[ANN] BlackCoin (BC/BLK) | PoS | BlackHalo | Smart Contracts | Anonymous

[mr_random]

Regardless of this debate... the final outcome will more than likely be 1 person = 1 vote. If not, people won't use the foundation as a means of driving the direction of the coin. History will just repeat itself and the coin will once again go into the hands of the people.

The foundation is a smart group.. they won't allow just a few to have more pull over the masses. So I'm glad of that.

Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?

[acseric]

Regardless of this debate... the final outcome will more than likely be 1 person = 1 vote. If not, people won't use the foundation as a means of driving the direction of the coin. History will just repeat itself and the coin will once again go into the hands of the people.

The foundation is a smart group.. they won't allow just a few to have more pull over the masses. So I'm glad of that.

Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?

Businesses are not decentralized in the least.  They are totally centralized, with the board of directors and CEOs making all of the decisions.  Shareholders vote for the board members, based on how many shares they have (and also for big resolutions, etc)

That isn't decentralized, and this isn't a pulblicly traded business.

[qratzpalatz]

awesome,the blackboygroup doesnt know how a foundation should work...better this coin stay for himself! they talk so much bullshit.

No,no you mixed it up. It's "Black Hand group" and "IRC Boys",not "blackboygroup...

[acseric]

Regardless of this debate... the final outcome will more than likely be 1 person = 1 vote. If not, people won't use the foundation as a means of driving the direction of the coin. History will just repeat itself and the coin will once again go into the hands of the people.

The foundation is a smart group.. they won't allow just a few to have more pull over the masses. So I'm glad of that.

Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?

Businesses are not decentralized in the least.  They are totally centralized, with the board of directors and CEOs making all of the decisions.  Shareholders vote for the board members, based on how many shares they have (and also for big resolutions, etc)

That isn't decentralized, and this isn't a pulblicly traded business.

Also, the foundation is not even similar to the board of directors of blackcoin (not in name, and not in function)

I dont know why apples are being compared to orangutans here, but they are.

[vizique]

An interesting video idea once there is a Android BlackCoin wallet.

4 Smartphones each with a crypto wallet open and with a send address ready and a single unit of currency.
BTC, LTC, DOGE and BlackCoin.
Next to these phones will be a PC screen with the 4 various currency wallets open on screen. One in each corner.
The send button is pressed on the 4 phones at the same time.
First to receive the coins from the phone isthe winner...
That will of course be BlackCoin

[MuffinMaster]

can't wait till monday !

[Cryptoolate]

People that have more money should have a higher say, The more blackcoin they have, the more they care to have it successful, also the more they know what are they doing since if you have $20K USD to buy crypto with, its more likely that you are a very successful business owner in real life with a lot of experience, then a bum living in your mom's basement. Just probabilities and its a number game.

I vote for people that hold the most cash to have the biggest say in what the foundation should do. Oligarchy for the win
[/quote]

Interesting you say this because how does oligarchy (very rich and powerful) even come to play for decentralized currency?  It's an oxymoron, talk of taking BC for votes is bribery and greed filled IMHO and the Foundation is an organized group to focus on projects and helping in bringing BC to the next level.  I would like to think they are not an Exchange or some dirty politicians.

So counterpoints to previous quotes:

Asceric
"Businesses are not decentralized in the least.  They are totally centralized, with the board of directors and CEOs making all of the decisions.  Shareholders vote for the board members, based on how many shares they have (and also for big resolutions, etc)" I really respect your opinion and enjoy your posts so yes, you're right but do you bribe them to sway decisions?  No, CEOs and Presidents are chosen because they earned it through hard work, reputation, and an uncanny ability to lead.  And while your point does exist everywhere to a certain extent, it shouldn't here in crypto. The fabric for which crypto exists is to operate opposite of your argument, not to let a few control it.  If that's the case and 'The Foundation' is to operate like board members, then they should call the shots without a voting system.

Mr_Random
Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?
[/i] They do but who's winning and who's losing?  The bull traders with inside info/immortal practices or the joe schmoe that invested because he/she believed in something or was swindled?  That's the exact problem with what happened in 2008.  The only way I can see you argue this is you're a large holder yourself or you didn't feel the pain of the 2008 downturn, when trading firms and banks swindled innocent people and we faced the largest deficit (still today), loss jobs, loss of confidence, foreclosures, etc.  If you don't remember, or were a part of the swindling, or were too young, I suggest you read up on it.  Crypto is decentralized and independent of those that can control our lives and run by a network of peers (equal). I'm not saying you don't have a point, I'm just saying, we have to put things in perspective.  


BC community consists of multiple BC believers

so

1 member = 1 vote or no vote at all if you all believe that 'The Foundation' will do what's right for the big picture.

[maarx]

Hi guys, thank you for your concerns,

As XBladeX pointed out, any member will also have to pay a yearly fee to the Foundation (money which is used to support projects in turn). To "rig votes" one would be paying several yearly fees, have different email accounts and prove different addresses.

Also we will be adding a tiered system:

0-1k bc = 1 vote
1-2k bc = 2 votes
2-5k bc = 3 votes
5-10k bc = 4 votes
10-20k bc = 5 votes
20-50k bc = 6 votes
50-100k bc = 8 votes
100-200k bc = 10 votes
200-300k bc = 12 votes
300-400k bc = 14 votes
400-500k bc = 16 votes
500k-1 million bc = 18 votes
+1 million bc = 20 votes

Logarithmic scaling

Let me know if you think if this is fair ^ (still a draft!)

Hi, let me make this clear:

Votes as I talk of them now are on a per project basis.

e.g. say the website shows there are 3 community projects:

- Wall Street promotion
- PR firm fundraising
- MIT airdrop promotion

And the foundation has 2000 BLK funds.

In total there are 3 users.

Person A has 700 BLK (1 vote)
Person B has 70000 BLK (8 votes)
Person C has 700000 BLK (18 votes)

Now these persons combined voting power is 27 votes and they go vote:

- Wall Street promotion (A, C) - 19 votes
- PR firm fundraising (C) - 18 votes
- MIT airdrop promotion (B) - 8 votes

: Total votes cast = 45 * Note that anyone can vote on any project, but they can only add a vote, or remove their vote.

Funds would be divided accordingly between the projects. e.g.:

- Wall Street promotion: 19/45 * 2000 BLK
- PR firm fundraising: 18/45 * 2000 BLK
- MIT airdrop promotion: 8/45 * 2000 BLK

e.g. funds will be divided equaly between projects.

Larger holders have more votes, because in essence, they can gain/ lose the most (though debatable). But as you can see: it doesn't matter.

There are some problems with above formulas though (e.g. the foundation's funds would be 0 after said funding of projects- and this formula does not take into account that perhaps projects would be over-funded if they receive the share as stated)

Therefore there will be a Treasurer to budget for projects. The budget per project will be discussed with the board. Say for example 600 BLK is budgetted per project:

- Wall Street promotion: 19/45 * 600 BLK

Is what would be funded or pledged to the Wall Street promotion.

This however, brings the "human" into the equation. Ultimately, we want to have a plan which removes the human from the equation. (e.g. why would 600 BLK be budgetted for the project, and not 800 BLK?)

We are looking for, ultimately, a complex equation that includes the following:

# of current projects AND the required $ for these projects
# of new projects per week and the expected average $ for these projects
Amount of BLK in the foundation's funds
Amount of votes cast for a specific project
Amount of total votes that all members combined could have added during the voted period
Expected amount of new donations/ fees going into the foundation fund

The system will have to take into account that there will be future projects and limited funds. The system should fund projects fairly without compromising the funding power on new potential projects.

Mathematicians that would be willing to help on such a formula, I am calling out for you!

In the end, the foundation is just 1 part of the crowd that will fund projects. It is in no means a mean to completely fund projects.

Also posted on:
http://www.reddit.com/r/blackcoin/comments/255nke/blackcoin_foundations_funding_of_projects_a_call/

Right, small update.

How about:
Say a yearly membership fee is $25. This will give everyone who is a member 1 vote. Extra votes can be bought for $25 per year. That way, larger holders, who are equally a holder as a small holder is, do have a chance to increase their voting power, but by doing so, they increase the foundation's financial supporting power on projects.

[acseric]

People that have more money should have a higher say, The more blackcoin they have, the more they care to have it successful, also the more they know what are they doing since if you have $20K USD to buy crypto with, its more likely that you are a very successful business owner in real life with a lot of experience, then a bum living in your mom's basement. Just probabilities and its a number game.

I vote for people that hold the most cash to have the biggest say in what the foundation should do. Oligarchy for the win

Interesting you say this because how does oligarchy (very rich and powerful) even come to play for decentralized currency?  It's an oxymoron, talk of taking BC for votes is bribery and greed filled IMHO and the Foundation is an organized group to focus on projects and helping in bringing BC to the next level.  I would like to think they are not an Exchange or some dirty politicians.

So counterpoints to previous quotes:


"Businesses are not decentralized in the least.  They are totally centralized, with the board of directors and CEOs making all of the decisions.  Shareholders vote for the board members, based on how many shares they have (and also for big resolutions, etc)" Yes, but do you bribe them to sway decisions?  No, CEOs and Presidents are chosen because they earned it through hard work, reputation, and an uncanny ability to lead.  And while your point does exist everywhere to a certain extent, it shouldn't here in crypto. And to your point, the fabric for which crypto exists is to operate opposite of your argument, not to let a few control it.  If that's the case and 'The Foundation' is to operate like board members, then they should call the shots without a voting system.

Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?
[/i] They do but who's winning and who's losing?  The bull traders with inside info/immortal practices or the joe schmoe that invested because he/she believed in something or was swindled?  That's the exact problem with what happened in 2008.  The only way I can see you argue this is you're a large holder yourself or you didn't feel the pain of the 2008 downturn, when trading firms and banks swindled innocent people and we faced the largest deficit (still today), loss jobs, loss of confidence, foreclosures, etc.  If you don't remember, or were a part of the swindling, or were too young, I suggest you read up on it.  Crypto is decentralized and independent of those that can control our lives and run by a network of peers (equal). I'm not saying you don't have a point, I'm just saying, we have to put things in perspective.  


BC community consists of multiple BC believers

so

1 member = 1 vote or no vote at all if you all believe that 'The Foundation' will do what's right for the big picture.

[/quote]

You have a false premise.  The Blackcoin Foundation isnt in charge of Blackcoin.  It is in charge of distributing Blackcoin funds raised by the Blackcoin Foundation.  They are composed of members voted on by the community, and are trying to figure out the best way to get a feel for what the blackcoin community wants by having the community vote on what the blackcoin community thinks the funds should be spent on.

In a lot of ways, it is more similar to a chartiy that gives its funds to various efforts related to the charter of the charity.

[acseric]

You have a false premise.  The Blackcoin Foundation isnt in charge of Blackcoin.  It is in charge of distributing Blackcoin funds raised by the Blackcoin Foundation.  They are composed of members voted on by the community, and are trying to figure out the best way to get a feel for what the blackcoin community wants by having the community vote on what the blackcoin community thinks the funds should be spent on.

In a lot of ways, it is more similar to a chartiy that gives its funds to various efforts related to the charter of the charity.

Wow, I just read what I wrote and confused myself.

simplified:  the foundation is an organization composed of members of the community who's purpose is to determine how best to spend the funds controlled by the foundation for the betterment of blackcoin.

[blade87]

I like the logarithmic voting style myself. It doesn't give too much power to big holders, and it also gives the small holders more incentive to obtain more BC. Because owning BC would actually become worth something more than just monetary value. If not the one already proposed, maybe some other one. But, I do believe owning more BC is a form of support and should be rewarded appropriately.

The other thing I can suggest - more votes to verified community members working on some larger technical projects or PR for BC?
(I'm trying not to be biased but I wouldn't mind an extra vote or two myself )

So overall, my imo, more support for BC = more votes awarded. This can be done either by obtaining more BC through mining or buying (or foundation membership dees), or for those who don't have deep pockets - working on some kind of project that can benefit BC. This way there is no excuse that only big holders and deep pockets have the most votes. If you have a technical skill or some real world connections than can benefit BC, get to it.

[KingSchultz]

Coinkite just posted this pic, lol!

https://twitter.com/Coinkite/status/464815252618887168

Yes! CoinKite rocketship currently fueling. BTC-LTC-BLK to the mooooon. But mostly BLK. 

[XbladeX]

.....

How about:
Say a yearly membership fee is $25. This will give everyone who is a member 1 vote. Extra votes can be bought for $25 per year. That way, larger holders, who are equally a holder as a small holder is, do have a chance to increase their voting power, but by doing so, they increase the foundation's financial supporting power on projects.

For me is obvious that when we have genius idea to complete we will donate it as always.
Buying vote itself is not such great...
Personally i would sent 100$ direct to project than pay for membership...
Initial 25$ fee is good to deter smurf accounts creators.
Vote is like voice of community but someone with big bag can push some idea it self
- at the end BC will gain. ^^

[Astroxjr]

Right, small update.

How about:
Say a yearly membership fee is $25. This will give everyone who is a member 1 vote. Extra votes can be bought for $25 per year. That way, larger holders, who are equally a holder as a small holder is, do have a chance to increase their voting power, but by doing so, they increase the foundation's financial supporting power on projects.

WOW, Just WOW.
Seems you guys are really in it for the money after all.

All i see in this so far is Money this, more money that, money=power.

Maybe prove yourselves first before asking for money.

E.G We are still waiting for the $30K invoice from the PR company that was said would be given to show transparency

And since when has foundation had ANYTHING to do with Wall.St - are you now 'officially' bactracking backing it ?
Maybe you should have helped to fund that before throwing $15K to a PR firsm that has so far done nada and maybe say they will require even more money  

[mr_random]

Regardless of this debate... the final outcome will more than likely be 1 person = 1 vote. If not, people won't use the foundation as a means of driving the direction of the coin. History will just repeat itself and the coin will once again go into the hands of the people.

The foundation is a smart group.. they won't allow just a few to have more pull over the masses. So I'm glad of that.

Why do you think in the running of multimillion dollar businesses on the stock market people who are the biggest shareholders have more of a say? Just curious what you think about that. Or do you think every shareholder in a business should be equal?

Businesses are not decentralized in the least.  They are totally centralized, with the board of directors and CEOs making all of the decisions.  Shareholders vote for the board members, based on how many shares they have (and also for big resolutions, etc)

That isn't decentralized, and this isn't a pulblicly traded business.

Also, the foundation is not even similar to the board of directors of blackcoin (not in name, and not in function)

I dont know why apples are being compared to orangutans here, but they are.

I disagree but I don't want to argue. Imo it's comparing Blackcoin to voting for some democratic goverment election which is absurd.

[cryptoangel]

Right, small update.

How about:
Say a yearly membership fee is $25. This will give everyone who is a member 1 vote. Extra votes can be bought for $25 per year. That way, larger holders, who are equally a holder as a small holder is, do have a chance to increase their voting power, but by doing so, they increase the foundation's financial supporting power on projects.

WOW, Just WOW.
Seems you guys are really in it for the money after all.

All i see in this so far is Money this, more money that, money=power.

Maybe prove yourselves first before asking for money.

E.G We are still waiting for the $30K invoice from the PR company that was said would be given to show transparency

And since when has foundation had ANYTHING to do with Wall.St - are you now 'officially' bactracking backing it ?
Maybe you should have helped to fund that before throwing $15K to a PR firsm that has so far done nada and maybe say they will require even more money  

+1

Wooaaah I can finally post after 2 hours been logged in, took the words out of my mouth!.

[Cryptoolate]

Wow, I just read what I wrote and confused myself.

simplified:  the foundation is an organization composed of members of the community who's purpose is to determine how best to spend the funds controlled by the foundation for the betterment of blackcoin.

Thanks Acseric, I understand now and after reading Maarx's breakdown on voting.  I'm all for organized allocating of finances and a team is needed for this in any operation so long as it's not for the financial benefit of the 'Foundation' members via trimming or so-called commission and its genuinely for BC.

[Degolep]

Coinkite just posted this pic, lol!

https://twitter.com/Coinkite/status/464815252618887168

+100

[Soepkip]

Right, small update.

How about:
Say a yearly membership fee is $25. This will give everyone who is a member 1 vote. Extra votes can be bought for $25 per year. That way, larger holders, who are equally a holder as a small holder is, do have a chance to increase their voting power, but by doing so, they increase the foundation's financial supporting power on projects.

WOW, Just WOW.
Seems you guys are really in it for the money after all.

All i see in this so far is Money this, more money that, money=power.

Maybe prove yourselves first before asking for money.

E.G We are still waiting for the $30K invoice from the PR company that was said would be given to show transparency

And since when has foundation had ANYTHING to do with Wall.St - are you now 'officially' bactracking backing it ?
Maybe you should have helped to fund that before throwing $15K to a PR firsm that has so far done nada and maybe say they will require even more money  

1) No. All money from Memberships will be used by the Foundation to fund projects.
2) Yes. Money this, Money that. You know, stuff needs money to happen.
3) We (as a Foundation) have always supported the idea of WS. We simply stated it was not official BlackCoin nor that we used Foundation funds for it. And no, we have nothing to do with the WS event, that is IE's thing.
4) The transparency for the PR Firm will be provided by dognip somewhere in the upcoming week.
5) We cannot prove ourselves without money. Oh and by the way, see our history page.

[Subtuppel]

LOL as soon as the CINNI pump was over people jumped on DRK and pump it up beyond any reason.
and again lots of BC being dumped to go into that.

I think it won't last long and whoever does this will eventually reach his goal and scare lots of people out, with every day another shitcoin rising while BC is forced back below 29k whenever it goes up for more than 1%.