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Author Topic: [ANN][LIBERTYCOIN][XLB] v1.0.3.0 | X11 | 100% POS | No IPO | No Premine |  (Read 359860 times)
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Boomslang
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June 03, 2014, 02:25:03 AM
 #6541


I dont agree with restrictions on ownership.  Coins can get redistributed over time because anyone can buy them at any time.  There is no way to fairly distribute coins, it is the nature of the crypto beast.

If everything goes well, as more people buy the coins, the price will rise, and the coins will be redistributed to the buyers.

I'm not sure that came across properly, I'll try again!  The 1% thing was just a starting point for discussion.

What I was trying to say was that if the initial distribution is fairer, then the acquisition can develop over time, but at a much slower rate than it does now.  The wealth acquisition and the potential for manipulation right now is out of control, and the rich get richer, the poor get poorer.  The solo miner is disenfranchised.

When that initial distribution favours only a few, then they will be in control of the coins and in a position to potentially manipulate the market to their advantage.  This is the current state of cryptos and a lot of the problems surrounding P&D, hype & FUD.

I can see 3 possible solutions for the future :-

1) Create a new mechanism that distributes coins more fairly and evenly across many, many more miners so that market manipulation is drastically reduced - at least at the launch - and large-scale wealth hoarding becomes more difficult.

2) Take the current coin distribution and re-allocate it more fairly and go forward from there with much more people actively involved.

3) Rebrand Libertycoin and drop the concept of Liberty and remain the same as every other coin.

I can't see a way where Liberty can exist when the coins are controlled by a ruling Aristocracy of a few wealthy owners.

The two are diametrically opposite to each other, you can't have both at the same time, within the same system.

It's one or the other.  

Only solutions 1 & 2, or variations thereof, can release control so that Liberty can evolve.

There will always be the urge to acquire more wealth.  That is human nature.

In a marathon race, there are always fast runners, charity runners, people dressed as lions, olympic gold medalists.

However, they all start from the same start line and they run the same race, regardless of where they end up once the marathon is under way.  At the beginning, everyone has an equal starting position.

It's not really fair if someone jumps into a car to get to the end (ASIC), someone else takes shortcuts (pre-mine) or people throw rocks into the road  to stop the runners at the back from moving forward (DDoS).

It needs to be a level playing field from the outset, to give everyone the same chance, and the current state of cryptos is not.

What is likely to happen is the name stays as Libertycoin, the concept of Liberty is ignored or oversold, the coin distribution remains asis and it will be lost amongst the other cryptos without the innovation it requires to evolve.
Boomslang
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June 03, 2014, 02:35:53 AM
 #6542

Aceric boomslang....why dont you just develop your own coin? You do realize that you are free to build your coin as u see fit... just as the xlb dev did.
Then u can build it to suit u and others will bitch and complain and drive ur coin into oblivion.. Cheesy

Hehe, we're back to the "one with the biggest hammer wins" again, using it to destroy rather than create!

This isn't Liberty.
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June 03, 2014, 02:42:15 AM
 #6543

No, its just the name of a coin...get it?
Boomslang
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June 03, 2014, 02:49:47 AM
 #6544

No, its just the name of a coin...get it?


Yes, that is what it will become - just a name.

If all people want is a fancy name, ok, job done.

Just another crypto, no innovation, no real desirability, no real value, no uptake outside of the exchanges.

However, the devs think bigger than this and so do most of the community.

 
acseric
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June 03, 2014, 02:55:00 AM
 #6545

No, its just the name of a coin...get it?


This is what a pump and dump advocate would say.  I want to have innovation that brings liberty to the moon.

You can also create your own coin if you dont feel like trying to improve this one.
Coinasaur
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June 03, 2014, 04:26:01 AM
 #6546

You guys see that they are trying to antagonize you into responding to them and you guys are taking the bait, right? Just don't respond to them and they will go away again.
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June 03, 2014, 04:59:34 AM
 #6547

A few interesting observation iv seen over the last couple days... yer sorry im one of thos boring people that watch what’s going on lol

1: What happened with IE and his cronies dumping on his own promise of bringing good news then blaming it on the dev (which was clearly what went on) was a very big hit and “most” coins would not of stabilized after that.

2: Iv never seen a coin hold out for so long after all this without people dumping it as the buy wall goes down, 3000 looks very solid to anybody with half a eye lol.

3: Because people wont sell lower then 3000k most of the movement up have been from red sells which iv never seen either.

4: Really small buy and sell stacking switching back and forth on mintpal for days, there that small im not sure which way there trying to move it but I have notice the bid wall being pulled out to a much lower price a good few times, saying that I aint seeing any panic to sell when it does then the price slowly goes back up again.


All in all its kinda interesting really and im not sure what going on but for a coin with a great name only a 17 million supply and such resiliency among the holders 3000k isn’t a price Iv been turning down with the profit from my other coins the last few days.
I haven’t been here from the start and I do feel bad for the peeps that lost with IE but I think this coin has real promise from 3000k onwards. You got my total respect and support for bagging that thief, im mainly a blackcoin holder so needless to say I think this community did the the hole cryptocurrency world and great service.

THIS ^

+10000000

Bump Smiley

Change...is in the air.
You know why
acseric
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June 03, 2014, 05:19:17 AM
 #6548

You guys see that they are trying to antagonize you into responding to them and you guys are taking the bait, right? Just don't respond to them and they will go away again.

Why are you trying to make us go away?  Arent you interested in the betterment of Libertycoin?

If that isnt your goal, why are you here?
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June 03, 2014, 12:52:00 PM
 #6549

To all those who are calling for change:
Libertycoin was doing great until people began to call for change. Bashing the developer and by default expressing that the coin is not good enough. You people are either ill intentioned or complete idiots. You say you want libertycoin to succeed while you kill it. I find it hard to believe you are that stupid, but maybe you are. I'm betting you have ill intentions.
So stop one of two things: acting ridiculously ignorant, or acting with bad intent
hashpuppy
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June 03, 2014, 01:49:06 PM
Last edit: June 03, 2014, 02:01:37 PM by hashpuppy
 #6550

This concentration of wealth on a coin is nonsense. What is the difference between Liberty and Bitcoin and other alts that are dead now?  I am one of the bagholder of alts that are 5 million in circulation and less than 1 litoshi in value. Now can you call that concentration of wealth.  The value of the coin is in its usefulness, liquidity and community.  If more people will use it, it will become more valuable.  I can hardly imagine now, why Bitcoin have that immense value when it burns a lot of electricity to maintain its network and have 10 minute confirmation when proof of stake coins (POS) like Liberty can do 30 second transaction and without the need of mining.  If you want to create value on this coin, build communities and businesses around it so it become useful.  So people will demand the coin thereby justifying its value.
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June 03, 2014, 02:18:46 PM
 #6551

  is there any good news about the price

SMith777
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June 03, 2014, 02:50:16 PM
 #6552

Someone place order in mintpal to buy 451842.33749033 at a price 0.00002910 = total 13.14861202 BTC   Shocked  Shocked  Shocked

Boomslang
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June 03, 2014, 02:55:11 PM
Last edit: June 03, 2014, 04:09:05 PM by Boomslang
 #6553

This concentration of wealth on a coin is nonsense. What is the difference between Liberty and Bitcoin and other alts that are dead now?  I am one of the bagholder of alts that are 5 million in circulation and less than 1 litoshi in value. Now can you call that concentration of wealth.  The value of the coin is in its usefulness, liquidity and community.  If more people will use it, it will become more valuable.  I can hardly imagine now, why Bitcoin have that immense value when it burns a lot of electricity to maintain its network and have 10 minute confirmation when proof of stake coins (POS) like Liberty can do 30 second transaction and without the need of mining.  If you want to create value on this coin, build communities and businesses around it so it become useful.  So people will demand the coin thereby justifying its value.

The wealth is only a perceived wealth, seperate from it's value.

Diamonds, outside of industry, have no practical value whatsoever, yet they remain deisrable because they have perceived rarity.

The strict control of how many diamonds are released onto the open market maintains the perception of rarity and value.  

Only about 1% of all the jewelry diamonds mined make it to the public.  The price is maintained by deliberately limitting the supply.

Ultimately, they are worthless - but people still see value in them because they are shiney.

https://mises.org/Econsense/ch91.asp


The concentration of wealth with altcoins is the same as they are fundamentally useless, but their perceived value is based on limitting the supply to control market value.

It is not how much a particular coin is worth, it is how they are distributed and who controls the movement of flow.

Any coin where large proportions are held in very few hands means that the owners of those coins can control supply and try to increase demand, thereby increasing prices and perceived value.  This is a cartel, no different to diamonds or the privately run banks.

It doesn't matter if a coin is worth 1 cent or 100 dollars - it's just managed perception.  

If, for example, 60% of all coins or more are held in 10 accounts or less, you have a cartel-type structure, not the free movement of money.   The concentration of a given resource is in the hands of a small number of people.

Satoshi, in creating a methodology for everyone, wanted to do away with cartels and strict control of supply.

That no longer exists in cryptos.  They are being run, knowingly or unknowingly, by cartels - and investors are at their mercy.

It's our money they are taking.  And they laugh all the way to the next coin.

Don't blame the coins, blame the mechanism they are all built on and the persuit of greed over fairness.
Boomslang
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June 03, 2014, 03:12:00 PM
 #6554

Someone place order in mintpal to buy 451842.33749033 at a price 0.00002910 = total 13.14861202 BTC   Shocked  Shocked  Shocked

That's about 7% of all Libertycoin in circulation.

Either from a single buyer or from 2 or more people all wanting to buy at the same price.

The concentration of coins into fewer and fewer hands looks like it is continuing.

And yet the top wallet of around 725k yesterday is down to 500k today.

The top wallet has dumped 30% or more of their holding.

Hmmm
incognito73
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June 03, 2014, 03:17:44 PM
 #6555

I suggest not having any expectations....
A coin has only one chance

  is there any good news about the price

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103 days, 21 hours and 10 minutes.


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June 03, 2014, 03:22:01 PM
 #6556

Someone place order in mintpal to buy 451842.33749033 at a price 0.00002910 = total 13.14861202 BTC   Shocked  Shocked  Shocked

That's about 7% of all Libertycoin in circulation.

Either from a single buyer or from 2 or more people all wanting to buy at the same price.

The concentration of coins into fewer and fewer hands looks like it is continuing.

And yet the top wallet of around 725k yesterday is down to 500k today.

The top wallet has dumped 30% or more of their holding.

Hmmm

It's going to take weeks to get all the larger hands to unload.  If this drops to 1k I would expect a jump in price again like what we saw last week.
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June 03, 2014, 03:33:26 PM
 #6557

Why do you people buy coins like this? You think you're betting on the next bitcoin? Seriously, get real.
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June 03, 2014, 03:43:27 PM
Last edit: June 03, 2014, 03:56:54 PM by Boomslang
 #6558

Someone place order in mintpal to buy 451842.33749033 at a price 0.00002910 = total 13.14861202 BTC   Shocked  Shocked  Shocked

That's about 7% of all Libertycoin in circulation.

Either from a single buyer or from 2 or more people all wanting to buy at the same price.

The concentration of coins into fewer and fewer hands looks like it is continuing.

And yet the top wallet of around 725k yesterday is down to 500k today.

The top wallet has dumped 30% or more of their holding.

Hmmm

It's going to take weeks to get all the larger hands to unload.  If this drops to 1k I would expect a jump in price again like what we saw last week.


I'm not saying anyone is scamming, just a quick breakdown of where the coins are based on the published Rich List.

The Libertycoin Rich List (I wonder why it's called that) only accounts for 5.771 million coins

There are roughly 800k coins missing from it which is weird.  I wonder where they are?

The top 5 wallets combined hold 34% of all coins (of 6.5 million coins)

The top 10 wallets combined hold 58% of all coins (of 6.5 million coins)

The top 15 wallets combined hold 77% of all coins (of 6.5 million coins)

Taking a sensible lower limit of 1000 coins, there are 501 wallets with 1000 or more.

This means roughly 23% of all coins are held in 486 wallets, at an average of around 0.45% each (of 6.5 million coins)

The average is a little misleading ... there are 30 wallets with over 100k after the top 15.

This is freely available information

http://xlb.blockexplorer.cc/richlist/index.php?min=0


I suspect a similar pattern is repeated for nearly all the other coins.

When such a concentration of "wealth" is held in so few hands, a (wo)man is no longer in control of his/her own destiny - (s)he is at the mercy of the rich, subject to their whims and control, which is no different to the current banking situation we are all trying to get away from.





hashpuppy
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June 03, 2014, 03:51:26 PM
 #6559

Quote
I suspect a similar pattern is repeated for nearly all the other coins.

Yes, including shit coins that have almost no value.  I know. I'm a bagholder of many of these coins.  Giving up BTC speculating.
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June 03, 2014, 03:54:36 PM
 #6560

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I suspect a similar pattern is repeated for nearly all the other coins.

Yes, including shit coins that have almost no value.  I know. I'm a bagholder of many of these coins.  Giving up BTC speculating.

Please don't give up!  Fight for change!

You have a right to be outraged.

Liberty is for All
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