:58 PM
 #37079


I pay 20 dollar per month for 2MB VPS. Because i belive in nxt ecosystem

The quetión is whether we can increase the number of transactions per block to 100
The question is whether a 1900 nxt node will want to wait a year to forge
The question is whether the value will rise soon nxt 1 dollar
The question is profitable to keep the funds in an account standing. which is the opportunity cost

Keep thinking.  You've got $1900 in cash.  How much can somebody make per month with $1900 spent on joining a DOGE pool instead of acquiring a stake in NXT?
NXT is in competition with the real world running on a profit motive.   Believers in the NXT ecosystem are going to be running at a loss, month after month...


is much better nxt ecosystem.

the cost of maintaining the network is a lot more economical.

inflation is a lot smaller.

I agree.
I agree.
I agree.

Believers in the NXT ecosystem are going to be running at a loss, month after month...
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February 24, 2014, 04:15:14 PM
 #37080

We already have it - any account with 1 NXT can forge. Odds to find a block is another question.

The purpose of my proposal is to "change the odds" (in favour of the small stake holder).


For example, with 2358 Nxt I can forge the next block in 345 days.

and I believe that the reward will be 0 nxt, in my opinion it is not right  this is not EQUALITY  Undecided

I do not understand. You create only 1 block per year. What exactly do you expect? 1000 NXTs for that?

I recently pondered about the discussion of inequality. I think it only stems from a perceived stagnation of the value associated with the amount of NXT a person has.

Let A be amount of NXTs and t1 and t2 two different timestamps. Humans cannot clearly see why A@t1 and A@t2 is a different value (in terms of goods one could buy with them). They just see A. They'd rather have a higher amount in their account (like interest in bank accounts).

One should teach people that NXT is deflationary (will they understand?). The increase in value is achieved indirectly and not by changing digits of the account balance.

No , but i expect at least 10-20 Nxt .. i'm helping the community and when i forge one block and the reward is 0 Nxt... i'm so angry  Grin
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