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Author Topic: [BCN] Bytecoin. Secure, private, untraceable since 2012  (Read 1035628 times)
jt7382
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July 17, 2015, 07:54:44 AM
 #4581

Where can I download a wallet since sourceforge is down?

We've temporary put the files on our servers. Check out the downloads page: https://bytecoin.org/downloads/

Excellent, thank you.
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July 17, 2015, 08:04:10 AM
 #4582

Where can I download a wallet since sourceforge is down?

We've temporary put the files on our servers. Check out the downloads page: https://bytecoin.org/downloads/

Excellent, thank you.
Sigh.. Let me guess, another BCN promoter/sock-puppet account? Makes sense now why Ullo made a new topic regarding Bytecoin, this one seems unmoderated.
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July 17, 2015, 08:28:52 AM
Last edit: July 17, 2015, 08:54:58 AM by child_harold
 #4583

can anyone explain why BCN has been rising while XMR is stagnant ?

not many 'real' buyers, so buying & selling to themselves is the answer to BCN rise. XMR supply & demand is real people, and sometimes less exciting

Speaking for myself I became intrigued by Bytecoin and the cryptonote story. I saw an aggressive roadmap and read many posts that raised more questions than they answered. As I began my research (ongoing) I bought cautiously between 11 and 14 sats. Now Im holding and watching.

vaporware asset wizard
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July 17, 2015, 09:18:43 AM
 #4584

can anyone explain why BCN has been rising while XMR is stagnant ?

not many 'real' buyers, so buying & selling to themselves is the answer to BCN rise. XMR supply & demand is real people, and sometimes less exciting

Speaking for myself I became intrigued by Bytecoin and the cryptonote story. I saw an aggressive roadmap and read many posts that raised more questions than they answered. As I began my research (ongoing) I bought cautiously between 11 and 14 sats. Now Im holding and watching.

@child_harold, you'd love supernet, you can chat with the dev team in person on their slack - no shit - detective work to verify takes 5 minutes tops Smiley
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July 17, 2015, 10:00:14 AM
 #4585

EDIT:
Lol at the post above by a BCN core team member ignoring my questions and any of the stuff being said. Another red flag, happy to say I never invested in BCN..

What does my answers change exactly? There are other people here who love arguing about the conspiracy theories. I bet I'll be overwhelmed with accusations and dirt as soon as I post this.

Quote
1) What's the talk about an 80% premine? Any proof that this DID or DID NOT happen?

I've mentioned multiple times that Bytecoin was launched in July 2012. You may check its genesis block, the info is open. I don't know what was wrong with the whitepapers on the CryptoNote website and why there were errors in it, whitepapers are on their side. What's more, I do not understand how exactly this proves that Bytecoin was not launched in 2012 or whatever argument there is against the project.

When we first launched, Bytecoin was a raw Java version, which was quite clumsy and very different from other altcoins that were booming at that time. This, among other factors, made us rewrite the code to C++ and gradually shift the users from Java to Java/C++ hybrid and then to pure C++. It also allowed substantial hashrate optimization which was implemented by the community.

The argument that Bytecoin did not develop its source code and somehow it's completely different people contributing now is nothing but hilarious.

Quote
2) What's the maximum amount of BCN that can be transfered per transaction?

It depends on the transaction properties. Usually, you may easily send 10M BCN at anonymity level (mixin) 6.

Currently txs over 20 kB are note accepted by the network. The size can be decreased by lowering the anonymity level. There might be issues with wallets that have a lot of tiny inputs (usually derived from older versions of open source pools), but in Bytecoin 1.0.7 we're going to introduce inputs optimization, which is going to resolve the issue.

Quote
3) Where else can I download the latest version of the wallet? (SourceForge is down, they're having issues at the moment)

The files are temporary moved to our servers.

Quote
4) Where's the discussion about BCN? (The inactivity/silence in this BitcoinTalk ANN topic bothers me)

The discussion is ongoing on bytecointalk.org, which is Bytecoin community forum.

Quote
5) What about the activity of the development team? (The OP guys [DStrange] hasn't been online for nearly 2 weeks?)

The development team does exactly what the word "development" means. It's usually me and DStrange posting info on forums, but he's been quite busy lately with other things he has to do in his life.

Quote
6) What's up with the price? (Unless there's no marketing/adoption/active development at all, 20 sats is incredibly low)

Our primary goal has always been development. You may check our roadmap to learn how we do it and what is upcoming.

Bytecoin BCN core team: https://bytecoin.org/
cryptrol
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July 17, 2015, 11:27:08 AM
Last edit: July 17, 2015, 11:38:53 AM by cryptrol
 #4586

Quote
1) What's the talk about an 80% premine? Any proof that this DID or DID NOT happen?

I've mentioned multiple times that Bytecoin was launched in July 2012. You may check its genesis block, the info is open. I don't know what was wrong with the whitepapers on the CryptoNote website and why there were errors in it, whitepapers are on their side. What's more, I do not understand how exactly this proves that Bytecoin was not launched in 2012 or whatever argument there is against the project.

When we first launched, Bytecoin was a raw Java version, which was quite clumsy and very different from other altcoins that were booming at that time. This, among other factors, made us rewrite the code to C++ and gradually shift the users from Java to Java/C++ hybrid and then to pure C++. It also allowed substantial hashrate optimization which was implemented by the community.

The argument that Bytecoin did not develop its source code and somehow it's completely different people contributing now is nothing but hilarious.


Wow, a core dev answering a non development question, this is new.

Regarding your facts :
- The blockchain could be faked, I am not saying it is, I am just saying that this doesn't prove that BCN was aroung in 2012.
- The community you mention has not been identified as far as I know, so this again proves nothing.
- The whitepapers prove nothing.
- The ancient Java code you mention, well, I could only saw some compiled java objects (no source), although again this could prove nothing again even with source.
- The 80% of coins emitted before going public can certainly be called a premine because all of the above points.
- The connection between the Cryptonote people and the Bytecoin people can't be proved but it's really apparent for the people that has been here since the beginning.

I am just writing this for the clueless people that crowd this forum, not trying to start a conversation with BCN devs or supporters, since they already know all of the above and it has never been addressed as far as I know.

I guess if these "people" are a team, this kind of mess and scam accusations will tear them apart, that's when things will start to get interesting in the BCN scene.
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July 17, 2015, 11:33:31 AM
 #4587

- It could have been easy to prove the existence of the blockchain at some date with a News headline (like the one in the bitcoin genesis block).

That only proves that it wasn't created before a certain date, not that it was. I could easily put a news headline from 1850 in a genesis block, that doesn't mean such a coin existed in 1850.
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July 17, 2015, 11:38:56 AM
 #4588

@smooth,
I'm not here to bash you nor Monero, in fact I hold some XMR myself. But as much as I respect Monero and the efforts you're putting into defending it from FUD, quite often (just like now - out of the blue) I come across reading things about Monero that are mostly negative or fueled by hate/FUD. What the hell is up with that? Same goes for some other coins that I support (For example DASH and Shadow) but to a much smaller extent.

I can't tell you what's up with any other Monero or Dash or any other coin supporters or detractors except to say that people do get rather attached to their favorite coins and sometimes that is expressed in a negative and hateful way.

I don't believe that my posts are hateful. Skeptical and challenging of questionable or obviously doubtful (at best) claims is more the approach I tend to take when it comes to coins I feel are no being straight with the community.
cryptrol
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July 17, 2015, 11:39:32 AM
 #4589

- It could have been easy to prove the existence of the blockchain at some date with a News headline (like the one in the bitcoin genesis block).

That only proves that it wasn't created before a certain date, not that it was. I could easily put a news headline from 1850 in a genesis block, that doesn't mean such a coin existed in 1850.

Of course, I guess there is no easy way then (post edited).
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July 17, 2015, 11:46:12 AM
 #4590

- It could have been easy to prove the existence of the blockchain at some date with a News headline (like the one in the bitcoin genesis block).

That only proves that it wasn't created before a certain date, not that it was. I could easily put a news headline from 1850 in a genesis block, that doesn't mean such a coin existed in 1850.

Of course, I guess there is no easy way then (post edited).

An easy way would be to find some reference to the coin or the blockchain or the project in a third party verifiable source (such as archive.org) or find some credible identified people with valuable reputations at stake to come forward and attest to that fact.

Instead, bytecoin proceeded in precisely the opposite direction, running away from transparency by blocking archive.org from their web site after it became clear that it was being used to call them out on their self-contraditory statements and after-the-fact changes to posted files (such as white papers and css reset scripts).

Quote from: bytecoin.org/robots.txt
User-agent: ia_archiver
Disallow: /
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July 17, 2015, 02:32:00 PM
Last edit: July 17, 2015, 04:57:41 PM by child_harold
 #4591

It is entirely unfair and unacceptable that you would cherry pick the bits from the cryptonote.org site and team you like  and yet dismiss the others that do not serve you. The text emboldened below shows you do defame the CN Team. Either they can be trusted or not.

In your words:

"As I explained to you before, the fact that cryptonote repeats the implausible and essentially disproven claim of two-years-in-the-deep-web, it is clear that not all of their statements can be trusted"

Maybe they repeat it because it's true. (And archive.org wont help with deep-web matters anyway)

ps you use the phrase "essentially disproven"? nothing has been proven or disproven, except the wobbly dates on the whitepaper which the CN team are accountable for.




Scammers dont go around writing ground-breaking code.

You base that on what exactly? I fail to see any essential positive or negative connection between the two at all. One might say, Harvard graduates who go on to receive Ph.Ds. in Mathematics and become professors don't go around blowing people up, but that would be nonsense as demonstrated by the example of the unibomber.

Quote
If u wanna scam in crypto you there's a million easier ways than actually creating an anonymous Bitcoin. FFS.

You keep repeating this, yet not only isn't it even true (for similar reasons as above), but it doesn't fit even Cryptonote's claimed facts at all. Supposedly the system was designed and implemented and then some members of the group decided to launch their own coin with it. It was that last decision that was done as a scam. It had nothing to do with the designing and implementing. (Again, we don't know that this is entirely correct, but it is at least plausible, and contradicts your cloud castle of a mantra that it can't possibly be a scam because it is innovative.)

Quote
these developers (also your benefactors)

As I explained above, every Cryptonote-derived coin is a legitimate offspring of the original Cryptonote work (as explicitly invited by them when they released the cryptonote starter kit). In that sense Bytecoin and Monero are just siblings. Choose whichever you prefer, being fully informed.

The Bytecoin Team helped the Cryptonote Team implement the code. This is the version of events as described by the CN Team on crptonote.org. Monero just copied it. How the hell are you siblings? Rather Monero is more the bastard son.

A while back there was an interview posted with someone alleged to be from cryptonote who said that the bytecoin team split off from cryptonote because they wanted to implement a coin, and cryptonote was more interested in promoting the use of the technology by independent groups (which is exactly what Monero is doing, I might add). It was stated that they were still in contact but no longer working together. I'm simply going based on what they said. I can't easily find that interview now, but I'm sure its around somewhere if someone wants to dig it up.

It is also clear that cryptonote has invited other people, besides Bytecoin, to create coins using the technology they invented when they released the cryptonote starter kit. This is entirely beyond dispute, and again, this is exactly what Monero is doing.

If you prefer Bytecoin for your crypto investment needs because you believe (without any evidence I might add, and I strongly suspect incorrectly) that the people running it now and working on the code are the same ones who implemented the original reference code, and that matters a lot to you, go for it. It's your money.

(BTW, again I would suggest to you that you enlist the advice of technical experts who would tell you -- if they are competent -- from looking at the original and new code that it isn't the same people working on it any more.)

Quote
When I fist mentioned cryptonote.org's recognition of BCN you dismissed it out-of-hand accusing the CN Team of being in the same boat as the BCN Team.

As I explained to you before, the fact that cryptonote repeats the implausible and essentially disproven claim of two-years-in-the-deep-web, it is clear that not all of their statements can be trusted, and their motives appear, to some extent, aligned with those of Bytecoin in perpetuating this false backstory. (This was well-discussed last year, and had nothing to do with you pointing it out.) By the same token, that does not demonstrate that all of their statements are false. Correct logic may be tricky at times, but I'm sure you can understand this, correct?

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July 17, 2015, 07:26:16 PM
 #4592

ps you use the phrase "essentially disproven"? nothing has been proven or disproven, except the wobbly dates on the whitepaper which the CN team are accountable for.

Sure thing child_harold. Nobody has disproven Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy either. Believe what you want to believe then.

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July 17, 2015, 10:13:04 PM
 #4593

ps you use the phrase "essentially disproven"? nothing has been proven or disproven, except the wobbly dates on the whitepaper which the CN team are accountable for.

Sure thing child_harold. Nobody has disproven Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy either. Believe what you want to believe then.




What need has the world for Santa when you are here to determine with equal mad pendulum swings those of us who have been nice and those of u who have been naughty?

The freedom to choose what I believe is not yours to give smooth. It is mine to keep.



p.s. still cherry-picking? state your position on the CN Team pls.

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July 18, 2015, 01:21:05 AM
 #4594

ps you use the phrase "essentially disproven"? nothing has been proven or disproven, except the wobbly dates on the whitepaper which the CN team are accountable for.

Sure thing child_harold. Nobody has disproven Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy either. Believe what you want to believe then.




What need has the world for Santa when you are here to determine with equal mad pendulum swings those of us who have been nice and those of u who have been naughty?

The freedom to choose what I believe is not yours to give smooth. It is mine to keep.



p.s. still cherry-picking? state your position on the CN Team pls.

Wtf. Do you really care so much about monero or the totally anon CN team? Butthurt much? it's pretty clear what your agenda is, and if you think we are stupid and don't get it, you're about 2x as stupid. Go find your purple crayon and be a child again, ffs.
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July 18, 2015, 01:17:29 PM
Last edit: July 18, 2015, 04:32:18 PM by child_harold
 #4595

ps you use the phrase "essentially disproven"? nothing has been proven or disproven, except the wobbly dates on the whitepaper which the CN team are accountable for.

Sure thing child_harold. Nobody has disproven Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy either. Believe what you want to believe then.




What need has the world for Santa when you are here to determine with equal mad pendulum swings those of us who have been nice and those of u who have been naughty?

The freedom to choose what I believe is not yours to give smooth. It is mine to keep.



p.s. still cherry-picking? state your position on the CN Team pls.

Wtf. Do you really care so much about monero or the totally anon CN team? Butthurt much? it's pretty clear what your agenda is, and if you think we are stupid and don't get it, you're about 2x as stupid. Go find your purple crayon and be a child again, ffs.

Oh, so you know me better than I know myself? Why not enlighten us all and explain what my agenda is? Are you another crypto-guardian come to doll out more swiss cheese propaganda? Lest I remind you that even smooth admits rethink-your-strategy may have got some things wrong. Sure Im a little butthurt after you crypto-bunnies tried gangbanging me, but Ive beaten the odds before and I have no interest in switching my brain off as others here clearly do.

A purple crayon is all I need.

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July 19, 2015, 10:44:51 AM
Last edit: July 19, 2015, 11:38:21 AM by ABISprotocol
 #4596

Where can I download a wallet since sourceforge is down?

We've temporary put the files on our servers. Check out the downloads page: https://bytecoin.org/downloads/

Brief comment on this, since sourceforge has been the subject of a lot of community rage (nmap pulled its stuff off of sourceforge (details: http://seclists.org/nmap-dev/2015/q2/194), bitcoin removed lists from sourceforge, etc, etc) because sourceforge would add malware onto repositories. Just one of the back stories on this... http://www.techrepublic.com/article/its-time-to-go-away-sourceforge/
And that's before the latest "tits up" debacle
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/17/souceforge_titsup/

I like the idea of Bytecoin community taking care of its own files but I would like to see that distributed too, to be a bit more specific by that, what I mean is this...

1) Github it all (source available from github and linking to it off the bytecoin.org downloads page)
https://github.com/amjuarez/bytecoin

2) A harder step perhaps to examine and implement, but one worth taking a look at, is Gittorrenting this
See: http://blog.printf.net/articles/2015/05/29/announcing-gittorrent-a-decentralized-github/

If that could be done it would protect the community even more.

Cheers all

ABISprotocol (Github/Gist)
http://abis.io
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July 19, 2015, 03:42:37 PM
 #4597

Quote
I like the idea of Bytecoin community taking care of its own files but I would like to see that distributed too, to be a bit more specific by that, what I mean is this...

1) Github it all (source available from github and linking to it off the bytecoin.org downloads page)
https://github.com/amjuarez/bytecoin

2) A harder step perhaps to examine and implement, but one worth taking a look at, is Gittorrenting this
See: http://blog.printf.net/articles/2015/05/29/announcing-gittorrent-a-decentralized-github/

This can be a good start. I never liked SourceForge and I'm glad it's been replaced with Bytecoin website.
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July 19, 2015, 03:45:01 PM
 #4598

By the way, the recent Bytecoin blog post is very comprehensive on all major proof-of-work algorithms. It goes from the very basics (Hashcash and other ideas) to Bitcoin's SHA-256, scrypt, X11 and finishes with CryptoNight. It's a great reading indeed, I suggest you to check it out.

The Proof-of-Work in Cryptocurrencies: Brief History

https://bytecoin.org/blog/proof-of-work-part/
https://bytecoin.org/blog/proof-of-work-part-2/
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July 20, 2015, 09:49:46 AM
Last edit: July 20, 2015, 10:19:01 AM by child_harold
 #4599

In the past criticisms have been made over some of the crypto used in CN after audits were performed*. Thusly one CN coin changed some of the crypto. This was brought up recently on twitter and Peter Todd's comment reads: "Yup! Rather have cleaned up bad code w/ good crypto over bad crypto..." https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/622081863008436225

My questions to the devs here are:

1) Are the criticisms fair?
2) Has BCN similarly changed some of the crypto used?
3) If not will they? If not, why not?

Many thanks in advance for any responses to these question.

*Im not the most super savvy tech guy but if memory serves the criticisms related to some of the libs used. There is at least one post in BCT detailing this.


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July 20, 2015, 12:08:10 PM
 #4600

In the past criticisms have been made over some of the crypto used in CN after audits were performed*. Thusly one CN coin changed some of the crypto. This was brought up recently on twitter and Peter Todd's comment reads: "Yup! Rather have cleaned up bad code w/ good crypto over bad crypto..." https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/622081863008436225

My questions to the devs here are:

1) Are the criticisms fair?
2) Has BCN similarly changed some of the crypto used?
3) If not will they? If not, why not?

Many thanks in advance for any responses to these question.

*Im not the most super savvy tech guy but if memory serves the criticisms related to some of the libs used. There is at least one post in BCT detailing this.

1) Criticism "after audits were performed" is a little bit vague. For my current knowledge nobody has published a full review of Bytecoin/CryptoNote cryptography or code (except for Monero's peer review of CryptoNote whitepaper, but it was generally positive). If there was a specific paper or comment, I may come up with a more relevant response.

2) Peter Todd's comment is in line with previous Monero/Dash comparison. I suppose it means that Monero is based on a good cryptography and they're doing code refactoring, while Dash is supposedly based on some weaker cryptography (I'm not going to comment on this here). As for your question, only DigitalNote made any significant changes in the CN cryptography (encrypted messages).

3) Even though Bytecoin has made tons of code refactoring in the past few months, there were no significant cryptographic changes. However, in the upcoming release 1.0.6 there going to be a substantial crypto improvement. We'll cover that once the release is ready.

I hopes this clarifies your doubts.

Bytecoin BCN core team: https://bytecoin.org/
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