[Ultracoin] [Est. Feb 2014] ~ ASIC Resistant & Ultrafast 6 Second Transactions!

[usukan]

Cheers - confirmed

Just send it !

It will be an extra addittional donation dear Usukan 
..... (...............)

[usukan]

Cheers - confirmed

great service you use there

@wtfc360 - thanks and noted via PM your contribution is on its way.

Your continued strong support for Ultracoin very much appreciated by all.

Cheers - usukan

I have sent my contribution to the UTC Dev Fund account.

https://blockchain.info/address/1LpFmfieMBH63ivFA1Us5ju1jnH9CSccKZ

0.312 BTC

I encourage others who have already pledged - or those who have not indicated their support yet - to follow.

As you might have noticed - I like to keep moving forward.


Thanks - usukan

[Roister01]

Hi Usukan...

My 0.312 should be on its way now...
Thanks again for all your hard work...

Cheers,
Roister...😃

[usukan]

Cheers Roister - all confirmed.

Hi Usukan...

My 0.312 should be on its way now...
Thanks again for all your hard work...

Cheers,
Roister...😃

[usukan]

Thanks everyone for your strong and prompt support on this project.

Current contributions are from the following:

wtfc360
PaulR1
Valpe
Roister01
usukan

The UTC Dev Fund holds 1.95319198 BTC
https://blockchain.info/address/1LpFmfieMBH63ivFA1Us5ju1jnH9CSccKZ


Just confirming final details now with PressTab on exactly how we want to proceed and payments.

I will hopefully report back later today - with payment details for Stage 1 (Diff re-target fix) and confirm that PressTab is "on the job".

Note we have 1.26 BTC approx to go - to raise the full funds for all 3 stages.

If anyone else in the Community wishes to support this work - we are very happy to hear from you now.

Any contributions large or small will be gratefully received and put to good use with PressTab.

We need to reach at least 2.4 BTC Total in a weeks time (an additional 0.45 approx.) to move on to Stage 2 (Tidy up the Ultracoin code).

GREAT WORK EVERYONE 


Cheers - usukan

[fabietech]

Thanks everyone for your strong and prompt support on this project.

Current contributions are from the following:

wtfc360
PaulR1
Valpe
Roister01
usukan

The UTC Dev Fund holds 1.95319198 BTC
https://blockchain.info/address/1LpFmfieMBH63ivFA1Us5ju1jnH9CSccKZ


Just confirming final details now with PressTab on exactly how we want to proceed and payments.

I will hopefully report back later today - with payment details for Stage 1 (Diff re-target fix) and confirm that PressTab is "on the job".

Note we have 1.26 BTC approx to go - to raise the full funds for all 3 stages.

If anyone else in the Community wishes to support this work - we are very happy to hear from you now.

Any contributions large or small will be gratefully received and put to good use with PressTab.

We need to reach at least 2.4 BTC Total in a weeks time (an additional 0.45 approx.) to move on to Stage 2 (Tidy up the Ultracoin code).

GREAT WORK EVERYONE  


Cheers - usukan

Count me in Usukan great Job! 0,312BTC will be transferred

[usukan]

Excellent - thank you Sir.

Things are really humming now.

Cheers - usukan

Thanks everyone for your strong and prompt support on this project.

Current contributions are from the following:

wtfc360
PaulR1
Valpe
Roister01
usukan

The UTC Dev Fund holds 1.95319198 BTC
https://blockchain.info/address/1LpFmfieMBH63ivFA1Us5ju1jnH9CSccKZ


Just confirming final details now with PressTab on exactly how we want to proceed and payments.

I will hopefully report back later today - with payment details for Stage 1 (Diff re-target fix) and confirm that PressTab is "on the job".

Note we have 1.26 BTC approx to go - to raise the full funds for all 3 stages.

If anyone else in the Community wishes to support this work - we are very happy to hear from you now.

Any contributions large or small will be gratefully received and put to good use with PressTab.

We need to reach at least 2.4 BTC Total in a weeks time (an additional 0.45 approx.) to move on to Stage 2 (Tidy up the Ultracoin code).

GREAT WORK EVERYONE  


Cheers - usukan

Count me in Usukan great Job! 0,312BTC will be transferred

[usukan]

PressTab is on the job.

All is sorted - he has started work already today.


I have some other important engagements today - but will get back later with some more detail.

Cheers - usukan

UPDATE

PressTab has been paid 1.20279 BTC
https://blockchain.info/tx/1090dafd1a1daf4a2ccf42e94524de0b2839ec0556713d5670736da9c5257d2b
This is payment for Stage 1

From the UTC Dev Account
https://blockchain.info/address/1LpFmfieMBH63ivFA1Us5ju1jnH9CSccKZ

He has already started reviewing the code (Stage 2) since he decided that fixing up the code first was by far the best idea - rather than starting on the re-targeting fix (Stage 1) and applying it to the current messy UTC code.
He reports significant code that is a resource hog and fixing this will lead him more easily into the re-targeting fixes and associated code changes.
In UTC's case - this is a far more efficient approach to the work.
Essentially he will be working on both Stage 1 & Stage 2 next week.

There is a chance he will have both Stage 1 & Stage 2 finished by late next week (or shortly after) and he is happy that we pay him next week for Stage 2 - or sooner if we have the available funds - even though his terms are full payment upfront.

So by the end of next week we will likely be ready to consider a hardfork date.

At this point we can apply the liteStake code if we have available funds.


I have been truly impressed by the support and trust the Community has bestowed both me and UTC in this work.

All I can say is THANK YOU

We are now in the capable hands of PressTab - I believe this will turn out very good for UTC.



And if we hit any obstacles






Let the fun begin!


Cheers - usukan

[Beave162]

Any plans to adjust the NFactor?

[usukan]

Hi Beave162

No plans unless the community agrees there are good reasons to change.

What are your thoughts on this?

Please discuss.

Thanks - usukan

Any plans to adjust the NFactor?

[Roister01]

Could I just ask, as a novice here - what would it mean to change the N Factor? What should it be, and what would we change it to...and of course, what would be most advantageous, and why?

Cheers,

Roister01

[usukan]

This is a discussion for the miners to start and fill us in on really.

Could I just ask, as a novice here - what would it mean to change the N Factor? What should it be, and what would we change it to...and of course, what would be most advantageous, and why?

Cheers,

Roister01

[Beave162]

Hi Beave162

No plans unless the community agrees there are good reasons to change.

What are your thoughts on this?

Please discuss.

Thanks - usukan

Any plans to adjust the NFactor?

I wasn't trying to impose my views or anything. I was just genuinely curious if that was something being considered in the midst of all the other developments and changes.

[presstab]

If any changes are to be made, now would be the time.

[Thiago1]

The Ultracoin team should  change how many coins for block 10 still to many 5 help the inflation

[usukan]

Thanks Beave and Thiago

Here are my thoughts on NF and block reward.

Everyone please discuss, agree or disagree.  Silence as always will be taken as agreement.

First - we have only just (Nov/Dec 2015) changed both these based on extended discussions from what was a much larger community base.  Although everyone did not agree 100% - overall this was the group consensus.

 - Lower the block reward from 30 to 10 UTC
 - Reduce NF from 16 to 14


On the NF

UTC was getting raped by botnets at NF16 - it had to be changed and quick.

Alenevaa made a useful post 11 Nov 2015.

Your miners need to use 4 times less memory at NF14 than they have used at NF16.

If roughly estimate [CPU] vs [GPU with 4GB VRAM]

Code:
NFactor | GPU advantage
-----------------------
NF17   | 1x  gpu has no advantage
NF16   | 2x
..
NF14   | 10x gpu 10 times faster

then we can clearly see that Ultracoin NF14 becomes GPU-coin.

From one side (negative) - it has no sense to mine Ultracoin with CPU now
From other side (positive) - Ultracoin will be more secure as GPU-miners stands well against botnets.

also
Quote from: lpedretti on October 27, 2015, 02:50:49 PM
Awesome!
Right in time for me to add another gpu to my rig Smiley
NF14 rocks. the best balance between mem usage and gpu stress



On the block reward - the current plan can be summarised:

Change notes:

Change to 10 UTC per block pending new update
10 UTC per block - 4,000,000
5 UTC per block - 6,000,000
2.5 UTC per block - 8,000,000
1.25 UTC per block - 20,000,000
1 UTC per block - 25,000,000
.5 UTC per block - 30,000,000
.25 UTC per block - 40,000,000
.125 UTC per block - 50,000,000
.01 UTC per block - 208,145,600

Change to 2% pending new update
1.5% per year at block 4,000,000
1% per year at block 8,000,000

GitHub Diff:

https://github.com/Kracko/ultracoin-2/compare/6135192516147ae7d478fd850b085165289558a1...Kracko:master

So it changes to a reward of 5 UTC from block 4,000,000
But in this post
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=727023.msg12811221#msg12811221
lpedretti suggests that its not coded to change yet - but there is plenty of time before we hit block 4,000,000


My conclusions:

Block Reward

Maintain at 10 UTC for now.
We have just reduced it from 30.
We have few miners and to be quite honest we do not want to further discourage mining.
We only have 6-7 miners on Alenevaa's pool and maybe a solo miner or two.
Any less miners at this point is suicide.
When the price goes up (yes I believe it can only go up from here - barring a few dumps) - these miners who held UTC together in our darkest hour - need to be rewarded.
Sure if the price of UTC goes up substantially in the future - we can change (reduce) it before block 4,000,000.
But not now.
If we reduce it - in the thinking that will make the price go up (which we almost certainly know does not happen) and our miners leave - UTC is dead.
Leave block reward at 10 UTC


NF 14

Leave it at NF14
I have only seen positive feedback on NF14 over other NF's discussed
We avoid botnets which almost killed UTC
I am not a miner - so can offer no other wisdom here
lpedretti's comment is stuck in my mind "NF14 rocks. the best balance between mem usage and gpu stress"

Community - Please discuss.







Thanks - usukan

[Hilux74]

Below are my arguments for NF15 and follow up comments from Kracko and Thirtybird that were made during the original discussions last year about NFactor changes.  I'm no longer mining anything but I still feel NF15 was perfect.

Since most GPUs from high end to low end are pretty much on equal footing at NF15+, with speed more or less dictated by their amount of RAM there is less need to perpetuate the arms race of newer better faster more expensive hardware to remain an effective miner.  Since there is not a continued requirement to invest $ into new hardware there is also less need to dump mined coins to payoff the capital costs.

Some continued arguments for Kracko:

I think the equality in mining higher NFactor chacha is a very marketable feature.  Both for hardware costs and power usage.  At higher N the all GPUs are drawing less power as NF increases, but this is particularly noticed on the lower end cards.  My entire 6x R7-240 4GB system currently pulls only 150w at the wall (I believe it was 180w at NF15).  At NF15+ this system is hashing just as fast as a 6x R9-290X system for a much less ridiculous capital cost and runs quiet and cool as a cucumber.

I was recommending NF15 over 16 since there are many more people who have 2GB GPUs in their computers (or mining systems) than 4GB.  At N15 these are still functioning at decent efficiency.  At NF16+ the 2GB cards take a big hit in mining effectiveness so there would be many less people willing to mine.  Since I have mostly 4GB cards I am making this recommendation not for the benefit of myself but what I think is potentially most beneficial to UTC.  N16 has been treating me very well.

So at NF15 you have a unique currency with 1) the most egalitarian mining hardware requirements of any coin (ie almost anyone with a PC can mine it), 2) has among the lowest, if not the lowest, power usage requirement for GPU mining of any coin and 3) remains asic resistant and 4) is botnet resistant since it remains far more efficiently mined by GPU and not CPU.  That combination of features is the golden egg in my view that so far has eluded others.

All that said NF14 would still be ok in my view...just not as perfect.  But as you stated you are also working toward lite clients to function on android and other weak systems so if that goal is not obtainable at NF15-16 then that is a valid enough point.

You make a compelling and rational argument- also unencumbered by ulterior motives.  I'm liking the egalitarian/sweet spot for the most cards concept at NF15.  The power savings are a plus too as the margin of profit over electricity keeps on shrinking and this is a very concerning point.  To be honest, Steven was favoring 15 as well.  While I would prefer that mobile devices be able to support a full client, it's still is not really where it would need to be at NF14.  Call me sold on 15.

Alright, so- next.  Arguments for staying on schedule?

I know you've moved on, but Hilux had some really good reasoning in his statement, and I want to call him out for props on putting to paper some good points on where to pin the NFactor.  As a miner - I've moved more into the casual group - I used to enjoy the challenge of tweaking when a new NFactor came along, now it's just a matter of going into my lookup table and trying between three and four sets of LG/RI values to see which one gives the highest results (or fewest shaders if they're the same), so the challenge just isn't there anymore.

Arguments for staying on schedule :
It will take more than 6 years, for the NFactor to increase 4 more times - who keeps a GPU for 6 years?  We will have a proliferation of newer hardware, and a 290X will NOT be the place to mine at, people can use those for gaming finally!
By around NF=18 or so, high end laptop (maybe even mid-range) CPU's should be in very close parity to GPUs in terms of mining power and efficiency, which opens the door to the slightly-more-casual miner
Doesn't require a hard fork
Next NF Change isn't until next year, no need to be in any hurry to change things

Disclaimer - I'm not mining UTC right now, and higher NFactors suit me just fine

[usukan]

Thanks Hilux74

I did not search the threads back this far (May 2015 - time constraints)

Your key statements here are:
------------------------------------------------------
So at NF15 you have a unique currency with 1) the most egalitarian mining hardware requirements of any coin (ie almost anyone with a PC can mine it), 2) has among the lowest, if not the lowest, power usage requirement for GPU mining of any coin and 3) remains asic resistant and 4) is botnet resistant since it remains far more efficiently mined by GPU and not CPU.  That combination of features is the golden egg in my view that so far has eluded others.

All that said NF14 would still be ok in my view...just not as perfect.  But as you stated you are also working toward lite clients to function on android and other weak systems so if that goal is not obtainable at NF15-16 then that is a valid enough point.
--------------------------------------------------------------------

So I take from this that the current NF14 is OK - but you think NF 15 is better - if not perfect - and with a "unique" coin claim.

Is there any other NF15 coin?

Are there any current miners watching this thread?  What do you prefer?  The preference of current UTC miners would be a high ranking opinion for me.

Who has mined NF15 - Whats NF 15 really like compared to NF14 that we have now?

and how botnet resistant is it?

If NF15 compromises lite clients in the future - thats a serious drawback.

@PressTab - do you have any comments on NF14 vs NF15? Is there much work involved in changing the code? How many hrs?




Thanks - usukan

Below are my arguments for NF15 and follow up comments from Kracko and Thirtybird that were made during the original discussions last year about NFactor changes.  I'm no longer mining anything but I still feel NF15 was perfect.

Since most GPUs from high end to low end are pretty much on equal footing at NF15+, with speed more or less dictated by their amount of RAM there is less need to perpetuate the arms race of newer better faster more expensive hardware to remain an effective miner.  Since there is not a continued requirement to invest $ into new hardware there is also less need to dump mined coins to payoff the capital costs.

Some continued arguments for Kracko:

I think the equality in mining higher NFactor chacha is a very marketable feature.  Both for hardware costs and power usage.  At higher N the all GPUs are drawing less power as NF increases, but this is particularly noticed on the lower end cards.  My entire 6x R7-240 4GB system currently pulls only 150w at the wall (I believe it was 180w at NF15).  At NF15+ this system is hashing just as fast as a 6x R9-290X system for a much less ridiculous capital cost and runs quiet and cool as a cucumber.

I was recommending NF15 over 16 since there are many more people who have 2GB GPUs in their computers (or mining systems) than 4GB.  At N15 these are still functioning at decent efficiency.  At NF16+ the 2GB cards take a big hit in mining effectiveness so there would be many less people willing to mine.  Since I have mostly 4GB cards I am making this recommendation not for the benefit of myself but what I think is potentially most beneficial to UTC.  N16 has been treating me very well.

So at NF15 you have a unique currency with 1) the most egalitarian mining hardware requirements of any coin (ie almost anyone with a PC can mine it), 2) has among the lowest, if not the lowest, power usage requirement for GPU mining of any coin and 3) remains asic resistant and 4) is botnet resistant since it remains far more efficiently mined by GPU and not CPU.  That combination of features is the golden egg in my view that so far has eluded others.

All that said NF14 would still be ok in my view...just not as perfect.  But as you stated you are also working toward lite clients to function on android and other weak systems so if that goal is not obtainable at NF15-16 then that is a valid enough point.

You make a compelling and rational argument- also unencumbered by ulterior motives.  I'm liking the egalitarian/sweet spot for the most cards concept at NF15.  The power savings are a plus too as the margin of profit over electricity keeps on shrinking and this is a very concerning point.  To be honest, Steven was favoring 15 as well.  While I would prefer that mobile devices be able to support a full client, it's still is not really where it would need to be at NF14.  Call me sold on 15.

Alright, so- next.  Arguments for staying on schedule?

I know you've moved on, but Hilux had some really good reasoning in his statement, and I want to call him out for props on putting to paper some good points on where to pin the NFactor.  As a miner - I've moved more into the casual group - I used to enjoy the challenge of tweaking when a new NFactor came along, now it's just a matter of going into my lookup table and trying between three and four sets of LG/RI values to see which one gives the highest results (or fewest shaders if they're the same), so the challenge just isn't there anymore.

Arguments for staying on schedule :
It will take more than 6 years, for the NFactor to increase 4 more times - who keeps a GPU for 6 years?  We will have a proliferation of newer hardware, and a 290X will NOT be the place to mine at, people can use those for gaming finally!
By around NF=18 or so, high end laptop (maybe even mid-range) CPU's should be in very close parity to GPUs in terms of mining power and efficiency, which opens the door to the slightly-more-casual miner
Doesn't require a hard fork
Next NF Change isn't until next year, no need to be in any hurry to change things

Disclaimer - I'm not mining UTC right now, and higher NFactors suit me just fine

[usukan]

Return of rapture333 (Steven)


Steven and I are now working closely together to move to the next stages of Ultracoin development.

Its going to be a little more exciting from now on.

Steven will post shortly

Basically - I will follow PressTab through to delivery of the tidied up code, retarget fix and liteStake code - Steven will take it from there but I will be around to assist wherever needed.

Steven will manage the fork etc with PressTab.

Steven will update the ANN, and Ultracoin website - and engage the social media channels.

I will let him talk about the other developments and marketing activities.

WELCOME BACK Steven

This is the dawn of a new era for ULTRACOIN


Cheers usukan

[Beave162]

All that said NF14 would still be ok in my view...just not as perfect.

I agree with this statement. I just want to point out how admirable ThirtyBird is about how he valued the challenge that used to come with increases in NFactor. But like he said, things are different now. If only more people would be welcoming challenges, more than just focusing on price or trying to pump a coin, good things would happen.

I'm not sure what you mean by having an android phone supporting a full client? What does that have to do with the NFactor?

The fear of botnets is a little overblown. The only worry in terms of botnets, or anything similar, is centralized control of the blockchain. At NFactor 15, UTC will be mined most efficiently with 750ti or R7 240 cards. There are a lot of people with those cards lying around who can ensure the blockchain is secure. NF14 is not a complete departure from that idea though. Like you say Hilux, it is more of the sweet spot at NF15.

I will add another point... Current prices incorporate speculation, which accounts for people betting on events years in the future. At higher NFactors, it could be that these newer CPUs with high memory cache will completely change the dynamics of profitable mining hardware and attract new miners, new interest. It is a good bet to say eventually GPUs will come with higher VRAM, which will have the same effect. There are no real negatives for UTC with that scenario.

I also agree that the lower energy consumption of higher NFactors is a big positive.

It is not a big issue to go from NF14 to NF15. Staying on NF14 would not be a mistake, even if not preferred.