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Author Topic: DefaultTrust changes  (Read 76752 times)
Lauda
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January 09, 2019, 10:24:29 PM
 #141

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
It kinda does.
It does not.

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January 09, 2019, 10:27:24 PM
 #142

It kinda does.

Well it doesn’t, just because I have done a load of physical deals over the years doesn’t mean I would take DT seriously. In my case I actually will start tagging people and will re evaluate all previous tags, but the 2 things don’t go hand in hand

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January 09, 2019, 10:30:35 PM
 #143

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
It kinda does.
It does not.


I thought that's how the system works.
You give someone a positive they move up to your DT0?

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January 09, 2019, 10:31:19 PM
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 #144

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
It kinda does.
It does not.


I thought that's how the system works.
You give someone a positive they love up to your DT0?

This is known as CanaryInTheMine syndrome.
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January 09, 2019, 10:32:23 PM
 #145

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
I don't think so. You may give someone positive feedback due to a good trade or specific case. But this doesn't mean that you trust this user entirely and whoever he also trusts.

I thought that's how the system works.
You give someone a positive they move up to your DT0?
It's not. Someone only becomes your DT0 when you manually add them into your trust list. All that giving someone feedback does is changing his trust rating (in case you are in DT or if someone has you in his trust list, otherwise, your feedback becomes untrusted and doesn't count for the rating).

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January 09, 2019, 10:32:41 PM
 #146

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
It kinda does.
It does not.
I thought that's how the system works.
You give someone a positive they love up to your DT0?
No. If you add people in your list just because they sent you a positive rating, then you are doing it wrong (and/or likely intentionally abusing it to boost your score).

This is known as CanaryInTheMine syndrome.
This. There would be probably stronger consequences for doing this again given that DT1 is expanding in size.

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January 09, 2019, 10:37:14 PM
 #147

Would it not be logical that when one leaves a positive or negative trust for someone, that one's own trust list should automatically change to either respectively include that member or exclude (~) them? Or at least to have that option in Settings?
It kinda does.
It does not.
I thought that's how the system works.
You give someone a positive they love up to your DT0?
No. If you add people in your list just because they sent you a positive rating, then you are doing it wrong (and/or likely intentionally abusing it to boost your score).

This is known as CanaryInTheMine syndrome.
This. There would be probably stronger consequences for doing this again given that DT1 is expanding in size.

I'm just lost now.

I deleted the entire trust list and I'm still on 13 -0/+3?

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January 09, 2019, 10:38:11 PM
 #148

I deleted the entire trust list and I'm still on 13 -0/+3?
Your actual rating is: Trust:    11: -0 / +2; can view it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=543626;dt.

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January 09, 2019, 10:40:40 PM
 #149

I deleted the entire trust list and I'm still on 13 -0/+3?
Your actual rating is: Trust:    11: -0 / +2; can view it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=543626;dt.

Ah that's what I did.
I added vod to my trust list and it bumped jet Cash up.

I'll just leave that list empty then if I can't add anything to it without producing uproar.



It turns out you can't add an empty list I had to fill it with ~defaultttrust

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January 09, 2019, 10:41:25 PM
 #150

OK now they have changed.. OgNasty is out wow..

Ya, I'm pretty shocked by this.  Not as shocked as I am with the current #1 trusted user being someone who has been confirmed to dox users and was just involved with a non-transparent escrow scam with the current second most trusted member and a former disgraced staff member turned DT now, but theymos must have his reasons for doing things this way.  Unfortunately, an accurate trust rating system doesn't seem to be the highest priority anymore.  In any event, congrats to those who are happy with the changes.  Hopefully crafting a hands-off approach will quiet some of whining around here and give theymos a break from complaints.  


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January 09, 2019, 10:44:43 PM
 #151

~
It only bumps Jet Cash up for you.

You are not on DT, so your rating only changes the way you see other people's ratings (unless someone has you on his trust list; in that case, everybody you adds on your trust list becomes DT1 for those users).



It turns out you can't add an empty list I had to fill it with ~defaultttrust
Anyone knows if this counts as an -1 score on everybody on DT list if you are on DT1?

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January 09, 2019, 10:46:51 PM
 #152

~
It only bumps Jet Cash up for you.

You are not on DT, so your rating only changes the way you see other people's ratings (unless someone has you on his trust list; in that case, everybody you adds on your trust list becomes DT1 for those users).

Err that's what I meant. Dt no longer exists for me since I have wiped the entire list Grin.

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January 09, 2019, 10:48:19 PM
 #153

It turns out you can't add an empty list I had to fill it with ~defaultttrust
Anyone knows if this counts as an -1 score on everybody on trust list if you are on DT1?
I would assume yes unless there is some sort of different way that particular exclusion is handled. I'm not willing to try it given that my list is big and that exclusions work in real time (?):

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January 09, 2019, 10:49:46 PM
 #154

It turns out you can't add an empty list I had to fill it with ~defaultttrust
Anyone knows if this counts as an -1 score on everybody on trust list if you are on DT1?
I would assume yes unless there is some sort of different way that particular exclusion is handled. I'm not willing to try it given that my list is big and that exclusions work in real time (?):

Everyone is 0 for me Grin
Although it's hard to see on meta.

The lending scammers were on zero too. I guess with a negative from vod that would've pushed them positive if that was the case.

Vinsin is zero too.

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January 09, 2019, 11:00:32 PM
 #155

The lending scammers were on zero too. I guess with a negative from vod that would've pushed them positive if that was the case.

Vinsin is zero too.
Might be worth to build a custom list then, if you don't trust DefauftTrust?

theymos: Total votes 9 = included
HostFat: Trusted by theymos; distrusted by gmaxwell, TMAN, Lauda, achow101, owlcatz, The Pharmacist. Total votes -6 = excluded.
dooglus: Total votes 8 = included
gmaxwell: Trusted by theymos, OgNasty, Cyrus, TMAN, Lauda, achow101, The Pharmacist; distrusted by HostFat. Total votes 6 = included.
OgNasty: Trusted by theymos, SebastianJu, greenplastic, achow101, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by TMAN, Lauda, suchmoon, owlcatz, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist. Total votes -1 = excluded
SebastianJu: Total votes 4 = included.
qwk: Total votes 5 = included
Cyrus: Total votes 7 = included.
monkeynuts: Total votes 6 = included.
TMAN: Trusted by Lauda, greenplastic, owlcatz, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by OgNasty. Total votes 5 = included.
Lauda: Trusted by gmaxwell, qwk, TMAN, Blazed, suchmoon, owlcatz, JohnUser, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist; distrusted by HostFat, OgNasty. Total votes 7 = included.
Mitchell: Total votes 9 = included.
Blazed: Trusted by Cyrus, monkeynuts, TMAN, Lauda, Mitchell, suchmoon, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by zazarb. Total votes 8 = included.
greenplastic: Total votes 2 = included.
suchmoon: Trusted by dooglus, Lauda, Blazed, owlcatz, The Pharmacist; distrusted by OgNasty. Total votes 5 = included.
achow101: Total votes 2 = included.
owlcatz: Trusted by TMAN, greenplastic, suchmoon, BitcoinPenny, krogothmanhattan. Total votes 5 = included.
JohnUser: No trusts/distrusts on DT1. Total votes 0 = included.
BitcoinPenny: Total votes 4 = included.
zazarb: Total votes 2 = included.
actmyname: Trusted by TMAN, Lauda, Blazed, suchmoon, The Pharmacist; distrusted by theymos. Total votes 5 = included.
The Pharmacist: Trusted by qwk, TMAN, Lauda, Blazed, suchmoon, owlcatz; distrusted by OgNasty, zazarb. Total votes 6 = included.
krogothmanhattan: Trusted by monkeynuts, TMAN, greenplastic, BitcoinPenny; distrusted by owlcatz. Total votes 4 = included
It would be nice if these scores were actually shown here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dt. All I see is -1 or +1.

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January 09, 2019, 11:12:23 PM
Last edit: January 09, 2019, 11:26:37 PM by jackg
 #156

I wasn't happy with defaulttrust so I built a custom list and:

No. If you add people in your list just because they sent you a positive rating, then you are doing it wrong (and/or likely intentionally abusing it to boost your score).

I added people I've traded with. I added vod and jet Cash and then thought I'd add the pharmacist as he's normally pretty accurate with trust ratings.

But now I guess I'm free of the trust system entirely so...



I don't trade too often with many people here and I generally take a habit of going through people's trust histories just in case there is something hidden or overlooked by dts.

Is default trust on dt2? I thought I spotted it earlier...

Edit: darkstar made the list too along with loyce. (My list I mean).

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January 09, 2019, 11:14:16 PM
 #157

The lending scammers were on zero too. I guess with a negative from vod that would've pushed them positive if that was the case.

Vinsin is zero too.
Might be worth to build a custom list then, if you don't trust DefauftTrust?

theymos: Total votes 9 = included
HostFat: Trusted by theymos; distrusted by gmaxwell, TMAN, Lauda, achow101, owlcatz, The Pharmacist. Total votes -6 = excluded.
dooglus: Total votes 8 = included
gmaxwell: Trusted by theymos, OgNasty, Cyrus, TMAN, Lauda, achow101, The Pharmacist; distrusted by HostFat. Total votes 6 = included.
OgNasty: Trusted by theymos, SebastianJu, greenplastic, achow101, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by TMAN, Lauda, suchmoon, owlcatz, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist. Total votes -1 = excluded
SebastianJu: Total votes 4 = included.
qwk: Total votes 5 = included
Cyrus: Total votes 7 = included.
monkeynuts: Total votes 6 = included.
TMAN: Trusted by Lauda, greenplastic, owlcatz, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by OgNasty. Total votes 5 = included.
Lauda: Trusted by gmaxwell, qwk, TMAN, Blazed, suchmoon, owlcatz, JohnUser, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist; distrusted by HostFat, OgNasty. Total votes 7 = included.
Mitchell: Total votes 9 = included.
Blazed: Trusted by Cyrus, monkeynuts, TMAN, Lauda, Mitchell, suchmoon, BitcoinPenny, The Pharmacist, krogothmanhattan; distrusted by zazarb. Total votes 8 = included.
greenplastic: Total votes 2 = included.
suchmoon: Trusted by dooglus, Lauda, Blazed, owlcatz, The Pharmacist; distrusted by OgNasty. Total votes 5 = included.
achow101: Total votes 2 = included.
owlcatz: Trusted by TMAN, greenplastic, suchmoon, BitcoinPenny, krogothmanhattan. Total votes 5 = included.
JohnUser: No trusts/distrusts on DT1. Total votes 0 = included.
BitcoinPenny: Total votes 4 = included.
zazarb: Total votes 2 = included.
actmyname: Trusted by TMAN, Lauda, Blazed, suchmoon, The Pharmacist; distrusted by theymos. Total votes 5 = included.
The Pharmacist: Trusted by qwk, TMAN, Lauda, Blazed, suchmoon, owlcatz; distrusted by OgNasty, zazarb. Total votes 6 = included.
krogothmanhattan: Trusted by monkeynuts, TMAN, greenplastic, BitcoinPenny; distrusted by owlcatz. Total votes 4 = included
It would be nice if these scores were actually shown here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dt. All I see is -1 or +1.

Yes, it would.
That list also appears to be out of date as the knives are already out for zazarb, by the look of it, going from undisputed +2 on that list to -1 now, (and consequently struck thru and off DT1?) according to this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dt
How does one find out where his 3 negatives came from?
This is a bit much for my tired brain, I probably have it wrong.
Some simple relaxation before sleep is in order, Game of Thrones anyone?

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January 09, 2019, 11:19:55 PM
Last edit: January 09, 2019, 11:32:01 PM by The Pharmacist
 #158

Might be worth to build a custom list then, if you don't trust DefauftTrust?
Seriously.  I tried doing the old ~DefaultTrust thing a couple years ago and didn't make a custom list and thus couldn't tell who was who anymore.  You really need some sort of list if you're going to do any business with people or feel like you're going to have to trust what they say (unless you feel like manually checking every single time).

I have a relatively short trust list that Lauda suggested a while back with a couple of modifications, and I'm going to just keep it as is for the time being.  I wouldn't mind eventually adding Jet Cash to it, since I do trust him and he's done quite a bit for newbies and the forum at no cost to himself.  Anybody opposed to that?

It's your list, feel free.
I know that, believe me, but I don't want to start any potential drama before acting since this is all brand new and soliciting opinions isn't a bad thing.  I'd been thinking about it for a while, though my status on DT2 wouldn't have mattered much up until today when I got bumped.  There are some others I'm thinking about as well, but the vast majority of my functioning neurons are screaming at me to just sit still for now and not do anything. 

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January 09, 2019, 11:23:44 PM
 #159

Yes, it would.
That list also appears to be out of date as the knives are already out for zazarb, by the look of it, going from undisputed +2 on that list to -1 now, (and consequently struck thru and off DT1?) according to this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dt
How does one find out where his 3 negatives came from?
This is a bit much for my tired brain, I probably have it wrong.
Some simple relaxation before sleep is in order, Game of Thrones anyone?

It doesn't seem like this page lists all of the exclusions for some reason? Looks like Lauda has an exclusion, BitcoinPenny has an inclusion and I can't find anything else for zarzab.

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January 09, 2019, 11:24:41 PM
 #160

I have a relatively short trust list that Lauda suggested a while back with a couple of modifications, and I'm going to just keep it as is for the time being.  I wouldn't mind eventually adding Jet Cash to it, since I do trust him and he's done quite a bit for newbies and the forum at no cost to himself.  Anybody opposed to that?

It's your list, feel free.
You can stick me on it too if you like, I'm a very nice chap and honest as the day is long.  Cheesy



Yes, it would.
That list also appears to be out of date as the knives are already out for zazarb, by the look of it, going from undisputed +2 on that list to -1 now, (and consequently struck thru and off DT1?) according to this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dt
How does one find out where his 3 negatives came from?


It doesn't seem like this page lists all of the exclusions for some reason? Looks like Lauda has an exclusion, BitcoinPenny has an inclusion and I can't find anything else for zarzab.

Oh good, I thought it was just me. I wonder why that is then?

Extraordinary Claims require Extraordinary Evidence
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