No petrol/diesel car sales by 2035/ Reality or dream?

[Balmain]

Naturally, I think it should be left to a matter of preference. It seems to me that it is impossible for all vehicles to become electric at the moment, that is, it is a dream, but the majority of electric vehicles may be in use. Not every country will comply with this law, and even if such a law is passed. They say that the batteries of electric vehicles will last more than 20 years. We are just at the beginning. Will these batteries be as durable as they say? If all production switches to electric vehicles, there will also be a battery shortage.

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[terrific]

Naturally, I think it should be left to a matter of preference. It seems to me that it is impossible for all vehicles to become electric at the moment, that is, it is a dream, but the majority of electric vehicles may be in use. Not every country will comply with this law, and even if such a law is passed.

That's true, there will be more countries that will on it if they've got a lot of roads that are set for these EVs but if not, diesel/unleaded cars will remain.

They say that the batteries of electric vehicles will last more than 20 years. We are just at the beginning. Will these batteries be as durable as they say? If all production switches to electric vehicles, there will also be a battery shortage.

Not all of them are durable. I've heard people had troubles with their batteries and it will cost them almost a brand new tesla to replace the battery alone.

[oktana]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

[poodle63]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

the government kept on giving incentives for those that buys an electric car it seemed the youngsters like the gen Z are usually favour electric cars because they consider it to be futuristic and techy, the cost of electric car is indeed higher right now and that is a fair argument even worst, changing battery also gonna cost really high but technology advance, the electric car technology aren't just fixated on one thing. maybe in the future we might encounter newer battery technology that could make charging faster and also could contain more electric power we don't know, right now some countries even already changing their public commute like buses using electric bus that don't require fuel, just charge overnight and its ready for commuting in the next days.
I think the vision of 2045 100% electric cars might be unrealistic but 2045 with 90% electric cars might be realistic, after all diesel car known to be so polluting that many country already starting to ban it.
im all in for the betterment of the worlds eliminating prominent source of pollution.

[Kelward]

How about those poor countries? Are they capable of having charging stations in those remote areas? I think this would be implemented in rich countries, as they are sure to be capable of it. For sure, in that year, electric cars will be more affordable compared to their price right now, as most people really want electric vehicles, but the problem is that they don't have charging stations, and the price is also very expensive. Also now for sure that it is pretty normal to see electric cars running on the road, unlike right now, it is a head-turner when you see one.

I believe that currently electric power supply in most underdeveloped countries can only be described as epileptic, so if developed countries in Europe were to move forward from petrol vehicles to electric vehicles, then these countries will not measure up to use the electric vehicles. Unless if the vehicle manufacturers will perhaps invest in the electricity power sectors of these backward countries to sale their products, then It'll be a blessing to them because they'll also benefit the electricity in their homes.

I believe that if the European countries are able to accomplish their 'no petrol or diesel car sales by 2035', then other countries of the world will emulate them and we'll see a new ora of zero smoke emission. It might take more than 2035 to accomplish, but definitely it'll happen, with modern technology anything is possible, except bringing the dead back to life. The move will surely affect crude oil producing countries negativity.

[electronicash]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

when the leaders of our world decided to adopt cars running on gasoline, they made gas field owners wealthy such as Rockefeller. with electric car adoption, they will make Elon Musk wealthier but right now, it's China that is winning the electric car technology, this is something that they will not like in this development.

if they decide on hydrogen-powered cars, these cars will just need water and the extractor of hydrogen from the water to keep running. no one will however get rich. maybe this is the way to go to be fair and manufacturing countries will only compete on whose technology is better.

[dunfida]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

when the leaders of our world decided to adopt cars running on gasoline, they made gas field owners wealthy such as Rockefeller. with electric car adoption, they will make Elon Musk wealthier but right now, it's China that is winning the electric car technology, this is something that they will not like in this development.

if they decide on hydrogen-powered cars, these cars will just need water and the extractor of hydrogen from the water to keep running. no one will however get rich. maybe this is the way to go to be fair and manufacturing countries will only compete on whose technology is better.

But hydrogen based type of car or simply being run with water then it would really make those industries die right away. It doesnt matter on who be the ones who get rich but for those people who had sit up in the top of the chain or into those industries would really be thriving out and do their very best on trying out to sustain or make it exist and useful for a very long time. Doesnt matter on whose personality or country would really benefit out as long it would be able to being used by humanity then this is what matter the most.

Try to look into this, which is the a hydrogen fueled car.
https://www.facebook.com/snngpage/videos/a-filipino-inventor-developed-the-first-water-fuelled-car/228276247306253/

So where he is now? Why PH didnt really put up that funding on developing this thing even more?

[DrBeer]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

when the leaders of our world decided to adopt cars running on gasoline, they made gas field owners wealthy such as Rockefeller. with electric car adoption, they will make Elon Musk wealthier but right now, it's China that is winning the electric car technology, this is something that they will not like in this development.

if they decide on hydrogen-powered cars, these cars will just need water and the extractor of hydrogen from the water to keep running. no one will however get rich. maybe this is the way to go to be fair and manufacturing countries will only compete on whose technology is better.

I think the statement "when the leaders of our world decided to adopt cars running on gasoline" is wrong. the transition to internal combustion engines was caused by progress and industry requirements. And the fact that some of the "fastest" entered this market globally is due to their ability to navigate the market, the situation, and what to hide - connections and information.

But electricity has created a very competitive market, which you can now observe - Musk has started mass production of above-average cars, China produces a huge number of inexpensive, and recently even top cars, all carmakers have picked up the trend and are also producing their electric cars. So there is no monopoly in this field, there are those who have entered earlier and those who are in more comfortable conditions in terms of resources.

Regarding hydrogen cars - it is almost an ideal solution, but technologically, it is still available to a small circle of manufacturers, plus it is not a cheap (today) solution. Perhaps there will be technologies that will make hydrogen plants as common as internal combustion engines, in which case I would favor it.

[oktana]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

the government kept on giving incentives for those that buys an electric car it seemed the youngsters like the gen Z are usually favour electric cars because they consider it to be futuristic and techy, the cost of electric car is indeed higher right now and that is a fair argument even worst, changing battery also gonna cost really high but technology advance, the electric car technology aren't just fixated on one thing. maybe in the future we might encounter newer battery technology that could make charging faster and also could contain more electric power we don't know, right now some countries even already changing their public commute like buses using electric bus that don't require fuel, just charge overnight and its ready for commuting in the next days.
I think the vision of 2045 100% electric cars might be unrealistic but 2045 with 90% electric cars might be realistic, after all diesel car known to be so polluting that many country already starting to ban it.
im all in for the betterment of the worlds eliminating prominent source of pollution.

Haha. I do not see the difference between 90% and 100%. And even if you bring it down to 80% or 70%, it still may be unrealistic. Many people can’t even afford these normal petrol powered cars, and let’s say they save for years to get one and then you tell them to rather buy electric cars? Where will they get the complete money from? Unless the government wants to give a good discount (though some people will still not buy it because of maintenance). Like you said, battery changing will be expensive because unlike petrol powered cars, the battery of an electric car is like the soul of the car. Who even knows how many battery that is used by an electric car.

[DrBeer]

Yes the costs of running an electric car are lower, how about the cost of acquiring an electric car? Anyways, I think that the mission of no diesel cars by 2035 is a dream. Not just any dream but a dream that should be woken up from. 2035 is just like a decade from now and 100% electric cars? The time frame is too short for that. Time really flies and 11 years isn’t as far as it seems. Maybe the percentage of fuel powered cars diesel powered cars can cut down to 50% but 100% electric cars by 2035 (even 2040) is nothing but a wish.

the government kept on giving incentives for those that buys an electric car it seemed the youngsters like the gen Z are usually favour electric cars because they consider it to be futuristic and techy, the cost of electric car is indeed higher right now and that is a fair argument even worst, changing battery also gonna cost really high but technology advance, the electric car technology aren't just fixated on one thing. maybe in the future we might encounter newer battery technology that could make charging faster and also could contain more electric power we don't know, right now some countries even already changing their public commute like buses using electric bus that don't require fuel, just charge overnight and its ready for commuting in the next days.
I think the vision of 2045 100% electric cars might be unrealistic but 2045 with 90% electric cars might be realistic, after all diesel car known to be so polluting that many country already starting to ban it.
im all in for the betterment of the worlds eliminating prominent source of pollution.

Haha. I do not see the difference between 90% and 100%. And even if you bring it down to 80% or 70%, it still may be unrealistic. Many people can’t even afford these normal petrol powered cars, and let’s say they save for years to get one and then you tell them to rather buy electric cars? Where will they get the complete money from? Unless the government wants to give a good discount (though some people will still not buy it because of maintenance). Like you said, battery changing will be expensive because unlike petrol powered cars, the battery of an electric car is like the soul of the car. Who even knows how many battery that is used by an electric car.

Sorry to cut into your dialog, but the problem is that you are making an assessment from a "poor people" perspective. And for countries with low living standards and incomes of citizens - progress always comes with a huge delay, and they should not be taken into account when introducing new technologies. It sounds a bit frustrating, but that's the reality. We should look at developed countries, where people do not save up all their lives for a car, where there is a convenient and developed infrastructure. And it simply makes no sense to make a forecast for the consumption of high-tech products in frankly backward regions.

[AndyGryffindor]

Too bad they are getting rid of diesels. Mine are around 75% efficient, nowadays.

It depends on a country where you at but this is a very inevitable adoption that most countries will do. As long as where the world is heading, most of the countries have to adapt from the situation.

But I think that there will still be countries that are dominant with diesel cars that shall retain the supply of their cars and will still keep up with it because there's a market of it on their country.

We will see on how these changes will take effect when majority of the rich countries are already into EVs.

There is room for improvement with internal combustion and E Vs yet. Car companies get turbo charging wrong. Old airplanes did it right with the turbo adding momentum to the flywheel instead of sending extra air pressure through the engine. Energy going to the flywheel or a generator (for hybrids, to charge a battery pack) from the turbo can be more efficient because the compression ratio of the engine can be the same as a NA engine, which is higher. Other areas for improvement would be converting waste heat into electricity or motive force. We've come this far with internal combustion engines. Why throw away all that effort?

Anyways, people are missing out on a true breakthrough for diesel engines. I estimate it would save the world over a hundred trillion dollars in fuel costs per year! I'm here if anyone needs help on building the device? Just ask nicely...      

[oktana]

~~

the government kept on giving incentives for those that buys an electric car it seemed the youngsters like the gen Z are usually favour electric cars because they consider it to be futuristic and techy, the cost of electric car is indeed higher right now and that is a fair argument even worst, changing battery also gonna cost really high but technology advance, the electric car technology aren't just fixated on one thing. maybe in the future we might encounter newer battery technology that could make charging faster and also could contain more electric power we don't know, right now some countries even already changing their public commute like buses using electric bus that don't require fuel, just charge overnight and its ready for commuting in the next days.
I think the vision of 2045 100% electric cars might be unrealistic but 2045 with 90% electric cars might be realistic, after all diesel car known to be so polluting that many country already starting to ban it.
im all in for the betterment of the worlds eliminating prominent source of pollution.

Haha. I do not see the difference between 90% and 100%. And even if you bring it down to 80% or 70%, it still may be unrealistic. Many people can’t even afford these normal petrol powered cars, and let’s say they save for years to get one and then you tell them to rather buy electric cars? Where will they get the complete money from? Unless the government wants to give a good discount (though some people will still not buy it because of maintenance). Like you said, battery changing will be expensive because unlike petrol powered cars, the battery of an electric car is like the soul of the car. Who even knows how many battery that is used by an electric car.

Sorry to cut into your dialog, but the problem is that you are making an assessment from a "poor people" perspective. And for countries with low living standards and incomes of citizens - progress always comes with a huge delay, and they should not be taken into account when introducing new technologies. It sounds a bit frustrating, but that's the reality. We should look at developed countries, where people do not save up all their lives for a car, where there is a convenient and developed infrastructure. And it simply makes no sense to make a forecast for the consumption of high-tech products in frankly backward regions.

Is it from a poor people mentality? Be it as it may, how many percent of the world is rich? I know you may want to say the news/post isn’t about the world at large but Europe, but then, are all the countries in Europe rich? No. There are still countries that are struggling, there are still people who are trying so hard to eat daily. I’m not saying it isn’t possible that everyone will use electric cars, of course we’ll get there. But for that to happen by 2045? 11 years from now? that’s not something I think will happen.

[Sithara007]

One good news for all the EV fans is that the price of Lithium Carbonate has collapsed. By the end of 2022, price per ton was around ¥600,000 but now it has declined to ¥96,500. More and more lithium mines are coming online and this will ensure stable prices for the next few years. However I am still concerned at the slow progress in new innovations in battery technology. Most of the EVs have a range of 200-400 km with a single charge and this is a major drawback for them over gasoline or diesel driven vehicles.

[DrBeer]

....
Sorry to cut into your dialog, but the problem is that you are making an assessment from a "poor people" perspective. And for countries with low living standards and incomes of citizens - progress always comes with a huge delay, and they should not be taken into account when introducing new technologies. It sounds a bit frustrating, but that's the reality. We should look at developed countries, where people do not save up all their lives for a car, where there is a convenient and developed infrastructure. And it simply makes no sense to make a forecast for the consumption of high-tech products in frankly backward regions.

Is it from a poor people mentality? Be it as it may, how many percent of the world is rich? I know you may want to say the news/post isn’t about the world at large but Europe, but then, are all the countries in Europe rich? No. There are still countries that are struggling, there are still people who are trying so hard to eat daily. I’m not saying it isn’t possible that everyone will use electric cars, of course we’ll get there. But for that to happen by 2045? 11 years from now? that’s not something I think will happen.

Not mentality, but a real low standard of living. These are slightly different concepts.
And I'm not talking about rich countries, I'm talking about countries where a significant portion has an adequate income. To this I include approximately $3,000 in income per month for an adult member of the senya. Are these RICH people? These are people with NORMAL income, let's say middle class. And they can easily afford to buy a new car, for example, once every 5-10 years. This is fine. How normal it is to be able to buy your own apartment/house. We must evaluate opportunities not by the poorest example, but by average, good income. That is why I said - that in poor countries, with poor populations, innovations come very late

[oktana]

....
Sorry to cut into your dialog, but the problem is that you are making an assessment from a "poor people" perspective. And for countries with low living standards and incomes of citizens - progress always comes with a huge delay, and they should not be taken into account when introducing new technologies. It sounds a bit frustrating, but that's the reality. We should look at developed countries, where people do not save up all their lives for a car, where there is a convenient and developed infrastructure. And it simply makes no sense to make a forecast for the consumption of high-tech products in frankly backward regions.

Is it from a poor people mentality? Be it as it may, how many percent of the world is rich? I know you may want to say the news/post isn’t about the world at large but Europe, but then, are all the countries in Europe rich? No. There are still countries that are struggling, there are still people who are trying so hard to eat daily. I’m not saying it isn’t possible that everyone will use electric cars, of course we’ll get there. But for that to happen by 2045? 11 years from now? that’s not something I think will happen.

Not mentality, but a real low standard of living. These are slightly different concepts.
And I'm not talking about rich countries, I'm talking about countries where a significant portion has an adequate income. To this I include approximately $3,000 in income per month for an adult member of the senya. Are these RICH people? These are people with NORMAL income, let's say middle class. And they can easily afford to buy a new car, for example, once every 5-10 years. This is fine. How normal it is to be able to buy your own apartment/house. We must evaluate opportunities not by the poorest example, but by average, good income. That is why I said - that in poor countries, with poor populations, innovations come very late

I don’t think that someone with $3,000 monthly salary can easily afford a car (BTW, we are talking of an electric car). The average salary in the EU for example is just around 2 times (from what I researched) of what you mentioned, but does everyone own cars? And we need to look at what type of cars they have too. You said it takes about 5-10 years, right? And what if people could just afford something cheap but now the law is saying that in just about 11 years, you can’t use fuel-powered cars, that is a short time because people have other responsibilities and they can just start saving to buy a car when someone of them even with that average money are only able to afford what they need. 

[boyptc]

It depends on a country where you at but this is a very inevitable adoption that most countries will do. As long as where the world is heading, most of the countries have to adapt from the situation.

But I think that there will still be countries that are dominant with diesel cars that shall retain the supply of their cars and will still keep up with it because there's a market of it on their country.

We will see on how these changes will take effect when majority of the rich countries are already into EVs.

There is room for improvement with internal combustion and E Vs yet. Car companies get turbo charging wrong. Old airplanes did it right with the turbo adding momentum to the flywheel instead of sending extra air pressure through the engine. Energy going to the flywheel or a generator (for hybrids, to charge a battery pack) from the turbo can be more efficient because the compression ratio of the engine can be the same as a NA engine, which is higher. Other areas for improvement would be converting waste heat into electricity or motive force. We've come this far with internal combustion engines. Why throw away all that effort?

Anyways, people are missing out on a true breakthrough for diesel engines. I estimate it would save the world over a hundred trillion dollars in fuel costs per year! I'm here if anyone needs help on building the device? Just ask nicely...      

Oh the technicals, I need to learn more about them but what you are saying is giving me a little bit of idea on what's the correct one that should be done by the manufacturers themselves.

I think that they're just relying to the demand about EVs and the petrol diesel cars and that's why some manufacturers are transitioning from diesels to EVs because that's what they think is in demand.

[AndyGryffindor]

      
[/quote]
Oh the technicals, I need to learn more about them but what you are saying is giving me a little bit of idea on what's the correct one that should be done by the manufacturers themselves.

I think that they're just relying to the demand about EVs and the petrol diesel cars and that's why some manufacturers are transitioning from diesels to EVs because that's what they think is in demand.
[/quote]


"Turbo Compound Piston Engines. Almost magic tech." is the name of the YouTube video that I watched on the subject. The diagram that I like is at 15:30 in the video. Enjoy...

Also https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5403404.0 is where you can learn how to build a very cheap fuel saver for diesel engines. I don't know how it works but it is awesome! The more of them you build the faster you get at it. Given some away as gifts, to neighbors and friends. Build time around 2 hours of easy work, for the first one.

[DrBeer]

....
Sorry to cut into your dialog, but the problem is that you are making an assessment from a "poor people" perspective. And for countries with low living standards and incomes of citizens - progress always comes with a huge delay, and they should not be taken into account when introducing new technologies. It sounds a bit frustrating, but that's the reality. We should look at developed countries, where people do not save up all their lives for a car, where there is a convenient and developed infrastructure. And it simply makes no sense to make a forecast for the consumption of high-tech products in frankly backward regions.

Is it from a poor people mentality? Be it as it may, how many percent of the world is rich? I know you may want to say the news/post isn’t about the world at large but Europe, but then, are all the countries in Europe rich? No. There are still countries that are struggling, there are still people who are trying so hard to eat daily. I’m not saying it isn’t possible that everyone will use electric cars, of course we’ll get there. But for that to happen by 2045? 11 years from now? that’s not something I think will happen.

Not mentality, but a real low standard of living. These are slightly different concepts.
And I'm not talking about rich countries, I'm talking about countries where a significant portion has an adequate income. To this I include approximately $3,000 in income per month for an adult member of the senya. Are these RICH people? These are people with NORMAL income, let's say middle class. And they can easily afford to buy a new car, for example, once every 5-10 years. This is fine. How normal it is to be able to buy your own apartment/house. We must evaluate opportunities not by the poorest example, but by average, good income. That is why I said - that in poor countries, with poor populations, innovations come very late

I don’t think that someone with $3,000 monthly salary can easily afford a car (BTW, we are talking of an electric car). The average salary in the EU for example is just around 2 times (from what I researched) of what you mentioned, but does everyone own cars? And we need to look at what type of cars they have too. You said it takes about 5-10 years, right? And what if people could just afford something cheap but now the law is saying that in just about 11 years, you can’t use fuel-powered cars, that is a short time because people have other responsibilities and they can just start saving to buy a car when someone of them even with that average money are only able to afford what they need. 

Let's count a lot?
Let's take, for example, a model like the Volkswagen Id 4. The price of a new car is up to $30,000.
For a family of 2 people, with a total income of $5,000. Tell me, is it difficult for them to save, for example, 30% to buy a car? Plus, many cars are sold with installment payments - a down payment of 10 to 30%, and installments for 12-24 months. As for me, this is a completely acceptable purchase scheme.
Tell me, how much does a car of the same class with an internal combustion engine cost? And how do they buy them? Despite the fact that when we go out into the street, we see a huge number of completely new cars!

[dmamigo]

Firstly, be it reality or dream, for me I will miss these cars. I like shifting gears which are already missing in many Petrol cars and this is not only me but found out that there are many people with same thought.

Now, I belive EVs will help reducing environmental pollution and all but I also read a debate that to manufacture the batteries the environment is getting affected very badly. A huge amount of CO2 is being released. So, if this is the case I doubt if this is even helping apart from car running cost saving.

For me when I read about Ethanol cars, I liked this technology as already e20 fuel is being distributed in India and it does releases less polluted fumes. They also do have a con related to farming where fertilizers used are synthetic and causing harm to the soil and ground water.

In conclusion, stopping the sale of petrol/disel cars used as a personal vehicle or a cab might be possible with any of these alternatives and be it any they will impact the nature in some way. As of now, I think everybody in this World is just trying to innovate a way where less carbon is ommitted from the cars, so there is a chance that this might get extended. And stopping the sale of every vehicles including commercial trucks is only possible with great innnovation which will take some time. Bus are still fine, they are running but not every vehicle.

[|MINER|]

Maybe it is possible. And this initiative is very good. I think it should be implemented as soon as possible. This is the biggest initiative to reduce the level of CO2 gas. Our public life and climate are threatened due to excess CO2.  And electric cars will be cheaper than oil cars.  I hope the quality will be good too.  The demand for cars will only increase over time.  If the car runs on electricity, the electricity demand will also increase.  This will benefit the government.  Now it is not sure how many countries agree to this.